Mark Waid is back on twitter after self-imposed break. He wrote a piece (in a form of twitter rant/apology) about harrassment among fans. Interesting view about how he perceives current comic climate. Do you agree, Sup Forums? Is he the hero that we need to call out horrible behaviour?
>What I Keep Forgetting About Twitter (or An Apology to Actual Fans): Every once in a while, I’ll call out haters with a known history of harassment towards non-white-straight-males. But when I say “known,” I tend to forget that (luckily for them) just because they have YouTube channels or whatever, that doesn’t mean everyone IS aware of their toxicity and bullying behaviors. Assuming that they do is a horrible mistake on my part, as to those not in the know, I come off as a bully myself. >A big part of their success, which I overlook, is that some of these guys have framed themselves as “gee, golly, all we’re doing is critiquing your work!” rather than the more accurate “but we also champion serious harassment campaigns towards non-CIS creators either off-the-clock or in dogwhistles” admission. And if you’re not in the loop as a fan, you know only about the former, not the latter. I keep forgetting that. >I don’t know any comics pro who’s not aware that criticism of the work comes with the job. Everyone I know works to accept that, listens to what makes sense to them, and ignores the crap that has nothing to do with the work and is a personal attack. Do we fumble that sometimes? Yeah, we’re human. But we know we should rise above. This, to say that we’re/I’m hardly spotless. But where I keep falling down is that I stumble right into the trap some of these racists/bigots put down: I call them out when they show themselves, I warn other fans of their harassing ways, all without remembering that EVEN THEN, I’m punching down because of who I am. And when I see harassing bigots/racists/misogynists online, I lose sight of that.
>I will try to be more mindful, but I might also come to the point soon at which I finally admit that Twitter is not for me. We’ll see. In the meantime, if I’ve led you to believe I’m picking on specific “fans” (who aren’t fans), I apologize. That sort of behavior is unbecoming despite the justification that hatemongers need to be taken down a peg or two. The problem with shedding light on racist/bigoted roaches is that the instant that switch is flipped, like roaches, they skitter away at blinding speed to their hiding place. There’s no stamping them out. All I can ask of you, if I’ve built up any good faith with you over the years, is to consider that the off-the-grid harassment/death threats they engender is something no one wants. I know it’s very easy to dismiss everything I’ve said here as “snowflake talk,” which is your right. It’s also very frank to admit that sometimes we the pros come off as aggressive ourselves (something we’re all working to tamp down), and that’s not good. Therefore, what looks like an obvious demo of good “SJW”s against racist/bigots/etc looks to you like a damn circus.
Asher Lee
>The crime there is that we play right into their hands. Some of these harassers have crowdfunding programs that run on hate—that stoke this concept that pros hate poor, helpless fans—so that they can keep getting donations/clicks/whatever. That’s tragically cynical. These wanna-be Alex Joneses draw you into a curious crowd, rile you up with false rhetoric in order to monetize your anger, and encourage you to hate more so that they can make more money off of you. I genuinely believe my fans—not the guys who pop up to tell me I’m ruining comics because I promote diversity—don’t want their feelings monetized by someone else. It’s a pity that some have figured out ways to do that. Almost all comics fans are good people, and even when they don’t like what I write, I’m happy to listen and engage. The ones who come at me screaming “SJW” or “white knight” are the ones who get muted and ignored. >As more opportunities come around to help expose harassers, you’ll see more of that happening, I hope. The tricky, tricky part is to keep from looking bullying myself while I help others deal with the harassment. Already over the weekend, I’ve gotten one or two tweets from genuinely good people who’ve said, in essence, “hey, be careful, the way you phrased [x,y,z] borders on being a bad look for you,” and I’ve taken those comments into account. Still much work on my part to be done. >So to recap: I take full responsibility here for anything I say, however stupid. And I am perfectly fine taking criticism, even angry critiques, though I would prefer they were about the work and not about me personally (go figure) Still, you become a public figure, you take the good with the bad. In the meantime, promoting positivity is probably a better use of my energy than warning you about the predators and appearing to punch down. So I’ll work on that.
I think his heart is on the right place.
Nolan Cooper
He wrote all that shit on Twitter?
Samuel Robinson
They increased the character limit to 280.
Jaxon Nguyen
>everyone who criticizes my shit donut steel minority character is a fucking bigot Waht a fucking pussy. Glad this bald SJW cuck is getting his shit handed back to him
Josiah Myers
So TLDR Waid is apologizing because he's a twitchy autist who will easily respond to bait tweets from nobodys and is slowly coming to the realization that social media isn't for him but is still going to stay on because he can't help himself. Also, that's a REALLY old picture.
Thomas Lopez
>apologizing to SJWs for being a SJW The absolute state of Waid.
It’s clear the reference to YouTube channels was directed at Diversity & Comics. On twitter, D&C’s biggest critics say that his videos incite his fans to carry out online harassment, as if to say he creates a mob mentality of harassers. This can’t be further from the truth. D&C frequently advises his viewers that they should NOT approach or reproach SJWs creators online. But Waid continually insists that people like D&C are literally Hitler.
Liam Brown
When did we lose him?
Grayson Jenkins
>This can’t be further from the truth. D&C frequently advises his viewers that they should NOT approach or reproach SJWs creators online. But Waid continually insists that people like D&C are literally Hitler.
he isn't doing a good job in doing it.
Blake White
Hey, at least he's starting to realize that social media is affecting him negatively.
Logan Watson
At the risk of belaboring the obvious, that wasn't an apology.
Jacob Richardson
You can’t control what your fans do, no matter how much you try. People have a will of their own.
Colton Rodriguez
I don't use "SJW" or bait thumbnails in order to get attention.
Levi Robinson
He had a break since April. It was for the better since he used to have spergouts on the reg.
Hunter Bell
>letting trolls live in your head rent free ISHYGDDT
Charles Diaz
>It was for the better Clearly not since it seems to have just built up until he unloaded with this rant.
Samuel Hernandez
Mark Waid obviously caught the liberal mind virus which turned him into a dumb cunt and took away his ability to write interesting stories. He was one of the most talented writers until a few years ago but now everything he writes is worse than shit stains on blank paper.
Jose Scott
I haven't managed to read a single text containing interest for everyone except my group (straight white guys) that didn't make me at best ignore the full text. Sorry.
Chase Robinson
are you posting about me, HMMMMMMMMMM????
Matthew Jackson
His Empire was utter trash, that should have given you a hint.
Ian Wilson
Yep. Doesn't even recognize that some of the people he's called bigots aren't and isn't backtracking his silly generalizations like all rural areas being hives of racism with no minorities at all.
Austin Jackson
MFW the same guy wrote FF, Birthright, and Kingdom Come now writes Champions.
Gabriel Murphy
So he used to write thrash for DC and now he writes thrash for Marvel?
Carter Bennett
nigger, do you really expect me to read all that bullshit?
Hunter Robinson
Mark Waid went insane after Kingdom Come
>Discard all his opinions
Juan Johnson
I expect nonreaders to refuse to read it, and to post an angry comment about how long it is. Remember that you are free to ignore this thread.
Christian Anderson
This isn't much of an apology, he still spends the bulk of it attacking others instead of discussing his own mistakes.
Joseph Thomas
That's because he doesn't actually think he made any mistakes, user.
Noah Flores
Wow George and Waid look like twins
Zachary Gray
When has any SJW ever in the history of the world admitted that they were wrong about something? I'm genuinely curious here.
Jeremiah Mitchell
"My problem is, that I care too much"
Sebastian Gonzalez
Ian Miles Cheong is the only person I know that apologized and stopped being an SJW.
Eli Foster
That sure is a lot of words to just say pic related.
Jose Cox
He was always crazy. That guy is an obvious social climbing opportunist who does whatever gives him the most money/prestige.
Luke Cooper
Birthright sucks and Waid himself admits most of KC is Alex Ross.
Also his JLA sucks.
I've recently started to realize the only good thing he's written is Flash. Still, that's a lot of good issues of Flash, so I can't say wholesale he's a shit writer.
Brody Campbell
Do you think we'll get a chimpout from Waid that he won't get to write in Action 1000 now that he's back on Twitter?
Brandon Adams
I expect regular chimpouts from him, so it's safe to assume that he'll speak about AC1k at some point.
Lucas Taylor
>it's a "this guy is a retard but thank god we actually never liked his works" episode
Leo Parker
I anticipate they'll have breakdowns like Waid, too.
Aiden Roberts
Is there anyone left that still defends this white nationalist?
Hudson Ortiz
Mark Waid isn't right about anything.
Adrian King
I genuinely have never liked anything of his i've read. Even before he started spouting his shit opinions I've been saying Kingdom Come and Birthright are trash.
Jayden Evans
>I genuinely have never liked anything of his i've read. Sure you haven't
Christopher Bell
but still... get a blog, mark
Joshua Reyes
Is it sad or funny that a few assholes with shitty mics on youtube broke Waid and made others sperg so much on social media?
Daniel Wood
Rex is no stranger to flip flopping. He's still an obnoxious cunt no matter his allegiance.
Jackson Nelson
Not entirely surprising based on what's happened online in the last eight years (at a minimum).
Josiah Long
The fact that he apologized alone already puts him leagues above everyone else. He's definitely sorry and wants to be on good standing. The narrative about the aggression towards fans and the company of Marvel itself becomes more murky when done through Twitter. There're so many different people saying different things that it becomes hard to determine the actual narrative, so he follows his gut. He's working on it, though, and while I'm still upset and sad that Marvel's gone to shit, I'm at least giving Waid sympathy for this because he actually went and apologized like a mature adult (something rare for Marvel employees, nowadays). He's unfortunately misguided in some of his views, but he truly means well, I think.
Jeremiah Carter
Just block them and dont talk about them, how hard is that Waid?
And dont come to me with that "i care about people getting harras" just tell them to do the same thing, twitter is big enough for both communities to exist
Lincoln Hughes
wow, fucking kek it's true
Zachary Ross
>I genuinely have never liked anything of his I've read >but I keep reading him
Nathaniel Ross
He wants to go back to DC. That's why he will try to stop being a dick online.
Jaxson Moore
WHAT IF- we got guys in comics who didn't give a rats ass about politics? You wanna write a minority character then do it well and not in a patronizing way that makes us feel like you think we're white peoples pets or some shit. You know, like in the 90s
Julian Hernandez
Marvel HQ show Seinfeld style when?
Liam Scott
Huh. I've read this story before, but somehow I'd completely forgotten about it.
Gabriel Reyes
Not that user, but I read all of Conway's Firestorm.
Sometimes we just read things we don't like.
Matthew Johnson
I almost feel sorry for old, pasty-white men working in this industry because such a response as this one is *required* for his continued survival. The second he strays a nanometer from the social justice holy scripture is the second he is tossed under the bus.
The thing is, it'll happen *anyways*, eventually they'll grow tired of him and cast him aside. White male allies are disposable and inherently questionable in the first place.
So keep toeing the SJ line there, Mr Waid, you're still a hair's breath away at any moment from being put up against the wall by your own movement.
Matthew Ortiz
>Sometimes we're just retarded
Evan Cox
>WHAT IF- we got guys in comics who didn't give a rats ass about politics? But that's impossible. People that don't give a fuck about politics are few to none. Good storytelling requires you to have a basic grasp on how real world works - and this includes having some basic understanding of political spectrum. The problem is - SJWs are running the show. That's why we have to swing the pendulum and support far right activists trying to get into comics. You can have my word that comics made by civic nationalists or people even further to the right, would be better and way more fun than those that are published currently. Imagine how mad SJWs would be, having whole comic industry not publishing books for them.
Jack Harris
Why are you repeating what I just said?
Oliver Baker
He's not wrong, but at the same time he seems to be spending much more time publicly calling out bad fans and doing nothing against bad industry behavior actually costing people jobs. Like maybe he left DC because of Berganza, but I don't remember him ever saying shit about it. So stuff like this really just really falls flat when it seems like he's not willing to stick his neck out to actually protect people. Why are only bad fans demonized like this?
I almost tweeted this at him in reply, but I didn't want to get into a twitter fight.
Nathan White
>People that don't give a fuck about politics are few to none.
I used to.
Logan Long
>That's why we have to swing the pendulum and support far right activists trying to get into comics. You can have my word that comics made by civic nationalists or people even further to the right, would be better and way more fun than those that are published currently. Imagine how mad SJWs would be, having whole comic industry not publishing books for them.
Your entire mentality is utterly bonkers.
Landon Thomas
you do not solve the issue of far left fanatics ruining stories by bringing in far right fanatics to ruin stories. You bring in centrists who lean either left or right with world experience and diverse backgrounds (literally diverse, you write what you know. So that means former military, blue collar workers, college students, former activists and so on) who can play off each other to make better stories.
Christian Baker
You might have a point there, but far right comic industry hasn't been tried before. We can only speculate but it's unfair to assume it couldn't possibly have a potential to be a good answer to current problems.
Jordan Young
>far right comic industry hasn't been tried before. That's because both art and reading is for fags and imma go shoot muh gun like a real man.
Charles Mitchell
Waid must have a really fucked up rape dungeon to be doing this level of virtue signalling. #malefeminist
Chase Russell
But like every other one of the idiots who angrily quits and makes a lot of noise about quitting, he ends up coming back because he's addicted to it.
If he was REALLY quitting social media, he'd have just disappeared without announcing it.
Jaxon Gray
Gerard Jones's arrest from earlier this year had him spooked.
Joseph Baker
Waid's gonna be EVS' guest on Monday, may be funny.
Landon Collins
matter and anti matter
Jason Harris
Has there been any more news on that since the arrest?
Nathaniel Taylor
And because the only few far right comic that exist are made by indies that sell less than 500 copies with bad art
What's more likely? 1. That Waid cucks out and gives some weaksauce excuse about hahwassment or deff thweatts 2. He goes on just so he can reaffirm that anyone who trashes Marvel is a dogwhistling KKK Nahtzii 3. He behaves like a professional who just wants a reasonable discussion
Connor Thompson
>frames "I'm sorry we had to insult you for being so wrong" as if it's a legitimate apology D&C is shit though.
Ayden Foster
He saw Slott's interview and thought it went well so he'll try to do 3, but he's way less adjusted than Slott and will sperg out, inevitably turning it into 2.
Chase Cruz
Nope, but the legal process is incredibly lengthy.