When technically correct is not the best kind of correct

When technically correct is not the best kind of correct.

>It was not at all wished away.
>It was just all wiped away instead.
>
>Literally wiped away.
>But not WISHED away.
>It wasn't an alternate reality. It was just retconned.
>That's not the same.
>
>
>Listen, punk, there are big changes now.
>Secret Empire wasn't a waste of time.
>I mean, Black Widow is dead now!
>Forever!
>This is the first time in a comic book that we're permanently killing a character.
>Trust me.
>Also, Las Vegas is destroyed.
>
>That's a big deal.
>
>Trust me.

HACK

>he was. Kobik rewrote relity
>nothing got reversed

See, reverse would mean undo, this is just pasting on top.

fuck off spencer

Which is still reversing if the thing that got pasted is what was there before.

It's been fun seeing the new generation deal with the same shit that's been going on forever.

Hydra Cap stood up against thanos is this correct so blacktin America emulated a Nazi.

i've never seen a man so full of shit and spencer wonders why people laugh behind his back

>Behind

>kobi rewrote reality but didn't fix the damage costing the country millions of dollars on reparations and left everybody dead
>because she's an asshole
Hahaha fuck you Spencer

>on the other hand... jobs!

On the one hand, it's a little unfair for Spencer to be set up as the fall guy for the shitshow of Secret Empire, because turning it into a mega-event was clearly not his idea.

On the other hand, Spencer's a petty little shit. And he actually enjoyed voting for Hillary instead of voting for her as the lesser of two evils. So fuck him, he can twist in the wind.

And he's not even a liberal; he worships Rudy Giuliani like the shitty neo-con he is.

He just hates Trump bigtime.

I'm still surprise so many actually thought Hydra Cap or evil Cap was something new and bad. Fucking mind control or reality bending shit has been done with these characters all the damn time. Secret Empire is literally like that story where Tony becomes evil and they replace him with his younger self, except in this case, they just got the original Cap back instead of a younger Cap. What a fucking hack job.

I think most people are upset because Marvel/Alonso/Spencer insisted on things and then they would flipflop

That's the thing, everyone who reads comics knew what the fuck was coming a mile away. When the first outrage started when Cap said "Hail Hydra" I knew a ton of people who don't read comics getting upset about it and I was telling them it's just for shock value, Cap will be back or it'll be a clone or whatever.

The writers of the event then come out and say "NO FOR REALS THIS TIME, WE PROMISE." The people who still read comics knew it was bullshit, but now they're just directly lying to our faces. But wait, TECHNICALLY, they didn't like, they just told 97% of a lie and weaseled out of the clear intent behind their statements.

So the people who read comics are mad because they got directly lied to, sure hype up an event I get that but they full straight out lied saying it's totally real.

The people who don't read comics bought into the outrage shock headline from the very beginning and are upset about all that shit.

Yup, a lot of people in America like to call themselves or others Liberals when they aren't even close to being one.

If you believe in hate speech laws, you aren't a Liberal.
If you believe that Nazi's deserved to get punched, you aren't a Liberal.
If you believe in quotas, you aren't a Liberal.
If you believe people should be forced to call people by certain names, you aren't a Liberal.

People in America have forgotten what true Liberalism means.

I still can't believe that "the ingenious device" that Alonso talked about to trigger the Generations one-shots was literally just Kobik, a fucking cosmic cube.

They should have just said "We're enthusiastic about the response we've got -- some people got some really good theories -- as for the others, just keep reading and you'll find out!"

Instead, by going all "for realsies" they just pissed everyone off.

>"We're enthusiastic about the response we've got -- some people got some really good theories -- as for the others, just keep reading and you'll find out!"
See, this is what any properly managed company in any other industry would do. But not Marvel. Their employees have no reins.

What a piece of shit

What happened was defacto what he said wouldn't happen. His writing is loterally click bait at this point.

>Las Vegas shows up in America #7

expecting rivera to know continuity... she doesnt even know spanish.

It just occurred to me that tying in "Generations" to "Secret Empire" was wholly unnecessary. They could have run the one-shots as dream sequences or imaginary stories or whatever.

I'm sure they'll retcon it as saying that it happened before Secret Empire at some point

Also Ben Reilly Scarlet Spider has been taking place in Vegas this whole damn time.

He was a politician, what'd you expect

can someone sum up how the hydra cap story went? i stopped following marvel after the soft reset

Is black widow dead or will she show up in another book vecause no one at marvel reads each other's books.

I think a Cosmic Cube was utilized to trap Captain America inside of the Cosmic Cube and replace him with Hydra Cap from an alternate universe, who then usurped control of the world apparently (or at least America) for ten issues until they managed to pull Real Steve out of the cube.

Or something like that; I honestly don't know what happened exactly.

Red Skull or some other villain manipulated Kobik, a cosmic cube that grew a childlike sentience, into changing Steve Rogers' past. Steve became Hydra at a young age and had been a sleeper agent for decades, through all past adventures we've read over the years. He was Hydra all along.

By plot convenience alone, Kobik kept a "memory" of the original, non-Hydra Steve alive within the cosmic cube. "Classic" aka Kobik's memory of Steve is essentially a photocopy of the real Steve (Hydra Steve). What we're dealing with here is a Clone Saga level of character assassination. Taking the original, replacing it with a non original, and pretending everything is back to normal.

She's dead but she'll be back just in time for the Infinity War movie. And she'll be a platinum blonde too just like muh MCU.

Was there any external/extant evidence that a memory of Steve existed within Kobik?

If so, that means that the climax of "Secret Empire" hinged almost entirely upon an assumption.

Will the 616 media forgive cap?

Same when they "killed" peter "permanently" for spock

No.

>Was there any external/extant evidence that a memory of Steve existed within Kobik?
There were sporadic transitions between what was currently going on in the event (HydraSteve's takeover of the US government) and dream-like sequences involving a bearded Steve Rogers in some mysterious wilderness. Beard Steve turned out to be the "real" Steve in the final issue. He isn't though. Not if you accept what Spencer plainly showed to be true within the story (Real Steve was Hydra all along).

so how did steve pick mjolnir then? and how come cap hydra also lift it?

Elisa used a cube fragment to allow him to lift it.

kek how thor reacted afther he destroy las vegas for steve cause of a gimmick

Because Spencer is a hack that's how. Picking up mjolnir is the easiest way to prove a character's righteousness, so by having HydraCap pick it up, Spencer created a shock-value cliffhanger without substance. He wanted to make us say "Wow. This really IS Steve" And stir up another shitstorm for further controversy points.

This is what happens when you hire magic 5th Dimensional Imps to write comics; suddenly all the shit is just whisked away with the snap of a finger.

Even though if he was Hydra all along, Hydra in that moment, etc, he would not be able to pick Mjolnir up.

Spencer is quantum levels of up his own ass, and retarded.

Psh
Haters gonna hate. Secret Empire is the best event in years.

So, is Hydra Steve still being the "original timeline" still canon?

>what happened was retroactive because we said it wouldn't be

lol i don't even know who this piece of shit is and i was to kick his knees with my steel toe work boots

I really don't understand why people read mainstream cape comics when there's no possibility for meaningful long term change or growth for the main characters.

Fuck off weeb, characters change and grow all the time in cape comics, it just takes longer.

That's not exactly saying much though, is it?
It was okay, with a few high points (Pymtron kidnaps the Avengers, Black Ant and Taskmaster being goofballs, Hydra Cap getting bodied by Real Cap) but some really low points (tons of padding, stale narrative, half-assed cliffhangers).
I feel bad for Spencer to a degree, as he was quite clearly pressured by the editorial into turning what could've been a fun little storyline into a full-on event with tie-ins up the ying yang.

I don't read Superman for long term change or growth. I read Superman to see him kick some ass and inspire people.

Sure, Superman is a dad now. I'm under no assumption that it will last forever, either. It's an interesting experience right now. That's what matters.

Superdad probably will last forever, it's just that Jon Kent won't get any older for 5-10 years at least.

Unless he dies, but I doubt that'll happen unless Manhattan does it

This story had no business being in 616 continuity.
No matter what, the payoff will forever scar the character a la Hank Pym slap, if not worse.
While just making a non "problematic" Captain America out of Kobik fairy dusty is a weak writing device that is not satisfying for anyone ON TOP of dealing with the radioactive mess of a continuity Spencer gifted cap.

I think this could have actually made for a great story, they just needed to change it up a bit. First of all, it should have been a long arc, not a giant event. Then 'stopping' Steve shouldn't have been the conflict, that should have been undoing the change to reality. For that, they should have used somebody like Sharon Carter, like make it so she or Falcon or Bucky knows about Kobik making Steve a nazi, and then they have to change it while Hydra-Cap keeps doing Nazi things, even working against them. It should have under no circumstances been a way to permanently taint Steve's legacy and replace him with Sam Wilson, though, That's retarded.

You also don't read comics from the look of things, or at least you're very new. I can tell because you said "the writers of the event". It's newfag/poseur terminology, just like:

>in the comic books
>Marvel Comics
>DC Comics
>comic issue
>spiderman
>"*character I just found out about* thread"
See also: Punisher 'fans'

Not to mention that's totally someone else's explanation that you're just rephrasing, everyone gave that exact description of the scenario with hydracap like two weeks after the issue dropped.

>I feel bad for Spencer to a degree
You shouldn't. Despite all the bashing and bad press Secret Empire has been getting, he still feels like his story was god's gift to literature.

He won't hesitate to belittle and insult you for disagreeing with him or proving him wrong. Pic somewhat related. Spencer is too busy bashing DC for a preconceived notion of lack of diversity. Another twitter user proves him wrong, citing several examples contradicting Spencer. Spencer then proceeds to say that user has no life.

>Guy in charge of canon tells you what's canon
>Get upset because it doesn't line up with your headcanon

Go away, Nick. Your event was worse than Civil War II.

>Guy in charge of canon
He's the writer, not the editor.

I think Spencer should stick to humor books

That's not a good excuse.

>Your event was worse than Civil War II.

No, I'd say it was better than Civil War II but still terrible for a lot of reasons.

Having to confirm or deny "canon" OUTSIDE of canon is a sign of terrible writing and even treating it as a fact flies in the face of Death of the Author.

>immediately call him a weeb
insecure much?

Remember when he was dancing for taking the #1 spot with Secret Empire #1? Even tho he only did it on a diamond list technicality? Since Batman and Flash had to be split in two due to different prices on regular cover and lenticular cover?

>Kobik rewrote reality
>but this isn't a different reality

True nuff.

>acting like this is a new thing
America has been using "liberal" in place of "socialist" for the last 60 years and continues to do so. Probably has something to do with those communist witch hunts they had.

In the rest of the world a liberal is a libertarian.

I'm sure we're all gasping in surprise.

Again, people that have been reading comics for a while are not upset because of the changes, we knew the status quo would be back. Even if it hadn't that was still ok.

People are upset because they were lied to.

They were insistent with their terminology; not sure why they're upset when their use of terminology turns out to be suspect or inconsistent and people call them out on it.

>Reader too stupid to understand plot

Ok copper, what words are we supposed to use to describe those things so we can be super legit Sup Forums members?

>Another twitter user proves him wrong, citing several examples contradicting Spencer. Spencer then proceeds to say that user has no life.

Got a cap of that?

How can I know if I'm both liberal and a scotsman?

No life part came later

"The cosmic cube didn't reverse ALL of it just SOME of it"

>Writer too incompetent to write a comprehensible plot

I'm still salty over the fact that countless Cap storylines fall apart if he was a hydra sleeper at any point. The top two off my head are the time(s) Red Skull took over America/Earth and when he had to lift mjolnir.

What a fucking bitch boy. Spencer should learn to keep his virtual mouth shut if he doesn't want anyone to call him out for spewing bullshit.

Well, we never really saw the post-defrost years of Hydra Cap, did we?

I just want this trash over and done with.

>"you're just gonna reverse it in the end"
>"heh, you only think so because your limited minds can't imagine another outcome"
>reverses it in the end
pottery

This could have been a good story line if it was handle with care and consideration. We hop from Captain America's machinations to seize power to suddenly in the space of one or two issues Hydra has complete control of the country with their own social economic policies for organisation already implemented and instituted! Fucking heroes super fucking politicians more like.

I mean, it's Black Widow, she's a spy, she can change her hair.

also yeah this fucking sucks. I thought this event'd just bore me but it managed to shit on a bunch of characters I like. Again.

what a dumb fuck, he was so unoriginal every comic reader with even half a brain predicted the outcome.

It can happen, but it makes people uncomfortable when the comic character is 15 years into a character arc and doesn't match up to their movie/cartoon versions.

See: Spidey

It turned out Eliza used the cube to rewrite the enchantment letting HydraCap pick it up

There was an interview of him saying cap lifting mjolnir was not a trick

Spencer's a rules lawyer he probably said something like "yes, he's really lifting the hammer."

I thought the enchantment can't be forced since it's sentient? I mean Odin who supposedly made the enchantment couldn't control the hammer anymore in Aaron's run.

I believe in all of these things except quotas. I'm not sure how you force someone to use a name, though. But I assume that's just you being assblasted because you smugly tried to call a trans person their previous name to be pedantic, and someone called you an asshole, or inaccurately called you a fascist for it, so you feel attacked.

As far as I know, there is no society on earth where trans people have personal bodyguards who shock your nads until you use their proper xim/xher/xhem pronouns.

>no true scotsman!

>As far as I know, there is no society on earth where trans people have personal bodyguards who shock your nads until you use their proper xim/xher/xhem pronouns.

Not personal bodyguards with tasers, but New York City and Canada both have laws set up to make sure people don't call others by pronouns they don't like.

Yeah, laws are stupid and forced judiciary rules are useless when compared to strong communal ones, but if you have them to protect some people, might as well protect everyone. You can't call a black guy a nigger or a trans dude a woman any more than you can call yourself president and assume office or call yourself Bill Gates and try to withdraw half a billion at the bank.

The thought that trans folks aren't what they say they are is a line of thought that leads to a lot of dead trans folks, so I can see why they'd want to mitigate that, and while I don't think it's exactly the right path to go on, my ideal system of government would take too much overhaul to be effective with any kind of soonishness.

So can someone quick explain SE for me?
From what I got
>Nazi Captain America
>That girl that had a slither of the Cosmic Cube did that
>The Cap that we knew was in his mind, fighting
>Shenanigans happened
>The Cap we knew came to reality and fought Nazi Cap
>The end

How wrong did I get it?

Nobody reads each other's runs at Marvel.

Yeah, go thought police I guess.

fucking quisling.

Well, I for one can't wait for the inevitable "I don't think you are real" plot

That's close enough, except Cap wasn't in Hydra Steve's mind, he was in Kobik's.

I'm wondering how the Scarlet Spider book is going to handle Vegas getting glass'd after the 1st arc.

Close. The original Cap wasn't in Hydra Cap's mind, but the cosmic cube girl's.