I'm not sure if this is the right board, since although I'm talking about Batman, I'm referring the movies specifically.
I've just finished the 1966 Batman movie, and I thought it was great. However, I'm finding myself noticing the huge contrast between this and, say, The Dark Knight. The original Batman seems self-aware about how ridiculous it is while The Dark Knight is much more serious.
What happened to cause this shift? It went from a goofy parody of itself to a serious, more gritty film.
Dark Knight Returns
are you seriously asking about this shit like 50 years later?
>and I thought it was great.
What exactly is the appeal?
Even as a kid, I hated how stupid that show was.
It's like, why make a Batman show if it's just gonna be le quirky dancing and obnoxius?
>What happened to cause this shift?
Frank Miller, Dennis O'Neil, and Neal Adams.
Frank Miller happened, and then Tim Burton's movies came along and that interpretation became what normies associated Batman with.
Because the comics were just as goofy, if not moreso, when it was made.
....you're seriously asking us to explain why two different movies produced in two completely different eras, fifty+ years apart, are different?
Frank Miller Bats>Burton Bats>>>>le funny ill fitting dolar store costume Bats
batman and comics in general were goofy and sometimes surreal. The show was made to reflect that.
Batman 89 reflects the darker version of Batman that started to appear in the 70s and was most famously done in the Dark Knight Returns.
>batman and comics in general were goofy and sometimes surreal.
Yeah, but not really like the show.
The show was just unfunny meme comedy.
The Batman of the time got up to more interesting antics because you can do anything and go anywhere in comic books no budget needed.
I'll admit, it's probably mostly because of the nostalgia. I remember watching it when I was maybe 5 or 6 and thinking it was cool. I know it's ridiculous, but I don't really care.
*that appeared in the 30s and started to REappear in the 70s
fixed for you
>The show was just unfunny meme comedy.
So whats it like? Not having a soul, I mean.
fuck ya self boco desu
50's/60's Batman comics where odd to pin down as just being campy because while you did have some goofy stories, you also had things like Batman finding out his parent's death was a targeted hit. It wasn't intentionally goofy, the writers just went with the flow. The TV show was intentionally camp.
It seems a little odd to me that a company like DC would completely change one of their franchises like that. Sure there were different directors and different trends at the time, but it's still interesting how much it changed.
this
And I think this is why I liked comics fro mthe time as a kid but not that stupid show.
It feels like it's laughing at/trivializing Batman in a way the comics never meant to.
Thanks
user, do you have no perspective on the history of comics? Have you ever seen Superfriends? The Lynda Carter Wonder Woman show? Any of the Christopher Reeves' Superman movies?
Have you read ANY comics from before 1980, or any comics from after 1980?
I don't mean to be such a dick cuz I can understand your interest, but it's just too big a question to answer all at once without several blog-length posts. It's not just Batman, it's the changing shape of superheroes and comic books in general, the effect of television on the perception of urban decay in America, huge advances in criminology and psychology in the 20th century, the changing trends of Hollywood over several decades, and multiple generations of different creators all being drawn to Batman, all bringing different things. If you want me to explain why TDK is different than Batman '89, that'd be one thing. If you want me to explain why the '66 movie/show is the way it is, I can do that. But covering all that at once, it wouldn't just be a primer on Batman it'd have to cover all the influences on Batman over the years.
This post is a pretty good primer on why the comics darkened over time.
BANE?
...wha?
Are you autistic?
he's asking why Batman ended up with villains who wax philisophical about shooting men before throwing them out of planes
Movies go in trends. Around TDK gritty reboots were hot shit. The Iraq war also had a lot to do with the mindset that made gritty reboots successful.
Nolan Bats isn't really that "gritty" in the meme sense.
It's not tryhard, that is to say. It's just a less styled world.
The Dark Knight Returns, Watchmen, and Crisis on Infinite Earths happened.
They showed how fantastic a darker tone could be, but the industry and writers started taking it too far without considering the option of a lighthearted story.
I don't really have any perspective at all, actually. So generally, in summary, DC (and other entertainment companies) did what they had to do to get money, and over the years that brought them to different places?
Shut up, Boco. Nobody asked you. Nobody will ever ask you.
>le quirky dancing
Think there was only dancing in the pilot actually.
Pretty much
Times change, writers change, the comics change with it.
You should have gone from Adam West to Tim Burton Batsy, and even at least having Batman Forever and Batman & Robin on as a DVD rental or stream in the background for the lolz.
You act like Dark Knight is a direct sequel to this or something. There's like 5 other batman movies in between, Tim Burton ones were even more dark and edgy that TDK.
>Tim Burton ones were even more dark
They certainly had darker imagery, but they're fairly light hearted movies.
>and edgy
Yeah, nah. No Batman has ever been as edgy as Christian 'sore throat' Bale. His Batman voice is edgy to the point of unintentional hilarity.
Batman changes several times. Golden age Batman was serious. Silver age was silly and in the last 30 years he is "realitic".
The comics had silly stuff, but they weren't a self-parody like this show. A more accurate representation of those comics would be Batman: The Brave & The Bold. To me, the '66 Batman show was making fun of the comics' absurdity, not honoring them.
Batman 66 >>> Batman: The Brave & The Bold
You should take the worst parts of Batman serious.
Edgy
Batman '66 was intentionally silly
Let me give you a little rundown on Batman's history.
Batman was created as a dark and gritty masked vigilante who would take brutal vengeance on serial killers and mobsters.
In 1940 Robin was added in order to appeal more to kids, but the focus on mystery and crime stories remained. Like, Dick Tracy, Batman had some colorful themed villains, like the Joker and Scarecrow, but at the end of the day they were still violent criminals.
In the early 50's, superhero comics started to fade from popularity, though Batman stuck around. In 1954 there was a national controversy where crime and horror comics were blamed as corrupting America's youth, and in fact Batman & Robin's relationship was cited as promoting homosexuality. The industry adopted the Comics Code Authority, which was incredibly strict self-imposed censorship banning any kind of realistic or violent depictions of crime. This actually caused superhero comics to become the prevalent genre because they were able to transition naturally to a more kid-friendly approach, with their history of eccentric villains and colorful costumes.
The 50's saw Batman become bizarrely scifi focused, with Batman regularly encountering aliens and traveling through time, with cartoonish gadgets and wacky characters such as Bat-Mite and Ace the Bat-Hound. This direction would actually lead to some of the worst sales in Batman's history.
In the early 60's, comics like the Flash and Justice League of America were very popular, but Batman's sales were suffering. Julius Schwartz, who was responsible for the reboots of the Flash and Justice Society, decided the time had come for Batman to do the same. Batman received a "New Look", silly characters like Bat-Mite were eliminated and stories returned to revolving around mysteries.
cont.
However, in '66 a new Batman live-action television series was developed. The show was a comedy that parodied the campy action and dialogue of the 50's Batman comics and the strange villains. The show was wildly popular with adults and families and cemented the image of Batman being a comedic character in most Americans' minds.
As a response to the show, the late 60's saw Batman comics attempting to also be intentionally silly, but this was not a successful direction for the comics, as kids preferred Superman and older kids preferred the more serious stories pioneered by Marvel Comics.
Despite the Batman show becoming one of the most successful merchandising entities in history, sales of the comic just didn't reflect it.
In 1970, writer Dennis O'Neil and artist Neal Adams gave Batman another makeover, and looked back to the earliest Batman comics for inspiration. Batman returned to his roots as a dark vigilante solving murders, and O'Neil incorporated his love of kung-fu action movies by making Batman a master of martial arts. Characters like Lady Shiva and Ra's al Ghul were introduced who would go on to be some of the Bat's most famous enemies. Batman lost most of his strange gadgets and even Robin was significantly downplayed during this era. This is when Batman became a fan-favorite once again.
The mid- to late-70's was perhaps one of the most iconic periods in Batman's history with acclaimed stories by Steve Englehart, Archie Goodwin, Marv Wolfman and David Vern Reed reimagining many of Batman's classic villains. This era was what would go on to inspire many episodes of Batman: The Animated Series.
Though throughout the 70's and early 80's Batman regained traction with fans, DC as a whole had fallen out of favor, and most people still associated Batman with the wacky 60's TV show.
cont.
In the mid-80's DC made massive strides to rejuvenate their image with comic fans. Gritty, adult and thematically rich stories like The Dark Knight Returns, Year One and The Killing Joke easily spread across company lines and made Batman a king of comic book sales.
Then in '89, Tim Burton, inspired by TDKR and Killing Joke, brought this dark vision of Batman to the public consciousness with Batman the Movie. For the first time since the 40's, the public once again associated Batman with serious and dark stories rather than the silliness of the 60's show.
From here on Batman became an absolute juggernaut in both comic and merchandise sales. And I think you all know what happened from here: Batman continued to get reimagined in grittier and grittier fashion until you had the award-winning Christopher Nolan directed films once again alter the public perception of the character.
Well yeah, pretty miuch every Batman adaptation (with the possible exception of the Schumacher movies) has been wildly successful
Return of the Caped Crusaders is better than pretty much every DC animated movies since the late 00s
>Batman 66
These Batman comics have gotten so serious let's do a silly fun Batman like we remover remember when we were kids.
>Batman 89
That old Batman show sure was silly. Let's do a dark serious Batman like remember when we were kids
>Every Batman since then
Holy shit Tim Burton made all the money!!!!1! Let just keep doing a variation on that
How is that edgy?
AND THAT WEIRD ONE FROM 1966
>sales of the comic just didn't reflect it
It was a direct cause of having Batman featured on the cover of the JLA more than not, as well as having Robin be the first side-kick to be featured on the cover, roll call, and actively participating in the story arcs.
The Lego direct sales DVDs would disagree with you.