Feudalism

Can Sup Forums give a quick rundown of what Feudalism is?

All I know is that it heavily involves property.

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serfdom
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1. serfs are souls
2. souls are taxed
3. read "dead souls" by gogol it explains the whole system really well

peasants live on land, are bought and sold with it, owners of land can exercise complete control over peasants. free to kill peasants as they have no rights.

noble and wealthy own the land and the peasants.

essentially slavery without the titles and chains

Guy learns one weird trick on how to lease his land to people to farm so that they can get protection through a symbiotic relationship

>free to kill peasants as they have no rights.
This part is wrong. Serfs were in bondage, but they had numerous rights.

Hmm... I don't remember the kill but ever being a thing. I'd define it as this...

A social, political and economic system, most prominent in Medieval Europe. A feudal society was typically ruled by a king, to whom noblemen pledged loyalty. The noblemen were able to rule over expanses of land, but had to be loyal to their king, and had to fight for him or supply troops for him when he went to war. In the land ruled over by a nobleman, there would be many families of peasants. These peasants were effectively tied to the land and its current master, and generally couldn't move away or get married without the nobleman's permission. The peasants were expected to work for the nobleman, in exchange for protection and a (meagre) livelihood. Especially in the later Middle Ages, a growing merchant class effectively lived outside the feudal system, self-employed and not loyal to any particular nobleman. This class would spearhead the shift from feudalism to capitalism.

Bit, not but.

YOU ARE PEASANT DIE

SWEET NJ-BASED FOLK/CABARET BAND

look at south italy
it is what feudalism looks like in 2016

The land is divided into fiefs. Each division of land has peasants living on it that are legally tied to it. They work the land.

The fief is owned by a lord. He owes them protection, they owe him a certain amount of labour or goods.

The lord owes loyalty to another lord above him. His overlord also owes loyalty to another lord, like a Duke or a King. This creates a network of fealty which creates a sovereign state.

westeros basically

You lose all rights and become a serf (slave by any other name). You live your life in poverty and pray to God every night that your children live to adulthood.

Near 100% restriction of social and economic mobility: you are born to a funcion in life (99% likely to be 'peasant') because your father had that function, and your children will have that function.

In *theory* it works as such: the peasants provide food, the lords provide protection, the church provides for your soul's salvation. In reality everybody's constantly trying to fuck each other over for a few more measly scraps of resources and refuses to integrate/work together.

It's a complete assinine way of life and that's why it's widely considered half a millenium (up to a millenium in other parts of Europe) of wasted time: no technological advances, no economic development. It was a complete catastrophic system, and it took an even bigger catastrophe (the plague(s)) to fix it - by completely breaking the system.

Some people itt are confusing manorialism with feudalism.

Manorialism was the system by which peasants were given land to work by their local lord.

Feudalism and manorialism go hand-in-hand but it's a good idea to distinguish the two because manorialism outlived feudalism by a long shot. It started before Feudalism and continued on long after Feudalism ended.

slide thread

a libertarian paradise

this will help

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serfdom

Socialism is literally feudalism.

Capitalism destroyed the former system, which was feudalism, and socialism is an attempt to bring it back.

Under feudalism, there were no private means of production, everything belonged to the community, embodied by the feudal lord. Replace the lord by the party commissar, and you have socialism.

The Marxist system in the end works in EXACTLY the same way as feudalism did.

The means of production are not controlled by private persons, this is exactly how the feudal system works. Ever heard of the Royal We? The holder of the feudal domain does not consider himself as a private person, he represents the community. Exactly the same way as a union leader or any other representative of the people.

Socialism is identical to feudalism in the sense that the means of production are controlled by one leader. It's irrelevant if the leader has the title of Marquess, Baron, or Workers Council Chairman. The fact is that there is one leader and an independent person cannot do anything that leader does not approve.

Under feudalism, specialist workers were organized in guilds, under socialism the guilds are called trade unions. Same thing, different name.

Under capitalism there is freedom. You are restrained only by your own personal limitations. And that's why so many people hate capitalism. They hate to admit their own limitations, so they try to transfer it to someone else. You're not in debt because you cannot plan your finances properly, the problem is not that you flunked math, the problem is the bank that lends you money.

What the capitalist system accomplished was to liberate the means of production from the political system. It doesn't matter if the people in control are called a king, earl, senator, or commissar, the result is the same, the means of production are controlled by representatives of the community, be it called feudalism or socialism.

Sliding what?

To understand feudalism you should look at Alexander Del Mar books (archive.org)

actually he wrote great pages on money and its meaning in the power structure

but

as you asked about feudalism, he expalins the passage between the fall of the roman empire and the rise of noble families allegedly owning both the land and the farmers.

this is the known vision about feudalism, what Del Mar explains is that the property - or the use of the land and the people on it - was passed from CAESAR to the holy roman empire and than to the nobles thru the priests.

>alexander del mar

read his books
they are great

INB4 OLD BOOKS
Yes?

TRUTH HAS NO AGE

capitalism is the means by which the bourgeoisie replaced the aristocracy as the ruling class, senpai. let's not kid ourselves here

pls stop embarrassing yourself

feudalism is manoralism on a pyramidal scheme

>you're right

It's also the means by which thousands if not millions of serfs, who were slaves in all but name, managed to get away from being worked to death by someone who owned them and control their own production and consumption.

You use the word "bourgeoisie" to denigrate the people who, up until the Feudal system began to fall apart, had literally zero control over their own lives.

Life would be so much fucking fun as a nobleman. Life would become an RTS

Do you have a counter argument?

Crematorium and a bakery aren't the same thing simply because they both employ ovens.

exept that you are wrong

feudalism involved many social factors that where/are not employed in socialism
feudalism centered around agriculture while (im going to say communism) centers around industry
in feudalism you have a varity of diffrent social casts, a vast array of people in varying degrees of bondage and freemen, you also hade such things as knigths and vassalage
mean while in (im going to say communism) you really only have two casts workers and leaders (even tho they aspire to be classless this is impossible since you must always have leaders)

Guilds where obviously comprised by skilled workers but they operated in a system much closer to capitalistic cartels for lack of better words then anything els
meanwhile trade unions where basically what they are today, exept that that the most skilled workers where choosen for the trade unions instead of who ever wanted to be a unionist (im guessing the reasoning there was that the skilled workers would know what the wokers in their union needed and how the workers would operate best)

A crematory and a bakery are indeed the same thing for the people being chucked into the ovens employed by said crematory and bakery.

HINT: You, me, and everyone on Sup Forums are some of the people that would be chucked into the ovens.

Fuck off commies- socialism devolves into a modern interpretation of feudalism with the party elite taking the role of the feudal lords. They live luxuriously while the peasants starve.

This sounds just like the USA.

but.... you cant even cremeate someone in a normal oven user

Im not defending authoritarian socialist states, but we have also dictotarships who are capitalist, its about the economical system not the political. "Socialism is a range of economic and social systems characterised by social ownership and democratic control of the means of production." thats the definition of socialism.

Eh close but not quite, there where many diffrent types of bondadge and in the most common forms the serf actually did have some rigths, and they where usually only made to help out seasonly (bringing in the harvests for example)
and then there where ofc the type of bondadge when you where the lords little bitch and he could take your wife and all your kids whip you to death then burn your house down, if he wanted to but then he would have one less slave so he probably wouldent

>84741184

>unironically defending capitalism
Your wife's son must be proud.

lol no.

Great rebuttal

now please fuck off

actually you know what imma fuck off just to save you the trouble

This pyramid is much more simplified
As if knights could have squires, that provided to knights their services in exchange of equipment
Or people who terminated as crafts had to obey masters and work for them in exchange of knowledge, skill and money

Basically it was hierarchical system, where one layer get into interaction with layer above and below
This system of
Vassal of my vassal isn't my vassal
was present in most countries, but some of them adopted (like England)
Vassal of my vassal is my vassal
So king could demand anything from anyone
While in most countries he couldn't, he could only order nobles, but not peasants, which were owned by that nobles

All the land is property of a lord, who has peasants (serfs) work it in exchange of letting them live in a small house and keep a small fraction lf the produce to feed themselves and their families and suposedly protecting them in case of foreign agression. The lords, in turn, had to pay taxes to a king. Needless to say, were a peasant not to pay the lord his part, he and his family would most likely recieve a severe punishment.

ITT

>Can Sup Forums give a quick rundown of what Feudalism is?
There are two aspects of feudalism:
- Economic: A distribution of economic power (separate from military and political) from a central government to smaller local governments that are beholden to the central government. These municipal governments have nearly absolute power over each locality it governs.

Societal - A stratification of citizenry into specific classes. For example, in shogunate Japan:
1) Nobility
2) Warriors
3) Peasants
4) Professionals

WHY DID YOU SUMMON HIM!

It's ironic that people confidently use the Dunning-Kruger effect as an argument but have no understanding of it besides the summary from a wikipedia article.

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See pic related.

It sounds good on paper, but it can lead to a great deal of corruption when implimented in large nations.

every governement bring corruption when implimented in large nations, especially with democraty

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Feudalism is the precursor to Anarcho-Capitalism, where Ancap has the advantage of Capitalism allowing a far greater degree of freedom and prosperity for everyone involved.

Feudal class structure didn't just have; lords, vassals, knights, serfs, slaves etc it also involved a complex society including:

- Freemen
- Villeins
- Cottagers
- Serfs
- Slaves

All of these had varying agreements of land use/ownership, protection, work arrangements and rent arrangements etc.

Modern capitalism with property investment and tenancy agreements has largely become an evolution of the above system. The only real difference now is that instead of a property owning lord we have temporary caretaker politicians who have the most perverse incentives of any political system yet devised.

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A meme.

that house looks sorta cozy.

>tfw ywn have a grass, oak, and stone house hermit hideaway