Agree? Disagree?
Is it just the American sphere of influence?
Is it a force for good?
All things NATO.
NATO is obsolete
Colton Sanders
Aaron Nelson
If (((Leon Poneta))) says NATO give the authority to wage war instead of Congress, then I'm firmly against it.
If people like (((Victoria Nuland))) use it to wage war on The Ukraine and start a big mess with Russia for no legitimate purpose, then I'm against NATO.
If they make Turkey or Finland/Sweden part of it just to fuck the whole thing up even harder, then I'm against NATO.
Christopher Allen
turkey is part of nato.
Gavin Hall
Hence the problem.
Ryan Butler
But Turkey was a logical addition at the time considering the alliance was intended to oppose the Soviet Union. I know Turkey doesn't make sense now but they're already in.
Camden Collins
But burger, you don't understand, the new enemy is terrorism!
Elijah Cooper
Warsaw Pact was dismantled NATO should have been as well. There should be more localized treaties to deal with the Russian Problem in their on sphere of influence. For instance maybe a Scandinavian alliance or the like.
Brandon Robinson
It wasn't logical at all except for the (((academics))) who live in their little bubbles of theory instead of reality.
This is why we need the great purge.
Leo Walker
Couldn't NATO be given credit for preventing some potentially major conflicts though? The Baltic states for example have been under Russian rule for centuries yet their membership essentially guarantees their independence.
How is it not logical to try and out-manoeuvre your opposing superpower at any opportunity?
Jace Anderson
The Warsaw Pact was dismantled because the Soviet Union lost and all the blocs wanted fucking out.
Flash forward to 2016 and countries are still petitioning to get INTO NATO.
It's not even equivalent.
And in America, besides some hardliners who are not great at foreign politics or history, most Americans are fine with NATO. Fuck, even Trump (after someone finally explained to him) now wants to work within NATO.
Oliver Brooks
>How is it not logical to try and out-manoeuvre your opposing superpower at any opportunity?
Because if you're blind enough to play the game that way then somebody like Erdogan, who you thought was just as (((academic))) as (((you))) were because you're still thinking like it's the past century instead of the current year, then you get taken advantage of.
Aaron Young
I'm not sure why you're throwing your brackets at me like I'm a jew, I'm just trying to understand where you're coming from. It seems to me that that's just business, if both parties stand to benefit from a deal why aren't they going to make that deal? I've already conceded that in "current year" Turkey in NATO is a bad idea.
Evan Russell
It's a cold war relic. Fucking Turkey is in NATO.
What the fuck?
I was an airman in the Royal Air Force. We had to patrol the border in Cyprus to keep the Turks in check. Part of Cyprus is British. It's called sovereign base area. A NATO member (UK) keeping an eye on another NATO member (Turkey).
It's a fucking joke.
Anglo countries have a lot of cooperation. 'five eyes', and other alignments. It makes NATO redundant.
Bentley Clark
Isn't it natural for great powers to exert their influence regardless of redundancy though? Why would a post-Cold War America and NATO suddenly decide to give the Russians or anyone else some elbow room?
Juan Ward
It's shoddy business. Who's going to replace Erdogan? Who's going to replace Putin? These regime change efforts might adhere to a tried and true functional method, but it amounts to nothing more than continued surfing without any end game in sight.
So if that sort of thing is all NATO is good for than fuck it. Might as well surf properly if the surf's up. Maybe within that context we can reexamine what sort of a deal might actually be of real mutual benefit.
Colton Jackson
So you're saying there's no mutual benefit in America maintaining what is essentially hegemony and weaker states maintaining relative independence under a defensive umbrella.
Daniel Robinson
No, I'm saying it's a good time to take a closer look at what it is vs. and a closer look at what make sense.
Take for example. He claims that it makes more sense to continue to work within NATO. Is that true? Maybe it is. Let's find out.
Transitioning out of American Primacy as our neocon-heretofore Grand Strategy is tricky business. But we're approaching a situation of great opportunity to reinvent ourselves if we are willing to take advantage of the conditions rather than revert to the status quo.
Connor Evans
As far as I can tell the conditions are an increasingly aggressive China, a clusterfucked Middle East and an opportunistic Russia that's starting to show its not afraid to swing its dick around on the world stage.
Do you reshuffle the preeminent military alliance in the face of all this?
Josiah Ross
Cyprus is a bong outpost. It's an important listening post. It's next to Lebanon and Israel. It's of massive strategic importance.
We don't have the British Empire any more, but there are loads of islands and small territories - Cayman islands, Gibraltar, Diego Garcia, Cyprus, Falklands, Ascension islands etc.
All bong clay.Britain never really gave up the Empire.
Aaron Williams
Nato is obsolete because it is far too passive.
We have at our borders a threat of Islamization, Nato should not merely be idling within their own borders. They should be unleashing a hell-fire of ungodly proportions upon anyone who even remotely looks awkwardly toward a Nato nation.
If Nato were valid, ISIS would have been firebombed out of existence and collateral damage wouldn't even be a second thought.
We need a new force, one that isn't afraid to decimate entire populations to safeguard our own nations.
We need a titan of force, the likes hell itself dare not contest with.
Carson Jenkins
I'm inclined to agree with you. I always find it funny that we were more than happy to level German and Japanese cities filled with civilians but now we're devastated when a drone strike hits a few civvies that were hanging out with known terrorists. We've lost our appetite for total war.
Julian Ortiz
China has zero to do with NATO
Middle East is clusterfucked by US and Nato
Russia "swinging a dick" is result of US actions in Georgia, Ukraine and Syria
NATO would be ok if not for US shitting all around
Ryan Thompson
Jesus fuck, and I thought my country was filled with modern day pussies... thanks for restoring my faith in the battle hard countrymen I grew up loving.
Adam Cooper
China has zero to do with NATO until a NATO member is attacked and then its article 4 up in this shit.
Granted.
Granted, but not an argument for dismantling NATO. As I said earlier it makes no sense for a great power to willingly concede power to a potential rival.
Luke Brown
NATO is too busy trying to police Russia and China. What NATO needs to be doing is preventing terror attacks and keeping certain countries at bay. Focusing on counter terrorism efficiently, and defending instead of acting like its the 1960s Cold War. If a country has civil issues, they should help stabilize them first before war.
Evan Jackson
Yes. Eastern Europe and Finland need to ally with Russia.
Jaxon Walker
I think NATO needs to just fucking die already,
Juan Johnson
*Meaning NATO countries
Charles Rodriguez
Yes, because the only bad guy in all of this is the US. The Pentagon is still run by neocons whose idea of American exceptionalism is making the entire world like us, and what we are is Brazil-lite and falling.
Cooper Jackson
L2Geography. US interests in asia != NATO interests.
If US decides to throw weight and get in conflict with China over something there, its not NATO bussiness and all of its members maybe except Brits will tell US to btfo.
Kayden Cooper
Also,
>mfw threads on asian women, would you fuck Her Majesty, and poor quality memes are doing better than my NATO thread
John Wilson
No. Having allies is always more strategically advantageous than not having them
Landon Myers
C'est littéralement la NWO et les agents impériaux kikes réunis, saloperie de paysan Anglo...
Asher Thomas
L2read
>until a NATO member is attacked
United States is a NATO member, NATO would be obliged to commit if China pulled something.
Aaron Morgan
NATO is a proxy that allows Europeans to not have to pay for their own defense and unfairly passes the bill onto the USA.
I'll be glad when Trump cancels it. All of the sudden our military spending will cut drastically just from that. And the European pseudo socialism bubble will end because they'll have to start paying for defense again. Which will be a crippling blow to local liberals who look up to them as beacons of hope for cuckoldry.
Grayson Edwards
Rappel quotidien que les Juifs sont les grand alliés des USA...vos vrais amis...
Ian Fisher
En Anglais s'il vous plait.
Robert Smith
>NATO is a proxy that allows Europeans to not have to pay for their own defense and unfairly passes the bill onto the USA.
>I'll be glad when Trump cancels it
Wallah...tu es vraiment un gros porc Muricain stupide...Nato essaie d'entourer la Russie avec des missiles intercontinentales pour les forcer vers la 3e guerre mondiale....
Owen Brooks
Will correct to be more objective though - its not just US. Brits, France, Italy made its own shit - Iraq, Lybia. Only Germany was remotely sane - but Merkel is cucuck now as well - signing and then ignoring the promises they did to Ukraine goverment and supporting the coup was last straw.
So, its pretty much coalition of the guilty. NATO coutnries like to hide behind US weight and blame them for mistakes - but have plenty of their own, due to opportunism or lack of political will and foresight.
So yeah - Nato is necessary. To defend them from their own sins - be it instability on Balcans, Middle East or now Ukraine.
Luke Bennett
As much as anyone wants to pretend otherwise, coalitions like this are going to be, for the most part, useless, to anyone aother than the primary superpower within it.
NATO is a United States dominated Organization, meaning, anyone in NATO that doesn't cede to the US demands is going to wind up getting kicked out. Those that are in this coalition that play nice with the US will end up getting the benefits of defense, protecftion, etc etc. If the people entering into the agreement are aware of that and whatnot, then great, that's essentially a contract between two nations.
If anyone is coming into it thinking that all parties have an equal say or whatever else, they're just deluding themselves.
So, force for good? Sure, if you live in the US, or, want to depend on the US for protection. For anyone else, not really.
Isaiah Howard
Fuck off French fry
Easton Flores
Nah...je suis bon en Francais et en Arabe...inshAllah...الكلبة سخيف
Hudson Cook
Nah...ce thread est rempli de dummies Anglos ignorant sur la vrai situation mondiale..il faut que je vous éduque...
Isaac Brooks
Doesnt matter one fucking bit. No one is obliged to anything, and NATO exists solely until it US throwing it weight, not for others to do that for US in which case they`ll quickly say "lol no, your problems" - which they are.
The people would rebel in say Germany or France if they were told they countries had to go to fight china - their biggest trading partner, for US interests.
Owen Brooks
>muh world war conspiracy theory
>posting muslims
lel alright. Talk about stupid.
world war 3 could have already started if anyone was ready for it to. But instead its easier just to vote to choke the Russian economy and keep them from ever rising to a state where world war would be necessary.
Eli Thompson
Rappel quotidien que Nato ne fait qu'appliqué le plan des Sionistes...la tombe de mon grand-pere...
Xavier Scott
>world war 3 could have already started if anyone was ready for it to.
...et comme les deux premieres ca va seulement arriver a cause des sales Sionistes appuyer par votre ostie de pays sale...les bons chiens goyims de service...les big ole US of A...
Colton Diaz
Rappel quotidien que les kikes veulent nous forcer a nous mixer pour mieux régner sur une gang de cabochons avec un Q.I. de 89...
Jayden Green
I disagree. As the burger just pointed out I think Europe understands when they're going to have to tow the line. Article 4 after 9/11 was sketchy because it was a non-state actor, and the invasion of Iraq was completely unjustified as far as NATO is concerned. Europe bailing on the US in the face of American aggression after the United States has spent billions essentially defending them from nothing could quickly throw them out into the cold and reacting fast. The situation from there could then become very unstable very quickly.
Brandon Cook
In the face of Chinese** aggression
Benjamin Perry
...vu qu'il y a ben des fakes Canadiens dans ce thread...
Nathaniel Wilson
>Russia sucking China's dick
>a war between Russia and China is more likely than war between the USA and China.
I love this Russian meme.
They think China will surrender their biggest business partner in favor of their poor shithole. They actually think China views them as equals and isn't in the process of subverting their society with the ultimate goal of stealing 2/3's of their territory out from under them to form Greater China.
They honestly don't realize China is their BIGGEST RIVAL in their sphere of influence and instead fall for outdated Soviet mentalities.
They don't realize China is making them completely dependent on them while maintaining larger economic dealings with the USA and Europe. They think China is building these railroads and taking their oil as a gesture of good will and not as future planning for subversion of a weaker rival state and total regional dominance moving forward.
Russians everyone, its fucking funny.
Jayden Smith
militarys are obsolete
police are obsolete
all of this armed warfare stuff is absoltutely disgusting and i cant wait until wwiii lol trmpgeddon plz end this mother fucker
ps. this is a board for satire fags listening in
Hunter Reyes
Le vrai probleme de cette terre est l'union Américaine-Sioniste...voyer vos vrais ennemis en face...goyims....
Nathan Long
Why continue to expand towards Russia where they have zero elbow room at all? We need to de escalate and open trade and cooperation.
Boxing in and fucking with a Nuclear power forever is a recipe for disaster. Im no fan of Russia, but our current expansion is very dangerous.
Connor Roberts
>very dangerous.
You are very fucking dangerous, USA will roll over and die if you do not create yet another shitty war with rice farmers or sand niggers.
Russia would only starve a bit.
Zachary Sanchez
>Boxing in and fucking with a Nuclear power forever is a recipe for disaster
Mais c'est le plan, pauvre paysan Allemand du Wyoming...c'est toujours ca que ton saloperie de pays de Juif veux...pusher les autre pays dans leur dernier retranchement pour les forcer a la guerre...et cette fois une guerre nucléaire...
Dylan Russell
I agree, however I think pulling back now that NATO has gone as far as it has is asking for a war. I'm largely in agreement with Trump that the rest of the alliance has to start meeting their 2% defence spending obligations, if only for the sake of showing solidarity. How long would the Baltics stay independent if they weren't a part of NATO though? Who the fuck would come to save them, the EU? lmao
Julian Nelson
If you're a Muslim why do you keep posting all these sluts? I don't bloody think all that makeup is haram m8
Christian Adams
>mfw i actually understood frogspeek
Ryder Lee
>I don't bloody think
Hon hon...un paysan Canadien qui utilise bloody...tu n'es pas Britbong, James...arrete d'etre drole...
Lucas Green
why did we give THIS shithole free missiles again/?
Poland: world's biggest prostitute.
Needs hands outs from everyone to develop but then talks shit about them later.
Name one successful thing Poland is doing right now that didn't come from the EU or USA. I bet you can't. You are literally nothing but niggers waiting for DEM BENEFITS.
John Smith
>Name one successful thing Poland is doing right now
Keeping their borders closed to refugees
Easton Adams
NATO needs to fuck off their war laws screw us over and force us to be the world police. We need to act on our own like Russia so nothing holds us back from being STRONK
Jaxon Edwards
>why did we give THIS shithole free missiles again/?
N'oublie pas toute la merde que vous avez vendu a Israel...comme les connards de la France...qui leur ont vendu des nuclear warheads...je vous nique les deux...
Daniel Gutierrez
its easy because they are so poor and have such an inadequate economy no one actually wants to go there.
Even Poles can't leave it fast enough.
They bleed their own citizens in the "brain drain" more and more every year. How many citizens have they lost now, about 5 million? more?
Parker Evans
No all of that credits could go to us for winning the Cold War
We did shit and nato took the credit
Cooper Robinson
Rappel quotidien que les USA drop des trillions sur des armes et munitions pendant leur plus pauvres citoyens vivent comme des chiens...
Lucas Mitchell
>98.6% ethnically European
>bleeding off excess labour at the expense of the rest of the EU
I see no problems here
Robert Bell
>Needs hands outs from everyone
Oh fuck off, my city exists longer than your country.
You fucked us up in WW2 by selling shit and loans to our enemies, you acknowledged creating Isreal, which is source of conflict in middle east, and you may or may not elect woman for president.
Not to mention your EU lapdogs do everything they can to make all countries less good to live for white man.
USA is warmonger. Your industry needs war. No war, no USA. That's it.
Asher Clark
Are Muslim girls always this fucking ugly? I just want to smash their faces in
Ryan Richardson
I don't know mate. If I look into history, then I can see the need for alliances. Turkey is a tricky one. The Ottoman Empire was was very powerful.
Erdogan is pulling Turkey away from the secularism that Attaturk laid the foundations for.
He is an Islamist. And very dangerous.
Josiah Myers
Nato est simplement un autre Jewish trick de ces connards de Khazars...la tombe de mon grand-pere...ces faux Juifs qui ne vienne meme pas des 12 tribus originels...
Jace Rivera
Nope. NATO keeps the Anglosphere at the very top of World Influence, thanks.
Also worth noting that much of mainland Europe can't defend itself from unarmed "refugees" marching across its borders these days; you chaps need us as a deterrent from the ones with tanks and guns.
Jacob Scott
Anyways good discussion fellas, I'm off to bed
Jackson Long
Détourne la conversation tant que tu veux, Big Bubba...le point est que ton pays est la truie(la main bitch)d'Israel...tu dois adorer ca, bon goy?
Wyatt Williams
If Israel wasn't created Poland would still be full of jews.
However if Poland was full of jews you would probably have an actual economy, unlike now. So Im not sure you gained anything there.
>muh old identity
>muh old buildings
Poland's borders aren't even natural. You stole clay from Germany and thats why some of your Western cities are a bit more developed. True Poland is East Poland + Belarus.
Yeah, some of the shitiest parts of Europe. Poles have always been shit, they even make Russians look good in terms of achievements and development.
And despite it all they still willingly look for anything free from anyone and then talk all this shit to pretend they are independent and strong. Definition of a prostitute nation.
If Germany billed you for the money you've basically stolen from them your nation would go bankrupt harder than Greece did.
Daniel Myers
Les quelques Juifs honnetes sur cette terre avoue que leur peuples sont la vrai plaie de l'humanité...
David Richardson
arabian bitches are so ugly they need to stay covered to not scare the kids.
Brody Moore
>However if Poland was full of jews you would probably have an actual economy, unlike now. So Im not sure you gained anything there.
Un bon eleve des kikes de Jew York...continue a écouté tes maitres...sales putes Sionistes...Allah ne sera pas généreux avec toi, pute...
Kevin White
Oh....Gianluigi...si tu saurais...le sang Arabes coule en toi...
Elijah Rogers
If Russia tries to pull an Ukraine on Estonia, do you really think the USA should start World War 3 to save them?
Connor Hall
Why not Finland. They seem like they would make a pretty based ally.
David Jenkins
Désolé, Gianluigi...mais votre sang est Arabe...regardé votre nez et votre teint de peau, rien de si étonnant...
Camden Thompson
>If Germany billed you for the money
Aren't you the country with most debt in the world?
>If Israel wasn't created Poland would still be full of jews.
U wot m8? They ran away as soon as they could, that is jew thing to do, go away to leech of the more wealthy one.
>Poland's borders aren't even natural
That is true
>You stole clay from Germany
And that is not. It is not Poland who decided this borders, but USA, UK, and CCCP.
>Poles have always been shit
Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth would like to disagree.
>And despite it all they still willingly look for anything free
You should have not fucked our borders USA, and you should not pumped money in Germany. We are taking free money, because we can, and we ignore your EU lapdogs, because we can.
Why you ignore the fact that I called USA on their constant wars but instead focus on Poland being somehow bad?
Poland is awesome.
Anthony Roberts
Désolé de te niqué tant que ca...mais les Italiens ne sont pas Aryens...trop de violes Arabes, Gianluigi...
Juan Hughes
Oh Mustafa, si tu saurais...
Your upper class kidnapped and enslaved our women for centuries.
Not you, you are a nothing, but your caliphs and your warriors were all born from white slaves. You were ruled by leaders born from spanish, italian and greek women. They had our blood.
Even your prophet Muhammad (may God forgive his name) had a pale skin.
Levi Lee
still doing better than the Warsaw Pact
Lincoln Sullivan
>Your upper class kidnapped and enslaved our women for centuries.
C'est la seul bonne ligne du paragraphe, Gianluigi...je veux dire regardé vos putains de visage...vos nez sont tellement Arabes...tu ne prendra pas un Hollandais pour un Algérien...mais un Italien...OO....
Jayden Turner
A 2015 genetic study of six small mountain villages in eastern Lazio and one mountain community in nearby western Abruzzo found some genetic similarities between these Central Italian communities and Near Eastern populations, mainly in the male genetic pool. The Y haplogroup Q, common in Western Asia and Central Asia, was also found among this Central Italian sample population, suggesting possible past Anatolian genetic influence .
La tombe de ma grand-mere...
Matthew Bailey
The warsaw pact ond't sdwe;;;;a
Brandon Allen
Look compatible with the old etruscan civilization
Or it can be dated to the more recent islamic invasions?
Juan Kelly
Tu me dirais qu'ils sont Marocains, je te croirais...en fait les Algériens et les Marocains sont plus blanc que ca en moyenne...
Jordan Powell
nato is fine. keeps pressure on russia and gives us another seat at the table in european affairs.
Jack Jackson
Makes me want one of these.
Lincoln Sullivan
Why these people look so disgusted, they have seen some moroccan immigrants?
I don't care about white, I'm Italian, not aryan, and I know my people have mixed with north africans in ancient time.
There is nothing wrong, in roman time north africa was christian and based, but thanks to islam they have became rotten and degenerate.
I don't want to be associated with the islamic north africans.
Hudson Collins
>I don't care about white, I'm Italian, not aryan
Well...au moins tu es réaliste, Gianluigi...c'est quand meme un peu sarcastique que les Italiens était le bras droit des Nazis...je me demande si mononc Hitler savais que le Duce était une pute avec du sang Arabe?