People often complain about Steven Universe having an obvious agenda, so I propose to you a question.
Would SU be received better if the entire cast was genderbent? That means it's a show about 3 male gems adopting a female main character, whose deadbeat mom cannot take care of her because her dad died. Also Gems are basically the same but 'all male' now.
nah, Sup Forums would still find something to bitch about
People just think that the majority of a cast has to be straight white males or else that means it's pushing an agenda
The mere existence of gays, women and minorities is propaganda.
This would have actually been good. Male characters tend to focus on their personality and what makes them "them", where this current show just focuses on "hurr I'm a gay women hurr".
Sup Forums always bitches about everything.
So with faggotry in lieu of lezbos?
The obvious agenda is the pro-homo stuff. Not male v female gender politics.
>THIS SHOW KEEPS FORCING IT'S GAY AGENDA DOWN OUR THROATS!
People would mock it for it's homosexual undertones, only with guys instead of lesbians.
Also people would jerk off to female!Steven more.
You guys are fucking retarded, the way this show is written is completely pushing an agenda, genders be damned.
But the show still does that, with all the main Gems. Have you just not payed attention?
I don't think you actually watch it
Can't, the shows agenda taints everything, where with male gems and less agenda the actual story could have shown more.
People pushing female "strong womin" so hard its ruined current media, it will take time before female leads can be taken seriously without an agenda involved.
Yes, the very existence of gay people is pushing an agenda and homosexuality must be censored.
>this thread
Female leads can never be taken seriously, because having a female lead at all is pushing an agenda
lets see
>guy garnet is still extremely gay; made up of a wise, future seeing blue guy and a fired up hot head red guy. theyre generally stoic, but have a playful personality in general
>guy pearl is super gay for bara daddy rose, instead of hw making dainty delicate maidens for service they make dainty delicate twinks for service. still neurotic and obsessed with order/cleanliness, still bitchy at times
>guymathyst is a lazy slob who hates theirself, still a manlet who shifts into the big buff dude they really want to be when they wrestle, still eats like shit
>girl steven is still a bumbling over excited mess on her first missions, still loves songs and jokes and puns, forgiving and empathetic
that being said, Sup Forums and /sug/ would like the story/characters better if they switched, but (despite the homosexual leanings of this board and the conversations/fanart/theories that get posted in /sug/) i feel theyd feel slighted by the lack of female waifus and there would be many threads and posts like this asking for sexy female gems to fap to. so i guess in the end itd roughly even out with how everyone feels about it currently, maaaybe leaning towards genderswap
>Can't
There is literally a reason why every character acts the way they do, it's not super subtle or deep either. Do I have to spoonfeed you? You're just Rorschach test'ing in agendas and things you want to see rather than seeing the obvious characterization at hand.
>People pushing female "strong womin" so hard its ruined current media
SU is literally anything but, it's far beyond that 90's "Gurrrrl Power" strong womyn superficiality.
I think it'd be better if Steven wasn't such a little bitch in Season 3.
Nah if anything it would be worse since the fans would be faggot men and fujoshit.
Plus their irritating flaws like Ruby and Sapphire never turning off their faggotry and Pearl obsession with Rose would still be present. Only now less accepted because straight men can't enjoy the gayness anymore.
>Pearl obsession with Rose would still be present
How's that a flaw? Thirsty Pearl is great especially seeing her finally getting over it.
>Garent - WE memes get stronger
>Pearl - sterotypical gay man
>Amethyst - pro fat agenda continues
it'd still be the same show more or less, except instead of the main character being a boy growing up to be a woman, its actually a girl growing up to be a woman
Kim Possible
Judging by how half the people draw female Steven, it wouldn't make a difference in the slightest.
It's like Frisk.
>pro fat agenda
amy is literally the opposite.
Amethyst is basically the least well adjusted of all the characters (at this point), even after getting a new fusion. So, she's basically proof that if you're short and fat you're going to hate yourself and not be as good a fighter as someone who is tall and anorexic.
To me the issue is that despite being "genderless" they still look and act effeminate.
I don't see the artistic point of making all the gems genderless female non-females if you're going to pull your artistic punches.
The issue to me is that people care about the 'genderless' thing.
It literally only matters in porn anyway.
>Can't
There is literally a reason why every character acts the way they do, it's not super subtle or deep either. Do I have to spoonfeed you? You're just Rorschach test'ing in agendas and things you want to see rather than seeing the obvious characterization at hand.
>People pushing female "strong womin" so hard its ruined current media
SU is literally anything but, it's far beyond that 90's "Gurrrrl Power" strong womyn superficiality.
The only one in the show who is really a "Strong Independent womyn who don't need no man"-type is Garnet, and she's made up of literally two children.
Do you have an issue with namekians?
They're not genderless, just alien.
The SU crew never said they were genderless.
Fans just made that up for themselves.
They're sexless, but Gems like Rose and Pearl clearly side towards the female gender.
You cannot really use Namekians. They're not hyper masculine being alien monks or anything plus they're only like, 40 of them on their entire planet.
it would still be ugly, poorly animated, shitty show that only gets any love because Cartoon Network destroyed all previous action cartoons that actually fucking TRIED.
Also stop making SU threads there are already like five, your show barely deserves one.
Artstyle's still too soft
Characters would still be too emotional
Tone would still make me feel like there are no stakes
This is more of a personal qualm, but I still wouldn't care about the plot
No, I think from a fundamental standpoint, SU is just...anodyne. No amount of genderswaping would make me interested.
The gems aren't hyper feminine either.
Genderless aliens having masculine/feminine traits are a common thing in media, I don't see why it's such a big deal when SU does it.
AHahaha, are you a retarded 12 year old that just wondered onto here? Action cartoons, like what? Generator Rex, Ben 10? Megas?
The very fact that you think any of those shows are animated better than Steven Universe shows your stupidity bias.
>Muh TESTOSTERONE DICK-PUNCH series deserved better!
G't a look at this kid.
No, my biggest problem with the series is that EVERYONE is butt-fucking-ugly and being men isn't going to change the artist sensibilities
The meeting of the minds.
Ruby and Sapphire are mature adults, yo. Short does not equal young in the SUniverse.
I could see how you could argue that Peridot and Amethyst are short and don't act like adults so they could be "children", but Ruby and Sapphire have always acted like adults more or less.
>watching cartoons for waifubait
You should probably just stick to anime.
>female!Steven
thank god this does not exist ___
LOL those character designs
Garnet is the only one with any change at all. Pearl and Amethyst are functionally identical, and all they did was add longer hair to Steven. So lazy.
to be fair, everyone but garnet is already adrogyne as is body type wise. A male!garnet with the proportions regular garnet has would probably be trap bait.
They might've not been the most well animated thing, but damn were they at least eaiser to look at and straight forward in a good way.
And they weren't faggots.
Coop alone is way more relateable, fucker wants a slushy and watch some television and work on his mechcar, go out on an adventure or two for a reason.
He wasn't saying he wanted waifubait, just that everyone didn't look like incredibly early concept "let's get a rough idea what this one looks like and add details as we go along" art, except without the adding details.
Fat little girls are not allowed to be main characters.
I think you just want to teach fem steven naughty things as she innocently acknowledges you as her "big bro".
are you fatshaming user?
No.
Part of what makes the show interesting is how it navigates gender roles and equips the male protagonist with female expectations and a traditionally female powerset. Steven overcomes his problems not because he's strong and virile, but because he's maternal, caring, and tenacious.
To do it genderbent, you'd just have a girl who needs to master a masculine powerset to overcome the world around her, but that's been done plenty before and isn't really interesting, even if it is more true to life.
It's literally pushing the agenda that everyone should be loved no matter who or what they are. It fucking states its own theme many times in the series, and Sugar confirms it.
Saying "What's wrong with that" doesn't make it any less of an agenda. It's still an agenda, even if a positive one. Compare that to something like Gumball whose only goal is to make you laugh even at the sake of dumping on the family dynamic it originally had in season 1.
So? I dont mind that message. Alot of cartoons have messages similar anyways.
ehhhh I'm not buying it
sides I've seen some folks claim that gumball is pushing an anti-father agenda
>I'm not buying FACTS
When Sugar confirms it and the show makes a point to never go against its own theme of love, even if there's potential for a joke, it's fucking true. It's not a matter of opinion, that's the writing of the show. Every interview Sugar has, she talks about how she wanted to make a show that pushed the theme of love.
Gumball doesn't have an anti-father agenda because there are many times him and Gumball bond and a lot of times where he's the butt of the joke, it does whatever the script serves. It also has never been confirmed by Ben, making it all speculation.
You're trying way too hard to make a obvious message sound bad
>themes are agendas
I guess that means 90% of cartoons push a friendship agenda
It is a stupid message, love is for the weak, it is only through hate and tragedy can a person mature, 'love' isn't even real.
No, you're just reading it poorly. I stated an agenda is an agenda, even if it's positive. It is factually still an agenda. It doesn't matter whether it's a good or bad one for kids, the debate is whether or not SU has an agenda. It does.
It's not going to turn kids into pussywhipped faggots on parade floats like Sup Forums thinks, but it is still pushing a strong message that Sugar does want kids to learn from. It's not a gay agenda, it's a love one.
It's only an agenda if the theme is consistent across a show or studio and being pushed. Angry Birds does not have an agenda because it was one movie by one studio. Until they make several movies with the same theme, there is none. But Disney does because they have the same themes across all their films. "Believe in yourself" "Make your own destiny". Do you think Zootopia wasn't trying to push an agenda?
Family Guy and South Park consistently push their own agenda by being mouthpieces of the authors and their political stance on certain issues. South Park consistently calls global warming made-up, that's their own agenda they're pushing.
TTG doesn't has an agenda because it's never consistent. In fact, it makes fun of morals. We Bare Bears doesn't really have one either, a lot of the times, it's just the bears sitting around doing silly things with no real message to be taken out of it. Even The Loud House is suppose to have a theme about family love but that could instantly be dropped if the writer thinks of a good joke at Lincoln's expense.
It's ok when shows push a Chauvinistic agenda but not visa versa
name them.
people dont like being told what to do or how to think, let alone when its laid on so thick.
if anything, making the cast all male would make it worse because it makes the homosexual undertones a lot more obvious, and there's a stronger bias against male homosexuality.
/thread
The sexual politics in stephen universe isn't just a matter of some dualistic switch you can turn on or off OP. It's baked into everything. The character designs, The color schemes, the minor background characters.
The show is also post gay, so simply switching genders is just moving the furniture around in circles..
For me, it's easy.
Change the voice actors. They don't feel natural at all. 3 friggin' episodes and I couldn't stand any of their voices. Damn. Put some women with better friggin' voice acting capacity and then I'll consider watching it.
As of the current time, the voices are grating as Hell.
The only acting I thought was okay was... Opal's, really.
That, and change Steven's mannerism. For the love of God, change it. It irritates me to see him act so... so... I don't know what to call how he acts. Spazz?
>$0.02 deposit into their account.
The problem with genderbending the cast is that then the only competent people in the show are men, which leaves you with a fat, incompetent little girl, Stephanie, and her failure of a single mother, Gretchen. Connie becomes Conrad, a hyper competent young man better at wielding Stephanie's inherited weapon than Stephanie herself. Basically, you're left with something that I absolutely PROMISE you would be called the most problematic show ever and people would bitch from here to high heaven about it.
>Do you think Zootopia wasn't trying to push an agenda?
You are legitimately fucking retarded if you couldn't see Zootopia's agenda. Jesus Christ, the predator/prey thing was such a fucking hamfisted metaphor for dangerous minorities that I think you actually must be brain damaged if you couldn't see it.
Are you speaking to me or adding to my post? Because you seem to be agreeing with me while calling me retarded and brain damaged.
>genderbent
i probably would hate it more.
That depends. Would the show still be popular? If so, then yeah.
>Would SU be received better if the entire cast was genderbent? That means it's a show about 3 male gems adopting a female main character, whose deadbeat mom cannot take care of her because her dad died.
No. Also Greg isn't a deadbeat dad you fuckin' moron.
You just described most of the gay dudes I know.
The equivalent would be to have the girl show paternal traits.
So when male Pearl sees her glowing pink in the distance as she comes to save them, he can just:
>DADDY!.mp3
It would be cool if certain gems were male. Not even all of the same kinds.
Even if it were just Jasper, eye gem Ruby, Peridot, and Bismuth.
Sup Forums would hate Steven a lot more, plenty of Mabel comparisons here. Lots of calls of "self insert" and such.
The lack of waifus with lots of substance would sting a bit, though they would probably just pick up the twinkiest characters (Pearl, Peridot) and run with that.
The gay stuff would be looked at about the same as it is looked at here.
>Making the best females male
What the fuck is you doing?
How does male Rose die giving birth to Steven? Does he turn into a gem sperm and shoot into the vagina? I mean the female rose was pregnant, how in the hell does a male gem turn into a daughter
I would like the show better genderbent because then I'd actually have something to schlick to.
I feel like a show about men being as gay as the Crystal Gems would be in a lot more hot water.
Way to prove his point
>stacy
he had his way with a woman he fell in love with. The show hasn't really explained how Rose gave birth to Steven, so let's just say genderbent Rose mysteriously disappeared one night and then his wife gave birth to a girl with his Rose Quartz gem on her navel.
This is the problem
If they were male there would be no butthurt mentally ill jasper freaks, no Lapidot, no Ruby Pearl faggots, or they'd at least be way less cancerous
>was
The second script fucked that up good. Every predator is male and in leading position.
Still born half gem baby needs spark of life to live.
Daddy hug fixes everything.
Reverse of Madrox.
Do not underestimate the faggotry of Sup Forums, or the faggotry of Sup Forums.
>It fucking states its own theme many times in the series, and Sugar confirms it.
>I stated an agenda is an agenda, even if it's positive. It is factually still an agenda. It doesn't matter whether it's a good or bad one for kids, the debate is whether or not SU has an agenda. It does.
Stop using words you don't know the meaning of.
>agenda
>inf. A usually unstated underlying motive:
Emphasis on "unstated, underlying". The word you're looking for to define Steven Universe is "theme" or "message". If it is made explicit by the author, it stops being an agenda, you imbecile.
>If they were male there would be no butthurt mentally ill jasper freaks, no Lapidot, no Ruby Pearl faggots, or they'd at least be way less cancerous
You don't know much about yaoi fangirls, do you? Because that's what we would have in our hands.
This. There is a very strong theme in the show about love, how it comes in many forms, and how to solve problems involving love. The message is to love yourself, no matter who or what you are. It isn't very complex or up for debate, but autists gonna autist.
No, because any and all men on this show are feminine and emasculated anyway so they might as well just be women.
You are blind if you don't see the writers behind the show having their politics influence the show. It was basically made as an "alternative"
>People often complain about Steven Universe having an obvious agenda, so I propose to you a question.
>Would SU be received better if the entire cast was genderbent?
No, see, MLP FIM has an ensemble cast larger than that of SU and even MORE of the characters are female and that show was even founded on feminist ideologies, that is NOT the problem
The problem with SU is the utterly tactless, classless, hamfisted, and obviously pandering way it shoves it's agendas into peoples faces considering it's a daytime cartoon meant for children
Creative content is not made in the void. Complaining that the creator influences their work is obvious and retarded. You're just upset because you don't agree with it.
>not liking the clam
What are you, gay?
All Art has a message.
A human creation without an agenda is literally impossible.
TTGO for sure as a constant "anti-moral' agenda. The show's consistent theme is irreverence. Very Slim Shady South Park Animaniacs turn of the century style no fucks given vibe.
Greg took fine care of Steven, he's not a deadbeat.
He only moved in with the gems because they needed to teach him how to use his powers.
...
If Fusion = Chilling with Bros, then sign me up
No, only Tumblr and sites with similar beliefs would do so. Sup Forums would love the show unanimously and Sup Forums would use this show to force down their agenda.
So Transformers. But spike is a female instead.
How has that been working out?
Is this a joke, user
Tumblr yaoi fangirls would lose their shit
>Genderbent
>Only Garnet is changed
Ok then.