How did the fellowship not know that Moria was taken by orcs...

How did the fellowship not know that Moria was taken by orcs? Wouldn't at least Gandalf know since he travelled around so much? I mean, no one must have heard anything from Moria in years. That in itself should have caused some suspicion among dwarves.

Gimli was in denial

Did you miss the multiple occasions on which Gandalf advised against going through Moria until all other options were exhausted?

It's not like news spread that fast around a medieval-ish continent.

News travels slowly and perhaps greedy dwarves found some treasure they kept to themselves

Shit was hitting the fan everywhere. Sadman coming back ninety years earlier was a go sign for everything 'dark' getting their murder on. It didn't matter if it was orcs or a daemon or kraken, Gandalf knew something was fucked with the mountain and didn't want to spend the time or energy on a symptom when he was trying to cure the disease.
Until he had to.

Did Gandalf know or did he just have a suspicion?

Had a suspicion

Surely the pass of Caradhras wasn't the only other option available to them other than Moria. I would have thought there would be many more easy passes across the Misty Mountains.

Caradhras was one of the only ways of the mountains and at the time they were being chased by wolves and spies of Saruman. They didn't have time to take another route.

The better question is that why wasn't Moria full of poop? There were dwarves living there for centuries and the obviously had to hide their poo somewhere and the orcs just probably pooped all over the place.

I surely didn't miss it. But suspicion is one thing, knowing is something else. The dwarves knew it was plenty of orcs in the mountains. It would be logical to go on a reconnaissance mission or something at least when they don't hear anything from Moria. Saruman knew (perhaps because of the palantir).

Dwarves probably built a sewage system, and there are enough giant empty holes to shit into. Also, Lotr isnt game of thrones so taxation and pooping isnt mentioned in detail

Why did they even both taking the ring to Mordor? Couldn't they just have sent someone with a bucket to collect some lava then take it back and pour it on the ring?

Seems pretty obvious to me and wasn't Gandalf supposed to be a fucking genius or something?

Lel'd. Anyways, dwarves were brilliant engineers. They probably had a system.

Gandalf was afraid of the Balrog that's why he didn't want to go through Moria.

Fuck you. Gondor called for aid and Rohan knew in an hour.

>a bucket with magma
Fucking genious man. Was Tolkien a fraud all along?

Someone would still have to go to Mordor to fetch the lava in a mithril bucket or something. And how would they heat it up later after it turned back to stone? Furthermore its probably more the location than the lava itself that enables the ring to be destroyed.

>Sadman

>giant chasms
they were really giant toilets built by the dwarfs

they knew it was taken, but they also knew moria was much bigger than the force of orcs that took it, and despite fast orc reproduction its unlikely the emptiness of moria could support a huge orc army that is able to monitor every single part of the dark underground at all times. Plus secret entrance the orcs didnt know about etc.

I dont think he knew about the Balrog specifically, or if he did he had probably forgotten long ago.

Gandalf didn't consider the possibility of having to travel through Moria until they were in Rivendell and even then they were set on either travelling over Caradhras or through the gap of Rohan. They only ruled out the option of the Gap of Rohan well into their journey when they realised Saruman was aware of them. They didn't have time to recon Moria and didn't think it would be necessary.

this. see the sitting dwarf skeleton in this image? he was taking a shit when he got killed. the bucket was probably filled with rocks to wipe his ass with, because dwarves are tough.

>Someone would still have to go to Mordor to fetch the lava in a mithril bucket or something.
Yes and? Send glorfindel for crying out loud

>And how would they heat it up later after it turned back to stone?
With a furnace

>Furthermore its probably more the location than the lava itself that enables the ring to be destroyed.
Mt. Doom is connected to saurons will but Its the heat that unmade the ring

Because they had an immensely expensive system that was only able to deliver one and only one piece of information?

I believe it. It clearly wasnt a well since there was no water.

gandalf was just pretending to be a wizard

>in an hour
The montage implied it took over 24 hours

Also a set of beacons can't send information in any detail at all.

He did some magic against the goblin king in Hobbit, and I believe he cast a rune of protection or something against the balrog in Moria, but I think thats literally it except for meme magic.

>>And how would they heat it up later after it turned back to stone?
>With a furnace
>>Furthermore its probably more the location than the lava itself that enables the ring to be destroyed.
>Mt. Doom is connected to saurons will but Its the heat that unmade the ring

If the heat unmade the ring, and its only that hot inside mt doom, reheating solidified lava won't magically make it reach the same temp you dummy

Well in the movie Saruman says

>You know what they awoke in the darkness of Khazad-dûm, Shadow and Flame!

I always think about those guys sitting on top of the mountians in the montage. Its implied its never been ised for generations. Like was it a ceremonial position to sit in a tiny hut on top of the mountains and wait to see if you saw a fire on some of the other mountians? Or like did they exile criminals for the position? This whole momtage really made me think and sometimes I still think about it. Maybe it was like a trip all new soldiers have to take for a week or something

Haha, Tanja. I really, really like this image. Mind if I save it?

moria is so wide and deep, there's no way gandalf could've known where the balrog would be

No it didn't. It's just what it was going over different timezones.

but of course. no idea who tanja is, but it's what i got when i googled "moria well"

"No!"

What was Moria's tax policy?
Why was everybody fine with a random ranger becoming king?
Why didn't they just give the ring to the elves who were leaving middle earth?

It's not the only place where lava is that hot. It's the only volcano within walking distance.

>won't magically make it it reach the same temp

Yeah, but it will scientifically make it reach the same temp.

>applying science to tolkien fantasy universe

bruh, don't be this dumb

how does your "science" explain THIS

They had a good idea that it had, that's why they only went through as last resort.
What they didn't know about was the Balrog.

>What was Moria's tax policy?
Feudal

>Why was everybody fine with a random ranger becoming king?
They werent but they came around when he proved himself

>Why didn't they just give the ring to the elves who were leaving middle earth?
The valar would never allow the ring to reach their shores

Stop replying to obvious bait

Everything on the left is made up by the Japanese and we all know they're a really small species. So the thing on the right isn't really that big, it just looks big by comparison.

The movie is wrong.

How did he prove himself? As far as we know we never see Aragorn govern anything.
Also, what if they just put the ring in a box, gave the box to some elf without telling him what's inside?

Nah Ill keep doing it. Its fun to speculate even if its joke posts.

You'd have thought there'd be other mountain passes in this fictional range created by an author for a fantasy novel? You retarded fucking sperg.

Because destroying the ring was the only way to stop Sauron. Hiding it would delay him from finding it for however many years, but it's academic if he's conquered all of Middle Earth in the meantime.

Why does this meme exsist? Why do people give Martin shit for having a fully thought/fleshed out world?

I imagine many of them probably had houses built their and a family. Or they were already located near villages

This. Gandalf openly said no to going through moria but saruman gave them no other option. They were being hunted remember

BIG BLACK DRAGON

>hide ring
>Men get wiped the fuck out as Sauron conquers middle earth

Someone should have noticed that the dwarves weren't paying their taxes and contributing to the economy, Tolkien is a hack.

Because it isn't that well fleshed out or detailed. Politics in ASOIAF are not particularly deeply explained at all, in particular tax policy.

There was, they could have gone through High Pass, where Bilbo and the Dwarves went and got caught in Goblin Town. You can understand why Gandalf would be reluctant to make that same mistake twice.

How would a dragon that size find enough food to sustain itself?

It was probaby like "that job" that gets thown on the lap of the new guy or that other guy nobody wants around.

Their worlds are based on two enturely different contrasts. Tolkien brings you away from reality and into fantasy while GRRM tries to tie reality with fantasy.

>implying dragons eat

That wouldnt be very cost effective. Morgoth probably used magic to make them subsist solely on their massive ego.

Martin never goes into detail about anyone's tax policies in Game of Thrones, and he shouldn't, because it's completely fucking pointless to do so. He also shows a pretty fundamental understanding of LOTR as a fantasy epic that serves as a mythology rather than a gritty realistic pseudo-medieval world. He also seems to think moral ambiguity is the be-all and end-all of writing.

>random ranger
Aragorn is a distant relative of elrond, the elves knew that Gondor needed a king once more. Aragorn himself was the only person who didn't want him to be king

>enturely different contrasts
Two contrasting fantasy worlds*

Aragorn was the heir of Gondor.

>i'm hungry, better go suck myself off

kek

not sure how else dragons survive sleeping on giant piles of treasure for hundreds or thousands of years

>any plot hole or awkward question you can ask about LOTR
>Dude it's magic lmao

Tolkein was a hack

just like bears in winter

You're pretty stupid

the misty mountains are cock full of gobbos and other orc scum

Dwarves are small. Probrably not much build up over time.

The real quesion is what did the elves do? Never seen an elf outhouse. Did they just shit off the side of their tree forts like ewaks?

But that was what? A matter of days?

Morria looked like it was taken MONTHS ago. Was there absolutely no trade in or out of one of the dwarves major cities? How did no one in any of the kingdoms represented in Riverdale know?

How the fuck did Gollum get into Moria after the entrance had been collapsed. Or had he just been waiting inside already?


On a side note, this is the only mistake i've ever found Tolkien to have made: On the Doors of Durin it uses the name Moria. Moria was only ever called that after it fell into darkness. It was derogative (it meant Black Chasm.) and would not have been used as an official title


Wtf tolkien

Moria was taken by the orcs for a couple hundred years before balin tried to reclaim it, and the balrog was alone in moria for nearly 500 years before that.

everyone knew the orcs occupied it, but it was still possible to maybe get through because it what was said here

All kingdoms during the lotr time are past theit glory days and have no real infrastructure. They are all fallen roman empires.

>Morria looked like it was taken MONTHS ago

It looked like it was taken DECADES before. There were skeletons and everything.

>A matter of days?
No, a matter of weeks if not months. Moria is unfathomably huge and very few people would be able to navigate through it without being lost. No one has set foot inside for years. It also takes about three weeks to get there from Rivendell.
>Was there absolutely no trade in or out of one of the dwarves major cities?
Obviously not from Moria. Rivendell didn't need trade with dwarves and Moria was in the middle of nowhere anyway.
>How did no one in any of the kingdoms represented in Riverdale know?
Because the dwarves present at the council of Elrond came from the Lonely Mountain.

>The valar would never allow the ring to reach their shores
So then let the Valar destroy it if they are that powerful

if you read the mangas you would've known that gollum mastered teleportation by the time they came to moria

Did he learn that from Ramsay's dogs?

Gandalf was clearly translating for the benefit of the non-Dwarf speakers in the party. It would be like the convention of calling Bayern 'Bavaria' in English.

Moria was reoccupied by Balin's expedition, but by no means was it reclaimed. It was still in a highly contested state and in the book it said the Dwarves ceased trading with nearby kingdoms centuries ago.

>sinking a ship is equitable to destroying the one ring

lol

>came from the Lonely Mountain
Wtf? Smaug is there...

Gandalf translated it. Tolkien also spent years fixing mistakes and changing details in his works.

moria fell in TA 1980
gandalf visited it in TA 2850 or so (870 years later)
balin tried to reclaim it in TA 2989 (1009 years later)
they all died in TA 2994 (1014 years later)
the fellowship entered moria in TA 3018 (1038 years later)

>Moria was reoccupied by Balin's expedition, but by no means was it reclaimed.

Gimli spoke as if they had an elaborate kingdom there, not just a military outpost.

The Valar couldn't intervene

hackson spoke

...

yeah same universe

Gimli was clearly talking out of his ass. He'd never even been there.

But in The Fellowship Of The Ring there is a drawing by Tolkien of the doors of Durin.
The text on them is in Sindarin and if you transcribe it to latin letters you get:

"Ennyn Durin Aran Moria. Pedo Mellon a Minno. Im Narvi hain echant. Celebrimbor o Eregion teithant i thiw hin."

Clearly the word Moria is there.

wtf hackien....

He was bullshitting because he's a proud motherfucker and also that line isn't in the books. It's like how Americans will talk about how amazing New York or LA is, even though they're Midwesterners who have never been anywhere near it.

He wouldn't talk out of his ass in a situation like this.

the fellowship entered moria in TA 3018 (1038 years later)

38 you mean

>It's like how Americans will talk about how amazing New York or LA is, even though they're Midwesterners who have never been anywhere near it.

Lol do Amerifats actually do that?

He spends the entire trilogy talking out his ass.