Explain to me what is wrong with this movie without mentioning the concept of Tone, Humor, and Quips

Explain to me what is wrong with this movie without mentioning the concept of Tone, Humor, and Quips.

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Joss Whedon directed it

It felt hollow and meaningless.

There were no stakes because the villains were poorly established as proper threats, and the pacing suffered hard for it.

Ultron had a face with moving lips

Too much trimming down. There's a good 30 minutes of content that got removed to make for a shorter run time, which was unnecessary, because the franchise was successful enough that they didn't need that damage control measure.

there was no ultron in the movie

Romance that didn't need to be there, subplots clearly shoved in to set up future movies like Iron Man 2, and a character who we don't really know very well dying for the sake of shock. The executives should have kept Whedon in check rather than shoving their bullshit in.

Ultron's plan made no sense. He first starts talking about the Avengers being slaves to some other thing pulling the strings, but then talks about needing to prepare humanity for something else that's coming, implying that he knows about, I guess Thanos somehow?

But then he switches to deciding to kill all humans for basically no reason.

Also the romance subplot between Black Widow and Hulk didn't work at all. It came out of nowhere and went nowhere.

Although I think I'm in the minority in that personally I didn't mind Quicksilver's death. The whole movie is telegraphing that Hawkeye is gonna die, and then that happens instead.

They killed a major villain (Baron Strucker I think?) as an afterthought.
Killing Quicksilver mostly for shock value.

Tony should be smarter than messing with alien magic AI in secret. I can't even remember what Ultrons motivations were. Kill all humans to make a perfect world?

He looked very Necron-like

>implying that he knows about, I guess Thanos somehow?
I mean, he was modeled after Tony's brainwaves, so I guess he could have been preparing humanity for what Tony thought was an inevitable alien invasion? I mean, sure, they fought off the last Chitauri invasion force, but what if an even bigger one shows up? Or even stronger aliens?

Read Ultron Unlimited and then ask this question again, OP.

Quickslav was wasted literally due to Whedon's death boner

It was basically the MCU bending down to Fox and admitting they can't do better

Also having him in Civil War would be more fun that what we got

Ultron's plans and motives kept changing throughout the movie. Comics Ultron only had one goal and it was to subjugate and exterminate humanity and anyone else who he didn't like.

>I mean, he was modeled after Tony's brainwaves
I don't think they even mentioned that in the movie.

They killed Quicksilver despite him being one of the better characters in the movie

Didn't he want humanity to fend for itself, and take out the Avengers because they were just a crutch?

I mean, technically most of them are human, so it is humanity defending itself...

Exactly what were his personality traits besides the same one everyone else had? He just ran fast and made jokes.

Character voice, for one. The characters tended to sound less like their usual selves and more uniformly like Joss Whedon's writing, which is not a neutral flavor, but one that's very recognizable. "At long last is lasting a little long" and "incoming already came in" - two lines with the exact same structure, but one's Cap and one's Widow; can you tell which is which if you don't remember?

I loved it. Ultron's one of my favorite villains BECAUSE he's not like the comics. I like him as a grandiose delusional vulnerable nutbag.

>the shitty romance subplot

He was a slav. Everyone likes slavs.

My take on it was that Ultron's whole mission was a perversion of Tony's "Peace in our time" goal. As is often the case in stories with AI, the fastest path to peace is to remove humanity as a chaotic element. Hence, "peace in our time = kill all humans". The talk of strings was him talking about them being slaves to their chaotic human nature, and his preparation of "humanity" was less about humans and more about sentient life; AI life like vision.
Which is why Vision has that name in the first place; he's ultron's vision of the new humanity; one made of metal.

The Black Widow and Hulk thing was stupid but I think they were trying to build it off of their interactions from Avengers. Which were NOT enough to start a relationship on by any stretch.

>ultron is a non-threatening antagonist
>destroying a country that doesn't exist hold's no emotional weight
>destroying a country/the world by throwing a city on earth is corny
>no chemistry between widow and hulk
>having cap say " watch your language" is beyond cringe. he fought in ww2, surrounded by his fellow soldiers, do you really think after experiencing all of that he would give a fuck about using dirty words on the battlefield?
>tony creates accidentally creates ultron and feels really bad and needs to stop him, but still wants to create another robot with the vision.
>hawkeye has a secret family who is boring as hell
>thor goes into a cave never mentioned before and has a visionquest for really no reason at all (as seen by thor ragnarok)
>thinks a crazy doctor running around is funny
>another battle with a disposable army
>hulkbuster vs hulk scene is too drawn out and totally unnecessary, adds nothing to the plot at all.

Brucetasha.

Literally nothing. I'm serious. The more you think, the movie get better and everything falls into its place. I too had problems with Ultron's motivations but somehow I got it. It's given to us - Avengers don't let the world evolve because they keep saving it from dangers. Without toil and pain there is no evolution and the moment Avengers fail, the world wouldn't ne able to help itself and will fall. Ultron was caring for the whole world. Of course when he lost his body, he stopped caring about carbon-based life but that's another story (and basically his arc in the movie).
There was nothing wrong with Quicksilvers death or BW-Hulk romance.

Ultron's motivation is unclear
The characters' arcs aren't well done
Tony survives

Nothing, really.

It's a pretty solid movie. Haters gonna hate for no reason.

"hurr durr it's not like the comics" will always be a retarded reason; this isn't a direct adaptation of any one comic, it is its own take on the characters.

Ultron shouldve been more of the focus, the idea of a new AI with a sense of humor and a personality was actually a cool idea but they ruined it by not having him in it enough. Hulk and black widows love story was cliched and boring as fuck. Hawkeye is the most boring character and so scenes with his family were dull and unnecessary, it felt like whedon was trying to shove his character down the audiances throats. Killing quicksilver “because its whedons tradition” was fucking stupid and it wouldve been better to have seen him in other movies. The actors for quicksilver and scarlet witch cant act and they shouldve gotten someone who wasnt a dull cardboard cut out for it. Killing baron von strucker for no reason when he couldve been used in future movies was dumb as shit. Loki shouldve been in the ashardian nightmare sequance instead of heimdall because no one fucking cares about him no matter how much they shove him down our throats. Over all i hated AOU and it was one of the first movies where i realized i was getting tired of the MCU. Good parts about it was vison was cool and ultron had an interesting premise especially had they explored it more

>>thinks a crazy doctor running around is funny
is this the one with the dr in boxers for no reason?

>Avengers don't let the world evolve because they keep saving it from dangers.

Within the context of the MCU all the Avengers have done at that point is stop a single alien invasion and hunted down HYDRA, hardly anything at all. Setting that aside the notion that world won't "evolve" because the Avengers are saving it doesn't make any sense, even by the most tortured definition of "evolve," as we saw all the way back in IM2 that the mere presence of Iron Man kicked off an arms race.

ULTRON DIDN'T DO SHIT!

During the final battle Thor said ''is that the best you got???'', unltron replied ''no, this is!!!''

He sends all his drones, all of them and... they just get defeated, again, like in the rest of the movie.

that was his final moment and it literally didn't do anything.

Black Widow and Hawkeye didn't even got a single scratch on them and they are just regular humans.

1. Ultron's design was shit

2. The big build up for Ultron to have this super duper godly form is quickly melted away by three of the Avengers.

3. Quicksilver being a throwaway character

4. Honestly, that was pretty much it because I can't mention the movie's excessive amount of quips or jarring humor during serious moments.

Ultron by himself never felt THAT threatening

Holy shit you’re retarded

Ultron hated humanity just bacause he entered the internet 10 seconds and saw everything "bad" humans ever did, thats not that great of a supervillain origin, should have done something like EMH where he said organic life is restraining progress in the universe

Ultrons plan was to lift a city and then drop, why can't he just get fucking nukes or something, the stakes could have been much higher

Ultron had an ugly face, with moving lips and teeth, and looked stupid. His body was fucking hideous.

Quipsilver fucking died.

Hulkbuster was completely unnecessary and was in the movie just to sell some toys about it

it was fucking boring,

His pland was basically this; humainty as it is now is too stupid and pampered by their heroes to know how to deal with Thanos. Ultron correctly calculates that the Avengers won't be able to stop Thanos when he arrives, and so he concludes that the only way to protect earth is by upgrading humanity. And to him "upgrade" means the deletion of the old system (mammalian humans) and the installment of a superior system (androids). Humans are far too fractured and tribal to effectively protect the earth, but a race of androids, under his rule, can function as a singular unit, working tirelessly day and night to devise and constantly upgrade measures against alien invasion. Thats what the whole conversation between the Vision and Ultron in the woods was about, Vision was chastising Ultron for not giving humanity and the Avengers enough credit, since the Vision would rather see them try and fail and try again than rob them of their ability to try at all.

Ultron needed at least 2 movies for proper development.

>NO PYM!

1) Ultron's origin was too vague and complex for what should have been a simple "man invents AI, AI goes rogue" story. If Tony and Bruce have already tried and failed to make an AI then what do you call Jarvis and Tony's pre-existing army of James Spaders? Why does the Mind Gem have a template for robot programming inside it? What's up with Thanos implying Ultron was somehow his fault in the end credits scene? Was Tony's brain scanned by the Mind Gem when he wasn't looking or did Ultron learn quipping and "keep your enemies rich" from the internet? All this shit is implied rather than exposited for what should have been a SINGLE story beat.

2) Ultron wasn't a threat despite having the potential to fuck the world up in ways the Avengers couldn't stop, in seconds before they would even know what was going on. Why create a villain who can control the entire fucking internet and then have him waste his time fighting Jarvis for nuke codes? If you want to launch the world into darkness, why stop at bombs instead of going nuts on everyone's bank balances and electricity grids and traffic lights and Tony and Rhodey's fucking armors which are definitely vulnerable because Jarvis could remote pilot them all.

3) To many subplots that go nowhere. The movie's called AGE of Ultron but the story's actually about the Avengers lying low on a farm for a day and a half feeling sad about losing a fight. The idea behind Thor's visit to the magic pool was neutered to the point where it no longer made sense for it to be there. Widow and Banner made a terrible couple and all their screentime together is a waste of time.

Well, allow me to do that, without limitations though.

I don't believe that the movie is terrible, but I think it's botched up in favour of Whedon's favourite quipping.

As a huge Marvel and MCU fan, I've grown to hate this movie.

Before I list my reasons, let me give you a prime example of how Whedon ruined this: The Thor vs Ultron fight should be one of the highlights of the movie. Instead, it is separated in 3 different scenes, and resolved with a quip, completely removing all urgency.

So, here are my reasons:
>characterization is very thin, because everything we saw in AoU in regards to character interactions was already done in AA,with the exception of Hulk-BW romance subplot.
>All the missed oportunities: Thor vs Ultron is just one: They did not have the Hulk vs Hulkbuster fight resolved with Hulk realising all the damage he's done, instead we get a quippy punch by Tony. They did not bother to make Ultron sophisticated about wanting to destroy the world (like in the life is meaningless part he has in the comics). They did not have someone like Cap lift the mjolnir, instead it's plyaed as a joke twice. They end the only meaningful dialogue in the movie with a quip (well, I was born yesterday).
>the fights and the choreography are bland and boring
>it feels that the original cut was 4 hours long, but instead we only got 2, creating an uncomfortable pace (Why on earth do we get 4 encounters of the Avengers vs Ultron?)


Anyway, my opinion is that it could be a great movie, but what we got is extremely disappointing.

It broke the Avengers apart despite Civil War being right around the corner effectively making Civil War worse because there were now three Avengers movies that established at these people just fight and bicker.

>>I mean, he was modeled after Tony's brainwaves
>I don't think they even mentioned that in the movie.

They don't. Not once.

People ASSUME that's where Ultron's personality came from because they know about his comics origin. The movie doesn't explain shit despite having a scene designed to point out Ultron subconsciously using Tony catchphrases.

Pacing

Pacing was off.

Other than that, good movie.

they waste ultron, he wasnt that big threat in the end

he was a no holds barred badass, he spent whole movie just shoulder blocking and smashing fools

I think my only real problem with it was Quicksilver's retarded little picture line.

>Quippy punch
>Cap lifting Mjolnir was a joke
>Vision quips

See this is why the OP put those limitations on. You autists don’t know what jokes are.

>Week of Ultron
>RoboMinions as strong as Tony armors in IM3
>There is QuickSilver, now he is dead
>Fucked up Ultrons face
>HulkXWidow
>Muh Dark Future visions

I know what jokes are. I'm just saying they're horribly misplaced.

now I'm a massive MCU shill but even I wasn't that satisfied with Ultron, he's of indeterminate origin (specifically designed by Thanos? a natural occurrence of the mind gem? Tony and Banner's creation? Mix of all three?) and indeterminate motivation (wants to replace the avengers because... Tony used to be a weapons manufacturer? but then wants to destroy humanity, so he's just mental? not very compelling) that hinges on introducing Vision in a convoluted manner (his body made out of adimantuim + biological printing medical tech + ultron gives him life by putting the mind gem in his forehead + ultron uploads part of his mind to the body + tony uploads jarvis to him + Thor animates him with his lightning = Vision)

>explain to me what's wrong with this movie without mentioning any of the things that's wrong with this movie

For me, it all really boiled down to Ultron not being scary. An army of nameless drones trying to destroy humanity has been done not only countless times in this universe, but was literally done in the previous Avengers movie.

Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver literally was a more compelling antagonist. They had better motives and caused more damage to the protagonists.

The movie really should've been more about that and more about the fucking infinity stone and less about the Sup Forums-robot.

Ultron wasn't a big enough threat and his grand master plan was stupid.

A conflict is created between the team and Tony, but is resolved without much reason. In one scene Thor is so fed up with Stark he fucking chokes him, but in the end everything is OK because Vision turned out to be good by sheer luck.

A whole country was assblasted by Tony's alien AI experiment. Should we say something about it? Fuck that. We're not going to mention it until CW comes around and we can all go back to being pissy with him again. .

Seeing the Avengers repeatedly fight an endless army of indistinguishable robots isn't very exciting, lesser so than aliens.

Actors felt as if they were kind of phoning it in as well. Tony's doesn't seem very concerned while being thrown around by Hulk with a bunch of civilians around them.

Hulk/Widow romance is awful and I'm happy Thor3 took a piss on the lame "Sun's getting real low" sequences.

It has some enjoyable scenes, mainly character stuff, but it wasn't good. .

>Omelettes
>Flying truck

Ultron is undefined and it feels like a big chunk of the movie is missing. Important information isn't given. They make all of these implications that would lead you to believe Tony directly crafted/is responsible for parts of Ultron's personality. But we're told and shown all he did was work on plans for an AI, fiddle around with the gem, and Ultron just created himself.

He figured "Peace of our time" literally meant he should stop all wars and violent conflicts on earth? He starts out completely insane. Why? He wants to kill all the humans, but he also has a Pinocchio thing and wants to be a real boy + comic Ultron daddy issues + longs for human interaction with Wanda etc.

youtube.com/watch?v=3zKaHp0zW7U
This scene makes the movie great alone

Does anyone think Joss fighting to keep the cabin scene in was worth it? Or did it just eat up time in the film where it could've been used to better pace out things like the infinity stones build-up?

Cabin scene was good, should have cut Hulk/Widow and made more time for better or more important things.

Ultron had a human face and it looked shit.

I think the infinity Stone setup should have been kept in imo

youtube.com/watch?v=zLxEDaA9j2E

Necrons look better.

I didn't love the movie but I really did like Ultron. It surprised me when I saw everyone shitting on him. Being the Tony to Tony's Howard was perfect and I totally disagree with because I feel like not directly pointing it out is exactly what makes it work. I don't need to be beat over the head and told LOOK HE'S GOT DADDY ISSUES LIKE TONY BECAUSE HE IS TONY.

The plot was all over the place, with too many action scenes that flt like filler, and too many downtime scenes that clearly did less to establish character and personality than Whedon seemed to think they would. All that time would have been better spent introducing Vision more fully, or having a complete characterization for the 3 new heroes they introduced, otherwise they just shouldn't have even introduced 3 new heroes.

That, we can agree on

but I still think he does look a bit like a Necron

Hank Pym didn't create him.

WidowxBanner. At first I didn't mind it but now I think it's dumb. i myself like mantisxbanner

>Explain to me what is wrong with this movie without regurgitating non-arguments

Cabin scene is an important slow down character moment. Hulk/Widow is the only issue in those scenes but that's an issue in the entire movie.

It was an empty vessel filled with a couple cool ideas but no real direction or purpose other than showing us some cool things in between some shit things.

>People ASSUME that's where Ultron's personality came from because they know about his comics origin
Really? Assume? Did you forget the part where Ultron makes a comment that reminded the Vibranium smuggler of Stark, and it pissed him off?

>Hulk destroys several city blocks and we even see him crushing a cop
>"Thankfully, no one was hurt!"

I actually thought Tony had said something about Vision being cool because it was using Jarvis and not him as a base. Am I remembering wrong?

I don't understand the hate for this movie either. I thought it was decent. The first one was really bad.

>hulkbuster vs hulk scene is too drawn out and totally unnecessary, adds nothing to the plot at all.
Not to mention it basically made the Hulk seem like a pointless addition to the team. If Iron Man can just wear a bigger armor and become strong enough to match the Hulk in strength, why the fuck do they need to keep a highly unstable and sometimes mindless monster around?

>Weak villain
>Villain makes Tony essentially unlikable
>Borderline obnoxious shifts from seriousness to humor (guess what OP, it was a flaw you retard)
>Jokes don't land and have no punchline, it's just people rambling
>Stakes and threat felt low despite the plot being high in scale
>Strucker wasted so fucking fast
>Twins feel shoved in awkwardly
>Quicksilver's death was forced

Nothing, other than it eats JUST League and all other DC Excrement Universe alive. How to do capeshit film universes right, that's all.

>without mentioning the concept of Tone, Humor, and Quips.

But the movie's tone/"humor" and overabundance of quips are its biggest flaws, you absolute turbofaggot.

It took what should have been a major series of events (Ultron, Vision's creation, etc.) and turned it all into what feels like pointless filler. Whedon's trademark style of making everyone "quirky" and "cute" runs perpendicular to what should have been a fairly serious and high-stakes plot. Characters make jokes at the worst possible times and completely derail any potential tension or gravity of a scene.

"Didn't see that coming" is the absolute fucking worst.

Replacing Pym with Tony.

>explain why this movie is bad without mentioning major things people dislike about it
Fuck off.

It was alright, but the lack of Bucky really took away from Cap's part. It seems ridiculous to me that Cap's vision was of Peggy, when he was supposed to be mentally tortured by the death of a man that was virtually his soul mate. I find Cap's storyline always frustrating because it could be filled with high quality beautiful friendship, and wonderful WWII imagery, but instead it's filled with plain faced Carters who are so dull they're reduced to muffsplaining their way through scenes and just being ridiculous, like skinny, ordinary Sharon Carter telling Cap "I'm here to protect you." I wish they had disregarded the comics more.

Men can't have intimate friendships, user. That would be gay.

>tell me whats wrong with it without mentioning its flaws

Nerfed ultron is nerfed. Ultron should be terrifying.

>Tone, Humor, and Quips

Those are okay in every Marvel movie.

People just have different expectations, and that's why they end up not liking Marvel movies.

Just learn that already, guys: Marvel movies are light, funny movies. They don't take themselves seriously, so why should you?

this is an excellent scene

Jesus, dudes. Ultron just wanted humanity to evolve into Ultron. That's it.

He's a hivemind of robots, and he wanted to exterminate all else on Earth cause he deemed himself the most evolved superior being, and being all Ultron, there'd be "peace for our time".

youtube.com/watch?v=iQ8tMDytEV8
war machine most underrated in the mcu

the bigger armor was designed against the Hulk tho. He was going to lose, and only won with a lucky move followed by a sucker punch.

Not to mention Hulk was mind bent by Wanda and was probably having alucinations. A lucid Hulk would probably have won.

Ultron's motivation is confusing
Hulkbuster is great, though. Teamwork is more interesting than the first Avengers.

>runs perpendicular to what should have been a fairly serious and high-stakes plot.

>should have

>not muh

Your mistake.

I went into AoU expecting the quips to be annoying as fuck because everyone on the planet constantly bitched about it


But they weren't even bad, to me

It had too many subplots going on.

Quicksilver makes a joke while he's dying though.

>Ultron's motivation is confusing

user...

So what? Show's how badass he is and is satisfied with giving his life to save others.

Not really. It just ruins the moment. Which was already ruined because he was barely developed.