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Pleb detected

Best movie I've seen all year.

>both the author and scorcese say that spiderman was wrong to acquiesce to the japs

nah, he was right tbqh

Good FILM.

Forgivu me churstian padre.

ridiculously good film.
Andrew Garfield is 10/10 in this

Why?

>was wrong to acquiesce to the japs

Go make more Tarky videos Dan.

>letting countless people suffer and die because you won't step on a picture
>why is that bad

because GOD DOESNT FUCKING EXIST

and IF he did it was mad hubris to think you could suffer for all the dumb fucking japanese village plebs who thought you the padres were prophets

I doubt Reddit liked it.

Otherwise one of Scorsese's best in recent years, saw it three times. It was just unlucky it released in december so it was quite the flop

*tips his fedora to oblivion

Is this like Nioh?

Garupe didnt deserve to go this way t b h

Those people didn't suffer because he wouldn't step on a picture. They suffered because the Japs were autists that were doing that to them.
God doesn't need to exist. And we're talking about back then. Christianity is infinitely superior to Japan's cucked-to-oblivion Shintoism.

>Those people didn't suffer because he wouldn't step on a picture. They suffered because the Japs were autists that were doing that to them.

excuse me mr japanese man could you stop screaming from the torture, I have to explain why this technically isn't my fault

They were buddhist like most japs, Shinto is not even the biggest religion.

>Shintoism.

did you even watch the film

God exists tho, he is a 9 dimensional creature and simply your stupid 3D ass can't comprehend him.

Serious question: what's the philosophical moral of this film, anons?

the point of the film was that the jesuits had zero chance taking over tokugawa japan and they should just have fucked off but the missionaries just HAD to keep coming. I love how depressing it was when he finally meets liam Neeson and Neeson tells Garfield to just give the fuck up

Ctrl + F the script for "swamp". The film was pretty heavy handed with it.

faith is possible but it verges on hubris and the greater your faith the greater the danger of misdirected belief. basically scorsese revisiting the theme from last temptation of christ

So he's wrong if he does it and wrong if he doesn't. Sup Forums in a fucking nutshell.

the contradiction is what makes the film interesting.

also pretty hilarious how the Diamyo's inquisitor would torture catholics to death but didnt give a shit about protestants and would trade with them KEK

>we need an actor in a film where the villains are japs--
>say no more famalamaloo

There's no single point. It's about a lot of things. Like if you believe an idea is worth spreading (religion in this case), how far are you willing to go to spread it? If it gets too hard, and you stop, then what does that say about you? Is it wrong to continue spreading the message, even if others around you are suffering? Is it acceptable to to give into your opponents just because they persecute you/people who share your beliefs?

You guys don't know what you're talking about. Read about how Shintoism slowly became incorporated into Buddhism. Japanese Buddhism are cherry-pickings and it's largely still Shinto stuff that they follow on a day-to-day basis.
Giving up is against the Christian spirit. They had less of a chance of taking over Rome, and yet they did. I don't see your point. Christianity has always thrived in adversity.
It literally wasn't his fault though. Not on any level. The whole situation is framed by the Japanese officials in the movie in the most binary and ludicrous way. He had no other choice.

>>letting countless people suffer and die because you won't step on a picture
>>why is that bad

We live in a society of secular people who just can't understand. If you genuinely believe in life everlasting everything that happens in this world is just a short preamble to the hereafter.

Western people and liberals especially have no frame of reference to belief. We see this every time a suicide bomber or random jihadi murders people in cold blood. They even take the time to explain that martyrdom means a golden ticket to heaven and that this is their motivation yet society wants to find non-religious answers and bends over backwards to invent a story that doesn't require belief.

Movies about belief are starting to be completely unapproachable to most people and it's almost impossible to talk about them without getting bogged down in shit like this.

Without the conflict between faith and standing by what you believe even though the consequences seem bad there is no story.

>They had less of a chance of taking over Rome, and yet they did. I don't see your point
taking over tokugawa japan was not going to happen. Even the head of the order in portugal tells them not to bother with this fucked mission and garfield and driver are like SEND US ANYWAY

so fucking good

>You guys don't know what you're talking about. Read about how Shintoism slowly became incorporated into Buddhism
It doesn't matter, they were buddhist in the movie which you didn't watch. Stop trying to save face you goddamn cockwipe.

I put a gun to a guy's head. I tell you that if you don't say the word "tangerine" then I will kill the man.

By your logic you are blameless if you choose not to say tangerine.

what the fuck are you even talking about?

these are the smarties
10/10

>reddit spacing
>phobia of "the liberals"
>seeing rational thought as degeneracy

shadilay!

Why are you pretending not to understand?

Boring.

>Christcuck
>bringing up Rome
Christianity was the religion of women and slaves until Constantine fucked over Rome and got rid of the Pantheon to "unite Rome". I don't understand the cognitive dissonance it takes to understand that Christianity is one of thousands of religions that Rome could have taken as their official religions but still believe Torah 2 Electric Boogaloo is literally real. Constantine himself didn't even really buy it, he just wanted 1 uniform religion to unite Rome and chose the one that fit Rome's Pagan rituals and holidays the best and had 1 god in its dogma.

t. woke

>t. retarded

youtube.com/watch?v=c6bIV1U85kY
>movie about Portuguese missionaries in Japan getting tortured and killed
>IT'S JUST A SHOT AWAY starts playing

scorsese has no taste. no fucking taste. disgusting

step on me

You're an idiot.

>no argument
You're a subhuman.

K E K

>because they're going to listen to a secular official
Are you some cuck? Seriously.
I did watch the movie and you seem to be too stupid to understand that in the case of Japan the two are virtually indistinguishable. When Buddhism came to Japan the Court knew the people weren't going to like it so they worked it in with Shintoism and created the nonsensical abomination they have today.
It's not the same at all. I have no value attached to saying tangerine. But if you told me to beat up my girlfriend or kill my dog, and I would say no, then it would be absolutely your fault. And one could argue that in his case denying Christ was even worse.
You're an idiot. Even if what you said were true, which it isn't, it still doesn't contradict the fact that the initial Christians lived under extreme conditions and threat from the Roman officials and pagan believers that thought they were nuts. Whenever the Romans told them to make any kind of compromise, they told them to fuck off, and stuck to their religion. Which is the point of what I was saying. It's not in the nature of Christians, historically, to back away from any conflict because a triumph is never taken as the end goal.
Whether or not they could've planted a seed that took over Japan is irrelevant. Their duty was to serve those few Japanese who DID want to embrace Christianity and make sure that those that didn't knew what they were denying. You are stupid.

Why? Because I see things as they are and not how the ((((books of history)))) want to portray them? Keep believing in your fairy tales, Chistcuck.

>Japanese Buddhism are cherry-pickings and it's largely still Shinto stuff that they follow on a day-to-day basis.
Not exactly. Day-to-day Buddhist rituals in Japan aren't very different from those in other Buddhist countries. If you're talking about the extent to which the Japanese in general understand or are serious about Buddhism then it's not much, but that holds true for those other countries as well.
The main reason anyway is that Buddhism has always been tied to the State in Japan. The Tokugawa government pushed this to the limit and, as part of the role they gave it as a population control device, involved it in crackdowns against Christians. There would be no difference if Shinto didn't exist, or if instead of Buddhism there was Hinduism or Jainism or whatever. It's all about the State and political figures infiltrating and exerting direct control over religious institutions, weaponizing them basically.

>books of history
You mean academic papers written by people with decades of expertise in the field that present their claims backed by archaeological evidence and are always under the scrutiny of their peers from different backgrounds and countries around the world?
Those ((((books of history))))?
I bet you like Varg. He is also very, very stupid.

>I didn't fuck up, you're just too stupid to read my mind instead of the bullshit I type
How's that anal retentiveness working for you? What a sad cunt.

You truly are the worst kind of idiot.

Did he honestly believe that Jesus Christ would rather he let all those people be tortured and killed rather than have his picture stepped on?

I don't know about you, mate, but I don't like letting other people think for me. I like having my own ideas and judgements about things. I'm perfectly capable of making my own research and reaching my own conclusions. It's called been a grown up.

This board is a swamp. No good thread can grow here.

>being
Small typo there.

I get that but I'm absolutely certain that most of the people bitching about how the Garfield should've backed off aren't doing so because they understand the realpolitik of the era so much as they just think Japan is some magical paradise untouched by the white piggu and Christianity is backwards and has no place there.
>Day-to-day Buddhist rituals in Japan aren't very different from those in other Buddhist countries.
Could be that the book I've read gave a skewed perception on this, but from what I was led to understand Buddhism in Japan doesn't resemble the original form of Buddhism at all due to all the sprinkling in of Shinto beliefs. That, and from my weeb history I can't say that I feel many Buddhist vibes coming from their Zeitgeist. And I do feel it from Chinese media--which should say a lot, given that's the land of the CCP.
Such shitty bait.

no, he told them to apostatize repeatedly, they were just plebs and didnt get it. for them the icons were sacred.

tldr the japanese inquisitor was torturing HIM with their misfortune so that the Jesuits would stop comming

But the people at the end had already apostatized.

Think what you want, but I'm not the one taking as gospel everything that is said in academia.

well at the very end they decide they want Garfield to work for them like Neeson so they just torture the peasants to get him to agree to do their bidding.

pretty hard core shit honestly.

Sup Forums hates it because they wanted garfield to fuck his jap wife

based spider-man btfo all the yellow feverfags

He had deferred all his will to how he had imagined god, then set himself believing he was doing the work of god. Questioning his actions would be questioning god. He needed to manufacture a voice for how he imagined his merciful jesus in order to create permission to apostatize.

apparently /tv loves this movie.
it's getting basically rave reviews in this thread user

>in the case of Japan the two are virtually indistinguishable.
Wrong. From the visual aspect to the way the religion is practiced there are tons of elements that cannot be mixed up. The lack of clear separation, to the extent it exists, stems from the fact that originally Shinto itself was nothing more than an accretion of superstition and myth. AFAIK it had no specific teachings or doctrine. Anything resembling that which it came to have has been copied from Buddhism. Buddhism itself has very clear teachings, rituals etc., but it also has always been fine with syncretism. To top it all off, for the average guy Buddhism came to be seen as a religion involving worship of higher powers for worldly gains (plus some moral codes). Thus for such people there was no need to conceive of the "old gods" as separate from the "new gods".
Japanese Buddhists' biggest mistake, IMO, has been trying to engage Shinto in its own field instead of simply relegating Shinto deities to devas.

>When Buddhism came to Japan the Court knew the people weren't going to like it so they worked it in with Shintoism and created the nonsensical abomination they have today.
Nope, there even was a civil war between the pro-Buddhist and the pro-Shintoist factions. Again the "working in" was in itself inevitable, as it happened in every Buddhist country.

This
Jesus lets himself be crucified and killed, but someone stepping on a picture of him to save lives is a giant no-no?

Fuck off, pleb.

Fucking idiot. Why the fuck would academists be lying about history? Do you think for a second you know better than them?

>Buddhism in Japan doesn't resemble the original form of Buddhism at all due to all the sprinkling in of Shinto beliefs
Nothing really resembles the "original form of Buddhism".

>I can't say that I feel many Buddhist vibes coming from their Zeitgeist. And I do feel it from Chinese media--which should say a lot, given that's the land of the CCP.
You're mostly right about this one, but I do encounter Buddhist elements in a respectable amount of Japanese media. Still it's true that the Chinese took Buddhism more seriously than the Japanese did, overall (the late Nakamura Hajime came pretty much to this conclusion as well). I'd say that Japan is still spiritually reeling from the destruction brought on Buddhism by State Shinto, as well Buddhist institutions' cooperation with the Imperial government before and during WW2, whereas China with its free Buddhist institutions and a more open engagement with Buddhism underwent a wholly different dynamic despite CCP.

>I care about my opinions like liberals told me to

jajajajajajajjajajajajaja