The Force Awakens

So I watched this shit after all. I'm not that big of a Star Wars person to begin with but I enjoyed it.

There was one thing though. How was Rey able to defeat Kylo Ren in a lightsaber duel?

Explain to noob.

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He got shot in the stomach moments before by a blast that would kill 99% of people

She believed in herself the mostest

Darth Vader was literally a torso on stilts and in constant pain and he could win again moderately trained duelists.

The actual answer is: Rey is a super force user in a completely different league

JJ stated that Kylo was only trained in the force, the battle with rey was his first melee combat.
Rey already knew how to fight with his stick at least

women are stronger than men, get over it

This tbqhwyf

Because he was seriously wounded.
Because she's super gifted.
Because she was lucky.
Because plot.
>not trained in melee combat

That literally makes zero sense. I'm more willing to accept Rey winning because shes the protagonist/chosen one/Mary Sue/etc.

>this is my biggest fetish

The force, you goddamn falseflagger.

Because fuck the first 3 star wars films and fuck Jedi training from three years old using buckets on their head to shoot training orbs.

Rey had a force awakening like Luke did, in the Star Wars universe your power level shoots through the roof, Kylo was still trained better which is why he did fine despite having a wound in him that'd kill any normal human.

This. sounds like 100% Damage Controll bullshit by JJ about a decision he regrets, even though everybody is already cool with the fact that Rey is simply a Force prodigy

Lol what a moron. He just keeps destroying the movie even more after it was finished.

...

Because the script needed it to happen.

Never mind that it completely deflates a primary villain in the first 1/3rd of a trilogy.

And yet he was beaten by someone who had only ever been in one lightsaber fight before. As the other guy said, at least Rey was clearly trained in combat.

This. In proper lightsaber scenes, it's the psychologically ready who wins.

Obi-Wan can be argued to have lost on purpose (or having actually Won) in EpIV, but in any case he felt he had fulfilled his mission. He didn't need to win in a conventional fashion.

Luke vs. Vader in EpV is obvious. Luke was in over his head and he knew it.

Luke vs. Vader in EPVI has the opposite outcome because though initially matched, Luke gets the emotional boost that Vader couldn't get.

The fight in EpVII is fine. Rey is talented, sure, but also was protecting a friend; Kylo had just killed his own dad, and was in a state of general turmoil, mental and physical

Bullshit he easily jobbed Finn. Reys a Mary sue.

Bullshit! You can box a bag of sand but go to the mma and box those guys as easily. JJs a pile of shit as is his boss Kennedy. Reys a stinking Mary sue.

But Luke only ever used the force to tell him when to fire the homing missiles. Reys a Mary sue.

because she closed her eyes and believed like any good Disney PrincessTM

>mfw people have to argue about which Star Wars movies are the best instead of just enjoying all the awesomeness

>kylo make a laser sword
>don't bother learning how to use it though haha

This is such a normie post

>he still thinks KR is the primary villian

Because she's a reincarnation of the "first Jedi, as revealed in the force sloth scene in Episode 8. Yes, it I agree that it's retarded that they didn't even hint at this fact in force awakens; but the entire story is retarded garbage anyways so who cares?

in yesterday's leaks, if I remember, the french dude said that it was because she kinda tapps into the darkside, and is closer to it than Kylo is, I think.

He's a stinking shill. I've seen that exact post pasta 30 times plus just now.

>posts facebook frog
>calls someone else a normie

Unless they completely up-end it, in which case we have a whole other, even more egregious kettle of retarded fish on our hands, hes going to remain a major antagonist, an antagonist who was eclipsed in the first third of the story, both mentally and physically by a completely untrained, unprepared protagonist.

Regardless of what you think about it in the context of the film 'muh injuries' and so forth. It's a bad move from a pure storytelling angle, and completely removes any threat he posed as an antagonist.

With the bland overpowered MC, the only way of salvaging this shit into an actually interesting story would be to make Rey and Kylo change sides for the third movie.

Rey has like way too much power; Luke can't give her proper training and/or answers, and she eventually falls into the hands of Snoke.

Kylo keeps failing at everything he does and feeling like shit, and eventually comes back to the light side to get things over on his own terms.

Final movie shows both his atonement and her attempt to make sense of her role, and in the end they team up to vanquish Snoke and seal Force Usage in general so story stops repeating itself.

Also Phasma goes on a date or something maybe.

> Phasma
> tfw cool tertiary 'strong man' villain a-la plane nazi in indiana jones gets reduced to 'PUT HER IN THE TRASH SHUTE!'

Stop reminding me of why i fucking hate this trash film dude. No doubt even though that place blew the fuck up shes going to inexplicably return too.

Also they could never do justice to such a plotline so you know they're not going to bother, hence the 'more egregious kettle of retarded fish.'

For simplicites sake i pray they don't try and pull such a fucking obvious switcheroo.

The film was setting Kylo up to lose. Rey tapped into the dark side and kicked his shit which caught him off guard. Kind of like how he was surprised Rey was able to resist his mind rape

Darth Vader had a suit keeping him alive, and it's pretty safe to assume he at least had some painkillers being pumped into him.

Ren had no painkillers, no suit, and was likely having to focus his power heavily on keeping his intestines from falling out of his body. He was gut shot but the goddamn crossbow, that thing is powerful as hell.


The fact that anybody questions how he got his butt kicked just shows how many retards there are in the world.

It makes sense that she knows how to fight, She grew up on a hostile planet with raiders harvesting scrap for a living. She probably had to learn to defend herself almost immediately.

But I really wish she'd used some kind of sword instead of the bo-staff. Then it would make much more sense for her to pick up a lightsaber and actually put up a fight.

Even with Kylo injured, she did far too well for having basically no experience with the weapon.

Who the fuck would he have fought with? He was literally the only person around with a light saber. Practicing on a punching bag does not prepare you for an actual boxing match. It makes perfect sense, you're just a bunch of butthurt autists who care more about muh EU than about logic and find anything at all to get your gay little panties in a bunch about.

She gets quite a lot more attractive in profile and isn't *really* a fivehead.

The problem with this trilogy is that they purposely have nothing planned out. They're trying to make it like how Lucas made the OT back in the 80s..just go with the flow.

No. That shit doesn't work now Disney. You had 6 movies and a shitload of EU content to work with. There's no excuse for not having a somewhat planned out story.

Don't forget her being able to resist his force mind probe, as well as out-power his force grasp with her own.

>she did far too well for having basically no experience with the weapon
It's a fucking stick. Yes, it's a lazer stick, but still a stick. Human's have been using sticks as weapons since the beginning of time, if a caveman could figure out how to fight with a stick, it's not surprising that a girl who had a bunch of experience fighting with another kind of stick and who is clearly very powerful in the force would pick it up pretty quick

>another one of those fucks

There no such thing as a Mary Sue. It's just some bullshit that a blogger made up to complain about bad fanfic.

If there were such a thing, Luke and just about every other young hero is the same.

Lastly, I don't here you retarded ass complaining that Luke was able to go from n00b to superJedi after ten minutes with an old dude and three weeks in a swamp with a muppet.

They could easily build a robot or use stormtroopers.

>if a caveman could figure out how to fight with a stick

finn did
topkek

/ T H R E A D
T
H
R
E
A
D

We'll memed friend!

Seriously fucking this.

I am so sick of this Mary Sue bullshit, how do you all not see how fucking autistic you sound? Literally every protagonist in ever story ever fits the description.

Rey's force ability is so ridiculous that I at least think there's some kind of plot reason for it. Like she's some kind of super-embued force user on the level of Anakin or something.

But using a weapon she should have no idea how to use and beating a trained master of said weapon is just kinda dumb.

That and being able to fly the Falcon like a goddamn champ despite living on Jakku for her whole entire life where the two places I felt like they overstepped with her.

The same could be said of swords.
A sword is just a sharp metal stick.
Does that mean you or a caveman could beat an expertly trained swordsman in a sword fight?

it's amazing that a simple morality play for children is too complicated and has to be explained to the prequelbabbies and wookiepedia autists on this board

>an expertly trained swordsman
>kylo ren

you must be joking

He's spent years training to be a knight under both Jedi and Sith masters. He's probably pretty good.

Skilled enough to wipe out all of Lukes other apprentices.

>He's spent years training to be a knight under both Jedi and Sith masters
We don't know how long he was with Luke, and the Sith don't exist anymore. Who after Luke was training him to use a light saber?
It's very likely that he didn't have much experience with it under Luke, if you remember Luke's training with Yoda, he never actually trained him to use the light saber, he was training him to use The Force.

>skilled enough to wipe out a bunch of children

yeah i bet that was a challenge

>ganged up on a bunch of trainees with his knights of ren, Captain Phasma, and and bunch of stormtroopers

Must be a total badass

>He's spent years training to be a knight under both Jedi and Sith masters
I think part of the problem is that you fags make up all this bullshit in your gay little imaginations that isn't actually in the movie.

1. We have no idea how long Kylo was with Luke or how much he actually got trained on the saber
2. As the other user said, there are no more sith, and who the fuck would have trained Kylo after Luke? Snoke? We have zero reason to believe that they had ever met in person, let alone that Snoke even knew how to use a light saber. Snoke isn't sith, there are no sith or jedi, nobody (other than luke) could have trained kylo to use the saber

So in what world did Luke not start training as many Jedi as he could from day 1 of dead empire.

You really think he had no adept or knight level Jedi in his association before Kylo was old enough to start training under him, let alone old enough to massacre everyone?

> Ren betrayed his fellow Jedi students, and, due to Ren's skills with his lightsaber, he killed them all, essentially destroying Skywalker's new Jedi and his hopes of bringing back the Jedi Order.

>So in what world did Luke not start training as many Jedi as he could from day 1 of dead empire
Uh, in the world that exists in Star Wars. As was said, you fags just make up a bunch of bullshit that isn't in the movies and act like it actually happened. Unless it is said or implied that Luke had trained other Jedi before Kylo, there is no reason to think he did.

>due to Ren's skills with his lightsaber, he killed them all
No, it was due to him being the only one of them WITH a light saber. He made his own shitty one himself, and there is no indication that any of the trainees had lightsabers.

Seriously. Get out of your gay imagination and pay attention to the real world.

> Stop imagining your own headcannon that's directly stated in the films and accompanying media released by Disney!
> HES THE ONLY ONE THAT HAD A LIGHTSABER BECAUSE HE BUILT IT HIMSELF!

Are you serious?

>seal Force Usage in general so story stops repeating itself.
They become Kreia?

>Snoke said he didn't even finish his training

>Rey was fighting ever since she was a child in a hostile environment

hmmmmmmmmmm why did he lose

Same reason that Luke flew an X-Wing well and landed a one in a million shot even though he only used a tatooine spacecraft before

PLOT

THE FORCE IS JUST PLOT

>starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Kylo_Ren's_lightsaber
fuck off, pleb

Rey beat him because he didn't intend to kill her but she had every intention of killing him. He was trying to spare her/injure her so he could take her on as an apprentice. The same thing happened to Vader when he fought Luke in RotJ.

Fucking this, and thats not even considering all the bullshit Anakin pulls off in TPM. The whole mary sue thing only ever become a meme talking point because Rey is girl. Even Rey flying the falcon is more believable than Anakin because you can visual see she's terrified and not going:
>WHATS THIS BUTTON DO?
>OOPS
>YIIIPPPPEEE
>NOW THIS IS FLYING!

So where does it say hes the only one capable of building a lightsaber of all of Lukes apprentices?

>using logic and the information we have actually been provided instead of ignoring logic and making up a bunch of nonsense you treat as facts

Clearly you aren't a TRUE Star Wars fan

Are you seriously. Seriously trying to act as though people weren't pissed off about all the fucking shit Anakin Skywalker pulled in The Phantom Menace?

Are you literally 12? Jesus H Christ.

It says he built his own light saber.

None of the media has told us that any of the other students had light sabers.

Therefore, we should not assume they did.

It's not that fucking difficult, you unbelievable retard.

Dafuq

>facebook frog
Say what

>It says he built his own light saber.

A regular ritual of every Jedi ever seen before in any and every other piece of Star Wars media.
Luke built a Green lightsaber all on his own. Why would he deny his other apprentices such a central aspect of the Jedi way?

So why are you assuming all the others don't have them? Sound to me you're doing the exact same shit you're accusing me of.

>Rey is a super force user in a completely different league
This and she already had some melee knowledge so it's not a stretch to assume she could best a dude who took a shot that throws mortals across rooms.

youtube.com/watch?v=PqaiKmm8gsY

It makes more sense than most things in the movie. The luke who casts away his lightsaber here is a Luke I could easily imagine simply not training his students in that. Feelings of inadaquesy and abandonment from that could even be why he was turned by snoke

Given the amount of prequelbabbies on this board, yes

>JJ stated that Kylo was only trained in the force, the battle with rey was his first melee combat.
This is so dumb. So Snoke has never once tested his protege in actual combat? I can understand there not being a lot of lightsaber wielders around to practice with, but you'd think someone would at least spar with Kylo. Sith are supposed to be all about strength.

>So why are you assuming all the others don't have them?
I'll say this one more time....

BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T BEEN TOLD THAT THEY DID

Seriously dude how goddamn dense can you be

>character wears black and has a lightsaber so he must be a good fighter

Why are Star Wars fans such niggers?

Well, Luke needed a lightsaber because he was going up against other Sith with lightsabers. Maybe he thinks they're a distraction from the Jedi's role as mediators. If he was reopening the order he'd probably make a few changes.

But it still seems like a long shot.

>that spacing
You have to go back

SNOKE

ISNT

SITH

YOU

FUCKING

IDIOT

>character starts off strong at the beginning and falters later
one movie without the bogstandard heroes journey and everyone chimps out

>How was Rey able to defeat Kylo Ren in a lightsaber duel?
If you don't understand how you are legit retarded.

Then what is he you, you... double-nigger

Jedi who got impaled in that vision didn' have one either

she's a strong independent woman with a beautiful smile who can do anything she puts her mind to

>How was Rey able to defeat Kylo Ren in a lightsaber duel?
This basically. Which isn't out of place in Star Wars in itself, but the way the film is written makes it hard not to connect her jarringly sudden victory against Kylo with the casual ways she succeeds in the rest of the movie up to that point. It robs it of impact and significance and makes it feel instead like just another contrivance to make us think she's cool.

It doesn't help that there's a disconnect between the "injured and distraught" Kylo the movie tries to set up and the way the fight itself actually proceeds; it's like the screenplay and director were on two different pages.

>every person in the star wars universe is either a jedi or a sith
>every bad guy in star wars is a sith
>my tiny tard brain cannot process the possibility of anything else

I was more thrown off by the light sabers just leaving surface wounds, right after they were slicing through trees.

>It doesn't help that there's a disconnect between the "injured and distraught" Kylo the movie tries to set up and the way the fight itself actually proceeds

I mean the fight is pretty good, the way he wildly clips trees and rocks with his sword is kino

Rey is a Mary Sue because she is instantly liked, trusted and put on a pedestal by everyone she meets.

Han Solo wants her on his crew and trusts her enough to work on the Falcon. Chewbacca watches over her and rips off Unkar's arm to protect her, who also wants her for inexplicable reasons. Maz is willing to give her a lightsaber, and not just any lightsaber, but the Legacy lightsaber of the series. Finn loves her and his sole motivation in rescuing her is that he loves her. The major villains of the movie want her. Princess Leia hugs her and not Chewbacca when Han Solo dies, and personally tell her that the Force is with her. She inherits the Millennium Falcon, Chewbacca, and R2D2 when one of the three most beloved characters in the franchise is killed off. The primary villain of the movie, Kylo Ren, obsesses over her when she is his prisoner and is the first person in the movie to take his mask off to. Absolutely every single thing is handed to her and her competence and personality are never questioned in any way, shape or form by anyone in the movie.

This is what makes a Mary Sue. Not the fact that she has all of these amazing powers and abilities without even trying or without having been trained, but the fact that absolutely everyone she meets instantly likes and trusts her. This is the true mark of a Mary Sue, and it is due to an inability of a writer to create a compelling character. A Mary Sue will always be a stand-in for how the writer wants the fictional characters to react to them personally.

None of this can be refuted. She is a Mary Sue, and it isn't because she has powers and is a woman. It's because she is horribly written and to defend her is to defend bad writing.

THIS

youtube.com/watch?v=4KiR_DICYgM

49 seconds in, you fucking plebs

Kylo was the only one with a saber

Yup.

You never hear one of these cretins squawking about how Luke heard Obiwan, nailed the exhaust, and just happened to save the entire rebellion after one lesson of Blindfolded Lightsaber 101.

If Rey had been a guy they'd be jizzing out their mouths about how awesome he was.

>BECAUSE WE HAVEN'T BEEN TOLD THAT THEY DID

We haven't been told that they didn't.

>we haven't proven that god exists
>therefore we should believe that he does

>Rey is a Mary Sue because she is instantly liked, trusted and put on a pedestal by everyone she meets.

because she's the macguffin. characters should not have to fit a checklist of "PROVE URSELF" for ever film, she impresses both Han and Finn. everyone else, even Maz, gives her things or wants her because she is innately powerful. she's a living weapon

Han Solo spends the entire movie up until just prior to the Death Star run doubting Luke and questioning his competence. They're very first encounter displays that he is a Brash and arrogant individual who thinks highly of himself and doubts that Luke could pilot a ship by himself. It is only when Luke and he make up prior to the Death Star run that they truly become friends.

The very first thing Princess Leia says when she sees him is that he is short. She then spends the rest of the rescue criticizing them for how poorly planned this entire operation is. It is only after Obi-Wan dies that she feels sad for him, and she knew Obi-Wan as well.

Red leader doubts Luke until his best friend from childhood vouches for him. The only two people to instantly trust and like Luke are his best friend and the mentoring wizard who has been watching over him his entire life, both of which are character archetypes that Rey does not have.

Darth Vader does not even know who Luke is in the first movie.

Continuing on into the next films, Yoda immediately talks down to Luke and claims that he cannot be a Jedi. He reluctantly trains Luke even though he says Luke has no patience whatsoever. Jabba the Hutt does not fear Luke and absolutely refuses the Jedi's offer of peace, laughing about it.

The difference between Luke and Rey, setting aside all manner of power level arguments, is that people react reasonably and normally to Luke. Rey however is immediately liked and trusted by everyone she meets and is never so much as talked down to once in the film.

Both Luke and Rey accomplished amazing feats. Both of them have a connection to the force. But one of them is written well, and the other one is not.

a-fucking-men

OR MAYBE the story telling in Star Wars has always been shitty and it's really just a laser light show. There's your equality.