What will take its place?

How can America wage a bloody war without bloody, dirty close combat aircraft?

The F-35 will never fly low to support ground troops.

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youtube.com/watch?v=zHwLs2oIsCQ
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NASA_X-43
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youtube.com/watch?v=aOYWbxrlGko&ab_channel=UTubePressOnLine
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Helicopters are a thing now Günter.

drones

>falling for the brrt meme

It's not just a meme, this plane has a big psychological impact on the soldiers. By its shape, its sound, and its well known efficiency, it boosts the moral of the GIs and often makes the enemy flee.
Things like that really count.
In Afghanistan sometimes the troups asked a Mirage to fly low and loudly, just to make know the enemy that the fight was over. And it works pretty well.

this

Helicopters also crash as soon as you throw a rock at them

Whats better, a Mirage just being loud or a A-10 BRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRT'ing all over the enemies.

pretty interesting actually
youtube.com/watch?v=zHwLs2oIsCQ

Well ours do, Russian choppers are built like tanks.

something like this magnificent bastard

the SEALs have already bought some for themselves, because they have discretionary spending that no lockheed lobbyists are able to block

if it's good enough for SEALs it should be good enough for anyone

as a bonus it's from BRRRRRRRRRazil

BRRRRT, unlike a Hellfire, is a very situational weapon.

The F-35 is dogshit

Not as good as the warthog for ground support
60 year old planes can out dogfight it
Some radars can already detect it

>but we wanted an plane that can do evruthing

When you surpass fucking hadrians wall for "most expensive military project" and yet the fucking thing still can't do shit maybe it's time to give it up

As for us.. We need to re open development of the plane in pic. Only a true nationalist Canadian knows this plane and its history but I'll give a point to any non leaf who can guess without reverse searching

The A10 is so fucking beautiful.

AYOO HOL UP

Am I seeing this right?

Did the burger just admit the Russians have something better than them?

That's a one in six gorillion rare post

Oh I agree

You guys should just make an updated A10 a "super warthog" if you will and use that instead

>propeller plane
>2016

What the fuck lol.

Enjoy trying to outrun literally anything.

>The F-35 is dogshit
It doesn't even work right yet, it's going to cost like 1.7 trillion dollars plus tax, and it's a fucking retarded design-by-committee abortion.

Our most enduring and highest performance, the "best" aircraft were all designed by small teams.

Pic related, it's from Boeing. Guess why the F-35's a turd? Because there is only one white man in five on the team.

>eu flag

Hmmmmm...

How the fuck did you get an EU flag?

Stealth is not an on/off thing, the F35 can detect and kill 4th gen fighters before they know it's there. Hating multiroles is fucking retarded considering even the F-15 was turned into a good strike fighter.

A10 would be fucked up by any enemy that has even modern MANPADS, not to mention SHTF scenario where actual enemy fighters would be in the air

Rufag proxy
>Muh pootin

It's a flying tank.

The A-10 is well past its use-by date. Were America to be engaged in a real war, it would suffer horrific losses. It's only used now against insurgents who are severely lacking in anti-air weaponry and a complete lack of air-to-air weaponry.

it will outrun this, which is all it has to do. it's a low-cost anti insurgency plane you nitwit.

good luck with your top gun fantasies tho

>Were America to be engaged in a real war, it would suffer horrific losses.
That's not necessarily true, they're not going to just throw the plane into situations where it's going to fail like air to air combat.

Where do you get your military analysis? You don't appear to have any inclination for strategic thought.

>the F35 can detect and kill 4th gen fighters before they know it's there
LOL, all in theory, if the shit's working right, and assuming that Russia and other powers haven't created countermeasures or ways to detect the new spread-spectrum "stealth" radars we're using.

Interesting. It's sad that you spent so much money on that. You could have literally afforded 3 trips to the moon or something.

My pic related is actually a Canadian designed plane that our stupid corrupt government killed off. It was great designed in the 50s and very far ahead of its time to the point where with modern computers onboard it could possibly go against many modern planes. Oh and it didn't cost a fortune (considering the completed project could have probably done Mach 3 in the 50s)

He's in Brussels

It still has reduced RCS, of course it's detectable at certain ranges but not far away by current aerial radars. Once again stealth is not an on/off thing.

F35 hatejerk is a reddit tier meme, inb4 some pierre sprey lemon comments

>F35 can kill before they know it's there

And our plane could have been so fast that by the time you got the radar blip you would already have a missile headed down your throat.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NASA_X-43

/thread

Yeah, that's why the MiG 25 is the best russki fighter there is rite?

>F35 hatejerk is a reddit tier meme
Shilling on the board for this flying duck is five eyes shill tier.

Pictured is what we should have gone with but whee, let's design a bunch of new systems instead of upgrading the airframe of a proven workhorse with RAM composites and keeping the rest which works great.

Fucking meme plane, that's what the F-35 is.

>Enjoy trying to outrun literally anything.
It's designed for light portable close air support and undoubtedly would be escorted by actual air superiority planes and UAVs and laser beams and shit on the ships nearby.

It's the Marines, they like to stay all cozy in the boats. They even pretend their buildings are boats.

Wasn't the project scrapped due to Russian spies infiltrating the leaf workers?

The Avro Arrow is no Russian piece of dogshit

The west was robbed of what could have been the greatest jet by government corruption

And was given the shitty overexpensive f35 by government corruption

The government needs to keep out of military affairs more often

Gonna actually post a picture m8?

BRRRT brrrt
BRRRRRRRRRRRT brrrrrrrrrrrrrt

...

Same thing happened here.

Our aircraft industry was destroyed by general kikery from the politicians. We were exporting fighter aircraft by the 1930s, developed our own jet fighters by 1947 (4th nation in the world to do so), developed our own Medium Range Balistic Missile, all sorts of ordinance, and we had this in planning by 1987.

But the globalist politicians don't want us to have our own arms industry. They've dismantled it all.

...

that;s classified

There are several conspiracy theories about it actually. Everything from America being jealous to Russians to NASA wanting to get the engineers from Avro company to Canadian Government wanting the money for themselves

That company as a whole had so many futuristic designs decades ahead of their time. I think the fall of that company set aviation back as a whole

When a plane does mach 1.5 with American spare part test engines you know something went right.

There wasn't a whole hell of a lot the Russians figured out. They say the mig foxbat may have taken some from the arrow but it doesn't seem like they got much from it

There's also a cool theory that Avro company smuggled the completed (but supposedly never flown) complete pototype with full engines. After the cancellation people in Toronto report hearing what they could only say was the unique sound the arrow made while flying the radar operator at Toronto airport said there was a blip that never appeared again (could be explained by getting up to full mach 3 which would probably have put it well out of range quickly) and a man living near an RAF base reports seeing a very strange delta winged craft landing there all on the same day

Very interesting story. There's even a company that wants to create a new design based off the arrow (super arrow) and adopt that instead of the F35

And here is the Pulqui II (1952), a contemporary on par to the North American F86 Sabre and the MiG-15, and extremely advanced for its time.

Are you seriously shilling for an aircraft from the 50s?

Damn I know that feels

They don't want us to be advanced. They can't control us that way

they're literally bunker death machine things

...

>Were America to be engaged in a real war,
Next you tell us that America should also prepare for "sword to sword" combat, because if that were the case, America got not enough swordfighters.

Today's wars (all of them!) are between a major superpower and terrorists or some small faggot countries without any actually working military equipment.

Producing aircraft which aren't up for the task at hand is just ludicrous.

This is literally the best plane in DoD inventory. Nothing can replace it.

RIP in peace A-10

An aircraft from the 50s that could possibly beat most planes today

If the Avro company had stayed in business we would probably have an unimaginably advanced new fighter

Think they built that in the 50s but it looks right at home in the present day

Imagine what they could have built now

And you're shilling for an overpriced slow plane that's plagued with problems and should have been released years ago. I'm mourning the loss of a great company that was made up of a close team of geniuses

CF-105 Arrow
First flight: 25 March 1958

Impressive

Air Force fag here, think of the F-35 as sort of like a new age F-16. It's meant to be sold to foreign countries, run all sorts of different mission types, and be cheaper and in higher numbers than its brother the F-22. Think of the F-22 as a new age F-15, it's the superior aircraft in nearly every way but is more expensive and designed to only be brought out when you actually need it. Also the F-35 is not completely finished yet, it has made leaps and bounds over its development cycle (as should be expected) and is not nearly as shitty anymore, it's not an amazing aircraft by any means but it's not even half as bad as some make it out to be. I would expect that atleast you guys out of everyone wouldn't believe everything you read online.

I doubt America will ever fight a bloody (for them) war ever again.
Media backlash is too strong and their soldiers too cowardly.
Even Afghanistan wasn't a bloody war (for them).

Just remote strikes and special ops.

Oh one more thing, I'm definetly not excusing it for how expensive it has been to develop, the financial aspect of the project and the politics behind it are retarded and not acceptable. However it's not even close to being the COMPLETE failure people like to say it is. Just my 2 cents.

>take apc and scale up to size of bus
>triple thickness of the armor
>attach large engine and rotors, many weapons
>air gopniks in front, regular type in back

This is Russian helicopter design strategy.
youtube.com/watch?v=_oBWkFiztV4

Our weapons have far outscaled our craft production.

I mean why in the world in a modern war would you need something like an A-10?

"To fly close and support the ground troops", What ground troops? It's all urban warfare, a helicopter is infinitely better at that.

"To dogfight"... Dogfighting these days barely exists. Everything is homing, and everything is moving supersonic. There's never going to be a time where you're trying to get 'behind' someone while trailing them with a machine gun.

Completely antiquated. Modern Wars will likely be fought almost completely with missles, rail guns and maybe energy weapons.

Once the losing country is decided that country is demoted to afghanistan status and they go in with basic tanks and door to door infantry like we did with the sandpeople.

The cost is the whole reason it's a failure.

My country can only afford 37 F-35's.
That's only just enough for training and homeland defense.
So we can't even use them abroad in any actual war.

I shit on it because it's completely battle-untested as far as anybody knows in the civvie world, and we're kind of betting the farm on this thing.

Also I don't trust stealth technology, I think it's mainly a meme. I know this is near heresy for somebody in the chair force to hear but I really believe it.

>everything is moving supersonic

Not the F-35

The A-10 is insanely good at destroying enemy armor and bunkers/places where they are hold up. To think that wars from now on will only be fought in urban settings is very narrow minded of you. The main advantage the A-10 has over a helicopter is how hard it is to hit. It's an aircraft zooming above and past you vs one that is hovering in relatively one place or moving at a slower speed.

I laughed

youtube.com/watch?v=aOYWbxrlGko&ab_channel=UTubePressOnLine

It sounds like a monster roaring in the distance

pretty scary desu

It is pretty much battle-untested, we actually just ran a few weapons tests just last month for the first time. I can understand your skeptism on stealth but it's not complete bullshit, it works most of the time but yeah it's not perfect.

I crew 35's. The platform is capable, 4th gen cunts can't dance with it and the A10 is a thing of the past. Get over it. Keep reading Gizmodo if you don't believe me, youtube video comments and that smear campaign from the general dynamics faggot who likely lost out on a lockmart contract. This fucker isn't all for nothing, just get ready. >inb4 shill

YEE HAW GO GIT'UM

F-16: 5000 planes built at a cost of 20 million per unit at today's dollars; RFP went out in 1972, first flight in 1974, introduction 1978, operational 1980. Still flying, workhorse of the USAF next to the A-10 in e.g. Syria and Iraq.

F-35: 171 built, 2400 planned in total, built at a cost of 200 million per unit (incl. engine, excl. development), contract signed in 1996, first flight in 2006, introduction 2015, operational status date completely unknown.

The F-35 can never and will never replace the F-16. The F-16 will just continue to fly, because the military needs it.

1 F-35 vs 4 or 5 Griphen?

>in b4 hurr money in infinite, just spend 101% of GDP on your military I need my expensive toy.

Shit, and I saw the documentary about this the other month. The Arrow?

Fucking treason that the project was shut down and blueprints destroyed.

ITT: 17 year old armchair generals

You use it in zones where you already have 100% air superiority with your billion dollar, bleeding edge fighters. You then send these guys in to support the ground troops.

It's not like an A-10 had speed enough to outrun enemy fighters either.

F35 squads were stood up nearly a year ago.

The Netherlands can afford much more than that EASILY. Eurofighters actually cost more.

F35 is really the only option, as all others will be extremely outdated in a decade or two.

It's a turboprop. It's only slightly slower than the A-10.

Is the F-35 project the single greatest example of Sunk Cost Fallacy?

I'd imagine, even aside from initial procurement costs, maintaining it is only a fraction the cost of a modern generation jet.

It looks adorable. What is it ?

Abo, please. It's not meant to dogfight, ground attack plane are meant to have lots of loitering time which is something propeller planes are good at.

>"Le F-35 is shit" thread
>not linking to WarisBoring dot com

>insanely good

Not really. In an environment where it has air superiority, it does okay. The BRRRT isn't even particularly amazing against armor, especially newer armor that appeared since the a10's inception. It's really just a A2G missile boat.

Its purpose was to be a cheap way to play cleanup against shit tons of Russian armor after we established air superiority and SEAD'd the fuck out of enemy aa.

That scenario doesn't exist anymore, so she got repurposed into a goatfucker axe swing, but F16s and F18s are just as effective at delivering anti-armor munitions, if not better due to their higher speed and evasiveness.

I think these prop planes also have better loiter time that is good for cas.

It's the Embraer 314 Super Taco

You're right, Kiwianon. The Tucano is underpowered for CAS in a place such as Afghanistan or Syria.

>Super Taco

Classy, senpai :^)

That is my understanding as well.

The American military has a hard-on for pissing away money on overpriced, overkill weapon systems of questionable value, so we probably won't do it.

lol sandnigs be like:

ALAAAAAHU AKBAAAAR!!!!! ALLLAAAAAHU AKBAAAAARR!!!!!

ALLAHU? ALLAHU AKBAAAR!!!
ALLAHU AKBAR????

ALAHU AKBAR ):

It makes sense from a historical point of view. In the first world war, America was initially very poorly equipped in some important areas. Arguably that barely changed over the course of the war in regards to their tanks, while they made some major efforts to create better and better aircraft throughout. I believe that after the war, initial inadequacy left a lasting impression on the military and they resolved to never by out-teched by enemy hardware ever again.
Today, however, I believe it's just an excuse for greedy corporations to extort money from the government via successful lobbying groups.

>Brazil creates the pinnacle of prop-fighter technology

wow, america are you even trying?

>first world war

Shit, I meant second.

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Why don't they just mount the gun on a uav?

Is anyone here trying to become a fighter pilot or is already one?

>Why don't they just mount the gun on a uav?
Hello! Anybody in there?! Knock knock! The Brrrrrttttt was built around the gun. the pilot doesn't even take much space at all.

I agree. Don't get me wrong, bleeding edge weapons of war are great. The fact is we simply have no need for them to blast goat fuckers hiding in hills.

Russia's advances in Syria this past year proved you don't need bleeding edge shit to kill these people. Keeping our casualties down is a priority, but I imagine if you compare our and Russia's $$/kill ratio in the past decade we'd look like jackasses.

I know this. I just don't see why the pilot is necessary at all at this point. Without pilots we could be building uav's that far exceed a humans tolerance to g forces. Faster jets that can turn at speeds that would leave pilots unconscious.

thats uuuuuh a photoshopped american YF-17, senpai

even the paint job is the same

Yank soldiers are literally known for being retarded and attacking allies

CAS can be messy and I imagine there's still some benefit to having a real pilot in the air.

Also for the time being it's probably cheaper to just keep using A-10's than to design a new drone that can carry a GAU-8.
All the drones we have just fly level and fire missiles. Doing strafing runs with a cannon is a little different.