Adventure Time General

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What are your honest and humble thoughts on Adventute Time Sup Forums?

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Great

There's only a couple of episodes I see as actually bad. There's like, a couple dozen episodes I think are mediocre. The rest ranges from okay to great. Some of my favourite episodes are very interesting to me thematically and do something I haven't seen much in animated TV. There haven't been that many situations where I didn't like something based on plot decisions solely (Apple Wedding, Red Throne, Breezy). For most of the times, if I dislike an AT episode, it's motly because it's just boring and not outright terrible.

Strong start that was a good mix of humor and a creative world. Bits of lore nuggets helped flesh out the world to feel more real. It was a fun simple show where the extra stuff felt like a bonus

These little elements slowly got more and more attention. At first this was okay or even good as it seemed like the characters and world would develop. Instead it didn't, the show started to just spin it's wheels yet still try to act like it was doing more with the characters it refused to develop. This lead to many episodes being random character has sad story cry now. Made even worse by awful episodes like Breezy, the general quality of writing went down and it felt like a lot of writers didn't care about AT but wanted to use it like a launch pad for their career. This was on top of creating a lot of baggage that was either never addressed or addressed in a way that made it pointless and feel like a disappointment.

Eventually the writing improved again but the damage was done. It can't get away from the mistakes but has been able to deal with them as well as could be hoped for, but it still falls into shit like Stakes which is just awkward OTP pandering that they won't even commit to.

Season 1-5 is a masterpiece
Anything after is hit or miss that gets worse over time.

Marcelline is great
Finn is great
They're great together

>but it still falls into shit like Stakes which is just awkward OTP pandering that they won't even commit to.
how
how the fuck do you even come to such a conclusion when Stakes are about 80 minutes long and PB interacts with Marceline for less than 10 minutes of it

>how the fuck do you even come to such a conclusion
Nigger how can you not? And it is way more than 10 minutes, they even have a bit where Marcy is old and they are living together. Did you just take it all as good gal pals wanting to care for each other and help each other out?

Also the rest of it was also shit tier, vampires were underused and the entire ending is one big fuck you of lol status quo is great

Badly drawn tripe.

Not him but, Stakes was the worst of the miniseries, and none of them were that great. The entire action that motivated the rest of the events was an internal conflict in Marceline that was not only not solved in the miniseries but never even existed before it, making the entire thing completely pointless.

Every single fight was anticlimactic, none of the vampires were particularly interesting. The story of the entire special centered around them and Marceline, but you learn the important parts of this story in the first 2 or 3 parts and everything in between that and the poor excuse for a climax the fight with the Vampire King was basically just filler.
There was no funny or interesting interaction between any of the characters, there was basically no joke or gag to the entire special, at least not a funny one.

You can literally skip the entire miniseries and you wouldn't know any less about the show overall, and you wouldn't have missed anything even mildly entertaining.

>And it is way more than 10 minutes, they even have a bit where Marcy is old and they are living together. Did you just take it all as good gal pals wanting to care for each other and help each other out?
I didn't even pay attention to that. It was a dream sequence meant to connect a different point, the one that actually had a role in the plot and character development. Yet you choose to get salty over one detail that's not even the main point.
>Also the rest of it was also shit tier, vampires were underused and the entire ending is one big fuck you of lol status quo is great
How were vampires underused? All of them showcased different colourful personalities and a variety of powers. Plus dissing the ending simply because it brings back the status quo is ridiculous.

>you wouldn't know any less about the show overall,
Well there is the humans sailing away and why they have hats, but you could just watch that one episode.

>The entire action that motivated the rest of the events was an internal conflict in Marceline that was not only not solved in the miniseries but never even existed before it, making the entire thing completely pointless.
Of course it didn't exist, because it comes entirely from her backstory which we didn't know before. Which is also for
>and you wouldn't know any less about the show overall,
I guess providing backstory for one of the main characters is not really important
It's also solved with Marceline coming to terms of who she is, being motivated both by her interaction with vampires and unwillingness to end up like Simon.
Your further critisisms all come down to it not being entertaining for you, which is understandable but subjective.

>critisisms
criticisms*

>What are your honest and humble thoughts on Adventute Time Sup Forums?

I think it's great, I genuinely think it's a really good show.
It's dragged on a little and has become somewhat flanderized, but I'd like to think they've tried their best to combat that by simply having the characters AGE and DEVELOP to some degree so they can't forget what they're like; simply 'cause they have to rewrite them every year or so.

I don't think it deserves a lot of the hate it gets(though, some of it is obviously justified, it hasn't been a flawless series, but I'm not expecting it to be fucking perfect): it's one of the few shows that is popular because it is/was GOOD and it isn't completely fucking stupid even though it's an american cartoon for kids, literal children.

I'm really excited to see how they end the series.

>entirely from her backstory which we didn't know befor
But we knew a lot about it, this was just inputting random shit to justify the miniseries. Didn't even add important shit, oh she got more magic when it showed she was magic before anyway.

>It's also solved with Marceline coming to terms of who she is
That really wasn't an issue and she is still a moody teen/20-something after that.

>But we knew a lot about it, this was just inputting random shit to justify the miniseries. Didn't even add important shit, oh she got more magic when it showed she was magic before anyway.
Literally the only thing we knew was muh fries. We didn't even know she wasn't born as a vampire.
>That really wasn't an issue and she is still a moody teen/20-something after that.
Yes but she's somewhat less of a bitch now, less angsty as well.

>Literally the only thing we knew was "muh fries".
And her whole stuff with Ice King, what more was needed that this added? She fought some bad guys and got powers. Oh wait she had powers before cause she is demon spawn and they even show that.

>less of a bitch now, less angsty as well.
She is the same, we even get the angsty story time with Bemo where she sacrifices herself to become candy. Even under what you propose it is nothing, 8 episodes to be a bit less of a bitch.

...

A man of taste I see

>And her whole stuff with Ice King, what more was needed that this added? She fought some bad guys and got powers. Oh wait she had powers before cause she is demon spawn and they even show that.
The only power she initially had was sucking out souls. Her hunting down vampires was something that needed to be brought into her backstory to enrich it beyond "she did some shit for 1000 years after Simon left"
>She is the same, we even get the angsty story time with Bemo where she sacrifices herself to become candy. Even under what you propose it is nothing, 8 episodes to be a bit less of a bitch.
Well, these 8 episodes are the only real character arc she's had in the series. Plus her throwing a shitfit and becoming candy in Elements was a wholly different conflict that had nothing to do with her angst about being a vampire and living for ages.

>to enrich it beyond
The show needed to justify why the 1000 year old demon spawn, in a world full of magic, who hangs out with magical beings had a range of magic powers? Really? At that point you may as well start justifying her choice in shoes

>only real character arc she's had in the series
Her first few appearances has way more as we see her mellow out and not be as bad. Even if we pretend that in stakes she got slightly less angsty in 8 episodes is pathetic.

>nothing to do with her angst about being a vampire and living for ages.
So now you change it, her living forever was never a big issue for her. Marcy enjoys life

> that needed to be brought into her backstory to enrich it
Didn't enrich it, it gave a boring answer to an interesting question. There was actually no real point to expanding on her backstory, the mystery was more interesting than the story we got, and a vampire in this world wasn't so out of place that it required a real explanation.

>the only real character arc she's had in the series
She really didn't need one. The show never put enough focus on her before for her to have any detrimental flaws, she was just Marceline, the most problem she had was with her dad, and that was mostly sorted. In fact, the writers had to asspull angst just to make the miniseries work. She never showed any turmoil about being immortal or being a vampire before the special, it was never even suggested.

>The show needed to justify why the 1000 year old demon spawn, in a world full of magic, who hangs out with magical beings had a range of magic powers? Really? At that point you may as well start justifying her choice in shoes
Why not? With that logic, you can also say capes shouldn't actually come up with how characters get superpowers. Maybe this is not always 100% obligatory, but not excessive either.
>Her first few appearances has way more as we see her mellow out and not be as bad.
This is not really an arc that has to do with inner conflicts, that's just her becoming friends with Finn.
>So now you change it, her living forever was never a big issue for her. Marcy enjoys life
Every single song she wrote was about misery, Finn himself has seen the music being an outlet for her sadness in Astral Plane

>Didn't enrich it, it gave a boring answer to an interesting question. There was actually no real point to expanding on her backstory, the mystery was more interesting than the story we got, and a vampire in this world wasn't so out of place that it required a real explanation.
The mystery is always more interesting than anything you can possibly get because it kills off countless possibilities and limits you to one option. That's not the reason to never give any answers though.
>She never showed any turmoil about being immortal or being a vampire before the special, it was never even suggested.
See

>you can also say capes shouldn't actually come up with how characters get superpowers
Well if we have demon man who is centuries old and we know has a demon dad then no, it is pretty self evident. Plus capes do waste too much time on origins.

Finding out that she punches some bad guys to get more power added nothing to her as a character.

>not really an arc that has to do with inner conflicts
And an arc doesn't have to

>Every single song she wrote was about misery
And now we flip back from angst about being a vampire and living for ages to just plain angst. Which she still has, but not about living forever. You just fucked up your entire argument.

>capes shouldn't actually come up with how characters get superpowers
False equivalency. Superheroes are almost always special in some way within their own canon, the reason they're different from everyone else requires explanation for their setting to be coherent.
Marcelline wasn't in anyway special when compared to the rest of the cast, from the people made of gum and fire, to the Martian Abraham Lincoln. Marcelline only stood out due to her interesting personality, which this special turned down from a 10 to a 2.
>This is not really an arc that has to do with inner conflicts
We saw her sort out conflicts with her dad (which were external conflicts), as far as internal conflicts, from her very appearance and subsequent appearances until "remember me (which is heavily overrated and have a lot of similar flaws)" she was never shown to be hung up on anything, especially not related to being a vampire or immortal. So, of course, we never saw an internal conflict until the writers pulled a really boring one out of their ass.

>The mystery is always more interesting
There are times when answering a question is more prudent to tell a story than to leave things open. In this case, it was not in the slightest of importance to AT or Marcelline's character.

>The mystery is always more interesting
no, we call it good writing
>That's not the reason to never give any answers though
yes it is, the question didn't need answering and wasn't even really a question

It's pretty good, I gotta admit that I'm not only nostalgia-bias but also I'm a sucker for shows that change with the times, it's had it's lows and downs but even then I still love 80% of it. Lately it's gotten better, I'd argue the best it's ever been, although the hiatuses are pretty annoying.

Finncelinefags forever BTFO, by the way.

I don't know, Ice known adventure time is basically Tabletop rpg the cartoon for a while now, it was pretty fun watching a miniseries with a lot of tarot imagery and theme of a dungeon

>implying season 5 is a masterpiece
7 and 8 are both way better than 5 and 6, the show had a strong upturn in the last two or so years, makes me happy. now they just have to nail the ending.

Finn and Marceline are great but they haven't done anything in years so who gives a shit.

I keep up with the new episodes whenever they're out, as usual. I think discussion on Sup Forums is kind of stale...

Last season hype, though. probably.

Honestly SOME of S1-3 has not aged amazingly, I feel like AT help create the lolsorandom humor and, specially in cartoons and now it's been done to death so much watching some of the first episodes makes it feel a little dated. Only some of it though.

we fell out

season ranks:

3>2=8>1>4=7>5.1>5.2>6

based on that I think they've done a good job keeping things from getting stale, and even in the seasons that I think are the worst there were dozens of episodes I liked.

Sup Forums discussion is lame as fuck cause it's all shipping this and wah Bubbline sucks that. It was fun talking about the stuff that happened this year like Islands and Elements but if there aren't new episodes out to discuss then just ignore the threads.
It might just be that we've run out of things to talk about, it has been over 7 years now.

I only think some select parts of season 1 are lolrandom, even at the earliest point most of the stuff made sense with the setting and characters so unless there was something really fucking wacky or a thing the rest of the show ignored I don't think there was much randomness.
I think AT's artstyle did worse since so many cartoons look pretty similar to it.

>Finding out that she punches some bad guys to get more power added nothing to her as a character.
>Marcelline wasn't in anyway special when compared to the rest of the cast, from the people made of gum and fire, to the Martian Abraham Lincoln.
>In this case, it was not in the slightest of importance to AT or Marcelline's character.
It let us know that she did struggle to be a better person once and was brought down by reality later on instead of always being a bitch, which gives her more sympathetic traits. She did have those before, but she still would be willing to fuck a person up for virtually nothing (Princess Day). It helped suggest where things like this would come from.
>And an arc doesn't have to
It's not really a character arc if it doesn't showcase inner conflicts.
>And now we flip back from angst about being a vampire and living for ages to just plain angst. Which she still has, but not about living forever. You just fucked up your entire argument.
I didn't because placing a character in new conflicting situations is normal. An arc can affect some side of a character, but it doesn't mean a character shouldn't have any other conflicts afterwards.
>which this special turned down from a 10 to a 2.
>So, of course, we never saw an internal conflict until the writers pulled a really boring one out of their ass.
I know Sup Forums generally prefers plain personality over inner character but that's still too subjective to really polemize about.
>she was never shown to be hung up on anything, especially not related to being a vampire or immortal.
This is like saying we never got anything sympathetic with Simon until the Christmas episode. She did have occasional bits of angst (as I mentioned, letting sadness out through songs + her seeing Simon degrade has to do with her living long enough for it, if she never became a vampire she would die before meeting him again), it's just that they were never the focus before.

Season 7 and 8 are absolute trash. There's been maybe 1 or 2 good episodes, the rest is just worthless miniseries that don't even feel like AT.

5 at least had more good episodes than bad. It wasn't as good of a season as the ones prior but it's good overall.

>lolsorandom
I really don't think you or most people who use this know what this means. Because it fits so few current cartoons, and definitely not AT, even at it's lowest points.

I remembered there was a bubbline graphic novel and the artist decided to shittily choose to make the characters have anime expressions all the time. I can taste the vomit in my mouth.

>Season 7 and 8 are absolute trash. There's been maybe 1 or 2 good episodes, the rest is just worthless miniseries that don't even feel like AT.
What a stupid opinion
Plus the miniseries fit in with what the show has been doing since season 5 with getting more interconnected and serialized, it was just finally in the form that the show should have been in all along. Instead of having a plot line that they come back to a couple of times each season they could get them all out in one go. Saying that doesn't fit is retarded.

Didn't this show die like three years ago

>Season 7 and 8 are absolute trash
Opinion discarded

>she did struggle to be a better person once
no it didn't, she was the same as she usually is
>instead of always being a bitch,
Again not a thing, even the first episode showed she just liked messing with people but is generally an okay person

You keep inventing shit to try and make Stakes good and it won't fly

>It's not really a character arc if it doesn't showcase inner conflicts.
yes it can be, arc just requires a change they don't have to be fighting with ideas within themselves

> in new conflicting situations
So you admit it was something pulled out their ass for stakes. We are done

>she did struggle to be a better person once and was brought down by reality later on instead of always being a bitch
Marcelline was never a bitch until later in the show (season 6 onward) where the writers were on a mission to make everyone as unlikable as possible, so this point is moot.

>character arc if it doesn't showcase inner conflicts
Character arcs can be internal or external. People have problems with other people that affect them emotionally, that's what we saw solved in the episodes with her dad.

>conflicting situations is normal
You have to actually let this conflict develop. They never took the time to do that with Marcelline. She was fine with it for 7 seasons, then a 30-second clip happens and she's not. It felt (and was) a completely out of nowhere reaction to an almost trivial problem.
>I know Sup Forums generally prefers plain personality over inner character
>"Sup Forums is a hivemind"
>Attacking a strawman
Stop being disingenuous. No one ever said that.
>we never got anything sympathetic with Simon until the Christmas episode
We didn't actually, and this was the first time they suggested Simon wasn't just a crazy old wizard, and it was completely unnecessary overall, but it was kind of interesting they told a few good stories with it. This did not happen with Stakes or the conflict within it.
>letting sadness out through songs
About different things
>her seeing Simon degrade has to do with her living long enough for it, if she never became a vampire she would die before meeting him again
She never said or suggested anything like this, during the Simon stories nor Stakes. Please keep your headcanons out of this.

I'm an irl Finn and wish i could find my Marcy yo

you gotta stop being a beta dawg

This is not a dating website though, maybe take this somewhere else.

A lesbian friend?

>no it didn't, she was the same as she usually is
She was actively trying to do something she believed was right and helping other people, contrast that with S1-6 Marcy having little principles, being secluded and acting nice to a small circle of friends around her
>Again not a thing, even the first episode showed she just liked messing with people but is generally an okay person
- kicked Finn and Jake out of the house and wouldn't really care about them if they never met again by accident and Finn never earned her respect
- kept a personal servant against his will for years
- was friends with a bunch of asshole ghosts, granted, being less of an asshole then them, but there was still something to even bring them together at one point
- harrassed a person for kicks in Princess Day
Marceline has always been a morally grey character.
>yes it can be, arc just requires a change they don't have to be fighting with ideas within themselves
Yes, it can be an arc, but it's not a character arc unless the change actually has something to do with chasracter's inner motifs being the focus.
>So you admit it was something pulled out their ass for stakes. We are done
No, I'm saying it's common practice to give more than one conflict to a character. The focus of the Stakes was her being a vampire, not her relationship with Bonnie.

Different guy but what the hell is wrong with you people saying that the vampires in Stakes sucked? They were all incredibly fun to watch and entertaining, aside from the Fool who was just a chump and seemed to exist to fill out the numbers more than anything else.

I didn't like Stakes but you got shit taste if you didn't like the vampires who were all great.

>What are your honest and humble thoughts on Adventute Time Sup Forums?
Absolutely amazing show even if the writers can't make any more convincing story arcs out of the one-offs from the first two seasons.

>Season 7 and 8 are absolute trash

Stopped reading there.

It started out decent enough, got better and better, then took a flying leap in mediocrity and then managed to pull itself back up to decent again. It suffered a lot from big set ups with disappointing payoffs. Hoping it has a satisfying ending.

>she believed was right
Yes, that is not in conflict with modern Marcy.

>Marceline has always been a morally grey character.
Well done, you fucked up again by admitting she is morally grey so does good shit as well. It isn't like her past self in stakes was some paragon and it changed.

Why you base your arguments on nothing and bullshit around you are gonna fuck up like this

>it can be an arc, but it's not a character arc
That isn't a real distinction

> chasracter's inner motifs being the focus.
motif being the focus does not equal inner conflict with them. A character does not have to be in turmoil over some part of them to experience a character arc. It can even be a concept becoming part of them which is not in conflict with old ones.

>give more than one conflict
You mean pull one out of no where. We are still done on this one you brought nothing new here

Fyi, that first post is someone else.

But none of them were even mildly interesting, and they all took like 2 minutes to defeat(all in the most boring ways imaginable) with the exception of the King, who just spewed cliche dialogue then killed himself.

>Marcelline was never a bitch until later in the show (season 6 onward) where the writers were on a mission to make everyone as unlikable as possible, so this point is moot.
>Character arcs can be internal or external. People have problems with other people that affect them emotionally, that's what we saw solved in the episodes with her dad.
See >You have to actually let this conflict develop. They never took the time to do that with Marcelline. She was fine with it for 7 seasons, then a 30-second clip happens and she's not. It felt (and was) a completely out of nowhere reaction to an almost trivial problem.
>About different things
Including themes of loneliess and depression caused by long life that got detailed in Stakes.
adventuretime.wikia.com/wiki/Journal_Song
adventuretime.wikia.com/wiki/Yeah,_Girl,_It_Stinks
Just like with a ton of other things in AT, this was something that existed but didn't became important until a certain point in the series.
>We didn't actually
Neptr? Hitman? What Have You Done?
>She never said or suggested anything like this, during the Simon stories nor Stakes. Please keep your headcanons out of this.
>her first friend becomes an old mentally challenged mess
>she's reminiscing about seeing her friends fade away
really makes you think
she might've also meant somebody else, but if they wanted to emphasize on that, they would've brought somebody else in

>Heirophant being an old fashioned vamp with shapeshifting powers isn't cool
>nor Moon who's weird as fuck and the most demonic and evil one of the bunch
>Empress is a hoity-toity sophisticated snob who fucked around with Ice King
All neat stuff there, not the most interesting or nuanced but since they all had about one episode in the spotlight they worked just fine.
Plus Heirophant had a wonderful death.

And how was the King cliche, he was made out to be the big bad but only wanted to escape the cycle he was stuck in and wasn't even a bad guy, and he had a peaceful resolution where the good guys didn't even have to defeat him. Just because he had some grand speeches and fancy words that's cliche?

>She was actively trying to do something she believed was right and helping other people
Marcelline performs at children's birthday parties, fights evil monsters, does favors for old people, and protects Finn from her more callous monster buddies, does a few ultimately harmless pranks in between but she was never a bad person, at least not as far as the standards set by the show.

>kicked Finn and Jake out of the house and wouldn't really care about them if they never met again by accident and Finn never earned her respect
She went to the cave because they were there, she was fucking with them, it wasn't an accident.
>kept a personal servant against his will for years
t. Someone who didn't watch the whole episode
>was friends with a bunch of asshole ghosts
Oh man, her friends were assholes, and she stopped them from taking a joke to far on her non-asshole(most of the time) friend? She must be a terrible person.
>harrassed a person for kicks in Princess Day
>Season 6
Also, was again, ultimately harmless, just because you're a prude doesn't mean everyone else has to be.

>but it's not a character arc unless the change actually has something to do with chasracter's inner motifs being the focus
Wrong

>I'm saying it's common practice to give more than one conflict to a character.
But it's not common practice to make one up with absolutely no build up that doesn't make sense in regards the character before that point.

I love it and hate it. I wish they cut out Finn's lovelife, especially the weird shit from Breezy (I'm a prude and don't want to watch Finn playing womaniser and then have regrettable ??? with LSP). Also, the one-off episodes kind of get weaker and weaker and the "plot episodes" get better and better. The one offs are still fun, they just have a weird melancholic tone. It kind of feels like two shows. I still love it though.

Also does anyone here have a special watchlist of the plotty episodes to "marathon" before the show end?

>Well done, you fucked up again by admitting she is morally grey so does good shit as well. It isn't like her past self in stakes was some paragon and it changed.
She did mostly good shit in her past. As the time passed, she started doing both good and bad shit, simple as that.
>You mean pull one out of no where. We are still done on this one you brought nothing new here
Whether you're willing to make headcanons about Bubbline or want to consider them friends, her relationship with Bonnie was a thing of its own for a long time. Stakes never focused on that though, so another episode bringing the relationship up doesn't contradict the miniseries. Just because Marcy is more okay with being a vampire now doesn't change much in her dinamic with PB. As I said, different conflicts.
>motif being the focus does not equal inner conflict with them. A character does not have to be in turmoil over some part of them to experience a character arc. It can even be a concept becoming part of them which is not in conflict with old ones.
A character has to have an inner conflict of some sort to change. Like, a realisation that goes against some of their former principles. Whether or not it is focused on defines whether it's a character arc or a different type of story.

See >Referring to a post that doesn't prove your point

>adventuretime.wikia.com/wiki/Journal_Song
>adventuretime.wikia.com/wiki/Yeah,_Girl,_It_Stinks
The problem is neither of these relates to a concept expanded on in Stakes. Neither of them even hint at anything to do with having a long life, stop with your headcanons
Stakes doesn't touch on her loneliness much, and only tangentially on her being depressed(which is portrayed as more upset than depressed, and more her being upset at being a vampire/immortal than being upset with her life overall)

>Neptr? Hitman? What Have You Done?
Are you implying he was sympathetic in those episodes?
>Neptr
He tries to make Finn's robot join him in attacking innocent princesses.
>Hitman
Tries to have a guy attack, Finn, and Jake, just because the guy was going to do worse than what he wanted doesn't mean it's acceptable to just have someone randomly go hitting people who've done nothing wrong. If that guy wasn't an assassin he would have just let him punch Finn and Jake.
>What have you done
His own irresponsibility almost killed people.

>really makes you think
>she might've also meant somebody else, but if they wanted to emphasize on that, they would've brought somebody else in
What is the point you're trying to make here?

>Marcelline performs at children's birthday parties, fights evil monsters, does favors for old people, and protects Finn from her more callous monster buddies, does a few ultimately harmless pranks in between but she was never a bad person, at least not as far as the standards set by the show.
I didn't say she was a bad person, I said she was morally ambiguous.
>She went to the cave because they were there, she was fucking with them, it wasn't an accident.
We don't know that for sure. The accident option is still possible considering early seasons storytelling with a lot of deus ex machinas like this happening. She states that she doesn't really care about them in the song if you're willing to count that.
>t. Someone who didn't watch the whole episode
Okay, I looked up the transcript, you're right here.
>Oh man, her friends were assholes, and she stopped them from taking a joke to far on her non-asshole(most of the time) friend? She must be a terrible person.
She stopped them from hurting Finn because Finn was her friend. I don't think she'd do that for someone she didn't respect, which is confirmed by her attitude to BP (a person she didn't respect) in Princess Day.
>But it's not common practice to make one up with absolutely no build up that doesn't make sense in regards the character before that point.
See my previous replies.

>All these autistic walls of text

This is why we don't have AT generals

>Heirophant being an old fashioned vamp with shapeshifting powers isn't cool
It isnt. A vampire... doing vampire things. THAT'S COOL AS HELL. WE'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THIS BEFORE, IT'S NOT LIKE THEY MADE THE SAME JOKE 5 TIMES WITH IT, AND IT ULTIMATELY LED TO HIS BORING DEMISE. AHAHA XD
>>Moon who's weird as fuck and the most demonic and evil one of the bunch
Is this even an argument?
>>Empress is a hoity-toity sophisticated snob who fucked around with Ice King
But it wasn't funny at all, nor was it unique or interesting.
>Heirophant had a wonderful death
>Walks in jake and dies
Amazing
>he was made out to be the big bad but only wanted to escape the cycle he was stuck in and wasn't even a bad guy
>Forces someone else to stay stuck in it instead
>Not a bad guy
>Just because he had some grand speeches and fancy words that's cliche
No, because his speeches and overall characterization felt like something we've seen 20 times before in other shows.
>I didn't say she was a bad person, I said she was morally ambiguous
She isn't. She's just good.
>We don't know that for sure
She literally says in when she came in
>She states that she doesn't really care about them in the song if you're willing to count that.
Marcelline? Pretending to be cool and not care about stuff? Unbelievable.
>BP (a person she didn't respect) in Princess Day.
No one was going to kill BP
>"Okay, I looked up the transcript, you're right here"
>Reading the transcript instead of rewatching the best episode of AT
Plebian.

I'm not a beta but it's hard to find girls that like adventuring, causing trouble and playing bass.

But.. discussing a cartoon is what a general is for.
Do you WANT waifufagging and shipping?

because I can do that

list 20 shows that had a character like vampire king faggot

Pretentious monologuing villains?
Am I supposed to remember any of these cookie cutter boring characters?

>Neither of them even hint at anything to do with having a long life, stop with your headcanons
I suggest you check their lyrics again, the theme of long life is pretty clear in there.
>Stakes doesn't touch on her loneliness much, and only tangentially on her being depressed(which is portrayed as more upset than depressed, and more her being upset at being a vampire/immortal than being upset with her life overall)
Her being upset at being a vampire/immortal is what I'm talking about, a single conflict. + Flashbacks in Stakes with Simon leaving her and then herself leaving a group of people she befriended contributed to her becoming a loner. Everything Stays is a song she remembered to get over loneliness (you may say it's not but the lyrics really are so vague they're open to different interpretations).

>He tries to make Finn's robot join him in attacking innocent princesses.
The ending sequence shows that at heart, he just wanted to chill with Neptr.
>Tries to have a guy attack, Finn, and Jake, just because the guy was going to do worse than what he wanted doesn't mean it's acceptable to just have someone randomly go hitting people who've done nothing wrong. If that guy wasn't an assassin he would have just let him punch Finn and Jake.
Hiring a guy specifically to punch somebody is ridiculous, petty and largely harmless. He was trying to save their lives when he realised what he'd done.
>His own irresponsibility almost killed people.
It was one of the first episodes suggesting his intents are not always bad.
Either way, we weren't talking about that.
>What is the point you're trying to make here?
She mentions having to endure her friends disappearing because of long life. The original Simon is her only friend to whom it was shown to happen.

did you even pay attention to him if you think his entire character was just pretentiously monologuing?
I thought you would at least have a few characters who had similar sticks like he did with being part of a cycle and getting fed up with it and trying to do anything to escape fates's chains and shit.

Only thing I'm not fond of its flipflopping between episodic or story driven. I understand shows will blur the line between the two, but AT seems to have done it almost schizophrenically.

>She isn't. She's just good.
She started out as an antagonist that got sympathetic traits shown later on. She's lawful neutral.
>No one was going to kill BP
Yes, but I'm talking about the general attitude.
>She literally says in when she came in
I looked up the transcript and this time there's nothing. She doesn't say she was following them.
>Marcelline? Pretending to be cool and not care about stuff? Unbelievable.
I doubt that was the intent back then. That would be weird in hindsight, considering how Marcy bit Jake without knowing he would transform and survive.

Lawful neutral? She's somewhere between chaotic good and chaotic neutral.

Lived since day one and still love it.

Definitely not chaotic good because those are active and aggressive in their pursue of a goal they deem as righteous. Marcy doesn't have such a goal. Maybe chaotic neutral but she does have some principles and her behavior doesn't get out of hand too often so it's hard to say for sure. Another example showing how limited and primitive the 3x3 system is.

She likes breaking rules and causing trouble that isn't significantly harmful to others. Sounds chaotic good/ neutral to me

>She started out as an antagonist
No, she didn't.
>lawful neutral
>Marcelline
>Lawful anything
Gtfo

>looked up the transcript and this time there's nothing
Her first line when she comes into the cave dancing. She says she came to show them that the cave was hers. Why do you like being wrong?

Marceline: Wow, pretty awesome party ya got here.
Finn: What do you want, Marceline?!
Marceline: Oh, I just wanna show you somethin'. This cave belongs to me!

>Marcy bit Jake without knowing he would transform and survive
We don't even know if drinking the red from his blood would kill him by the show's physics, nor if she would have actually done enough to kill him if she wanted to.

I ended up dropping it way back because I felt like it started focusing way too much on shipping bait and relationship drama in general.

Is it true that they tone it down in later seasons?

Definitely, after Finn breaks up with Flame Princess there's around two more episodes of it in season 6 and since then there's been nothing.
There was another episode in season 7 where Finn hung out with a wizard girl and they were kind of into each other but that was during an adventure so I'd hardly count it as a romance/shipping episode.

I think you're good if that's what scared you off.

They are still doing with Bubbline so if you are one of those people that sperg about lesbians even if it's just a background moment for a second they are kinda still doing it.
They really just have been focusing on lore lately, it's pretty good.

>No, she didn't.
Antagonist doesn't mean evil, it's a story role, and it's a fact that she was an antagonist for her first couple of episodes.
>We don't even know if drinking the red from his blood would kill him by the show's physics, nor if she would have actually done enough to kill him if she wanted to.
>Marceline: Wow, pretty awesome party ya got here.
>Finn: What do you want, Marceline?!
>Marceline: Oh, I just wanna show you somethin'. This cave belongs to me!
That doesn't outright say she followed them and we don't know for sure of her intentions regarding Jake, so my interpretation is still possible.
That's why I'm not leaving out the possibility of her being chaotic neutral.

But she has no evil and is shown to be good on multiple occasions, thus why i said between good and neutral. Not full good, but not full neutral. In other words, you just admitted you're fucking wrong
>lawful anything
Btfo nerd

Feel free to stroke your ego over not being proven wrong in an internet discussion

>it's a fact
Declaring things as fact doesn't make it true, and it's a really stupid thing to do on a point that is already being contested
>she was an antagonist for her first couple of episodes.
The literal point of henchmen was Finn learning she wasn't an antagonist
>That doesn't outright say she followed them
He declared purpose for being there "what she wanted" was to show them that mark on the wall. Stop being retarded.
>we don't know for sure of her intentions regarding Jake, so my interpretation is still possible
We know Jake is alive, and that Marcelline pretends to be evil when she's not. Stop being retarded.

7>2>8>3>6>5.1>5.2>1>4

This still feels wrong though. I like all of them for different reasons.

I will thanks

4 the lowest? Can I ask why?

There aren't many really bad episodes, but there aren't many great ones either. It's the most 'mediocre' to me.

Huh, I can respect that. Season 4 is usually held up in pretty high regard by the general fanbase I think, but that might just be because of a select few episodes like I Remember You and The Lich and stuff.

>Declaring things as fact doesn't make it true, and it's a really stupid thing to do on a point that is already being contested
She's the direct intentional source of conflict in both her initial appearances.
>The literal point of henchmen was Finn learning she wasn't an antagonist
You're confusing antagonist with evil again. The point of Henchman was showing her not being evil.
>He declared purpose for being there "what she wanted" was to show them that mark on the wall. Stop being retarded.
>We know Jake is alive, and that Marcelline pretends to be evil when she's not. Stop being retarded.
We don't know about the initial writers' intention. Her being in the cave and undoing the seeming solution might've just been added for comedy. And her intention regsrding Jake is, once, agains, unknown as he survived due to his own action. Either way, you're willing to shape it for your narrative, and I'm willing to shape it for mine. ???

Fun show ruined by people pushing in shipping, "deep" themes and bullsit philsophical drivel.

Why can't shows just be fun anymore? Why does there always have to be a philosophical theme, or try to promote diversity, or try to promote feminist themes, or try to be deep?

I just want a fun show about a kids weird adventures with his dog. Why is everyone depressed now?

>his dog
Jake isn't Finn's dog. They're brothers.

His dawg, maybe.

his nigga

>it's a "bmo acting retarded" episode
they're pretty good, but jesus christ there's more of them than i remembered

Antagonist means being in opposition to the protagonist, which, besides evicted, she never was. In Henchman the entire point of the episode was that she and Finn were on the same side and never had any conflict to begin with.

You're just being retarded and talking in circles.

people with a torture fetish should never be allowed to write anything. They go out of their way to put fun and happy characters through trauma because it gets them off.

Can't remember every specific instance, but Finn has called Jake both his dog and his brother in different circumstances(and so have a few of the staff). They aren't mutually exclusive.

i only remember finn calling jake his dog at the end of rainy day daydream, they seem to use bro or brother or best friend way more often than just dog

and wasn't there an episode where someone called jake finn's dog and finn got angry and said "HE'S NOT MY DOG HE'S MY FRIEND" or something like that? maybe i'm thinking of the pilot but im pretty sure this happened at some point

Honestly, these are some of the best episodes.

As much as I wish I remembered, I'll just concede on this one.

His dawg*, homie. Context man context

>watch this person's video
>the girl is trying her hardest to talk about this shit while the twp guys are sitting there doing jackshit and haven't even watched the show
why the fuck are those guys there when she could do this video all by herself and have it be way better

>Actually watching videos about cartoons instead of just watching the cartoons.
What is wrong with you?

I have time to waste and watched it at 2x speed anyway