Kylo Ren

There's been a lot of Star Wars threads lately, but this is a notion that I don't see brought up often. The majority consensus seems to be that the best part of the Sequel Trilogy is Kylo Ren and Adam Driver's performance. While I'm in agreement that Kylo is cool, even down to his basic concept, I don't know if I like him that much.

The problem isn't him exactly, it's the amount of attention he demands from the camera. And the implication that he needs to be redeemed. Darth Vader's redemption in the Original Trilogy was kind of weird when you actually started to think about all the atrocious shit he'd done, but it worked out when you realize that there's precedent for Luke's feelings and that not everyone feels the same way about Vader as Luke does. It's actually very mature.

With Kylo, I just can't stop thinking about what Han expected to happen. Even if he'd brought Ben Solo back, what would that do? Ben killed that guy on Jakku, who seemed to be a friend of the family. He also killed some of Luke's students. For that matter, what does Rey think bringing Kylo back will do?

Beyond the ridiculous notion of redemption for this mass murdering psychopath, what about the Knights of Ren? I assume they're the students who turned with Ben, so why doesn't Luke care about them? Even if they're not the KoR, it just baffles me that all of Luke's on-screen guilt and sadness stems from Ben. I know that he's his nephew. I know that he instigated the destruction of the New Jedi Order, but what about the other students? Those were Luke's pupils too, but it just feels like they don't even matter and it's weird.

Does anyone feel the same way?

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No one fucking cares. Fuck off with this bullshit already.

The truth is you have though more about the characters motivation than the director

The director though
Darth Vader / Luke
Kylo/ Rey
like pottery

I care.

Driver's makeup job in The Last Jedi made it look like he'd just finished crying but it was hot. Wish I could pull off that look.

If the people that made these movies could even think in the levels of such massive and controversial moral implications we would've gotten a movie that humanizes stormtroopers once we get to see one break conditioning, and how he is torn now, having to fight his brothers. Instead the same character that was a child soldier conditioned through his entire fucking life is seen mowing down fellow stormtroopers with a tie fighter while screaming "WOOOO 'CHU SEE DAT? DIDCHU SEE DAT?" like a fucking moron.

But it doesn't seem very hard to have Luke express a modicum of concern for his other fallen pupils. He could have had a throw away line with the word "them" or something. But it's all about Ben and that just bugs me.

>I know that he instigated the destruction of the New Jedi Order, but what about the other students? Those were Luke's pupils too, but it just feels like they don't even matter and it's weird.

We still don't know exactly how that night went down. Maybe the other students attacked him after he brought the roof down on Luke's head. Ben didn't even finish Luke off, it seems like he just tried to get the fuck out of the situation. It would make sense if some of the other students wouldn't believe him and instead choose to side with Luke (a hero and legend). Maybe it was self defense along with the students who sided with him?

Okay, but I'm not trying to get into a discussion about where they stand morally, and I don't really care about what happened that night. I'm asking why Luke doesn't show the slightest bit of concern for the others who left with Ben.

It feels like everyone only cares about Ben, and it's weird.

>We still don't know exactly how that night went down.

Kylo destroyed Luke's Jedi Order.

You cannot refute this, we have been told that this is what happened twice now. It doesn't matter how the fight between the Jedi and the Knights of Ren started. The Knights of Ren won. Luke's school was destroyed. Kylo is responsible for this.

>Hurr durr, defending yourself is bad. Murder is wrong in self defense.

Quit being a faggot.

My gf only likes Kylo ironically as a joke. It's fucking hilarious that he's supposed to be the villain but is actually an edgelord from 2007.

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Except that I didn't say it was wrong, I just said that's what happened. Calm down 'tist, no one is attacking your husbando.

I guess because it's his nephew and everything hinged on a misunderstanding. I think he knows deep down that he might not have snapped if he didn't approach him in such a way so he blames the other students' death on himself as well.

Don't let the deranged shipper retards hear you talk like that. They can't handle truth and logic that unlike Vader, he is a irredeemably evil person because the love of his family drives him further away rather than back to the light with a reason to do the right thing. At every turn, he has actively made the wronh choice and a commitment to an evil path because he WANTS it, not because he is tortured or misunderstood. In the face of his father trying to reach, he killed him. In the face of killing Snoke and being offered the love of a woman and a chance to free the galaxy, he doubled down on "nah, I want the power". There is no coming back from that because he is unreachable and unwilling to change course.

Well, yeah. I feel that.

But I mean, not all of his students are dead. Some turned. Those are the ones I wish Luke would talk about. It feels like he cares ONLY about losing Ben (not mostly, exclusively).

Well.

To a certain extent, the movie can get away with that because you could argue that the fact that he's totally and irredeemably evil is the point. The point that other characters keep missing, either because of a skewed perspective of the story of Vader or their attachment to Ben. But I get what you're trying to say; the point is going over the viewer's head.

I don't like Rey and Kylo as a ship.

Anakin had the love of his pregnant wife and future children. He had Obi Wan's support, and by extension, if he wasn't so obsessed with his vision he had the Order as well. He fucked up. They both fucked up. That's why they're villains.

More importantly, did you notice that Kylo knew about the whole force hologram thing?
He even says it to Rey when she appears at first to him, saying some thing like "Are you....? no..., that would kill you"

I think he was just postulating. I don't think he'd ever experienced projection before, I think he just thought it might be possible but then reasoned that it would take too much effort and that the exertion would snuff an uninitiated scrub.

Well, it snuffed a jedi master alright

RJ doesn't think so, sorry.

But Anakin did not FEEL like he had those things, which is important to understand. He thought Obi-Wan distrusted him like the council blatantly did and was conspiring behind his back. He felt ostracized and unwelcome and misunderstood. Whether he was truly an outcast is irrelevant, he felt and believed it, no one really showed him otherwise in the ways they needed to, and it became his reality.

This.

It's important to remember that Anakin really was seduced by the Dark Side of the Force and the weight of that can't be taken away from him. He may have started down a path to save Padme (which in and of itself is only understandable, not moral or even reasonable) but he was definitely evil by the time she comes to him on Mustafar. He wanted to be the Emperor.

That being said, Vader had years to think and reflect on his choices. Like Luke said, there was good in him. I think the other user is right. There's not really any good left in Kylo. Even his own mother thinks he's gone.

Kill yourself reylo

>likes Kylo ironically
What a dumb bitch.

Kylo believed that Luke was trying to murder him. He believes that FO is a good guys, and rebels are terrorists. He thinks that his family abandoned him.
What's the point of your post?

And how do you know Kylo didn't feel abandoned by his family for pawning him off on Luke at a young age and being more interested/concerned with their careers? And he obviously felt betrayed by Luke. Maybe it was all a little too late. You don't know. There's still another movie to explain motive user.

Rj doesnt have a job any more

>Even his own mother thinks he's gone.
"No one is ever truly gone".

Fuck off frenchie

But he make a movie with that thought.

I don't think OP is a Reylo, he is arguing that Kylo Ren should not be redeemed and is not deserving or capable of it. Which is correct. He already made his choice, it was the wrong one, and there's no coming back from it. That said, this thread is clearly now being overrun by those mentally ill trash trying to defend him, so it might be best to kill it.

Fuck off retarded hole. Its not a reylo thread.
I just hope you're underaged.

Yeah, it will be best to kill last Skywalker and last white male in SW without redemption and make a bunch of movies about tokken niggro, hothead latino terrorist and perfect MaRey Seu.

OP here.

I am indeed not a Reylo.

And while yes, I would argue that Kylo Ren shouldn't be redeemed, I more so wanted to talk about how central he seems to be to the Force user plotline and these movies as a whole. I would like to know more about Luke's other students, since they're still alive. I would like to know how Luke feels about them. And I was mostly looking to see if other people felt the same way.

It just feels weird that Luke is exclusively concerned for Ben. Everyone is exclusively concerned for Ben. I don't know how to describe it, but it's too much.

>mentally ill trash trying to defend him.
I don't get it. I didn't even attack him.

Fuck off reylo

>Kill last Skywalker.

I mean shit, I have a problem with this too.

But the idea of Ben Solo living to father a son that will somehow become a hero for the next generation makes me seethe.

Say it frenchie chowder

Because HE IS the center of this trilogy, he's a Skywalker. What's wrong with that?
Every big event/action in the films is arced around Kylo Ren. He literally launches the plot of Episode 7, creates the turning point by capturing Rey.

The most pivotal scene of the film is the meeting between him and Han Solo. That scene encapsulates this entire trilogy so far, Rey is literally on the sidelines, helpless as Kylo Ren makes a crucial decision and kills his father.

What is the final lightsaber fight about? It is about Kylo Ren fighting both of them. He is there for both parts, entering the battle wounded, dispatching Finn, and then succumbing to his weaknesses against Rey. Rey isn't even conscious for half of it.

Most of Rey's story in The Last Jedi revolves around Kylo. The mystery of why he turned evil and if he can be saved.

The big emotional climax of The Last Jedi? The huge moment? In Snoke's throne room....what happens there? Rey is helpless as Ben Solo makes an important decision about his destiny and kills Snoke.

Once again the final lightsaber battle is centered around Ben Solo and his failings.

I ultimately think that Rey's final purpose in this story will be to redeem Ben Solo through her own death.

Maybe Kylo will save her from death, just like Anakin wanted to save Padme. Poetry.

Nu wars was a mistake.

Don't try to talk with that shizo, he's underaged

Because they took Luke's character, raped him, killed him, and then shit on his grave. The truth is, Luke in any other incarnation would have cared just as much about his other students, just as Yoda and Obi-Wan did. But the movie is poorly written trash that hates Star Wars and its core values, lore, and moral compass. Those things don't sell shitty merchandise and amusement park passes, and that is all Disney cares about.

muh Luke

>Because they took Luke's character, raped him, killed him, and then shit on his grave.
They did it because of Ben. They also shit on Han and Leia because of Ben. That's why I don't think they kill him, Kylo brings money, not nigger or viet.

The ONLY reason anyone watched these movies was for Luke, Han, and Leia. And now they are gone. Episode IX is going go bomb because of it. It is no longer Star Wars. Fuck off with that retarded nonsense.

More reylo dishonesty. You whales cant help yourselves.

>What's wrong with that?
He's framed as an Antagonist. Even Darth Vader isn't framed as an Antagonist for his own trilogy until the last part of his last movie. That's what's wrong with that.

>I ultimately think that Rey's final purpose in this story will be to redeem Ben Solo through her own death.

He's beyond redemption.
That's what's wrong with that.

>Vader comparisons.

Let me stop you there, because J.J. has said himself that he could not think of a more heinous act for Kylo to perform than patricide. Redemption was not his intention, and even Rian Johnson supports this notion, because Luke literally tells Rey verbatim, "This is not going to go how you think."

So that's what's wrong with that.

>mclung chestnuts.
You can suck mine.

>, Kylo brings money
Not according to the last movie.

user why are you so surprised that a bunch of geriatrics aren't the main characters anymore? How can this surprise anyone? It's a damn shame they didn't film the Sequel movies 10/15 years ago, but try to see reason. Harrison Ford wanted Han to die, didn't want to do Star Wars anymore, Carrie Fisher looked like a corpse on screen all the way up until her actual death. I feel for Mark, he still has enthusiasm and spunk, but he was never going to be the main focus at his age at this time.

Ahhh
RJ said he's the protagonist. Rey and him - both protagonists.
>He's beyond redemption.
>doesn't kill his mother
>saves Rey and kills Snoke
>shows humanity in terms of his relationships with Rey
Yeah, definitly. Rj said that he's not even close to Vader.

Yes, according merch sales. He's the only one new character, that sales well. And he's more popular than MaRey.

But none of that sells at all. Literally none of it. Star Wars merchandise sales across the board are at an all time low.

If you're going to quote Jew Jew then know that Rian said this about him as well:

>“Are you kidding? Vader was worse than Kylo ever was, I think, and Vader got redeemed."

You can cry that Rian is shit and not filming the last one but Jew Jew produced TLJ, loved the writing, and was in consensus. Jew Jew started the ST as shit, it will continue the trajectory.

They are plummeting

>Redemption was not his intention, and even Rian Johnson supports this notion, because Luke literally tells Rey verbatim, "This is not going to go how you think."

Also Luke said "No one is too far gone".

Yes, because of new characters like viet Rose or admiral Tumblr.

>t. Rian Johnson

saw the directors commentary and that cuck always uses the word notion

First of all, checked.
Second of all, I'd like a citation. I want to see Rian calling him the protagonist.

Rian is shit. I highly doubt J.J. Abrams loved the writing, and isn't just saving face, but whatever, they're both shit.

Back to this, even IF Rian SAID he's the protagonist, he's not framed as one.

>saves Rey.
He literally told Luke he would destroy her. He sends his troops to attack her right before that.

>Doesn't kill his mother.
But he did kill his father.

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He said, "No one's ever really gone."

He was talking to Leia about her son, I don't know why this is being misconstrued as him believing in the redemption of Kylo Ren and not comforting his sister.

Kylo Ren figures and merchandise clog the shelves just as much you moron. No one likes him anymore either. He was cool in TFA with the helmet and before the franchise was irreversibly destroyed, but not anymore.

"Kylo and Rey are two halves of our protagonist. We all can relate to Kylo, just like I do." - something like that. You can find it.

I think he was also referring to Han and more broadly everyone else they lost along the way, like all his students and all the Resistance crew who died in the battle and escape.

I don't think anyone who defends these movies actually believes what they're saying, and I think every genuine fan of TLJ is, in contrast, very silent and frank about their enjoyment.

This makes sense.

Throughout the movie, Leia is constantly stressing about losses.

Yeah, sure

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>We all can relate to Kylo

Why did they make him kill his father.

Cause he's abuse victim.

Dude even YODA doesn't talk about them, I just remembered that.

He says, "Lost Young Solo," or something. And, "Lose Rey we must not," but he says nothing about the other students. It's absurd.

Fuck off reylo

>People love this emotionally abusive, violently psychotic murderer.
>He killed his father.
>It's okay, he was an abuse victim.

Kylo really is a hero for Nu males and tumblrinas when he was intended to be a warning signal.

Probably because the only people defending it at this point are delusional Kylo Ren and Rey shippers who are obsessed with trying to convince themselves they are right and aren't grasping at straws by shrieking autistically at everyone else calling it like it is. Anyone else who enjoyed the movie for what it is, do so just as they would any other blockbuster action movie without the need to discuss it.

>h-he is nazi, h-he is murderer!!!!
>he is hero of Trump age!
Pathetic

I don't understand how anyone could enjoy Kylo Ren x Rey.

You are not getting it, so read carefully you utter dumbfuck. It is not a matter of other new characters being less popular than him, it is a matter that he is equally unpopular and absolutely none of the merchandise sells. No one cares about Rey and no one cares about Kylo Ren. They aren't buying his figures and merch just like they aren't buying Rey, or Finn, or Poe shit either. Episode IX will flop because there is nothing Star Wars left about Star Wars and no one wants anything to do with it anymore after TLJ.

They are sick in the head. Best not to think about it too much. Like all shipping cancer in general.

>Thinly veiled /reylo/ thread
Soyboys keep going

It wasn't supposed to be this way.

It's just so funny to me because Kylo inflicts loads of abuse onto Rey almost every time he sees her.

Nu wars and reylos were a mistake

Women love being abused. It is their basest desire and default state. But honestly whatever may have been there between the two characters during TLJ is dead and gone when he chooses to finish what Vader started by killing his master to usurp his power rather than save the galaxy, and then screams at his army to exterminate Rey, his mother, and the other Resistance troops. That's not a romance.

Kylo is the most popular and central character. Stay mad Lukeshitters and sjw. He is getting redeemed and getting Rey too. This thread is sad. Remember that fiction is not reality autists.

This guy get it

Not if I get a gun.

no it doesn’t, yeah I’ve also watched a few of those “sw merch not selling” videos and a good portion of the time kylo ren figures seem to be the only ones doing decently because they rarely appear in the video. Also during the Christmas period most of the kylo ren figures were sold out in my local stores, just loads of hux, rose tico & Finn merch being left around.

Look at this dude, rampage in hollywood because of reylo ?
>/r9k/ was a mistake

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I'd neither like to be Kylo or spend time with him. Which is the worst you can say about a lead role in a movie.

Literally everyone give up on Anakin the moment he turned and they decided to kill him until Luke while Kylo has both of his parents showing him love and acceptance and a random girl who has no connection to him decided to give him a chance.

That emo bitch was given more chances than he deserves and had no legitimate reason to be the way he is.

Sure, buddy.

>Kylo is the most popular and central character
Even freaking tumblr hates him.

>That emo bitch was given more chances than he deserves and had no legitimate reason to be the way he is.
Cry me a river reddit nigger
>muh emo
He saved Rey's life and killed the big evil

>t.reddit/tumblr faggot
Kylo hater are very easy detectable

Reddit is the only place that likes him since it's full of teenagers like you.

>He saved Rey's life
Yeah, after putting her in danger in the first place and then using her as a bait to kill Snoke. What a hero.

>>>r/starwars or wait
>>>/tumblr/anti-reylo

Nobody forced her to come brainlet.

>the best part of the Sequel Trilogy is Kylo Ren and Adam Driver's performance
If he is the best they can offer, then there's literally no hope for ST.

> what will that do?

It would bring him back, I guess? So he killed some people...big deal. People with skill and value are allowed to get away with those things, and others will still want them on their side.

She come to save that manchild, but she is indeed dumb for believing that he deserves to be saved after witnessing him killing his father in cold blood.

>So he killed some people...big deal
>big deal