People (read: comic nerds) actually have a problem with Joker killing Batmans parents in Batman '89

>People (read: comic nerds) actually have a problem with Joker killing Batmans parents in Batman '89

This is why comicfags shouldn't be allowed to write anything

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I have never encountered anybody who had a problem with that

Thats because they haven't dance with the devil in the pale moonlight.

youtube.com/watch?v=-eBCpQSmiQA

>defending god awful movies
I could care less about Joker killing the Wayne's, the movie is fucking ass in general.
Just like all the 80s / 90s Batman abortions.

Since this is Christmas someone should make a Batman Returns thread. Because, ya know.

Least retarded live-action Batman in the last 40 years.
They are all flawed, but '89 is by far the least flawed at presenting the mythos.
Best Alfred as well.

Its the most faithful to the tone and spirit of the comics, but its not the best movie.

It's not the best movie arguably, but it IS the best Batman movie.
The Nolan films tried to improve upon it by moving away from Batman.

-Batman '89-
Better Bruce Wayne
Better love interest (Vickie Vale)
Better Gotham
Better Batmobile
Better Alfred
Better Supporting Villain (Jack fucking Palance)

-The Dark Knight-
Better Batman (he can actually move somewhat)
Better Gadgets
Better chase scenes
Better Gordon

-Debatable-
Main villain
Soundtrack

I'd say capturing the spirit of the comics is more important than grafting iconography and factoids. I'd rather get a live-action movie that's thematically similar in tone to The Dark Knight Returns than mere lipservice in the form of shots lifted from the comics page.

In a more relevant example, to make the Joker the man who shot Wayne's parents is a daring idea, but Burton executed it well by making the Joker into a memorable character.

Shit normies say to appear like they know their shit

Agreed, you don't have to be a slave to every detail. The little things get changed in comics in any case.

But these decades-old classic heroes have certain elements in their mythos and basic elements of characterization that you shouldn't tamper with. These have stood the test of time already, or you wouldn't be throwing a fortune at telling their story.
You can always make your OC Superman, after all.

Yeah i'm sure Tim Burton really cares about the opinion of some edgy faggot 28 years after the film's release.

>Soundtrack
Dark Knight had a pretty forgettable soundtrack in my opinion. '89 on the other hand is catchy as fuck. Not only did you have Danny Elfman doing the orchestral score, but you had Prince contributing his own stuff to the film.

There were idiots who had problems because Keaton was shorter than they thought Batman should be.
Nerds have always been the same, with or without internet.

Why do you have to respond to the least intelligent people in the thread?
You might as well spray shit back at

Some people just love their soundtracks Loud and Zimmer.

This is the best Batman movie and best capeshit movie of all time

Anybody who disagrees is a MCUck, or contrarian dipshit who ironically like Shoe Maker's Batman because "its fun!"

eh, I've never been a big fan of it.

I mean sure it works in a stand alone movie, gives bruce a personal grudge in his fight against the joker and adds that symmetrical "I made you then you made me" thing.

But I think bruce loses something if his defining foe is a personal grudge. There's something to be said about batman being born from a single random act of violence, one that he can't really seek retribution from.

Joe chill didn't make batman, gotham did, crime did. Joe's just the murder weapon, he's a non entity.

Never understood how people dislike the 89 Batman. I can't think of anything bad about it really.
It made Bruce look like a weirdo, which is what he is. It's the only time Bruce has even been interesting in any way in any media.

Making young Joker the Wayne's murderer was fine in the context of a condensed story and it's no less retarded than the whole Red Hood thing in the comics.

Gotham looked fantastic, Batman looked bad-ass, he had gadgets, he was a detective and he had the best car. Joker was an evil genius with an actual scheme and uniformed henchmen.
Literally still the best Batman movie.

Batman was already after Joker before he figured out the connection. It showed that crime has been rampant for a long time in Gotham and that Joker was an experienced thug who had a viable skill set to be a crazy crime boss.

In a grander scheme, yeah it works when it's just some random murderer, but people forget that Batman wasn't the easy sell in 1989 that he is now. They weren't sure if it was going to spark a resurgence of Batfever so they made it like a one-off story.

I have no problem with it happening in that movie. But I'm glad it never became canon anywhere else, because it doesn't work as well outside of a self-contained film plotline.

>lets fucking Vicki Vale into the Batcave
>suspicious as fuck in front of guests

Not even close to being best Alfred

Heath ledge > Jack Nicholson.

Fight me.

You're joking, right? Batman is the least important part of the Burton movies.

Watch Batman Returns then watch Batman Begins.

That literally only applies to Batman Begins....TDK was "Joker, the movie" and TDKR was "Bane, the movie"

Burtons Batman had a pretty even balance between Bruce/Batman, the support cast, and the villain

Which is how a movie should be, it shouldn't be so one sided but with the dry ass performance Christian Bale gave I certainly see WHY they went that route with Nolans flicks, Bale was easily the weakest link about those films , he had no charisma or charm like Keaton did

The Burton movies are utter fucking trash. Whoever made the decision to give him even one Batman movie is a moron.

>best alfred
Shit like this should be a bannable offense.

Underaged b& detected

Burton movies had one major focus, and that was the villains. Because that's what Burton cares about. There's more focus on Joker, Catwoman, Penguin, and fuckin Christopher Walker than on Bruce Wayne. Seriously I implore you to watch the movies again.

And the single most important part of the Nolan movies is Batman. Bruce Wayne has an arc, and it's beginning, middle, and end. Joker does not have more focus than Bruce, and Bane does not have more Bruce. Every single thing that happens in those movie is the result of Batman.

Every fucking Burtonverse movie.

>Hey Batman I'm a woman
>Hello woman I'm Bruce Wayne I mean Batman, SHIT you know my identity now, oh well.
>Oh Bruce, I am in love with you
>Thank you woman, I love you too. I will now tell you every Batman secret in the world.

*Batman and Woman break up somewhere between movies, she is never mentioned again, somehow this is never a problem*

>Burton movies had one major focus, and that was the villains. Because that's what Burton cares about. There's more focus on Joker, Catwoman, Penguin, and fuckin Christopher Walker than on Bruce Wayne. Seriously I implore you to watch the movies again.

I watched them both multiple times in the last month, and you might have a point for Batman Returns, but not Batman....which was incredibly well balanced

>And the single most important part of the Nolan movies is Batman. Bruce Wayne has an arc, and it's beginning, middle, and end. Joker does not have more focus than Bruce, and Bane does not have more Bruce. Every single thing that happens in those movie is the result of Batman.

Batman/Bruce gets more screen time ultimately, but it's empty screen time for the most part....like I said Batman Begins that might be true for, yeah in that it was certainly all about Batman, but for the others while Batman may have been on screen the most it was mostly a whole lot of quiet nothing filling space for the next Joker or Bane scene, which is where the movies actually went anywhere

Not everybody is so cynical to think that somebody you had a love affair with would sell you out to the public and turn full evil just to spite the fact that you broke up

Do you really think the character of Vicky Vale in that movie, who seemed to have a legitimate romance with Bruce regardless of how it ended up, would have just gone HAHAHAHA FUCK YOU BATMAN NOW I RUIN YOU!

Don't think just about screentime. Thibk about importance to the narrative and plot. Joker is created because of Batman, Dent is inspired by Batman.

Bane comes to Gotham because he wants to fuck with Bruce. It's implied that Catwoman was also inspired by Batman. Those movies just don't work without Bruce in the center.

true, like I said, it works in a stand alone movie.

I wouldn't want it made canon but I think stream lining the story is what made that film work.

Wow what a retort you showed me.
You are just as much a fag as OP.

Because Batman is the least interesting thing about the franchise as a whole.

Remember thread with old timey emails comic fans sent?
>they're ruining X!
>they're replacing Y! I hate pretender!

>guy made a comment saying "THING IS BAD AND FOR DUMMIES"
>expects to be taken seriously and responded to with respect

>could care less
>Wayne's

Literacy these days

I don't like it when people try to give the Waynes' deaths meaning. It's a random act of violence, which is why Bruce becomes Batman in the first place. It is was a hit, then all he would have to do is find the person responsible and take care of them. The meaninglessness of their death gives his crusade meaning -- he's trying to stop all crime, not just the person who killed them and/or had them killed.

Also saying the Joker did it is lazy.

Still had the best Joker

youtube.com/watch?v=utj9gV5t_uQ

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That's all fine and good, but your personal headcanon (while I mostly agree with it) and the fact that a movie about a fictional character who is entirely up to the whims of the writers deviates from it doesn't exactly make an entire movie "bad" in any real way just because of that fact

Also, while like I said I mostly agree with what you said, in the context of the film I really don't see how Joker killing Bruce's parents changes anything about his crusade at all, it simply made for a more climactic finale and that was literally it. Like another user said, Bruce was trying to stop all crime and trying to stop the Joker long before he figured out that Joker killed his parents, it affected nothing other then adding dramatic flair to the movie, you would have a point if from the very start Batman knew who did it and only became Batman because he had a desire of tracking down this one man while disregarding all other crime and planning to give up after getting vengeance, but that wasn't the case at all

It sucks because it'd make the Joker and Batman relationship much more ridiculous than what it is already. It'd make Joker the reason why Batman exist, instead of Batman being the reason why Joker exist.

>using copypasta troll bait from Sup Forums on Sup Forums

No user, Jack Napier is the reason Batman exist and Batman is the reason Joker exist

Returns is better

Also, TDK is hardly a movie when compared to Begins. Liam Al Ghul was menacing as fuck

Bob: great goon or greatest goon?

My issue is that it makes the universe seem smaller when you connect all the dots to each other. Also it needlessly elevates joker even higher above all of batman's other villains by making him the one who killed Bruce Wayne's parents but I don't care enough to throw an autistic fit about it

Nah, too Burton

I find funny how no one talks about things like characterization and character development. It seems that comicfags don't really care about all that shit.

It's capeshit. All characterization and development are shallow plot devices for our power fantasies to continue

Let's not kid ourselves here, capeshit is shallow entertainment and there is nothing wrong with that, but it is what it is, it's not high art

>comicfags
That's just Sup Forumstards. No one cares else about those shitty movies.

YFW
You notice that if Bruce had just looked in the left pocket of the Police file on Jack Napier, he would've found out much earlier on that he was the guy who killed his parents.

>Every fucking American election
>>Hey Donald I'm a woman
>>Hello woman I'm Donald Trump I mean future President, SHIT you know my identity now, oh well.
>>Oh Trump, I am in love with you
>>Thank you woman, I love you too. I will now tell you every Drumpf secret in the world.
>*Trump and Woman break up somewhere between businesses, she is never mentioned again, somehow this is never a problem*

fix'd

Jack rules

89 wins because of Batdance

en.musicplayon.com/play-touch?v=478997

>IT'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE GOOD CAPESHIT CAPESHIT CAPESHIT XDDDD
Fuck off Sup Forumsshitter.

If you had ever read comics in your life you'd know this is true. Comic books are shallow male power fantasies, and these days also female and faggot power fantasies

They're not anything more, and there is nothing wrong with enjoying them. Being a fan of super hero comics is no different than being a fan of action movies, there is nothing "deep" about it to anybody who isn't intellectually stunted

I did read comics, you retarded faggot and you're not doing anything but oversimplifying shit.


>wanting good storytelling = wanting depth
Just kill yourself.
>inb4 HURR >CAPESHIT >GOOD STORYTELLING

they feed into each other

it's pottery

It does kind of mess with things when Joker's 20 years older than Batman. At that point, his main danger isn't Batman punching his lights out. It's breaking his hips while running away from Batman.

>the guy they got to play young Jack Napier for 10 seconds looks scarier and more Joker-like than Nicholson

>we've reached a point where comic book readers are stigmatized on the comic board
I fucking hate this place.

>legitimate romance

It was some bdsm inspire lust. Same with the love interest in Batman Forever.

That's because Burton is an overrated by mall-goth kids hack.
The only thing people really like about his movies is aesthetic.

And you're a 12 year old who thinks TDKT is the epitome of film making

KYS ya fuckin' 'mo, Batman 89 is a mans mans movie, TDKT is for numale faggots

>if you don't like this pile of shit, you like the other pile of shit
I'd say you should kill yourself, teenage girl, but you're probably already cutting.

Burton's Batman is a piece of garbage like everything that one-trick pony ever made. It wouldn't be that bad if he only tried to create original shit, but he makes godawful adaptations no one with taste would ever prefer over the original.

>the original

Yeah I literally bet you've never read the original Batman comic books ot laid your eyes upon them you piece of fucking goo gobbling trash

Not talking about Batman, you mouth-breathing retard. The original comics are as bad as Burton's shit movie.

Dumb queer KYS

>millenial emo girl is butthurt her shitty """director""" gets criticized

>implying
Batman 89 is one of the few capeshit films that is generally loved by old school movie fans, and isn't trendy among tweens of the current generation

I saw the movie when I was like ten with my cousin who was a mobster, he idolized Nicholsons Joker and so did I

I don't care about worthless idiots it's loved by.
It's an objectively terrible piece of shit created by a hack.
Burtonfags should kill themselves for the good of the world.

In the film, it fucking works.

In the comics and their main continuity, I don't think so.

In some place like Earth 1, then it might, but I think it's too late to say Joker killed Batman's parents. But yeah, if I made my own completely original story with Batman, I wouldn't be opposed to make the Joker partially responsible for Batman's parents.

>soundtrack
>debatable

The 89 Theme continues to this day to be "the Batman theme song." It even overthrew the Adam West theme. The Zimmer score, while good, will only ever be the Dark knight score.

>The Zimmer score, while good
Zimmer is yet to create anything really good. No, ripping off Suspiria OST for Interstellar doesn't count as "creating".

>even the Batman can't beat the Elfman

Oh, kid you are lost? Where is your mommy?

>Tim Burton really cares about the opinion of some edgy faggot
Well, he should. He made a career out of pandering to them.

>That literally only applies to Batman Begins....TDK was "Joker, the movie" and TDKR was "Bane, the movie"
The fact is when I watch Batman films, I watch it for his villains. Batman's villains are a major part of his appeal, it just wouldn't be the same if it is just Batman against nameless gangsters.

Batman '89 is pretty shitty from a storytelling perspective. There's no overarching plot to the movie, if there is any it's the bizarre love triangle between Bruce Wayne and Vicki Vale and Jack Napier. And frankly, I never liked Kim Basinger's Vicki. She only had two moods in that movie: wooden and screaming hysterically.

Batman Returns is technically an even messier screenplay, but it's held up because Michelle Pfeiffer has actual chemistry with Michael Keaton and everybody's bringing their A-game, including Christophuh Walken. It's not a great Batman story, but it is a pretty great Tim Burton movie that happens to have his weird, Elseworlds-take on Batman characters in it.

But all in all, the Burton-noir style is all those movies really have going for them, and Burton is a very love-or-hate-him kinda director. Even I vary in how much I can tolerate his "cutesy-dark" aesthetic depending on my mood.

>cutesy-dark
I like how Burton managed to somehow make Sweeney Todd less dark. I know, it was satirical and had songs like youtube.com/watch?v=I96RZh8108o but overall the original play was pretty dark. Burton just had to make everything too clean and polished so it became impossible to take seriously.

Samefag here.
>clean and polished
Are wrong terms, now that I think of it.
"Sterile" would be more fitting.

Both of you shut up. The only live action Batman movie worth talking about starred Adam West.

>Even I vary in how much I can tolerate his "cutesy-dark" aesthetic depending on my mood.
Batman isn't cutesy dark....Batman returns is much more comedic/campy dark, but neither film is "cutesy" especially not by todays standards

>better move interest (Vickie Vale)
fuck no. Vickie Vale was fucking awful in the '89. She was the most typical boring damsel in distress with a bitchy attitude that screams aaaaall the fuckinh time and literally tries to defend herself with a bowl of popcorn. I can't think of a worst character in the entire movie.

She was pretty obviously an attempt to get a Lois Lane-type love interest.

>comic nerds
You mean normies who've never read a floppy or trade in their life

I actually liked Sweeney Todd more than most Burton movies. I was pleasantly surprised that the awful protagonists died in the end. And the songs were surprisingly catchy. I then found out it was based on a play and went "Ah, that explains it."

>The Nolan generation only accepts a grimdark, ultra realistic Batman.

You're a fucking pleb.

Both of Burton's Batman films are amazing.

Jack's Joker is miles better than Ledgers heroine overdose victim.

Sweeney Todd is my ultimate guilty pleasure movie. It's just so enjoyable to watch.

>Batman returns is much more comedic/campy dark
That's the reason why I think it's such a controversial movie - when I was a kid, it was too dark and genuinely disturbing for me to enjoy. When I was a teen, I just kinda hated the whole Burton sensibility because the goths-who-grew-up-with-TNBC were in full swing. When I was in my twenties, it was too campy for me. And now that I'm approaching 30, I finally appreciate it for the weird, dark, stupid movie it is.

She was hot and cute and even a little funny, that makes her a better love interest.

Nobody likes a love interest who's a 5 tops and has the personality of a sack of rocks, especially not when they're a brunette

The part where Catwoman puts the bird in her mouth gave me a vore fetish, so there's that

well he's basically Nicholson in face paint, so of course he's the better one.

Never change, Sup Forums