Im new to comics so please don't fuck my shit up but since when and why is spidey black ?

Im new to comics so please don't fuck my shit up but since when and why is spidey black ?

if you're new to comics, then how do you know that spider-man isn't black?
checkmate ableists

since Marvel decided pandering to tumblrtards and chronic whiners was a sound business strategy

Since 2011, when the Ultimate universe Spider-Man died in an excellent story called The Death of Spider-Man. He was replaced by Miles Morales, who took up the mantle because power and responsibility etc etc.
Later, in 2015, the Ultimate Marvel line was cancelled and Miles was retconned into the normal Marvel universe, so now there's two of them. This does kind of invalidate Miles' motivation, but hey.

So now there are two same characters in the same universe with the same power,why?
For what purpose ?

Same reason there are two Flashes and six Green Lanterns.
Also, Ultimate Spider-Man was the only Ultimate comic still selling alright, so they didn't want to lose him.
Also, Brian Bendis is an egotist with a lot of pull who wouldn't let them kill his OC.

New to comics,ei.
Brian Bendis welcomes you.

I don't know why, but that smug expression on his face makes me wanna fucking punch him in the dick.

Multiple Green lanterns actually makes a lot more sense though

>Same reason there are two Flashes and six Green Lanterns.

Because one is a sidekick of the real Spider-man, and there's a whole police organization of Spider-men?

White Wally isn't a sidekick though

Seems like Miles would be used to his best ability if he were in his own universe. I don't like the idea of there being two Spider-Men in the same world

So Kid Flash isn't a thing?

>imma pretend i'm new
Why do people do this shit?

The effects of Doctor Octopus' Blackinator.

Jokes aside, there is much (needless) controversy. The problem arises when this works out pretty well and it opens the floodgates.

Thor: gone and replaced by a mortal woman.
Captain America: First aged and depowered, replaced by an African-American (who ALREADY HAD HIS OWN SUPERHERO IDENTITY, BY THE WAY), then came back, then turned out to be working for the Red Skull.
Hawkeye: Has female counterpart now who is probably better than he is.
Giant-Man: Insane/ merged with Ultron; new Giant Man is Lebanese-American and gay.
Iron Man: Gone, possibly dead, replaced by 15-year-old African-American girl and Doctor Doom.

Diversity is good and just, but there were better ways to handle it.

I have no idea what you're on about, me specifying white Wally should let you know I know about the other one.

>and six Green Lanterns.


There where always lots of lanterns though. It's a job not a name.

Sup Forums

did you bitch bout diversity when bucky became cap? or is that only for falcon?

Wally West is prominently known as Kid Flash. Y'know, the sidekick. Having him upgrade doesn't change that fact

He isn't a sidekick now though, he's Flash, not ____ Flash, just Flash.

So what are you on about?

Wally upgraded to THE flash in the 70s,and he works side by side with Barry using that name as an equal with Jay as well.Likewise miles uses that name side by side with Peter taking care New York while Parker's off playing Stark for a while

I can't tell if you're pretending to be stupid or not. This isn't that complex, there's nothing difficult to understand here

But not from the same sector.

There is a spider corps in that one comic

>Why are there 2 Spiders
>Same reason there are two Flashes
>But one's a sidekick
>Not anymore, he's just a Flash now
>Yeah but he was a sidekick
What the fuck are you trying to say? You have added nothing of value to this conversation, there are two Flashes, plain and simple, the fact that one used to be a sidekick is meaningless in this discussion.

>Same reason there are two Flashes
>Because one is a sidekick of the real Spider-man, and there's a whole police organization of Spider-men?

You chimed in with "Oh, but White West isn't a sidekick", completely missing the point of dude's snark. You too contribute nothing to this discussion, but at least I'm here to make you aware of that

>one is a sidekick
>No he isn't
How the fuck am I missing the point?

>Giant-Man
Hank was always best-known as Ant-Man, though.

Except it was originally 1 per space sector, then 2, but Earth's still a special snowflake and gets 6. It was never really a "job" thing of multiple (notable) coexisting Lanterns until Johns.

I guarantee you, if Marvel decided to make, I dunno, that Muslim woman share being Captain Britain with the original, Sup Forums would pitch a bitchfit despite multiple Captain Britains being a longstanding element of the mythos.

...I was holding out for Eli to become Captain America.

Falcon becoming Cap felt wrong to me because he already had a superheroic identity. Now it's made out as if he was just an understudy for Steve - which is actually Bucky's job. He's Robin to Cap's Batman.

Was I bitching? Because I don't think I was bitching.

Long as we're on the subject... where are the Asian-Americans in all this?

Are you also saying that Bucky isn't a sidekick? Or Robin? Doesn't matter if they get upgrades later in their career, they're still just as equally known as sidekicks. It's REALLY not that hard

>Long as we're on the subject... where are the Asian-Americans in all this?

Most people don't consider Asians a "proper" minority.

...That's meta-racism.

>if you upgrade to non-sidekick status you're still a sidekick
What the hell is wrong with you? No one considers current Bucky a sidekick, no one considers Wally Flash a sidekick, no one considers Nightwing a sidekick. Are you fucking delusional?

Besides what said, Asians for the most part kinda just act white. They communicate in a similar way and have similar personal habits. These are generalizations, of course, but I believe that the difficulty blacks and latinos have of being treated equally can be attributed in large part to the cultural differences that those groups maintain through the generations. Asians stick to their own, but honestly they just assimilate better.

It's the conversational rhythm, the amount of eye contact, "proper" (standard) English pronunciation and grammar, food, dress, leisure activities, and the subject matter of small talk. Stereotypes are far from universally true, but they are often largely true. For many white people, interacting with an Asian person doesn't feel any different from interacting with a white person, while interacting with a black or latino person is like entering a foreign world. It's not that the way whites and Asians behave is necessarily better, but rather the fact that most rich clients of big companies tend to be white and to prefer people who display these cultural markers that put them at ease.

Also, there is one really big factor: Until 1965 immigration from Asia was banned in the US. After 1965 immigration was allowed but it was only skilled immigration (except for the Vietnamese and Laotian war refugees). This contrast with Black and latino immigration which included vast numbers of less educated folks (blacks brought over as slave and then freed but not given the economic resources to compete and Latinos who came over the border for low level work) Of course there are highly educated blacks and latinos but in general the education levels of the Asians in the US are higher than even the whites. (This has nothing to do with race . Their are plenty of less educated Asians in Asia . They just never made it to the US).

They're from parallel worlds.

New asian hulk now that Bruce is "dead". Silk and I'm not sure what they're doing with toni ho

I wish Spider-Man was real.

I'd argue that Bucky is more well known as the winter soldier/his own thing than as a sidekick.

>No one considers Wally Flash a sidekick

So Young Justice and CW Flash aren't a thing now?

>Young Justice
JL/JLU was just as, if not more, popular as that.
>and CW Flash
Doesn't that only have black Wally? I wouldn't say that counts.

when it came to falcon, it sounded like bitching. hes not the first to toss a code name for another.

and lets be honest.. weve lost eli. marvel has him benched for some reason and wont let him back on the field

Then there's the Teen Titans TV show and the Teen Titans comics. You're saying that no one considers Wally a sidekick, even though there are several prominent sources that consider him a sidekick, all with a considerable fanbase. It doesn't matter what you argue is more popular, because my point still stands

Those also featured Dick Grayson as Robin but no one calls Nightwing a sidekick.

It's the equivalent of saying Dick Grayson isn't Robin. You're ignoring decades of comic history to stupidly argue semantics

They really could have made that work.

Calling Nightwing a sidekick ≠ Calling Wally West a sidekick

One's an upgraded title, the other's a character who has two titles, one as a sidekick and one as a mainline hero

He ISN'T Robin, he WAS Robin, i.e: Dick Grayson was once a sidekick but not anymore. Do you not understand past tense?

That doesn't change the fact that Wally is not a sidekick, bringing up the sidekick shit was stupid and irrelevant to the discussion.

Wally is STILL considered a sidekick because there are still stories depicting him as one

Is that why he's still commonly depicted as Robin in media, even after he became Nightwing? Again, you're stupidly arguing semantics just to save face

Hell, in Nightwing's case he's undeniably best known for being the Boy Wonder than his new title

There is a certain portion of the Asian population that came over for the railroads back in the late 1800s. Mostly West Coasters who single-handedly created the stereotype of Asian Laundry owners and Asian Convenience Stores. Besides that, you're more or less on point.

There's also the fact that when Asians are seen as 'foreign', it's usually in an inoffensive, 'not like us but not worse than us' sort of way. Black and hispanic 'differentness' is more likely to be interpreted as 'not like us AND worse than us'

How long until he is put in the cinematic universe?

There's a difference between being most know for something and "You will always be this and nothing more", you numb skull. Wally, as the Flash, is not considered a sidekick. Dick, as Nightwing, is not considered a sidekick.

Are you retarded?

lol'd

>"You will always be this and nothing more"

The only person who even comes close to claiming that is you with your "no one considers Wally Flash a sidekick" shit

>Wally, as the Flash, is not considered a sidekick. Dick, as Nightwing, is not considered a sidekick. Are you retarded?

No, but considering the fact that you STILL think I'm saying that, I can tell you are. Congrats.

>The only person who even comes close to claiming that is you with your "no one considers Wally Flash a sidekick" shit
You're the one arguing that Wally being Kid Flash before has any relevance to this conversation when it doesn't. The guy I first replied to tried to make it seem like there are only Flash and Kid Flash running around when that's wrong, there's two Flashes and Kid Flash, there's only one sidekick there. Arguing that Wally still retains sidekick status is like arguing he's still a child, he grew out of it.
>No, but considering the fact that you STILL think I'm saying that, I can tell you are. Congrats.
Then what he'll ARE you arguing, retard? If you're not arguing that then you're basically saying you jumped in to spout a bunch of shit that doesn't matter, which makes you extra dumb.

The fact that Isiah was left of the "all Captains America" cover and Eli hasn't been heard from in years would seem to indicate to me that there's some sort of legal issue with use of the Bradleys. It's sad, honestly.

Frankly, if he was used again, I'd be happy with Eli sticking as Patriot. Like, sure, if there's a Captain America vacancy he'd work, but Patriot is as valid as USAgent as its own thing.

There's a hell of a lot more than just two spidermen anyways

There's peter parker the OG,l and Miles Morales, but you've also got Silk, who was bit the same spider that bit peter and until recently was kept in a bunker to avoid attracting the Inheritors to earth, you've got Spider-Woman, you've got Spider-Gwen who isn't from 616 but is currently visiting to help Kaine AKA the Scarlet Spider, an imperfect clone of Peter who doesn't have spider sense but is stronger, can make wolverine-esque spines from his hands and can see through/manipulate spiders in an area as large as a city (if anyone's read Worm he's got a more limited version of Skitter's power)

THEN you've got Miguel who is spiderman in the year 2099 but who until recently got stranded on 616 modern earth, and then you've got doc ock's "Superior" spiderman which is his brain in peter's body

Oh there's also Madame Web and Venom and I'm sure a billion other spider-powered heroes out there

Miles hardly dilutes spiderman's presence, he's just boring and too much of a damn boyscout. "What if teenage peter parker had both his parents alive, they loved each other and him very much, his family wasn't in any financial difficulties, he had no guilt and he got to buddy around with captain America and the avengers whenever he wanted to."

People don't like mIles because he's BORING.

>Spider-Woman
Which one.

>You're the one arguing that Wally being Kid Flash before has any relevance to this conversation when it doesn't

It does, though

>The guy I first replied to tried to make it seem like there are only Flash and Kid Flash running around when that's wrong, there's two Flashes and Kid Flash, there's only one sidekick there

He's referring simply to the superhero and sidekick dynamic, which he was being snarky about. You're making it ridiculously more complicated than it needed to be, but I guess I shouldn't be surprised, because you still don't even understand my argument

>Then what he'll ARE you arguing, retard?

Fucking read my first reply, scum. Hell, I even simplified it for you. If you still don't get it, I don't know what else to tell you

>If you're not arguing that then you're basically saying you jumped in to spout a bunch of shit that doesn't matter, which makes you extra dumb.

Stupid AND new? Well, that explains that

>It does, though
It really doesn't.
>He's referring simply to the superhero and sidekick dynamic, which he was being snarky about. You're making it ridiculously more complicated than it needed to be, but I guess I shouldn't be surprised, because you still don't even understand my argument
Literally all I said was " White Wally isn't a sidekick", anyone who's arguing against that is the one making it complicated, not me. It's an simple fact that did not require further discussion, Wally isn't a sidekick, it's not my fault the original guy felt the need to bring it to this point.
>Fucking read my first reply, scum. Hell, I even simplified it for you. If you still don't get it, I don't know what else to tell you
All you posted was a bunch of shit that doesn't matter, retard.

Hey, guess which one's Wally West

>Be Flash since 1986
>people still call you a sidekick

Not that guy but you're posting a pic of Kid Flash.
Who is a sidekick.

On the other hand there's 2 Flashes here and neither one is a sidekick.

Wally West has a famous history of being a sidekick. Again, not difficult to grasp

But not when he's Flash.

Can someone post all the pages from Titans with "My name is Wally West. I'm The Flash"?

How's that significantly different to two Spider-Men, then?

Are Wallyfags always this stupid?

I consider each of these faggots as sidekicks.

Christ, user. Just off yourself

Why are we arguing about Wally when we can just shit on Miles some more? He'll never be Spider Man and it drives Bendis insane

>I have no argument so I'll just talk shit
Wew

He'll never be the AMAZING Spider-Man.

>So now there are two same characters in the same universe with the same power,why?
Actually there's at least four.
Peter, Miles, Kaine, and Silk. And maybe also Miguel. I have no idea what his deal is after Spider-verse.

I have no stakes in this, just callin it how I see it. Enjoy your faggotry

What makes my post any worse than the others? Clearly I must have struck a nerve for you to single me out. How did I hurt you, user?

So how is the same power an issue?
There's always been multiple
>guys with powersuits
>supersoldiers
>guys who grow/shrink
>guys who run fast

In Spidey's case, it's less superpower and more identity. There's many characters with Spidey's powers, but there aren't that many "Spider-Men". Usually when there is more than one it's in a different continuity. People would still bitch about Miles even if he stayed in a different continuity, but now it's just weird. It's like having two Professor X's

But he's not a sidekick now. He is the Flash, and Barry is the Flash. Just like how in 2010 or so when Barry came back, he and Wally were both the Flash. The fact that Wally was a sidekick in like the '80s isn't relevant. He grew up. We're talking about the comics here, not Young Justice or the TT cartoon or the CW show.
SO. There is Miles Spidey and Peter Spidey the same reason there is Barry Flash and Wally Flash. They're on friendly terms and it's always nice to have help.

Wasn't there actually an issue where Peter complained about Miles using Spiderman name and Miles replied Peter (Ultimate) "gave" it to him?

>So how is the same power an issue?
Because in Miles' case it's more like
>same power, BUT EVEN STRONGEREST WITH ULTIMATE ELECTROSHOCK FINISHING MOVE PLUS INVISIBILITY

Stuck in current marvel and spends all his time traveling to alternate 2099s. Hes been to about 2-3 so far and now Captain America from secret wars seems part of his supporting cast despite feeling like a temporary character for a while.

Just ignore Miles' existence the character is pointless, bland, and uninspired. Anyone who tells you otherwise is blinded by the diversity brought forth by him. I can't name a worse character.

Him not being a sidekick now doesn't mean he isn't widely known for being a sidekick. That's why there's shows and comics that still hark back to that. Same with Robin/Nightwing

>They're on friendly terms and it's always nice to have help.

It's oversaturating. Having Miles appear in crossovers would be really cool but he's better off in his own universe

>I can't name a worse character.
Let's not get carried away, user, his own comic features two characters worse than him.

>That's why there's shows and comics that still hark back to that.
Yes, but he's not called Flash in those.
Miles isn't Peter's sidekick and from what I understand they've written themselves into corner.
If they left him as Spiderman people will complain, if they change him to something else people will still complain.

For clarification, we're talking about the Tumblr girl and his grandma, right?