Cyclops

archive.is/WtBct
>Cyclops has “lead” the X-Men on and off for over 40 years. However, over that same period he has managed to become one of the most disliked “heroes” in the Marvel Universe.

archive.is/6Udjp
>Q: Why all the hate for Cyclops?
>A: Because Cyclops is basically terrible.

>Yeah, I know, that’s exactly what I said about Aquaman. If I use it three times, though, it officially becomes a running gag, and that’ll come in handy the next time someone asks about Hawkman....
>I know otherwise rational people who insist that he’s not just the best X-Man, but one of the best characters ever. And they stick by this statement, even when you remind them that Cyclops is not Wolverine and therefore does not fight ninjas, like, all the time. It’s weird.

>This is how most of my conversations about Cyclops go. You can see how this is a problem. But the thing about Cyclops is that even if I agree with all that and see where he’s coming from, he’s still not Spider-Man. That might not sound fair. I mean, there are plenty of comic book characters who aren’t Spider-Man, and at least seven or eight of them are well worth reading about.

>...that’s the image of Cyclops that I have in my head whenever he shows up: The guy who frowns at all the cool characters and tries to stop them from doing awesome things because the Professor says and we have a responsibility and you can’t just stab everyone and not now Jean I have to program the Danger Room. And he kind of has to be that way, because there has to be someone providing the core of the team so that everyone else can orbit around it and push away; Wolverine wouldn’t be Wolverine if he didn’t have Cyclops to rebel against. I’d just rather read about the rebelling than the guy who tells him hey stop that, it’s after 10 and we have a noise policy here.

What is with the "Cyclops sucks" meme that Marvel and braindead retards like these fags are trying to push?

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He's a highly disciplined, no nonsense leader of his team because he feels the weight of responsibility on his shoulders for protecting the entirety of the mutant race. He takes what he does with deadly seriousness and his teammates find him rigid and hard headed for it

90s kids watched the cartoon where he was a stick in the mud and wolverine was the cool bad boy and it stuck and got into the movies and now everyone hates poor Scott.

But he can take it, he can carry that weight.

Cyclops was my favorite X-men, who wasn't a girl I had teen-lust for, when was a kid.

yes but he also doesn't fight ninjas xD what a LOSER!

I'm enjoying these daily Cyclops threads tbqh

He was so right that he left

These kind of "popular stuff" is what created writers like Bendis, cut it out

>Blaming the cartoon
That's the worst part about it. I had the same theory, but recently my roommate and I have been rewatching the series and Cyclops actually is really cool, has tons of emotional range, and is just as snarky, rebellious at times, and angry as Logan.

People remember him completely wrong is the problem, and most of that is because of Jean.

does anybody have that interview where Grant Morrison said Cyclops was his favorite?

You know, I'm actually sort of curious about the overlap between people who are big Superman fans and big Cyclops fans. I'd wager that the types of people who hate Superman also hate Cyke.

How can you tell someone's opinion is shit? They like fighting ninja. There was even an entire video game made to drive home just how terrible fighting ninja is, but, no, some people still enjoy it.

One of those links uses the Scott v the X-Men in the Proteus story as an example of Scott being shitty and I'm so mad.

This is Chris Sims right? Funny cause Batman and Cyclops are actually super similar characters. Scott just didn't have the privilege of all the money in the world

Sims did a whole like episode by episode series recap on CA and I have no idea how/if his opinions changed. bet they didn't tho

This whole article reeks of faggotry from some guy with daddy issues.

Cyclops was and will always be my favourite X-Men character, because I actually read the old comics at a comic store when I was young.

Wolverine just came off as an edgy tryhard when I read stuff he was in later on.

Cyclops is a character whose story was over at the end of Uncanny X-Men or, if we REALLY stretch it, when Jean was revived originally.

The fact that they've dragged him out this long has only hurt him. I find it a shame he has to be remembered as being character-assassinated into being a villain because Marvel no longer likes his kind of hero (white, male, dutiful, disciplined, but smart and brave).

>archive.is/6Udjp
>Cyclops sucks man
>I mean Wolverine is super cool
>but look at how cool Claremont made Cyclops
>I read the 90's X-Men and didn't like Cyclops in that
>Cyclops sucks
Chris Sims is dumb

ellis also seems to find him interesting and basically called him the closest equivalent marvel has to an actual batman.

>Hawkeye is boring
>turn him into ninja and use some other name

>Funny cause Batman and Cyclops are actually super similar characters

I can see that. Batman doesn't want people to have to suffer the way he did as a child, and Cyclops doesn't want people to have to suffer the way he did. Both are willing to protect people at the cost of their own lives.

I think the difference is that Batman does what he does out of feelings of guilt, while Cyclops does what he does out of duty.

There's also the fact that Batman is applauded for heroism, while the Marvel universe has every single hero and villain gang up on Scott for doing the right thing.

Hawk Eyes?

>white male

Why do you fags have to play into this shitty narrative? Don't fucking frame everything in the context of gender and race. There isn't a single one of these characters that represents men, women, white people, black people or any other kind of political identity of that nature. Cyclops does not represent white men in the same way that Storm does not represent black women. You've let your mind get infected with this racial persecution complex

I find everything about Wolverine and Japan incredibly cringy, all the Wolverine weaboo stories actually remind me of Sup Forums.

...

Ha!
Love you, user.

wolverine was only good when he was a weeb

Add that ontop of how much guilt he has for killing Xavier that he refused to admit. He knows he will never be able to be as good as Xavier in terms of helping the mutant race. He never will because the world will forever know that he killed Professor Xavier, the man that he admired the most

>why all the hate for Cyclops?
>>Because Cyclops is basically terrible.
>>Yeah, I know, that’s exactly what I said about Aquaman
Oh yeah, two sentences in and opinion discarded already. I don't agree with a lot of his recent decisions, but Cyke has a long history of being a damn fine character.

The fuck is your problem?

I looked up to white male characters like Cyclops when I was a kid over the black ones because they looked more like me.

Referencing that Marvel is trying to phase that kind of character out is a statement of fact, not a 'persecution complex.'

The only one left off the top of my head of their current runs is Tony Stark, and that's because RDJ sells movie tickets.

Also Xavier is a fucking monster but no one remembers because he can mind wipe them

What do you think you're getting across by showing me this? Don't fucking go to Salon and spread every single article they post around the places that you spend your time if you don't like them. They're allowed to write shit like that if they want user, it doesn't justify your pathetic white male persecution complex that you've adopted. You've literally just tried to make Cyclops out to be a pitiful victim of white male persecution and you don't even realize it. You're just like them, clamoring for victim status where ever you can. Just fucking stop. Stop surrounding yourself with blogs explicitly featuring things you hate if you truly don't like them.

>But the thing about Cyclops is that even if I agree with all that and see where he’s coming from, he’s still not Spider-Man. That might not sound fair. I mean, there are plenty of comic book characters who aren’t Spider-Man, and at least seven or eight of them are well worth reading about.

why are spiderfags such universally shit people

remember when cyke abandoned his wife and son for JEEEEEAAAAAAANNNNNNNN?

he's always been a fucking prick.

He solo'd some dinosaurs one time tho, that was pretty cool

...

Yeah, that just means you were and still are deeply ignorant and have a simplistic conception of who these characters are and what these stories are about. It's a requirement for simple minded people to have to see themselves in the characters they can read because they are wholly unableb to extend their thinking beyond themselves

true, but to be fair Batman is a fucking asshole too.

>marvel does not support the genocide of whites

I understand where you're coming from with "don't let that shit poison your thoughts" but is right to an extent. You think they're about to genderswap Blob? Or create any new black villains? Not a chance.

>Referencing that Marvel is trying to phase that kind of character out is a statement of fact, not a 'persecution complex.'
this. It's not just Marvel though. It's the same kind of thought behind BvS (Heroes are to be town down) and Suicide Squad (they're just misunderstood underdogs).

Is this faggot serious? "I don't like him because he's not Wolverine!" I don't want a person like this writing anything at all.

Neither of us are clamouring to say we're oppressed, we're pointing out the obvious.

Stop getting so offended over these things. If you don't like what we're saying, don't reply :^)

See how stupid you sound?

Captcha: select all street signs.

Why? Because as a child I wanted role models like me, that I could look up to and felt like I wanted to become?

I hope you kill yourself, honestly, daddy-issues.

...

They've done shit exactly the same as this gimmick every year or two for the last decade. It means nothing. We still have decades of comic canon that they cannot change.

>Spider-Man no longer exists.
>Neither does Moon Knight or Old Man Logan
>who the fuck is Hyperion?
>Hercules who?

what fucking Suicide Squad are you reading

the article goes into some depth about why he thinks Spidey has the similar "Forcing yourself forward and doing the right thing" thing that Cyke has

>This whole article reeks of faggotry from some guy with daddy issues.

You know, I've noticed this a lot in comics. Batman nowadays focuses on Thomas Wayne's influences on Bruce a lot more than Martha, Superman always has Jor-El and Pa Kent, modern Flash grew up with a dead mom (and the show hands out new dads like candy.)

I've got a theory that a lot of the people writing now grew up with Boomer dads who worked long hours at factory jobs or something, so they never had a father figure near them. It seems as if a lot of comic book characters either fill those surrogate father roles or are self-inserts for the writers' own issues.

What did you do other than paint your understanding of Cyclops to be entirely defined by the persecution of white males, which you feel you yourself ate a victim of?

>12 out of 27 shown are white males
>MARVEL TRYING TO KEEP US WHITE DUDES DOWN

jesus

All you're doing to submitting to the guiding leadership of these ideologies that you hate, allowing them to form your perceptions and your understandings of these characters.

the niggification of western society

>white male front and center
>four additional white males
>black character that has existed for decades
>white woman that has existed for decades
>black character that has existed for decades sharing a legacy name
>three additional minority legacies
>Alt-U white woman legacy
>a native american
>a robot
White males still have the most representation with white women close behind. Almost 2/3 of characters are white (Vision doesn't count for any race) which is roughly proportional to the American population.

My going theory is that Cyclops is too real for most cape fans, and by direct expension most writers as well (since 90% of all writers today are essentially just fans that get paid to write fanfiction).

Characters like Wolverine are the cool guys that every child and manchild wants to be. They're the tough guys who don't take shit from anyone, who can get away with almost anything, and who have that dark and gritty edge to them that 13 year olds try to replicate in their Sonic the Hedgehog OCs. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Wolverine is just that. He can be amazing in the right hands. But it's the image that counts.

When people contrast a character like Wolverine with a character like Cyclops, people are usually quick to point out the superficial differences. Wolverine is the cool bad-boy rebel, while Cyclops is the uptight straight-laced boyscout. The eternal party pooper, only there to complain about Wolverine's immaturity and irresponsibility, making him even cooler by contrast.

And while that's true to a certain extent, I don't think that's the real reason why people dislike Cyclops. Captain America is a straight-laced boyscout as well much of the time, but he doesn't catch nearly as much flak for it.

The reason, as I mentioned above, is that Cyclops is too real. Wolverine is the guy our inner manchild desperately wants to be, but Cyclops is much closer to the guys we really are and (perhaps even worse) the guys we're expected to be. The responsible guy who does his homework and goes to bed early instead of partying all night long. The guy who fucks up and has to live with the consequences instead of running away from it (which is more Wolverine's thing). The guy who never quite feels at home, but does what he can anyway. The guy who fails, who doubts himself, but for whom that failure and doubt is also a constant inspiration to be better.

I realized as soon as I jumped from comics to movies someone would hit me for that. I'm talking about the way our culture treats heroism and genre-fiction as a whole. I understand that comparing comicbook Cyclops to unrealsed-movie Boomerang is apples-oranges, but my point is about fruit in general.

Dead/missing parents are super common.
>I have no father figure!
>better start robbing banks
>I have dead mother!
>no kid will live without their moms >:(
Remember how Tim was fresh for having living family and all? Until they got Boomerang'd.

And if that last part sounds familiar, good. It's supposed to. Because the same thing is true, with relatively minor differences, for several other great characters that many writers seem to hate, like Hank Pym.

It's "led", you fucking idiot. You lead in the present tense, you led in the past tense.

>heroes can't face moral dilemmas.
That's a pretty shit idea, plus conflating two writers (one of which is known for his edge) is retarded.

Also the knock-off Thor wasn't killed by the Ultimates but by Nerd Hulk as a vampire.

I've seen it happen so many times with white men who get caught up in this pitiful racial persecution complex, literally just ranting about how women and non white people are keeping them down and oppressing them. These are of course the exact same people who would criticize black men for complaining about white people holding them down, but as soon as they got the chance they all jumped on the racial persecution train.

It's ironic that these guys are saying they like Cyclops so much too, when he is defined as a character by his capacity to overcome and disregard all of the unjust and unfair hatred levied against him by society and still hold to his ideals and his sense of duty even though he gets nothing but hatred for it

I stopped reading as many comics of late because of my job and university, I'll probably catch up on a few select titles when I have a chance.

Said off the top of my head, by the way, not "I just did thorough research and have extrapolated exactly 17 results."

Is Spider-Man Peter? I thought they brought Miles into 616. Didn't know Moon Knight still existed given I never hear anything about the character tbqh, figured they'd kill him off or something, I do quite like him, hope he goes to Netflix.

I've actually theorised the bit about comic characters filling surrogate father roles for awhile, first it was as you said, the lack of a father figure, and recently I've seen it as 'defiance of the father figure.'

Where the writers express how much they hate 'strict' characters by writing them into villain roles or just getting rid of them, because daddy didn't buy them an ice cream once.

Never said I felt like a victim, every day I like to sit back, toss back a beer or a couple shots and relish in the fact that I'm a white male, because Lord only knows what else I could be.

Doesn't mean Marvel isn't trying to write them out of their comics.

>change characters that have always been white males into insert-your-oppression-of-the-month
>how dare you disagree with Marvel's actions!

Here's a tip, too: we don't need 2/3rds in rough proportionality with the American population, because white males are the ones that buy comic books.

The new 'feminist' books and 'racial diversity' books are just a shallow marketing scheme to get upboats on Reddit.

Marvel's gone as far lately as turning Captain Britain into a Muslim woman. That was almost the point at which I wanted to drop comic books. I'll wait until they replace Dr. Strange with Neil DeGrasse Tyson first.

>>better start robbing banks
>>I have dead mother!
>>no kid will live without their moms >:(
>Remember how Tim was fresh for having living family and all? Until they got Boomerang'd.

>i dont read comics

nigga, if you dont even know what the fuck you're talking about why are you shitposting here?

Nah, you've just sold out to a defeatist persecution complex

I'm sure I've read more comics than you, buddy. Just not as many in the past, what, 5 months?

You need to take a drink. It's about noon West Coast, 3 East, sounds like a good time for you.

which chimp most resembles you

>Here's a tip, too: we don't need 2/3rds in rough proportionality with the American population, because white males are the ones that buy comic books.

translation: please keep pandering only to me.

Either way Ms. Marvel and FemThor sell well so they dont need to just pander to you.

>WAAAAAAAAAHHHHH EVERYBODY SHOULD READ MARBLE'S LITERAL SHIT OR ELSE YOURE NOT ALLOWED IN MY SAFE SPACE

you said turned Captain Britain into a muslim woman happened lately. Motherfucker that was an alternate universe event tie in from 2013

take your weak shit outta here

>im going to criticize something without knowing anything and look like an idiot

>you guys are actually letting this internet war faggot derail a Cyke thread

sad tbqh

if the only white male in comics you can think of is fucking tony stark then i doubt you read much of anything or maybe youre just stupid.

same writer

>>change characters that have always been white males into insert-your-oppression-of-the-month
>Oh no, a long time Cap supporting character has taken over his mantle, that's never happened before
>A black Spider-Man from an alternate universe who isn't even the main Spider-Man, may horrors never cease
>Thor is a woman? Happened before, her book sucks but the concept of a woman taking the hammer isn't new to CURRENT YEAR
>Ms. Marvel is muslim. The old Ms. Marvel is now Captain Marvel which is not only a more "prestigious" title but one that was held by a black woman

None of this shit is new or exciting and the fact that it bothers you so much is ridiculous

That panel can't be fucking real.

Does Superman pout like he's the only person doing superhero work and sleep with women that try to kill Lois?

*in marvel comics

White men aren't a single unified group. You're just another collectivist who can't understand just how different we all are from one another. I hate that you try to associate yourself with me based on race and gender. We're nothing alike in terms of our thinking.

It just kind of proves what everyone already knew; numales and nigs cannot handle the idea of a hero who does the right thing and happens to be white. They think Cyclops has to be torn down and destroyed

It gets shitposted literally every day, how can you be this new to have not seen it before?

Bunch of berrypickers, I say.
Also, Sup Forumsmrades never miss chance to take bait if it's SJW flavored.

hey I said he was a Batman

Holy shit. People actually bought this.

cease your chimpout

it is

Why don't you personally post some rad Cyclops shit instead of signaling your righteous indignation? I mean, I agree with you that it's sad, but let's turn it around

I love Superman and I hate Cyclops but I like Cyclops BECAUSE I hate him if that makes sense. I like that he's the stick in the mud control freak with enormous psychological issues and huge control freak because he hasn't been able to look at people without hurting them since he was ten years old. I like that he's the NO FUN ALLOWED guy because somebody on the team had to be, he had the responsibility shouldered onto him and he's endured it ever since. It makes him compelling. I love reading about him and watching him fuck up, even if I dislike him as a person.

Because Sup Forums is a bit shitty and I only come here occasionally.

whats the problem here besides some Sup Forums autism about racemixing?

are you gonna crop all the panels where danny rand kisses mysty or all the pages between luke cage and jessica jones?

Cyclops should put Wolverine down.

All you've done is attempt to post examples of what you perceive are signs of your persecution as a white man. You actively surround yourself with feminist rhetoric and multiculturalism, then act like it's society foisting it upon you. It's just been you and the people you hang out with that do it to yourselves.

rad or lewd?

>I love Superman and I hate Cyclops but I like Cyclops BECAUSE I hate him if that makes sense. I like that he's the stick in the mud control freak with enormous psychological issues and huge control freak because he hasn't been able to look at people without hurting them since he was ten years old. I like that he's the NO FUN ALLOWED guy because somebody on the team had to be, he had the responsibility shouldered onto him and he's endured it ever since. It makes him compelling. I love reading about him and watching him fuck up, even if I dislike him as a person.

i don't have any and it's just gonna be that handful of Whedon pages

No, translation: sell to your demographic, don't make it upset with you.

When Marvel gave Falcon Cap's legacy I stopped paying for their comics because I refuse to support it.

Also: nice strawman.

It did happen lately. 3 years ago isn't that long. Maybe it is for you when it's, what, 1/5th of your entire life so far?

But 3 years ago I was still in university. It's not that long.

I'm talking on-goings, buddy.

I am glad to see I've brought out the trigger brigade, though.

Someone even used 'translation:' to strawman my statement, a very classic Tumblrism, in my experience.

The part that bothers me is that they're forcing it for the diversity trend.

It's not races alone, it's things like Squirrel Girl and that fucking bimbo they have as a scientist spouting off about how 'superheroes don't need a Y-chromosome.'

If they weren't politicising it, I'd care much less. But you aren't here to listen to what I'm saying, you're here to strawman and rave.

We're one group in America, that's for sure, because no one but us will represent our interests.

When I lived in Russia, I was a Russian, not 'white.' Such a concept is foreign to a nation. But America is no nation, America is a country, and too polyethnic to be a nation. So I become white here.

>there is no problem here

Well, the race-mixing part is enough of a problem, but let's set that aside.

She's acting like a huge cunt to Thor while doing it, too.

No, we don't actively surround ourselves with it, it's pushed on us. I don't say 'man I can't wait to go outside and look at this amazing multicultural campus (and by multicultural, I mean 90% Asian and 5% white) that I work and study at!

whoops, didn't mean to quote that

i'm shocked no one has done like a Morrison thing with Erik the Red as Cyke's repressed sexuality or something. tho i guess the story would have to happen before he and Jean hooked up

He even has X over his chest.
Oppressive Five.
>Warren, you useless fuck

This user is right, I didn't intend to let my statement derail the thread. I did manage to become guaranteed replies: the person, though.

I'll take my leave so the shitposting stops. Glad to see that Sup Forums's always got some lovers of Marvel's best.

Cheers, lads.

i actually hated Wolverine in the cartoon because he could never use his claws on anyone. yeah, he could cut robots and cyborgs but that doesn't count, anyone can beat robots and cyborgs. at least Cyclops could shoot people with his laser.

>i'm shocked no one has done like a Morrison thing with Erik the Red as Cyke's repressed sexuality or something
That was joked about in one of the SW tie-ins. Not sure which one though.

Wasn't '92

If your identity hinges on being a white male, you've let the collectivist identity politics you're claiming to hate buy out your thinking and define your perception of yourself and the world around you. I'm a man of Western/European descent and we're nothing alike.

I always thought it was the cartoon as well. I've never gone back and watched it as a kid. but from when I remember he was just boring, I always liked morph the most followed by gambit and rogue, as I kid I guess I just really liked their backstories and characterization more than sniktbub. and cyclopes didn't really register much with me until I read the comic. from the comic I recall him being loyal, smart, heroic, and having a pretty awesome super powers compared to the other x-men, but there were some runs where he was more written as a bratty jerk mostly to push more wolverine down the readers throat, maybe it's more the comics than the cartoon that soured him with some people.

>i actually hated Wolverine in the cartoon because he could never use his claws on anyone.
Same shit with Leonardo and Rafael in TMNT.
>omg, Leonardo cut Shredder's fucking head off!
>oh, Shredder isn't actually human and is controlled from belly a la Krang

You push it on yourself faggot. You feast on it