In nowaday's cartoons boys get mostly to be submissive sidekicks of strong independant hero women...

In nowaday's cartoons boys get mostly to be submissive sidekicks of strong independant hero women. And they get indirectly or directly bullied for that a lot by them.

How do you think about that?

Picture related: perfect examples!

legitimately i only really take notice to this because the characters you're referring to are always hot as fuck twinks and i am a huge homosexual

even when they're the main hero, they're still the side kick

>tfw thats true even when the male character is the lead

They're both from magical girl shows, though.

Dammit 1 sec late

Yeah, but they end up being significantly better characters. Marco and Adrien have way more depth and charisma than a lot of the central male protagonists from shows past. I actually care about these two way more than I ever did about most male cartoon characters from my childhood.

For some reason, whenever a show decides to focus on a character, that character is usually bland. Star is an exception to this rule, but they had to deconstruct and cuck her to keep her interesting. Marinette/Ladybug is an almost text book example of a bland central character. She is by far the most boring character in her own show. By making Marco and Adrien into secondary protagonists, the shows became more comfortable with properly developing them. The question is: Why?

Star butterfly is a dumpster fire of troubles and nor is a badass, if he had the ability to nullified akuma's he would be fine.

FPBP

come on now, both ladybug and noir would be dead by now if they weren't a team. they save each other all the time.

Easy, MC syndrome. Main Characters are usually surrounded by a all-win lead aura, what makes them really boring and dificult to develop.

I think that it's the creators pushing for more futa on twink stuff and I'm perfectly fine with it.

>Walk into your room and see these two tied up on your bed (Adrien can be transformed as Chat Noir or in his civilian get up, whatever you prefer).
>There is a chest full of bondage gear and sex toys near the door
>A lot of bondage furniture now litters your room
>Your room is now ten times bigger than it normally is
>A whole barrel of lube sits near the bed
>What do?

Why are you watching cartoons for little girls, and then complain about how the boys aren't the main characters?

>nowadays

Um....OP

turn 360 degrees and walk away

cook some sketti

Free them obviously. What kind bro would leave some cool dudes in some unpleasant situation?

What the fuck do you think?

And once again, he was the best part of that show. Not to sound contrarian, but Kim Possible herself was somewhat boring. She could do everything because cheerleading. It was presented as a joke of sorts, and yet it was also the actual reason given for her superspy abilities. They tried to give her a weakness in the episode where it showed she had problems cooking for a home economics class. But that was the only episode where she seemed to have any conflict beyond "beat up the villain of the week." Ron actually had development and ended up being interesting.

These girl power shows seem to only succeed in making role models for boys.

>boys get mostly to be submissive sidekicks of strong independant hero women
But those are two examples of the boys being quite on the same level as the main girl. Marco especially, he's more often than not more right or has more sense than Star.

>ron
>role model
The kid was a walking, screeching punchline. You're really remembering him with rose tinted glasses

Dunno man, Marco took several levels in badass a couple of times, future Marco is a text book example of determinator and him earning his sensei respect was quite well done for a comedic subversion, finally punching the heart out of someone is no small feat, even if insane regeneration made it look weak you have to consider Marco pulled that off silently and went straight for it.

I kinda like Marco despite him being the butt of a lot of jokes.

Ron was a punchline, but he was also reliable, loyal, worked hard to keep up with how perfect Kim was just he could be useful, clever and was always true to himself. He had quirks and was always goofy, but he rarely tried to pretend to be someone he wasn't, and lots of times Ron got Kim out of a problem by just doing what he could do. Not to mention, the guy was a master martial artist, and had a number of cute girls wanting to get with him despite being a goofy, clumsy dum dum. How is he not a role model?

If only he kept some of adult Marco superskills like Ron kept the monkey kung fu shenanigans shit would be much cooler by now.

>The kid was a walking, screeching punchline
And yet, he was an honest, upstanding guy who was there for his friends and grew to kick ass by his own right as the show went on. I mean, it's not like Ron was a pariah, just weird. There's a reason a fair amount of girls fell for him at some point

Also despite being a screaming coward at times, he never stops going on missions or refuses to go (outside of those weird personalty changing episodes)

this.

And then propose the three of us gang-bang Marienette and Star for putting them in that situation.

the thing with Steven is that, in a way, Connie is being set up to be a bigger loser.

Conflicts in Steven Universe aren't ultimately meant to be resolved with violence, it's a universe where best conflict resolution is Steven mashing the Paragon dialogue options at every opportunity and winning the hearts and minds of his opponents.

Connie, Garnet, Pearl, Amethyst? They're basically stuck in medieval conflict resolution mentality and ultimately will only drag issues out.

In a way, you could ascribe Steven Universe as a parable about the shift of conflict resolution into the modern age. In olden times, it was all about beating the crap out of eachother, these days it's talks, diplomacy, and attempts to deescalate. (Except it works in a fictional world. Who knew?)

this, sadly. I even like Main characters normally, but show-runners gotta take a bit more chances with them.

And he still would have been ineffective against Toffee.

Marco is literally the best boy. When Star vs. started, everybody thought he would be this bitch boy at Star's beck and call. But he's like the best character on the show legitimately. That guy deserves his harem

(He's still at Star's beck and call though, just not for the reason people thought)

It is the nature of gender dynamics in action cartoons. Equally competent, the male would always overshadow the female.

He'd be cooler, that doesn't mean he'd suddenly be magic

Still, cooler marco is best marco.

>And they get indirectly or directly bullied for that a lot by them.

Can someone please show me at least 4 examples where this has happened?

>How do you think about that?

I think it's hot and I agree with this guy

Can you give us an example?

>There's a reason a fair amount of girls fell for him at some point
Because it was funny. The joke was that it's so unexpected that women would be attracted to such a ridiculous guy. I mean he became a master in a martial art called monkey-fu. Even his successes are jokes. His existence, every bit of development about him, was made into a joke. He was made to be endearing by being as wacky and non-threatening as possible.

Those two are girl power show user, of course the male sidekick will be submissive towards the female leader.
I like to think it's because the character can get a good character development, like Marco was the safe kid, yeah he still is but once Star got into his life, he couldn't live without a little danger in his life.

I think they initially meant Marco to be more of a silly character but realized it wouldn't work with Star also being a lunatic, so wrote him into more of a typical straight man role later. It's not so much development as it is a different character direction. Like the safe kid thing was dropped almost immediately.

I kind of agree with , but even he misses the point. Feminism back then isn't the same as feminism now, it actually provided some advantages for guys as well. One of which was that it was actually considered "cool" in some circles for girls to go after "quirky" guys. (Another major one was that girls sometimes actually had personalities!)

Nowadays just about every girl is basic as fuck, yeah, but you have to keep some perspective in terms of the time period the media you're watching was made in.

It makes me feel aroused.

Whats wrong with that?

>(Another major one was that girls sometimes actually had personalities!)
Kim was dull as dirt tho. Star's far more of a character than she was.

I heard that Marco was originally meant to be Star rival, even Proto-Marco looks like a rapist or Tom, maybe they asked to change Marco to be more of a loser, just like Marco friends exist because they wanted Marco to have male friends.

>Feminism [in 2007] isn't the same as feminism now, it actually provided some advantages for guys as well. One of which was that it was actually considered "cool" in some circles for girls to go after "quirky" guys.

I've been dating girls like that for years. Not every relationship has worked, but so what? I'm just saying this still holds true.

Sup Forums being Sup Forums, tends to think ALL feminists now are asshole man-haters, just because a loud minority are.
That's just like saying all of Sup Forums men are woman-haters. Just as unfair.

I think it's hot.

That was way early when marco was a crazed dbz fan named sol and star was just a delusional autist

I was talking about real-life girls you moron.

>Star's far more of a character than she was.

these threads boil down to faggots being butthurt that the male character isn't a proper mary sue self insert for you.

Well, to be fair I do live in Canada where every girl seems to be a walking SJW stereotype. (Unless you go to the boonies/Alberta, where every girl seems to expect a traditional relationship from the guy without any of the traditional responsibilities on her part instead - arguably even worse.)

Also I meant more when KP premiered in 2002 than 2007, which was quite late for that. (Which was actually one of the reasons season 4 went down in quality so much.)

FPBP

You can't honestly think kim possible wasn't the most boring character in her show

>in her show
user, I said nothing about her show.

I want to bully Star.

b8 threads since that's two examples out of a countless sea of way more non-examples I guess, or you wanted to see people dump Princess Marco and twink Adrien art?

Also Marco and Adrien are more equal partners than anything like everyone is saying. Fuck shows like Kim Possible and Sailor Moon and Dora the explorer from the past are better examples of what you're talking about.

Steven's growing into more of a leader lately, and learning to take on Rose's role, but not as corrupt. Is sort of the point of coming of age stories.