Can someone explain the varieties of german?

what are the names? is the light green one just a dialect? and how did the dark green one end up paramount. it reminds me of an english/scots type situation

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youtube.com/watch?v=C_D4MTpkf-E
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riograndenser_Hunsrückisch_German
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_German#Origins
youtu.be/y-NF1aBMRLk
youtu.be/z1Jfor9KJdE
twitter.com/NSFWRedditVideo

>varieties of german
>what are the names?
???

>varieties of german
umm you know what i mean sweetie
>what are the names?
pic is in german, plus i didn't realise dutch was the same language as german

North people are basically Prussian

South people are basically Austrian

Middle people are real Germans

>i didn't realise dutch was the same language as german

How do the standard written (not spoken) varieties of German differ in the three countries?

i see, so middle german is spoken throughout, low german is distinct but dying,

but bavarian is seen either as the same as allemanic and austrian or they're all seen as different? that's confusing

>17 = märkisches Platt? (On map)

Are you kidding me? It was once the Grafschaft Mark, but people there speak (if they switch to their local dialect) Sauerländer Platt, woll - du Fotze...

Dutch is an independent language in the Germanic family of languages (just like the Norwich languages and English).

It's important to keep in mind that languages do not obey borders. I did grow up close to the Dutch border and I can understand Dutch people with less issued than for example Austrians who are supposed to speak my native language.

And Japanese are Chinese?

Prussians have been a Slawic tribe...
The languages vary a lot on the east West axis...

What the fuck? What are you doing here?

Prussian (the Prussian you mean, not the actual old Prussians) isn't an ethnicity
Not at all.

All written dialects are invalid High-German and just used for colloquial stuff among these speakers or for deliberately humorous stuff.

This is different in Austria and Switzerland, where their language is basically a German dialect and using the spelling of the dialect is somewhat okay-ish. Bavaria can also be included in this list here. Ofc they are learning High-German as well, but using their "native dialect" is just accepted there.

In Switzerland they also have a different spelling where they are not using the ß/ẞ anymore and instead just use "ss". ß/ẞ, also called sharp s, is a ligature (letter combination) of the old long-s ſ (which existed in several Germanic languages) and a normal short s. The problem with removing the sharp s is, that certain words can't be distinguished anymore, like Maße (long a and s) und Masse (short a and s). Swiss logic, everyone...

All dialects are dying. Speaking dialect is considered being stupid and uneducated. It's related to being a hillbilly or a farmer and it's just uncool. You basically sound like a retard when you're talking with dialect to someone else who is speaking High-German.

Just think about how dialects have developed in the past. Dialects in every language are caused by illiterate people teaching their childeren their own broken language for generations and generations. This doesn't happen today anymore, because we are all going to school and learn our language.

There is one exception, though: English in the US. People don't learn their own language at all, because ">muh lingua franca" and the result of this is the popular confusion about there/their/they're, your/you're, its/it's, "should of", and many other shifts in spelling... Good job, Murrica! You're stuck in pre-1700-1800, before the age of enlightenment.

Bhaja...
I am just kind of good in german language, history and culture :)

kind of boggles the mind. that's why i said it makes me think of scots, the dialect versus language debate. when you heard the austrians was it more the accents that aren't standard or were they speaking in tongues?

Everyone north and west of Bavaria is gay

acha zaban nahi hai

Scottish (or better gaelic) is not a part of the Germanic language family, but of Celtic origin

>tfw living in the gay capital (Cologne)
WTF, I ALWAYS LOVED NOT BEING A FILTHY BAVARIAN

Mere zaban German hai Aur mere hindi acha nahi hai

same image as i knew that, scottish gaelic is the name,
but scots is different, it's the dark orange

You probably won't understand it but here's a video of the most prominent German dialects
youtube.com/watch?v=C_D4MTpkf-E

Hope you enjoy it

q? how long have you been in india?

Same here :) NRW till the grave. Born and raised close to Dortmund and although I don't understand this weird Rheinland-language I really enjoyed the people there (besides Düsseldorf)

> I did grow up close to the Dutch border and I can understand Dutch people with less issued than for example Austrians who are supposed to speak my native language.
What?

sorry forgot image
but yeah scots is the same stock as anglo-saxon, but evolved differently, the grey is where scottish gaelic is spoken

2 years soon

But not as a hippie or similar. I have a decent job a live a normal boring life :)
Sometimes I miss home, but it's a friendly and interesting place. Super easy to make great friends.

*Meri zubaan German hai aur meri Hindi acchi nehi hai.
How many times have you posted under this flag and I didn't realise you were White?

>All dialects are dying. Speaking dialect is considered being stupid and uneducated. It's related to being a hillbilly or a farmer and it's just uncool. You basically sound like a retard when you're talking with dialect to someone else who is speaking High-German.
this

>Oral language is broken
The fuck

Sorry dada... to lazy to put a proxy... and after all its hard to identify me as I am one of the biggest defenders of india on Sup Forums

Jay Hind!

>Königsberg
I crie everitiem

heritagefigging is hurting the celts. Their languages are dead but they still spend millions making their roads and public areas bilingual.
cool, don't worry too much about hindi grammar. it's not that useful, a large part of India doesn't speak it, and the upper class of the parts that do use English to sound posh.

Weird - sorry but I cannot explain

I live in Mumbai and people are anyhow often not pleased if desis speak hindi, but as a firangi it's ok.

i had the impression that the standardisation of german had less of an impact that it did with english during the industrial revolution or whatever, and also that many germans didn't like the 'artificiality' of modern standard german

it's pretty dire

don't worry about it

>any germans didn't like the 'artificiality' of modern standard german
thats because it was forced upon them by the prussian bureaucracy

Popularity of local dialects:
Differs from region to region.
In general cities speak more high German while you might even find pride in local dialects in rural areas, but everyone will be able to speak high German.
To special regions I encountered:
>bavaria: Local TV channels in local language
>Rheinland: around carnival they switch to their language for no reason - high German the rest of the year

Other interesting part: Sorbic language in eastern germany spoken as an official language by a Slawic minority

Low German and Hight German (low is north, hight is south).
>North people are basically Prussian
No, Prussians where Baltic people. Even the language was kind of Baltic with influence for the German conquerers (just to remember, during the time, the noble people often don't even speak their countryman language).
The only native Prussian speakers are a bunch of crazy people who like to party like 17 century. (Mennonite and Amish)
Written has being unified by the translation of the bible (the only book that the majority of the people are willing to read, and the press machine). Thanks to Martin, a reform in the church allow the bible to be translated, even for catholics.

i knew that much about bavarian ()
rhineland, it says that the dialect has low franconian influence, would that be why they're WE WUZing?

Why does standard German originate in Hanover?

Is it even worth it to learn a dialect for fun assuming you know Hochdeutsch?

German is far more strict and standardized than English. We even have language reforms every couple of years and the most impactful of them was 1997, which included many new and necessary grammar rules and many changes to spellings, like "dass" in favor of "daß", which is absolutely logical. There are only a couple of people who don't like the standardization, but those are the stupid and illiterate ones.

It's easy to understand how a dialect emerge by locking to examples.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Riograndenser_Hunsrückisch_German
This is the dialect of german that only exist in south brazil because the contact with different cultures and the ban of teaching german during WWII. Despite what people preach, isolation is not a key factor since they have never being isolated.

>Why does standard German originate in Hanover?
It does not... It's just because Hanover doesn't have a real dialect.

>Is it even worth it to learn a dialect for fun assuming you know Hochdeutsch?
If you have the time and it won't confuse you, then yes. You can make fun of people.

Btw, as an English speaker, you will have a very easy time learning Low-German. It's somewhere between High-German, English, Frisian and Dutch. See

see, i got that impression from Sup Forums, that there's germans who are all about being autistic about language, and those who have qualms about it and it's a flip of the coin

>i didn't realise dutch was the same language as german
It's not. We share more words with Afrikaans. German sounds like gibberish to me.

as i understand (germanoids can correct)

west german is a dialect continuum running from Dutch on one extreme to bavarisch/austrian on another with other extremeties like prussian and swiss german.

essentially they're all different languages, but because they blend into each other they are all part of a language family.

standard german isn't the central version of this continuum its just a variety that got a lot of prestige and was widely spoken.

>Afrikaans
Is a pidgin version of dutch you brainlet.

Dutch is related to niederheinisch german which is then related to franconian etc etc

>west german is a dialect
No, It's a region. Prussian, Pomeranian and Silesian are a west Germany dialect.

Bavarian/Franconian/Swabian/Austrian/Swiss>>>Frisisan/Low German>>>Sheep noises>>Standard Germ*n

Dutch is not a german dialect.
Compairing Dutch with German is like compairing Danish with Swedish. It's how you start wars.

wait, poorly phrased, you could see heritagefags as the autistic ones, it's all about perspective isn't it

is allemanic or swiss in the same branch as bavarian/austrian like pic rel

those are all places in the east of germany.
not a diaelct of standard german, but a dialect of the germanic continuum.

>comparing Danish with Swedish
these also belong to a continuum, but a different one.

Only English is younique.

>>west german is a dialect
COrrection

i mean west germanic dialect continuum - as opposed to north germanic (scandi languages) and east germanic (extinct gothic languages)

I think allemanic forms its own branch, as do bavarian, as does franconian.

but they're all more similar to each other than say dutch, because they're all southern (i don't speak anything besides dutch but that is my understanding of the classification)

>Only English is younique.
English is Frisian dialect.

frisian is related to Old English, and even then they're very different from each other.

let alone the fact that old english is completely unalike regular english

they're all norse to me

das riiite

There is nothing to "understand". Dialects in German work the same way as dialects in the UK.

People know the standardized grammar/spelling/pronunciation (High-German here, Oxford English in the UK?!), but in certain regions, people locally use dialects with grammar/spelling/pronunciation variations, because of their parents who also just learned from their parents, and so on. Dialects are a result of high illiteracy rates in times before the enlightenment. That's why we live in a world with many languages, because the same version of a language has never been taught up until this point.

So what happened to the expelees? I'd think most of them went to West Germany but then what?

How exactly did they integrate to wherever they ended up considering entire communities were uprooted and scattered across what remained of Germany.?

as i understand it works differently to this.

you have traditional germanic dialects like boarisch and allemanic and dutch.

then you have dialects of standard german - which might be standard german with a few words and accents thrown in.

in England its sort of the case, but no one considers english dialects (except scots which is nonsense because i can understand it mostly) as separate languages - as dutch or low german or even bavarian are considered compared to standard german.

Speakers of standard German sound gay as fuck, stick to your dialects

if i look at it tells me low german is more intelligible with middle german, than high german is, because low german isn't shown

German is less related to Dutch then Frisian is to English.

now you are talking shit

wait fuck i forgot it was the other way around fuck

>those are all places in the east of germany.
Yes, they are places in germany because what is now germany used to be a place filled with kingdoms and city states.

that's bullshit. but you're confusing the germanic dialect continuum with modern standard german language.
low german is the dotted one in the north.

the weird thing is that standard grman, despite being high german is

go on

And say what?

No I am not. We are not nederduits.
Our language is not lowgerman.

never mind i thought that wasn't a complete sentence

>Our language is not lowgerman.
You're right its low franconian just like niederrheinisch dialects in kleve and dusseldorp.

>the weird thing is that standard grman, despite being high german is
oh i see.

it was developed in a low german speaking part of germany iirc but is high german

you mean hanover?

this hasn't helped

ja

Just to clarify. (some people are having problem understating a basic thing)
The north is lower than the south. This is why It's called low german, and vice versa.

>this hasn't helped
What do you want to know? Ask a clear question. I don't want to read through this whole thread

And your language is anglo-frisian just like in Friesland.

yeah but that is the roots of our language.

our language has undergone a lot of evolution into its own mongrelised self. whereas frisian is very dutch/german and dane-ified so its not particularly similar to english anymore.

Dutch on the other hand hasn't be completely isolated from the other german dialects like we have

just talking to the bong about
>>Why does standard German originate in Hanover?
>It does not... It's just because Hanover doesn't have a real dialect.
what did he mean by this?

it evolved in hanover because it was an important trade city in germany with people from lots of places with lots of dialects and the most efficient means of communication was standard german, not the hanoverian local dialect or something like that.

same goes for mandarin in beijing.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_German#Origins

that makes me think about prussian-hanover relations and the german who said the prussians were the ones who forced it on germany.

so standard german was developed in writing by the high german speakers in the south, then it took hold in the north, and the prussians then standardised it and hanover was the epicenter of this. how accurate is that?

Modern english has as much bastard dutch words as germany has. We traded and fighted with everyone with our drunk heads.

Just because one tiny minority in germany has based their german dialect on us doesn't mean we based our language on german. If I would go there (and I have, it's lovely) I can't understand a word of what they're saying.

you are an actual idiot.

the point is not that dutch is based on standard german. its that west germanic is a dialect continuum that belnds one dialect into another.

dutch blends into maastricht dialect which blends into niederrheinisch which then blends into other german dialects which will eventually blend into anything else.

english, doesn't belong to a language continuum. it has a common ancestor with frisian but it doesn't start blending into frisian at any point.

Its not just about iliteracy
You cant just call a language broken before it got standartised as the oral transmissor and the community is in the right how to handle their language.
Now if these arent linguist memes then our dialects derive from different germanic tribes as the areas of allemanic, ripuarian, thuringian roughly overlap with the early medieval realms that were established. Thats not really broken as there was nothing to break, but a carrier of identity that now has become irrelevant as the standartisation has gotten its legitimacy.

Regiolekts still exist tho.

>in the south
no, it was a development of writers all around the "German" speaking area, but the pronunciation was "standardized" in the north around Hanover where the local dialect died eventually

Standard ist keine Art zu stehen...

English is also west germanic, mr snowflake.

low saxon dialect i'm guessing

Hab ich was falsch geschrieben oder ist das ein Witz den ich nicht verstehe?

alright, i think that'll be a good time to close the thread. thanks everyone

yes but its not part of the continuum you fuckhead.

Flemish is unironically the most pleasant sounding Germanic dialect.

youtu.be/y-NF1aBMRLk

*Blocks your path*

Judging by this youtu.be/z1Jfor9KJdE it certainly is not. The sounds remind me of Yiddish.

>starts to swear
Please, you need to do more research. I'm not helping you in your research as you are not nice and should reconsider your life.

>The sounds remind me of Yiddish.
Yiddish is not a jewish dialect?

Yiddish is a weird fusion language. I don't know which language family it belongs to, it's like a mix of Germanic, Semitic and Slavic influences.

I made the comparison to Yiddish because I find them to sound relatively similar (only the sound, I'm not saying at all that they're related or mutually intelligible) and I find Yiddish to sound ugly so I don't think Luxembourgish would be the most pleasant sounding Germanic dialect.

Yiddish is basically a german dialect with some words of middleeastern origin and newly made up ones thrown inbetween.
You usually can understand half of it.
They used to sit here for a thousand years after all, that rubs off.

Anyone still speaks Yiddish?