Muh nostalgia

>muh nostalgia
>muh SJWs
>muh plot holes that are not really plot holes
>muh luke

So, is there any real arguments against this film, or all we've got are salty Sup Forumstards and nerds who are afraid of new things?

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>why can leia survive in the vacuum of space
>why can leia fly like marry poppins
>why are the resistances ships faster than the first orders
>why doesnt the first order just jump ahead of the resistance
>why do the resistance ships stop moving when they run out of fuel? what about inertia?
>why does the resistance have gravity-bombers in space?
>why do all the tie fighters fuck off once the slow-chase starts?
>why doesn't purple-hair tell her crew the plan?
>if she doesn't trust poe, why doesn't she chuck him in the brig?
>why doesnt the resistance have a codebreaker on staff?
>why didn't finn and rose park their shuttle in an approved area?
>why did the casino scenes look like they were filmed in iowa?
>how can a ~10 year old be able to move a broom with the force?
>how can BB-8 drive an AT-ST? how can it get into one and start it without being noticed?
>if the first order can track ships through hyperspace, why didn't they track finn and rose's shuttle?
>why did luke leave a map to find him if he didn't want to be found?
>how did snoke create the force-skype connection?
>how did rey get off the destroyer and back to the falcon?
>why didnt anyone else ever use the hyperspace-kamikaze before if it's so damned effective?
>how did rose's speeder catch up to finns when they were both going full speed, but she broke off her attack?
>how did finn drag her back to the front door of the rebel base without getting wrecked by walkers?
>how did snoke not sense Kylo's betrayal?
>how did rey become so powerful in the force that she could blow open a rock wall with no training?

>how can a ~10 year old be able to move a broom with the force?
Anakin did more there's nothing wrong with that.
Same with Leia using the force. She's Luke's sibling after all.

nme.com/blogs/the-movies-blog/star-wars-plot-holes-1921277

OP BTFO. Just face it, it was a shit movie.

No one actually liked this film. You're just being ironic.

POSITIVES
>far and away the most space-based star wars
>resistance plot is speed in space and pulls it off well
>despite being a woman with purple hair, holdo is a captivating character with plenty of shades of grey
>prequel trilogy actually gets some love in the canto bight sequence calling back phantom menace's tatooine act
>rey shows weaknesses and faults (actually fleshing out her character)
>kylo shows strengths and doubts about allegiences (actually fleshing out his character)
>luke has failed and this actually effects his plot unlike some superhero who is heroic for the sake of being heroic
>fucking puppet yoda
>the suicide run was straight out of my animes
>snoke was a chump and the twist that he really wasn't that important felt good since trying to make him even more evil than sidious would have just been embarrassing
>luke vs kylo
>fuck you, porgs are adorable, didn't effect the plot like ewoks, and were kept mostly in the background
>papabacca
>hoth's placement always bothered me by making the rest of the movie sort of anticlimactic, action-wise; krait at the end was a fitting 'final stand'
>the 'true' story of luke searching kylo, becoming horrified, and then resisting the dark side fits perfectly with his character and actually bridges the OT and ST unlike Han and Leia
>johnson (who i don't care for) actually broke the boring abrams/spielberg/cameron mold and inserted a good amount of panache in the direction

NEGATIVES
>finn and rose didn't do much to endear me to them
>luke's exit wasn't quite as centerplaced as I would have hoped

Overall, 7/10. 3rd best SW after ANH and ESB. It seems normies hated it because it made TFA pointless, which was good in my book because TFA was a pointless movie to begin with.

>Anakin did more there's nothing wrong with that.
He was known to have "quick reflexes" by being able to see things before they happen - he never moves anything with the force until he's had training

>film where nothing is accomplished and no one learns anything

10/10 masterpiece

The movie was very poorly written with equally poor execution, it also felt nothing like Star Wars, more of a parody.
If you strip away everything people like about the franchise but give them something substandard you cant be surprised by people not liking the end product

There are an absolute shit ton of legit film making and storytelling problems with this movie. Expect the Plinkett review to be >4hours long

Thank you Mr.Shatner

The acting is absolutely horrendous.

>Isaac, Boyega, Tran, Del Toro, and Gleeson all seem half-hearted and bored.
>Daisy Ridley is marginally better than she was in TFA, which means she's still a plank of wood.
>Serkis overacts and still leaves no impression.
>Hamill and Fisher spout all their dialogue in a flat, croaking monotone.
>Laura Dern is somehow even worse than everyone else.

Adam Driver is the only one who gave a decent performance.

>nitpicking, the post

I thought Fisher did a pretty good job considering the material, but get your point.

So he can literally see the future without training but you think Mage Hand 1/day is more significant?

Maybe she's just not onscreen enough, but she didn't really leave an impression on me.

>luke trains for like a month and beats a sith lord with +20 years of experience
>"such a good character, so realistic, wow"
>rey defeats a wounded newbie sith lord wannabe
>"whaaat? mary sue! the jews want to destroy the patriarchy (that doesn't exist, btw)!!!!!

...

weak bait my man

friendly reminder that sjw is a meme that has come to mean anything not authoritarian right. no one is a self described social justice warrior.

SUCK IT DOWN WHITE BOY

you time is over

>sjw is a meme
spoken like a true subversive, aka a commie jew

Great pasta fellow redditor

>entire second act of the movie rendered entirely pointless because Rose Finn and Benicio got spotted by a mouse droid
It's shit like this that made me hate this movie

>you like females, you're a social justice warrior!
>you don't hate jews, s-social justice warrior!
no one outside of your internet circle jerk takes your nonsense seriously

the story itself feels fabricated

it has no direction

PT is a good example of a story that's going somewhere, the story of the ST seems to be a bunch of subplots, arcs thrown together, many of the things that happen could not happen and we'd have almost the exact some outcome

>if you don't stone women, jews and gay people, you're a sjw

not sure if Sup Forumstard or a muslim

>afraid of new things
>movie promises it'll do new things just to steal from ANH, TESB and ROTJ
Ah yes, TLJ truly is "kino" and Rian Johnson is a maverick of film. He sets up what people expected, subverts it, and then ends up taking the most reiterative route this series could take. The movie ends and none of our characters are wiser and are in the same position they were in at the end of TFA. So daring, and if you don't get it well sorry buddy, you're just a brainlet.

But anakin has 20,000 something, that makes him SPECIAL.

Every major university has multiple courses and majors to "teach" and propagandize social justice, many **literally called social justice**. others called black studies, feminist studies etc. etc.

Many of these courses are now required requisites regardless of major

You are a pilpul damage control shill or a complete moron

I don't remember this scene in the movie, wtf?????

samefagging jew

Dude, you turned your brain too much to this movie, and fuck i didnt remember mary sue being such a fuckin bitch.

If it did nothing else wrong, I'd hate this movie purely for butchering Luke's character. The Luke who throws away his lightsaber at the end of Return of the Jedi would never have even considered murdering someone in cold blood purely on the hint that they could be tempted by the dark side. It's not a natural progression of the character, it's a betrayal of the growth he experienced throughout the OT for the sake of cheap drama.

...

The first time I went to see it, I was pretty lukewarm on it. I went a second time today because my parents wanted to see it. Knowing what was coming helped. I enjoyed it a lot more. Probably going to settle at #4 on my SW list.

>So, is there any real arguments against this film

Rose was a shoehorned love interest for Finn, and the whole plot with Poe, Holdo, Finn, and Rose was stupid and dragged the film down whenever the film focused on it.

The people bitching about Luke not being a perfect hero good guy are being retarded.

I've seen it 8 times. Everyone NEEDS to go buy tickets to this movie ASAP! Don't wait!

> new things?
what were those new things?

Luke had an autist fit for Vader making a veiled threat towards turning his sister and cut his hand off. It's not too farfetched to see him as being impulsive.

need the webm of someone editing it so that she becomes the lightspeed kamkikaze

>>muh plot holes that are not really plot holes
Explain yourself.

Also
>Muh subverted expectations
This is easy to do, but not an argument, see?

Its two and a half hours long.

I'm okay with this scene, it just has terrible execution. Tie fighters destroy the bridge, Leia is blown out into open space. As frost begins to form on her skin, suddenly her eyes open. Using all of her strength, the force flows through her and she pulls herself into the destroyed control room before collapsing.

In screenplay format, it's cool. But it looks shlocky as fuck with Rian's direction.

I don't give a fuck if you liked it or hated it. If you didn't like it, super.

Just got out of it, and I was disappointed.

I thought it was going to be funny bad, but it was just boring. I only laughed at Super Leia

>m-muh non-existant plotholes!
>post entire list of plotholes
>nitpicking lol
mouse shills btfo

The movie has real flaws, but not the ones that Star Wars fanboys are bitching endlessly about.

The entire casino section of the movie felt drawn out and Finn's story line ultimately ended up being pointless.

Poe still isn't very interesting.

The entire movie overall feels like it should have been the ending and the story doesn't really have anywhere interesting to go. The death of Snoke, the revelation of Rei's parent's etc. all feel like they belong in the last of the trilogy, not the middle.

>>far and away the most space-based star wars
I'm a big Star Wars AND general sci-fi fan, and I don't get how this is much of a positive for a SW movie. ANH has the opening, and the Falcon chase, and the Death Star Attack. Having lots of the movie on one main rebel ship is much less interesting, especially when it's just the setting for a lame resistance misunderstanding plot.

The salt fort battle at the end was entirely superfluous.

Yes, he has the fit of anger and impulse. But then he sees Vader's smoking cybernetic wrist, and he realizes that in that moment of wrath he nearly became what his father became. And so, then, he throws his saber away and tells Sheev that he's failed. The whole point of that scene is that Luke will never do anything like that again.

>It seems normies hated it because it made TFA pointless, which was good in my book because TFA was a pointless movie to begin with.
Trouble is BOTH movies seem quite pointless now.

>there are an absolute shit ton of legit film making and storytelling problems with this movie.

This right here is exactly it. It's a blueprint of poor filmmaking that relies on "shocking" "twists" to carry a bare-bones, uninteresting plot.

>The whole point of that scene is that Luke will never do anything like that again.

The point is that he won't bow to the dark side when the chips are down. And he doesn't. He doesn't turn into a fucking vulcan, he still feels temptation. He regains control very quickly, unfortunately, hothead didn't take it well.

A good portion of these are valid. Some of us like a better explanation for things other than "because it's a movie."

Isn't this thread about TLJ?

I still think it was a massive overreach of an idea. Even if Luke had felt that urge of temptation I strongly doubt he would have gotten as far as turning his saber on. He would have mastered the impulse because he'd felt it before, and now he's older and wiser.

>why can leia survive in the vacuum of space
Force users can make do without oxygen for an extended period.
>why do the resistance ships stop moving when they run out of fuel? what about inertia?
>why does the resistance have gravity-bombers in space?
Space battles are WW1 aerial battles with tones of 18th century naval combat with a space background.

>why do all the tie fighters fuck off once the slow-chase starts?
Presumably if the star destroyers are unable to breach the shields, the fighters are not useful either. Fighters are there to destroy bombers and light ships, not capital ships, which are weak to bombers.

>why doesn't purple-hair tell her crew the plan?
Its very common in any bureacrautic organization for there to be power distance and red tape. Furthermore, the plan involved sacrifising a capital ship, something that Poe could have had a problem with as his plan did not involve such, and could have triggered a mutiny.

> why doesnt the resistance have a codebreaker on staff?
The resistance lost most of their staff before one becomes relevant. Might have been in the other capital ships, back on ground, with Akbar.

> why did luke leave a map to find him if he didn't want to be found?
Luke has been in exile for years. His initial thoughts could have differed from the the ones he presented after resigning to his fate. Furthermore, the planet had the Jedi teachings, towards which Luke clearly placed sentimental value, and might have wanted to have a way to be found.

> if the first order can track ships through hyperspace, why didn't they track finn and rose's shuttle?
They focused on the capital ship, and its not explicitly said that the technology works beyond capital ships.

> how did rey get off the destroyer and back to the falcon?
Good question, felt like there was a sequence cut after Luke's saber exploded, as she just sort of appeared later on in the falcon

>The whole point of that scene is that Luke will never do anything like that again.
I don't think that was the point at all.

Vader was going easy on him and that was before the prequels said you needed 15+ years of training to be a full-fledged Jedi.

The real problem with Kylo in this sequel trilogy is that the audience can't take him seriously like they could with Vader or Palpatine anymore, and now that Snoke's dead we're left with a conflicted Kylo that's just going to redeem himself to appease all the reylo disney fans and an incompetent comic relief character that gets bullied by Kylo/Snoke every other scene. If the antagonists don't feel threatening to the audience then they have no reason to care about the meaningless conflict in episode 9, especially since they're just rehashing the same boring empire vs alliance scenario despite everyone praising this movie for being so subversive.

I'll tell you exactly what will happen in the next movie. There will be a timeskip of 5 years or so and the resistance will have a functional fleet again, and then they will have a battle against the empire and their new big giant sphere with a superweapon attached to it. Hux may or may not betray Kylo because he has had enough of Kylo's temper-tantrums and Kylo will ultimately redeem himself and save Rey from Hux (but only after Rey humiliates him in a duel). Meanwhile everyone else in the cast will have a meaningless fight with stormtroopers where they discover the importance of working as a team and that they are #strongertogether

i kinda liked it
t.poltard

People swear they won't do the same thing again only to repeat themselves. In myth and literature, this is called a fatal flaw. Luke's impulse leads him to believe striking Ben down before he can cause any damage is the best decision, because he feels Snoke has him too entrenched that it will be inevitable Ben will saber the place up anyway. He ends up speeding this process up sooner rather than later and regrets he didn't make a better choice. Hindsight is always 20/20 and even our heroes are fallible. I'm not even the biggest fan of this movie, it's a huge mess, but I don't see anything particularly sacrilegious about the Luke portrayal.

the movie is so fucking bad, you can literally tell that the jews at Disney's entire purpose was to make money and shit on any good ideas Lucas had by completely retconning them and turning the series into a vehicle to sell retarded illiterate mullatos an endless series of generic forgettable trash cinema for the next few decades

>"I-i like star wars!" why? "because disney told me too!"

>but not the ones that Star Wars fanboys are bitching endlessly about.
OK, let's hear your new, original flaw...
>The entire casino section of the movie felt drawn out and Finn's story line ultimately ended up being pointless.
Oh, it's one of the main ones EVERYONE's been saying, you dumb fuck.

but the movie takes risks and actively subverts the expectations? Are you sure that your critique isn't latent view of TFA, and not TLJ, as the latter clearly attempts to be something else than a generic and forgettable cinema.

But I've always felt the whole point of the OT is that Luke overcomes his impulsiveness. He actually does learn Yoda's lesson and focuses on the present, rather than the horizon. Heroes are meant to triumph over their failings. It's part of what makes him heroic. That, to me, is the larger sin that Rian commits with Luke in TLJ. He doesn't feel heroic. He doesn't feel triumphant, even at the end when his projection confronts Kylo. And I actually kind of hated that in hindsight, because it just seems to be Luke retreading the ground he walked on in ROTJ. The whole OT is about Luke moving beyond that.

THIS.

Requesting the Leia lightspeed kamikaze edit

>Luke has been in exile for years. His initial thoughts could have differed from the the ones he presented after resigning to his fate. Furthermore, the planet had the Jedi teachings, towards which Luke clearly placed sentimental value, and might have wanted to have a way to be found.
Weak, weak, WEAK defense. If he changed his mind, this should be mentioned. And the sentimental attachment part is blown away by what's shown in the film.

>POSITIVES
kys

>Presumably if the star destroyers are unable to breach the shields, the fighters are not useful either
You are dumb, arent you? 5 minutes ago 2 TIEs murdered everyone on Home Two bridge with their rockets, and Edgelord's TIE-Silencer destroyed hangars.
Fucking 60 km super mega ultra star destroyer should have like 10000 different TIEs in hangars.

The Last Jedi is the first Star Wars feature since Empire to feel like a genuinely great, classic in the making, game-changing film in addition to being a great continuation of the mythos, and the fact that fans have had so much to argue about in the details of that is proof not only of its artistic success and but just how brave Rian Johnson was to take the risks he took. It’s a bold film that dared not only to be political and of the moment within the universal pop-mythos, but to actively interrogate, challenge, and recontextualize the very foundations of that mythos. And as a result Star Wars feels like it has more chance for change, growth, and genuinely culture endurance since at any point since the prequels

"a thing happened that i didn't want to happen" is the plebbest """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""critique""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" a moronic fucking pleb could have.

Yes, but the fighters had to withdraw because of...um...reasons.

Nah man blacks and wimmin will do it for me since i'm currently living in a time of genocide and ethnic cleansing because my skin is pasty.

> If he changed his mind, this should be mentioned.
He was shown to have mixed feelings towards his past and the reasoning of his exile, with him presenting two different versions of what happened with him and Kylo, which implies that he still has some reason to uphold his reputation as the first version was much more positive towards him.

> And the sentimental attachment part is blown away by what's shown in the film.
But he is willing to destroy the temple only after meeting Rey and her leaving to convert Kylo. He could have torched the place much earlier if he wanted the Jedi to be forgotten with no hope of a return.

Heroes are flawed and they make mistakes. That's what makes them interesting (see Rey). But when the last thing you see in the previous work is the hero overcoming this flaw, to see them fall right back into it in the next installment reeks of shit writing. The ST is rife with this style of writing. Everything that's old is bad and flawed and everything that's new is good and perfect. If they wanted to make a compelling story, they could have set up events that the OT characters were unable to deal with while still maintaining the growth they made during their journey. But they didn't. They went the easy route and the franchise will suffer all the more because of it.

Porgs are basically Gizka, but you cant even Force Lightning them. They doesnt even affect plot, Filler Wars Episode 8 as is.

I didn't mind it so much, but I just wish Luke actually did something heroic in person. Him being an isolated hermit who distances himself from the Force but then becoming hopeful again would have been a lot more powerful if there was crazy payoff to that, like him showing up and doing heroic shit. Instead he just shows up and does the whole Obi-Wan thing whereas Han already pretty much did the Obi-Wan thing in the last movie. It's redundant. I liked grizzled Luke being disheartened after everything he did only for it to all go to shit and for him to lose hope and become inspired, but that final act on Crait was terribly handled for every character.

Why did Luke make a map to find his location if he just wanted to be left alone to die
Why is Phasma's armor blaster bolt proof but regular troopers aren't
Why was the commander of the Dreadnought aiming the giant cannon at the empty Resistance base instead of the big ass ship they're all loading on

>with him presenting two different versions of what happened with him and Kylo
No, Kylo presented the second version.

Also, he could have fucking READ the Jedi books. I still can't believe how ridiculously dumb it was to have Luke say he never bothered.

and "It subverted the expectation of Star Wars nerds so it's a good movie" is a pathetic excuse for thinking it's the best movie ever when it has major problems with length, the tone, the unfunny ""comedy"", the useless B-plot and plot holes the size of the death star, the flat commentary on capitalism and people profiteering on both sides that goes absolutely nowhere, the fact that nothing gets accomplished aside from killing off interesting characters, and the fact that it answered every question from TFA and gives us no reason to watch Episode 9 where it's just going to be a boring battle between Rey/Kylo and the comic relief Hux vs the resistance, like a worse version of The Hobbit's Battle of 5 Armies.

It was boring, had poor writing, incredibly high amounts of filler, hurt the original films and failed to innovate with a new plot and, once again, reused the plot of ROTS but with the Hoth battle at the end. Just because it’s new doesn’t mean it’s good for progress doesn’t mean shit if your progressing to nothing or something bad it is pointless. There are plenty of real arguments against this movie and people like OP who say “ur a Russian bot” or “ur a trigrd Sup Forumstard” if you dislike the yearly beating of the dead horse are simply incapable of facing the fact that people don’t agree with them.

If I dont like sequel trilogy and I am russian does it mean I am a bot?

remove all the above points, it was still just boring

Yes, it has abandoned the theme of Star Wars, which is space fairy tale, and ruined the happy ending.
>inb4 muh space fairy tale
Leave out Jedis, leave out tie fighters, leave out blasters. The movie can still be Star Wars. But leave out the theme and what is left is only Star Wars in name. If you want to abandon the theme of Star Wars, why call it Star Wars except for marketing? Why not create a new franchise instead, OP?

>nerds who are afraid of new things?
If Disney is so brave, why did they acquire the Star Wars brand instead of creating a brandnew setting of their own?

Why acquire the brand but abandon theme, OP? Why?

Its easily the worst Star Wars film. But not for the reasons people say.

Dumb nerds hate it for not living up to their fanfiction, for treating Luke poorly, retconning pretty much all of Episode VII

Here you go gents.

>easily the worst Star Wars film

people who think anything is worse than the prequels should be gassed

>muh jar jar ruined muh childhood

Dude. Stop fucking posting this.

my fucking sides

lemme guess: you also hates sand?