Why should we sympathize with planet destroying tyrants who enforce a caste system on their people?

Why should we sympathize with planet destroying tyrants who enforce a caste system on their people?

They're basically space Hitlers.

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Because they did nothing wrong.

They'll pull some sympathetic backstory or "they see the beauty of life now" bullshit and basically claim that makes up for millennia of genocide.

And here comes the Diamond Defense Force.

But they had feelings and they got hurt, user!

And they will be redeemed by a crybaby manchild who will teach them that love and acceptance solves all...

Despite the fact that gem society is made with gem biology in mind.

>manchild
How can an actual child be a manchild?

Pic very fucking related.

because he's like 15 or 16 at this point and willfully chooses to appear like a fucking 9 year old version of himself still.

How is it a bad system if it's been thriving for untold millennia? If anything, the individualistic environment of earth seems to cause more problems for gems than it solves. They're quite literally not made for it.

I mean, Ruby and Sapphire sure as fuck didn't have any complaints about their former lives before they became fusion addicts. Gems in Homeworld's caste system aren't mistreated. They're just kept ignorant of alternatives.

And now that I think about it, the Diamonds themselves are probably equally ignorant of said alternatives. They are as they have always been.

He barely turned 14.

>14 years old
>child
>not preteen

Compared to Morty Smith, Steven is still very naive about reality. But then again different upbringing.

Why is this made by hippies pushing a liberal agenda?

I hate the limp wristed writing on this show.
They should just make the Diamonds real villains and have the heroes kill them off.
That's catharsis.

>Heh. I'm willing to bet if a human acted the way the Diamonds did people here wouldn't be so "understanding". Imagine a man whoose brother was killed in a mugging at his local mall and he becomes so consumed with grief that he plants a bomb to level that entire section of the building so he never has to see it ever again.
Would people rush to his defense when he is called a maniac? Would there be an outcry about how unfair it is to scold him for endangering so many people? I mean dozens of people could have had their internal organs shredded by shrapnal or crushed by falling debris but he lost his brother so the suffering is about equal.
Even if the bomb was disarmed he'd still rightly end up imprisoned for wantonly imperialing so many. In murder as in gift giving it is the thought that counts and a failure to succeed offers no moral credit.
The sad thing is our hypothetical mall bomber is likely more moral than Yellow Diamond. His brother was killed in a random mugging rather than a justified rebellion against a caste of slave drivers. His brother may well have done nothing other than be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Making the unfairness of it much more palatable.
Not only that but the bomb itself is just a physical object. It may be one that does horrible thing but on its own it is entirely inert. The Cluster is fueled by the perpetual agony of millions.

wtf I love Reddit now.

Not far off considering how they handled the villains and their resolution. And yes, still mad at how sad Peridot has become.

Oh you know they can't have that.

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>And yes, still mad at how sad Peridot has become.
Perifags deserve to suffer.

Rick, pls.

>They should just make the Diamonds real villains
That would imply the writers could actually handle real conflict, which as this show has shown time and time again, they can't.

>Oh you know they can't have that.
Why not, besides it being a horrible writing choice.

How so?

do you mean to tell me since that season one episode showing steven's 14th birthday having occurred; that at least a year (if not more) couldn't have passed in the show's timeline? because that seems farfetched given that steven has apparently traveled the entire world, been invaded by multiple alien gems, and even gone to outer space himself since I've stopped watching this mediocre show.

How are the Diamonds not real villains?
In fact, how has the show not handled real conflict? Sure there was the Cluster, but even then, that's still being sat on.

>do you mean to tell me since that season one episode showing steven's 14th birthday having occurred
He didn't turn 14 until the third season.
Seems like you should have kept watching a little more?

>since I've stopped watching this mediocre show.
>is in a SU thread
?

Because basically every single time genuine conflict shows up it's thrown to the side as quickly as humanly possible so they can get back to SoL

And that is what's dragging the show down. The pace and the writing.

5 seasons and we barely have an idea how gem society works. We know how they reproduce, who governs them, reasons behind their invasions and how they deal with rule breakers.

Rick and Morty have 3 seasons and we know plenty of the Galactic Federation. How they rule their world, their military, law enforcement, medicine even their economy.

The writers of SU need to watch more sci-fi.

When was the last SoL episode?

>Rick and Morty
>a decent sci fi show

But user, don't you know that some girl stressing over her part time job is way more interesting than a unique, genocidal empire of non-organic beings?

This.

>Rick and Morty have 3 seasons and we know plenty of the Galactic Federation. How they rule their world, their military, law enforcement, medicine even their economy.
And it was swept away in a single episode to jerk off to how awesome Rick is.

>than a unique, genocidal empire of non-organic beings?
Say what you will about the SoL, but you could get that from watching an episode of Star Trek or Doctor Who.

>more interesting than a unique, genocidal empire of non-organic beings
>unique
Holy shit you have not been exposed to a lot of sci fi, have you?

Sad but true. Seems like the Citadel is taking that role now.

Unless the gromflomites managed to rebuild.

I'm pretty sure if the Diamonds were "real villains", people would just complain that they're one dimensional, cliché galactic overlords.

If all they do is point at something and have it blown up, then yes. Otherwise, just show them doing something else besides ordering death and/or crying.

>And they will be redeemed by a crybaby manchild who will teach them that love and acceptance solves all...

Black Diamond replacing Pink Diamond's slot fucking when

Black Diamond is the fusion of all four diamonds.

...

It's not entirely fair to call it a caste system when they are literally manufacturing people and each caste is near-identical copies of the same person, complete with the same knowledge and skills.

We shouldnt sympathize with them. But they arent complete monsters. Like wilson fisk in daredevil. He does a lot of awful shit,but hes not just a fat psycho. He has a girlfriend he loves very much and shows he has a sensitive side. The show still treats him like a villain, but not a monster.
And steven has shown no remorse or empathy for the diamonds. Greg did,but he didnt knew how awful they where. This meme of the diamonds being redeemed has no basis. Besides,PD death is clearly something steven will use to make the diamonds stop attacking earth.
Also,theres no proof there is alien life other than the gems. All the planets they destroy and harvest could be empty.

same reason we love shark week

humans can empathize with nearly anything, from inanimate objects, sharks, and yes even villains

we humans can find pity even in the devil, and we can shed tears for them, even if they can not

>hey everyone look at my show rick and memey. Its better than shitty SU
Fuck off. They arent the same show. Its like if i compared star vs to gravity falls.
Also,S3 of rick and morty sucks as much as S4 of SU

>planet destroying
They don't really destroy planets, just convert them to suit their needs. It's literally what humans do every day to our own world, just on a grander scale. And they do it with far less waste.

>tyrants/caste system
Isn't that like saying a queen ant is a tyrant? Gems are literally -LITERALLY- created to fill a specific role. To satisfy a need within the whole of gem society. The aberrations here are the rebels who, in trying to buck their intended purpose, actively weaken their own people. They are akin to cancerous cells, growing uncontrolled and slowly killing the body.

>Gems are literally -LITERALLY- created to fill a specific role
a heavy theme of the show is that we arent constrained by what we were built to do, and that we always have a choice, we may be built a certain way but what we do with that is still what we want

the crystal gem are portrayed as stronger and better for embracing this choice, rather than being constrained by what they were originally made to do

>a heavy theme of the show is that we arent constrained by what we were built to do

>kill off several intelligent species on a world so you can create philosophers and scientists
>scientists decide "fuck science" and that they want to be professional jugglers
>now a bunch of organics are dead, you have no science, and too many balls being tossed in the air

Nice plan, genius. What are you going to do when all the Quartzes decide they want to be house painters instead of guards?

>They don't really destroy planets, just convert them to suit their needs.
>It's literally what humans do every day to our own world, just on a grander scale. And they do it with far less waste.
Then you've just completely sabotaged your own point. The effectively strip mine planets of its precious minerals until it is incapable of supporting any of its original life, it isn't literal destruction, but for all intents and purposes, that planet is stone cold dead save for its hive of gems getting ready to go and do the same to other planets.

There may be no toxic waste involved with gem consumptionism, but there's no waste PERIOD, nothing is going back into that planets ecosystem. All you've done is confirmed that gems are worse than humans and if we're already a selfish fucking mess draining our planet dry and causing hundreds of deaths, what the fuck does that make a gem?

bismuth was built to build giant structures for other people, end of story
but she is also an excellent blacksmith, because whatever junk they put in her that made her good at construction made her good at forging weapons that served the rebel cause
pearl was just a servant, but the grace and perfect control she was given made her a potent fighter

even though we are built for a task, doesnt mean thats all we ever are going to do
even gems, built for a specific job, are still more than capable than a mere hammer
indeed, even hammers have a million uses beyond hitting nails, they can hit a variety of objects

if a quartz is going to be a guard, ti should have been their choice to make the best of their impressive toughness, not because they were put into a warrior caste

>nothing is going back into that planets ecosystem

So? If you want to build a parking garage, you don't stack a series of compost heaps on top of each other. They convert the planet to suit THEIR needs. GEM needs.

"waste" is a stupid shitty term for what we do. Its all self contained, we're not putting anything into the earth that isnt already there. Once the human race eventually dies the world will gradually revert to how it used to be. Land will be reclaimed by nature, trash will decompose back into the base elements they were built from, and the earth will continue on. What the gems to is strip away everything not needed. Humans create waste, sure, but to a gem everything that isnt needed is waste, and gets destroyed.

A parking garage can still be put back in the Earth or recycled into other building projects dumbass, see Cute argument but still says nothing about the part where THEY ARE PERMENANTLY DRAINING A PLANET DRY. How? What are gems made from? Minerals, what does most of a planet need to sustain life including basic amoebas? Minerals. What kills a gem? Another gem that's so fucking mad to want to poof them or a really unlucky strike.

>That's catharsis.
Oh please just because you strung out a literary term doesn't automatically make it a good idea.
If you want to use that jargon then how about "thematic coherence"? How about a bit of moral complexity?
You know your problem is that you're acting like "Fighting it out" and "Hearing the other side's emotions" are mutually exclusive when that's never been the case in the show at all.

I'm going to say that I don't expect Yellow to get a redemption.

Blue has the potential for it, since her villainy was in a flashback and she's a lot less murdercrazy now. Yellow's a cunt though. She needs the murdercock

Not only that but there doesnt seem to be a need for them to actually eat, or sleep, or require any sort of external energy consumption. They're literally just making more of themselves for the sake of it. They dont age. Theres literally no point to them other then to consume all in the universe in order to make more of themselves. They're like the swarm or the flood. Makes me think they must have been created by another alien race as a self replicating weapon that got out of control

Yellow's going to be redeemed through Blue. The telegraphing is pretty obvious.

No, what she needs to be ground down into a coarse sand and glued to some paper abrasion discs.

>They're basically space Hitlers

What's not to love?

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>gems were created by another race
I really hate this theory and I hate even more that everyone seems to think that's the case.

I think it's the other way around. Yellow might be redeemed but Blue is engulfed by grief and bitterness.

I thought it was implied that they were in some kind of major war, why else would they need a fucking planet-sized weapon and militarized society?

>Can live forever.
I find that very hard to believe, it's a direct violation of the laws of thermodynamics.

It was just Yellow's excuse to blow up the planet in a "useful" way, I assumed.

Blue will be redeemed when she learns of the truth of what happened to Pink. Yellow will follow because she cares about Blue.

I'm very sorry magic rock people with bodies made of hard light that have access to teleportation and ftl travel don't give a shit about the laws of thermodynamics.

it's a cartoon. At any rate, Pearl, a low grade slave has been around for more than a millennium

nigga they made of magic

when's the last time you've seen a rock die, my dude?

>It's a cartoon
Doesn't mean it doesn't have to make sense. They clearly take themselves seriously enough to have in universe explaination.

These guys know what's up

>Pearls
>Literally exist to look pretty and be your subservient demure waifu
>Royals have them and show them off to people for brownie points
>Low grade

Maybe our Pearl is, but that's because she's a slut

And when was that brought up in the show to explain something?

They use resources to make new gems. Duh.

>They're literally just making more of themselves for the sake of it.

The impetus of all living things is the desire to reproduce. Who the fuck are you to say they shouldn't make more of themselves?

Whats the image they're talking about?

people were able to sympathize with hitler after the movie downfall

even the worst of us are human, and hitler, as evil as he was, was slowly slipping out of reality losing touch with little he had left
it was so pitiful and pathetic depiction of hitler that people actually felt sorry for him, were reminded that even someone as twisted as he was once a normal guy, how even in deepest depths of humanity, can we still find sympathy for the devil

the diamonds may he horrible, but they still feel, we can still understand their motives, we understand they they must be stopped and they cant run from their crimes, but still they are human who feel and think, and were doing what they thought was right for their species, as twisted as that vision was

you don't need to be soft on them, but we can find ourselves in them, the desire to make things perfect, the belief that things are fine just the way are and those upstart are trying to ruin the status quo

My man!

Because, strangely enough, some people want to fuck them.
Dick is the sole reason female villains and, some actual women, are able to get away with the shit they get away with.

When it's a teenager who acts like an 8 year old

The instinct to reproduce is because we die, nimrod.
Gems can be killed, but the only reason they have been killed so far is in pursuit of this bullshit endgame where they have more of themselves.
For no reason.
They don't need to consume, so there should be no reason to, they don't need to seek out resources, so there should be no reason to.
But they war and die because reasons.

>because we die
Gems can die, ergo they would have that instinct. If they didn't they would go extinct via attrition.

>don't need to consume
Yeah, they do. They do all their consumption as they gestate. It's part of their reproductive process. Ergo, they'd need to deek out new worlds to consume.

>don't need to seek out resources
Clearly they do, otherwise there wouldn't be a resource crisis on Homeworld. They need resources to make Gems and pretty much everything else, so obviously they'd seek them out.

Hate to break it to you, but Gemkind holds no obligation to organic life. Their only responsibility is to their own survival.

Gems literally cannot die.
Even early on they established that gem shards still have some level of consciousness.
They don't die. period.

They are this.

youtu.be/Rpy9Qp7NAaw

If gems couldn't die, the whole Pink Diamond business wouldn't be happening as it does.

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They cease being who they are on a fundamental level, and exist as a primal consciousness that lashes out.

A snake can still bite after you chop its head off, but that doesn't mean it didn't die.

rewatch frybo, keeping it together, nightmare hospital

Which is to say; they don't die.
And they won't eventually die in this state. It'll go on forever.

So if you grind up every shard to a fine powder is is still alive?

No. The Gem that was did die. She's gone forever.

What remains is a ghost. A spectre of what was. A tortured, malignant presence that knows only pain and hunger. It isn't a Gem, and it isn't alive.

We saw in Together Breakfast that it is the case, in a way.

They're essentially zombies once they're shards. And zombies are pretty much dead.

zombies are "undead"
you guys and your word-thinking

Concrete looks like a literal mammy. Holy shit. Also she is missing is a apron and she'll be good.

And they're not fuckin' alive, are they? They aren't people any more, they're reanimated corpses.

It's a terribly apt description. The Gem is dead, but the essence of it keeps mindlessly shambling on.

It's how she's gonna crush White Diamond, as WD wanted to shatter Pink for having flaws, and thus being 'defective'.

It's why she had to bubble Pink and make sure no one would find out until WD was already dead.