Is Jordan Peterson Right?

Are films with a political message not true art?

Holy shit he's lost his mind.

it's subjective

How is that political?

When in frozen did it ever make it a point that the ice girl needed a mm to control her powers? That's never even alluded to

nah he's right. Clean your room, soyboy

>Jordan "I made my career by telling displaced millennials what they wanted to hear from an older person" Peterson

yes, unless the message is a message i agree with, then its BASED!

That redhead needed the ice seller to help her on her journey, how is it propaganda that women don't need a man to succeed?

The argument he's making could work, but applying it to Frozen is stunningly autistic.

almost forgot to read my bible and donate to his patreon

beauty and the beats is also propaganda, it tells women you can browbeat men into how you want them to behave, which is why its always regarded as the feminists favourite disney movie more so than mulan and the little mermaid both of which have female protagonists that show far more agency in their lives not to mention not being literally slaves locked in dungeons

what a fucking retard.
art and political agenda have always been intertwined and they feed one upon the other.

Frozen is not art because it's absolute trite shit, not because it has a political agenda.

there is nothing outside ideology....everything is political and imbued with power relations...therefore everything is propoganda.

It's just a movie nigga

He is legitmately retarded. I think he just uses his position to push his own sexist agenda that incel's eat up.

>memerson

Firstly, he was a tenured professor that taught at Harvard. There were hundreds of hours of his lectures online years before he ever "blew up" in the last year or so. Secondly, what the fuck is wrong with what you wrote? Is that a bad thing?

kek really?

That's 100% accurate holy shit lol you just summed up his schtick.

>people think this guy is smart
holy fuck lol

t. retard

>Sexist agenda

Spotted the Tumblrwhale.

I used to like him when it came to political correctness shit at campuses and he was talking about it at first, now it's obvious with his mega hundreds of thousands of dollars donation requests he's an opportunist that thinks just because he's smart in one area, that he's a genius at everything else in life.

>hurr teh beest shouldve MGTOW'd and not ever broken teh curse, what a cuck!

Spotted the incel refugee.

propaganda is absolutely art

It's because he reaffirms what they say in their right wing echo chambers.

Have never been on Reddit in my life other than for competitions, what now?

>the podcast with sam harris where he gets so btfo he just repeats himself and argues the minutia of the argument

Embarassing. Also later on when he was on rubin report or some show like that where he said that Harris was a hypocrite because he did good things but didn't believe in the bible.

While I do believe in Psychology, Its far less applicable and intelligence based as literally any other STEM field.

Frozen didn't show that at all though

>reddit

...

>Fat dyed-hair barren wench calling anyone else an incel

ah, so it's one of those "this guy agrees with me, and he holds (insert credential)!!!" while ignoring that the other 99% of the people who hold that credential don't subscribe to any of those ideas

I admire Peterson, but there's so much wrong with this. Is it really a politically charged statement to claim a woman can be successful and independent? If it wasn't for the supposedly "political" theme would Frozen have been raised up into the domain of art rather than propaganda? A bad movie is a bad movie, regardless of whatever political message it hammers home. If all you're capable of seeing in movies is an ideological struggle, then you won't ever fully appreciate it.

Also, if the purpose of art is to explore and create, surely Frozen was exploring the idea of the disney princess by creating a subverted version of the damsel-in-distress motif? His projection is pretty pathetic desu

Good comeback. Hit the fucking treadmill and maybe you wouldn't be such a bitter cat lady.

kek sure thing buddy. Jordan will one day force a woman to be with you! Im sure of it!

>implying pampered, whiny mellenials wanted to hear that they are 100% responsible for everything they do, and any failure really means a lack of skill or hard work
I mean, have you even listened to the guy or are you just shitposting?

>hey uh listen, woah, hey, you gotta, woah
>hey listen
>you know
>its people like that
>i mean my god
>politicals movies...are.not.art
>right?
>whoa
>i mean really?
he's pursuasive

>what they wanted to hear
Your life is your responsibility and hard work and self-improvement are they only path to happiness? Since when is "it's your fault" what anyone has wanted to hear? What everyone wants to hear is how it's everyone else's fault but theirs, which is why he spends his time deconstructing that pervasive Marxist narrative that millenials DO want to hear, and giving them a harder, truer alternative. "What they want to hear" is the polar opposite of what he says.

he should have just teamed up with gaston and ploughed peasant pus, bitches would be lining up to get at that beast cock

>Haha look at these idiots appealing to authority
>Does the exact same thing in the same sentence

Yeah. It was a total facade. At first you think he's this real smart dude when it comes to free speech, then you hear him go onto other topics, and he just comes off as this neurotic grandiose old guy thinking he's God and has it all figured out.

No wonder pseudo intellectuals worship him, he's a reflection of themselves.

The only real difference between him and some cringey philosopher youtuber is a degree.

Tell me how it isn't a sexist agenda of his. He rarely ever mentions men in his complaints about modern home life. Its always about women because retarded beta virgins like yourself can't get one unless they are forced to be with you

>yfw peasant girls would line up to fuck unearthly cursed beast cock with spines on it
>still can't get gf

>referring to someone as an incel; one of reddit's favourite terms
Just go back

Mate, he literally called MGTOW faggots something to the effect of "cowardly runts" a while back.

lol stupid people are so bad at trying to call out what they perceive as appeals to authority. you'd unironically say that kevin who works at the gas station down the street has just as valid of an opinion on nuclear physics as nuclear physicists do because to think otherwise would just be FALLACIOUSLY APPEELING TO AUTHORITEEZ

>pseudo intellectual
>has a degree

I like Peterson sometimes but his obsession with Disney movies is annoying

>Strawman
You're not good at this whole arguing thing are you?

He doesnt criticize women, he criticizes feminism, and if you cant seperate the two then you are fundamentally retarded.

Cause he is just telling people that without making them do it. Everyone can sit and pat themselves on the back for believing in hard work, that they have the potential to be great and everything they believed is true cause they thought about cleaning their room.

It is just basic self help spiel that people watch to feel like they have the ability to do shit.

I have a degree. Many people have degrees. They're literally meaningless at this point. A degree especially doesn't make you an expert in every subject, but Peterson seems to have an opinion on just about everything, regardless of how informed he is on the subject.

At what exactly did Elsa succeed? All she managed to do was get over her own internal shit and bring an end to the eternal winter that she threw the kingdom into in the first place.

That is not his crowd. His crowd are the people who think women should be forced back into the homemaker role so they can basically force themselves into their life by being a provider.

Just because he talked like that awhile back, doesn't mean they still don't worship him.

He absolutely does. Did you not watch him on Joe Rogan's podcast? I think you are the one who is retarded.

He went on a 10 minute rant about women who persue careers and said they shouldn't or even have anything outside of homelife.

>literal strawman and making up shit on the spot
Jesus Christ, this has to be b8

>Come and See (a literal propaganda movie) is not art

Why do people buy this pseud's product again?

one day i'll be able to spout various entries from the logical fallacies picture in the Sup Forums sticky , just like you!

>describes the new thought principle of the law of attraction
>doesn't realise it

Once you're older you'll look back and laugh on your silly opinions

This is nothing new. Peterson was doxed as heartiste commenter "Great Books For Men" years ago.

>it's a pretending you've refuted somebody's argument by acting like you're above engaging it in any way episode

>soyboy
this sounds terrible and anyone who uses it should be embarassed

You haven't listened to his lectures clearly. Which isnt a bad thing, but dont act like you're an expert on the guy.

He said in a lecture that manchildren are the most disgusting and horrifying things to him since they are like the corpse of a dead child stuck in an adults body.

Yeah. Educated /= intelligent all the time

Lots of average iq people graduate school and enter in fields like Medicine, Politics, etc; and they're completely retarded.

>women should be forced
>and said they shouldn't or even have anything outside of homelife

You're talking absolute fucking nonsense, never has he suggested or even implied anything of the sort. You're just some dumb cunt feminist who reads their shitty little worldview into everything people say, paranoid cunt.

Why do youtube intellectual types have it out for Frozen? Ben Shapiro and that molymeme guy have said similar things.

Because hes a good dadee

funf m'ass daddee

cleanin room dadee funf funf cmon drumpf lol

Isn't he a Biologist foremost and just adapted that to everyday life support lessons?

t. Soyboy with zero testos

Ive watched both of his appearances on Rogan, and i have no idea what you're talking about. Unless you can show me his "rant" then im just going to have to assume youre strawmanning him.

>having a degree in X means he gets to talk about everything else except X

Literally everything that we cannot scientifically measure with absolute mathematical certainty is propaganda. Every piece of information you receive is trying to convince you of something. Beauty and the Beast is propaganda that if you're ugly you can still find love. Peterson has lost his fucking mind.

Also look at Bill Nye, dude has an Engineering Degree but thinks he's an expert in everything else, and while he may know some shit in science, he clearly doesn't know everything.

>Cause he is just telling people that without making them do it.
YOU have to make you do it. Peterson isn't going to kick you out of your fucking house if you choose to sit on your ass. Espousing ideology you don't even try to live would make anyone a fraud regardless of where their loyalties lie.

You literally dont even have an argument though. All you said was "uhhhhh i bet you think this!!!!!"; all i'd have to say is "No I don't", and poof, argument defeated.

Stop trying to spread normie words and gb2r

t. triggered by the netflix show

He bashed women who persued careers because they aren't being a good little cookie cutter woman and pumping out babies for a man

Never once mentioned the manchildren who watch capeshit all day.

I am loving the insults, Why the fuck would I be here if I was a feminist, get your head checked retard.

naivety on display

>what is scientific inquiry

>clean up your room and sort your life out
>this advice blows the Sup Forumstards mind

...

>You literally dont even have an argument though
almost as if i was just laughing at you people instead of trying to engage in an objectively rational ans suprememely logical debate of facts

Why are you lying? He's never said anything akin to declaring women belong in the kitchen and shouldn't have careers.

He has however said that career women have a much harder time since they have to basically abandon being a mother since raising a family while also having a full time career is extremely difficult. Also, they have to do this all before their biological clock runs out.

>i'm going to interpret a film based on my right-wing paranoia, and then ex post facto declare it to be "propaganda"

jordan peterson is a giant shill.

>Cause he is just telling people that without making them do it.
I can't even tell what you're trying to suggest here. He needs to shut up or become a dictator?
>Everyone can sit and pat themselves on the back for believing in hard work, that they have the potential to be great
That's not even remotely what he says, and this is logically incoherent. His belief is that life is suffering and the only way to make it better is to take responsibility for it and improve it. Taking this thinking to its logical conclusion, you can't blame other people for your misery and it's all on you. That's not easy or cathartic, that's difficult, it forces you to be completely self-critical. Easy is blaming society and everyone around you for your problems and never changing.

Wow, almost like you're pretending you're above the argument by not even engaging in it. Hmm... where did i hear that before...? Hmmmmm....

good b8

One writer once said (when he rejected writing for the left while being a pretty big activist for it) that if the only reason you're writing is for political purposes then yes, it is propaganda and it will never have a real soul, it will just be like a propaganda pamphlet, not art. You can do art that has a political message, but you have to want to de a piece of art, not a political message, that would be extra. I don't expect most americans to understand the difference.

wtf is "true art"? ars gratia artis?

a film with no message is a waste of time. a "political message" is a message that you don't agree with.

the very premise of OP is flawed.

Nah

Come And See is one of the best films made and it's pure propaganda. I agree with him on most things, but not this.

I guess 1984 is propaganda

>he's just PRETENDING not to be arguing with me because he cant handle my supremely logical skepticism!!! i have sargon of akkad tattooed on my chest!

If you post a video of him saying women shouldnt be allowed to have careers itt I will send you .1 bitcoin

Fat little redpilled teens want to be told that people who criticize the things they like and/or like the things they that they don't like are evil and have a secret agenda.

>pls buy my programs
literally every podcast and lecture he shills it

beauty and the beast is about white female/non-white male romance you fucking idiot

>He bashed women who persued careers
He didn't "bash" them. Once again, you're reading shit into what he said because you've subscribed to some retard worldview.
>Never once mentioned the manchildren who watch capeshit all day.
Yes he has, see >Why the fuck would I be here if I was a feminist
Plenty of your ilk come to Sup Forums to astroturf and try to control discourse of "toxic" opinions.

Hes revealed himself to be an opportunist