Why are Euros so upset at austerity? Don't they know that if you borrow a ton of money eventually you're gonna have to start paying money back AND not get benefits, especially at freaking debt equal to 100% of GDP.
Do they just feel robbed because they weren't as rich as say, the USA or germany for instance even under the benefits train and are even worse without it?
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Austerity has completely destroyed our economy. Yes, our previous governments were retarded and dincreased debt too much, but with austerity our debt still increased and the economy went to shit
Because lots of people are naive idealists who don't understand the implications of a large national debt and widening deficit.
They see it as on one hand you have someone telling you we need to make cuts to fund something they don't see as affecting them directly, and on the other someone telling them none of that is needed and we can spend more money which they think affects them directly.
I have met lots of left leaning people (Corbyn supporters for example) and they genuinely don't see the need for cuts and think it is all being done out of spite to widen the "rich poor divide".
They aren't necessarily bad people, they are just blissfully ignorant. They like the buzzwords like compassion, acceptance, equality etc which sounds good but doesn't actually mean anything.
Mostly because of this 1% boogeyman, this idea that every city worker rocks up to work at 3pm, get paid £999999 then heads home at 3:30 running over syrian refugees on the way home. No need for austerity if we can all get in on magic white man bucks.
The point is that austrerity isn't fixing the debt issue in Southern Europe.
Start by cutting unnecessary spendings on idiotic ministries (integration ministry) and stopping gibs for votes (80 euros to people who turn 18 so that they vote for your party).
Also turn politics for being a carrer to being a service, in which you don't get paid and you don't get a pension.
Cutting spending on importing third world fauna is also a good idea
The argument is often made that austerity in poor countries doesn't actually improve the economy. This is correct, in the case of Greece.
What austerity does do, however, is strip back parts of government that get you to economic ruin in the first place. Greece needed extreme, brutal austerity to fix its society, not its economy. If they had the economic strength and performance of Norway tomorrow, they'd be back in the shit a week later because at the end of the day its a cultural and social problem that manifests itself into an economic one.
The Conservatives do it in this country every now and again, but not far enough. Austerity should be the default. We would work fine with 50 percent lower government spending.
Yeah it needs to be done in a sensible manner, my perspective is a UK based one so naturally will be different in other countries.
The amount of wastage in public services here is shocking, and there is a strong line of thought here that throwing money at a problem will fix it.
Its racist not to spend 60% of gdp on enriching africa. No much better that we oppressively tax workers and businesses so they go elsewhere and then we can blame capitalism again when they leave and the economy fails.
It would fix it completely if you had your national budgets slashed by 90 percent and all your public sector starved to death.
go suck a dick bootlicker
Probably because they didn't vote for it. The previous generation votes for a bunch of benefits then the current generation has to pay it back? That would piss anyone off.
>if you borrow a ton of money eventually you're gonna have to start paying money back AND not get benefits
Unless you're a big bank of course.
>Send net £10 billion to the eu every year
>Spend £12 billion on foreign aid every year
When the government is doing shit like this the people have every right to complain about them cutting public service budgets
>No much better that we oppressively tax workers and businesses so they go elsewhere and then we can blame capitalism again when they leave and the economy fails.
Yea also this. Austerity will never work unless you create conditions for investement and growth
>wants the government to provide everything
>wants foreign governments to provide his country with everything
As I said, the problem with Greece isn't the economy. It's the people. When you have a low IW society with no sense of individualism, a vast amount of trust in government to provide and a culture that promotes doing nothing you're going to have a crap economy.
Greece could have all the natural resources and infrastructue it wanted, it would ruin it within a year and be back to square one.
Essentially if it's south of Turin or east of Vienna it's full of retards who like the government too much.
1 + 9 + 30 + 40 + 20 = 80? Where's the last 20%? fucking american math
Colour me surprised that the vast majority multiply far outside of their capability to provide sufficiently and dont work/produce any significant wealth. Its like complaining that we have cars when there are billions of africans. We actually worked and made something.
Might want to double check that m9
The song 9-5 is a popular american song lamenting the hardships of an 8 hour working day, jesus christ kek. Try go to any bank and find someone who can remember the last time it wasnt just 8 hours until lunch.
Yup
no austerity = very likely to win elections, good luck with the +50% gdp in a decade plan
moderate austerity = more likely to win elections, must be followed up with growth
severe austerity = need not be followed up with growth, good luck with the elections
you'd understand if your effective taxation rate would amount to some 70% of your gross income
Only that way because of bloated public sectors anyway. No surprise when you vote for feel good leftist governments for years that the party ends one day.
I'm euro and I think austerity rocks. As this cunt says We've overspent. The debt needs to be paid down. Increasing the GDP to offset it is a fucking fantasy. We (the UK) currently pay £60bn a year on fucking debt interest. This is bigger than our military budget pissed up the wall playing Shlomo's fucking usury.
I'm just pointing out the reason, I'd love to have a state so small I could barely see it but since I cannot opt out of social ponzi schemes I am not likely to agree to lower the payback without also lowering contributions, if that makes sense to you
>greek anarchist
Are you retards enjoying the demise of your nation?
In the UK we did vote for austerity. Twice. leftist tears are fucking delicious.
These same retards would complain if we tried to leave the EU (kek) or told Africa to fuck off.
>Debt only equal to 100% of GDP
Because evil whitey in canary wharf is hoarding our gibbesmedats
Don't get me wrong, I think growing income disparity is an issue. But decreasing our debt is an absolute must.
Disparity literally means nothing, money is not some distributed pool and even the worst off in society nowadays live how pharoahs could only dream of in the past. If someone wants to work themselves to an early grave in commerce then let them. You couldnt pay me twice what they earn to live their life.
That's because you never had austerity. Your budget was never cut and increasing taxes didn't increase revenues.
Except the people at the bottom are objectivly worse of than they have been for most of the past 30 years. We're fast moving towards a two tier society with those who've made it and those who never will. There is no middle ground any more and so spending on trinket and services, and so the economy will slow down. Without saying 'the free market dictates', justify a CEO earning 200x more than the average worker in the UK.
So instead of dealing with the problems, they would rather follow their parents' lead and force their children to deal with it.
At some point, someone has to deal with the consequences, willingly or not.
Nope. The buck stops here, too many countries are rearing their debt head.
Because they are easily 200x more unique, skilled and important? Also they are not worse of than any time in the past 30 years what shit are you chatting? Medical care is worlds away from then, entertainment and travel is far improved. I know people on benefits their entire lives driving state of the art trucks with 4K tv's receiving comprehensive crohns and cancer treatments.
Lad, countries don't repay their debts, they outgrow them.
>Describe why someone earns more without saying "he contributes more to society"
oh fuck off
>muh nation
i'm broke m8, last thing i care is muh nation's demise
Because there is no need for austerity. You can just stop importing millions of muds into your country to soak up welfare and social/security costs.
Because "austerity" is a buzzword for fucking the people while they should really be cutting their ideological hobby's.
Lol Aussie education nice bro
>i'm broke m8, last thing i care is muh nation's demise
if you had cared for your nation's wealth, you would not be broke.
>i personally destroyed a country's economy
wew lad topkek
>Because they are easily 200x more unique, skilled and important?
Sure they are. About half of the corporate elite are simply more determined. Sure, determination and hard work should be rewarded. I'm not arguing for a fucking revolution. But there's defiantly a case for more progressive taxes.
>Medical care is worlds away from then
The NHS is a fucking joke. There are technological advancements that have helped in prolonging life and some treatments but as this is a state funded operation I don;t see how it is relevant to earnings. People objectively have less disposable income today and real term wages.
> Real wages have been falling for longest period for at least 50 years, ONS says
theguardian.com
> I know people on benefits their entire lives driving state of the art trucks with 4K tv's receiving comprehensive crohns and cancer treatments.
I don't give a shit about your anecdote of welfare queens. I'm talking about the millions of brits working shitty jobs that will never help them move up in the world.
Broke myself lad but I don't see how bending over for the globalists is going to help.
This translates to
>I don't care about muh nation it stopped providing free gibs and a job in the public sector where i could have a desk job doing absolutely nothing and earning 5-6 figures each month
They are literally retarded, it's the only way to describe them
Benefits go down = sad face = protest
There is no thought process there. They are stupid people
>>i personally destroyed a country's economy
>wew lad topkek
you personally admitted you don't care for your nation's wealth, so yes you did it along with all your bootlicking comrades.
They are useful idiots for the banks that want to lend money so they get more interests in return
Commies are fucking stupid
So you dont care about reality then? Much what i expected. All of the people earning that are more determined that mike who works in sales and gets a pint in each evening.
Who cares what wages are when their lifestyle is that much better. If someone told me you will never get ill for the rest of your life in exchange for no wage id say sure, which is essentially the difference between a poor man now and a poor man 50 years ago. You have such a chip on your shoulder you cant think straight.
Are you arguing that they are taking the money from someone else?
Is the owner of a car manufacturing plant hoarding millions of cars?
Who actually consumes those cars? Isn't it the public?
Tzimeros pls
i'm not bending over to anyone
>politicians decide
>rich people avoid tax, make black money
>banks exploit people's money using them for their own interests
>greek faggots use the corrupted system to live a good life supporting at the same time the politicians through voting
>i'm a 25y.o guy taking no part in all of these
B-but i-it's your fault too!
Well fuck you!
Are you the kind of idiot that thinks that you can tax the rich without them either passing the cost onto you or leaving(and running up debt) if they can't do so as if they just cross their arms and take the profit hit?
The answer to your second question is no. They demand loads of services from the government, expecting them to be amazing, and then won't pay tax for said services instead claiming the rich should pay for them (eg. France trying to tax top income at 75%). That being said habibi, Egypt is a socialist shithole just like most Arab countries are.
>So you dont care about reality then?
You took that from me saying I don't care about your story of a welfare queen? Funfact, the banks are the second biggest welfare recipient ever in the UK. Supermarkets and other corporations pay minimum wage which is topped up by the government, so in a sense they're leeches too.
>Who cares what wages are when their lifestyle is that much better.
>Shut up and know your place pleb
> If someone told me you will never get ill for the rest of your life in exchange for no wage id say sure
I'd say fuck off. Would you fuck work 50 years simply for the benefit of being in good health to work an extra ten years.
No I'm arguing for a higher top rate of tax.
>Who actually consumes those cars? Isn't it the public?
It is. But they're becoming more and more unaffordable. Certainly over here the onus is now on long term vehicle hire over ownership. Just another example of the erosion of the working class. Are we forgetting that 40 years ago a man could work a menial job and support his family, buy his house and own a car?
How about one of you people saying income disparity isn't a problem explaining to me why growing disparity is a good thing? If it is neutral or having an adverse affect on society at large then why shouldn't it be changed if it can improve the lives of other citizens? Income disparity breaks down trust and cohesion in society. Left unchecked long enough this will become obvious.
>sandnigger
>knows nothing about economics
>quelle surprise
does egypt even have an economy
or does the government just bribe you all with gibs
>B-but i-it's your fault too!
>Well fuck you!
the difference between you and me is you are happy being a random subject, you bow your head to your masters volunteerly, you brag about inherent weakness.
Everything you described only happens because ppl do not organize and make their power count.
>i'm not bending over to anyone
You presumably fight nationalism? You're destroying the only thing that seeks to defend your country from globalists. I guess you're more of a fluffer.
You work in order to live so yes i sure as hell would work knowing i would never get ill or diseased. Lifestyle is the objective measure, you just want a pretty token number next to your name so that you dont feel so jealous.
It's been getting even more progressively socialist in the last year with very obvious welfare campaigns, so it's only going to get worse.
nah, i'm just not the kind of idiot that accepts anything the state forces as a "solution".
wew, know i'm also responsible for people being cucks.
Nationalists historically have given half Greece to the turks, and you say they somehow defend the country? Read some history mate.
Fuck off sand nigger, your dune coon opinion might mean something if your entire country wasn't dependant on handouts from the USA.
You don't beat a recession with austerity, you beat it by spending more in a controlled way to create more jobs and stimulate the economy.
Austerity does not spur financial growth, thus leading to a slow death of ever increasing deficits.
You work to live, correct. And a part of living is being able to afford some of the nicer things in life on occasion, or being able to afford a house/car.
>Nationalists historically have given half Greece to the turks, and you say they somehow defend the country? Read some history mate.
Whereas the direct and stated objective of anarchists/communists is the destruction of borders.
You work in a bank don't you?
Government spending does not stimulate the economy, that money comes out of the money businesses use to hire people to actual productive jobs which actually stimulates the economy, or out of debt which just murders your economy down the line. The only thing it stimulates is the gibsmedat sector.
The UK and most of Europe are growing. The UK, main proponent of austerity is one of the fastest growing economies in Europe.
If anyone would know about gibsmedat it would be a dune coon google.co.uk
Whites always want gibs me dats.
of course, i don't claim i care about borders, they do, and they fucked up several times
Not an argument.
>wew, know i'm also responsible for people being cucks.
yes, because you are a cuck in the herd of cucks rather than a shepherd.
How are you going to promote trust in an economy and get people to spend their money if everything is austerity and doom and gloom?
People hoard their money when austerity measures are brought in whilst they spend happily if VAT is reduced.
>governments lie about the state of finances of the country to the people for decades
>then one day they decide to increase taxes, kill public services that were paid for by taxes, and literally steal money the people earned all the while paying their hairdresser 20k/month despite being bald
>why do people hate it
People don't have to spend the money in uselss things
The economy is a lie fueled by money out of thin air
We are just bankrupting the country for 20 years of wealth
The economy has to be real, the prices have to go down, the house market has to collapse
that way we could buy houses again
Because when you are in a recession you need to invest and not cut back spending.
Yes but the poor today have television, the internet, free public space and events. Even the fucking homeless get ass blasted on drinks safely in public. You live in a relative utopia but whine because someone infinitely more capable and unique than you has a bigger bank number. You live better than nearly every single person in history.
What's the alternative? Spending more? This is precisely the Keynesianism you referred to here
>governments lie about the state of finances of the country to the people for decades
Keep austerity. Emergency taxes to pay down the debt. Raise top level of tax. Collect corporation taxes properly. Run balanced budget. None of this should be controversial.
on the contrary, you have to let prices go down so people can buy again, this is a pendulum and you don't have to catch it when is on one side, you have to let it swing
>no to austerity
>no to taxes
They don't get it, do they?
Because we did not borrow the money and we did not rep the benefits of the borrowed money but we have to face the effect of some idiots borrowing cash.Most europeans dont want austerity because it was the buissnes men and politicians that used up the money and now they are taking the things that we fucking pay for with our taxes. I dont pay my taxes for some rich asshole to tell me that my healthcear will be cut, or in case of job cuts i wont recive benefits intill i can find a new job, i pay my fucking taxes TO HAVE THOUSE FUCKING PRIVLIGES. And they arnt small taxes either, 45% of my paycheck
how about at least guaranteeing that public services like health, education and transportation are still assured ?
So people aren't (very often) dying in the streets or from fuel poverty, in the worlds 5th largest economy? Take about setting the bar low. Japan legally limits the CEO wage relative to the employee. They're a more cohesive and productive society.
>Austerity has completely destroyed our economy
That's not austerity, in fact governments aren't implementing austerity, if expenses are still growing you are not doing austerity.
How's Spain Portugal doing after 10years? Have we caught the pendulum?
Had we invested and created/stimulated jobs we would probably be much better than we are now.
>health, education and transportation are still assured ?
Sure I'd go for that. I was genuinely curious what system you had in mind when you dismissed Keynesianism and austerity.
not possible as long as you are in the € zone
>What's the alternative? Spending more?
Actually most of so-called "Austerity" measures lead to more spending.
No argument there, I only hope we leave this sinking ship to be with our oldest ally soon enough.
...
well my system is telling fuck to the debt holders, telling fuck to the EU and doing what De Gaulle did to fix France's economy in less than 10 years after the war
>forcing the people to pay debt the governments contracted without their direct approval
Or much more indebted. I think the elephant in the room is the fact that the west cannot compete in manufacturing. Even if you build the most advanced robotic manufacturing plant the world has ever seen the chinks will steal it and do it at a fraction the cost. Europe is in it's death spiral. The great rebalancing is in full effect. Bending the knee to international finance is not a permanent solution as those kikes will sell you out when the time comes. Nationalism is the only possible path of fightback. And an aspect of nationalism is looking after the people of the nation.
austerity is not the only measure, at the same time there is QE hence the rise of prices.
I think you nailed it.
Got a source on that? As user above pointed out, austerity is only partially about directly balancing the books. It is an excuse to trim excesses from the state, a worthwhile exercise.
No-one is dying in the streets, literally no-one. Its amazing. No-one even goes hungry, i worked in soup kitchens and half the time the homeless couldnt be bothered to come and we threw shit out. Stop being so full of idle envy.
We could always just have a war as soon as we brexit. No hard feelings, it'll just benefit both of us.