Wally West career

...

Seems more like Ant-Man

I respect how Johns bring Wally back in rebirth even though he likes Barry more, because the fans asked him to.

Is the opposite of what bendis did to us by years

John's said he missed Wally. And probablt you his fav.

>even though he likes Barry more
He's never said this

John's is like Alex Ross. Likes Wally but both don't care about Kyle.

Didio doesn't care about Wally or Bart and Jon.

Wally is going to be PISSED once he remembers his kids. Remember, this is the same guy who liked to freeze people in time as a private hell. Also they should really pair him back up with Linda again, its the Flash couple people liked, and Iris is a boring cunt

>even though he likes Barry more,

No, Johns is a Wallyfag, but WB wants Barry to be the main guy.

The kids are staying gone. Iris is only a cunt because of Dr.M.

If Flash War is about literally anything else I'll be disappointed.

Then why he did bring Barry from the dead and pretty much made him the choosen one of the speedforce or some shit?

Morrison brought him back and DC mandate,

here

He didn't bring Barry back from the dead. But Johns generally tries to work with the tools that he's given and tries to give everyone prominence and some cool moments. His run was supposed to be Flash family vs Zoom family. Some executive thought that sounded too fun and decided to force Flashpoint into being a reboot where they could establish that only Barry would exist and matter.

What is it with you retards? The point is Wally REMEMBERING them, not if they ever come back

Rembering is a problem. Only retard here is you.

Not him, but I think it would be unsatisfying if Wally has to live with that grief. But I don't know, maybe he'd start taking care of NuWally or something as the consolation.

Seems like Wally almost has to become that reliable dad/mentor type to contrast Barry being a shitty flake right now.

>Johns is a Wallyfag
Have you READ Flash: Rebirth? The book is almost completely Barrywank.

Him, Waid and DC in general spent 20 years building Barry up into a saint, what the fuck were they supposed to do when he came back?

Barry was the focus character because it was about his return, but almost everyone got some some good "badass" Johns style moments. The only disrespected good speedsters were Jai (lost his powers and implied to go evil in a future story) and his namesake Jay with the clunky "Barry Allen made me the Flash" line.

So Wally just never recalling his kids, or the hell Zoom put him through, is just alright with you? I'm not saying Wally has to be this depressing fuck from now on, but its the elephant in the room that should be acknowledged at some point

Wally remembering his kids and pulling them out of the speed force > Wally remembering his kids and not getting them back >>>>> never addressing it

It's too interesting a story to never touch on it. I just know I'll be annoyed if actual depression becomes his status quo.

Ross fucking hates Wally, what? He fought with Waid over Wally being in Kingdom Come which is why they made him look like Jay and never refer to his name.

Morrison brought him back technically but he even wrote the situation such that Barry wasn't necessary. Something Johns acknowledges in Flash Rebirth when Thawne tells him as much.

Not bring him back. COIE was an amazing ending for Barry. It's the worst possible middle imaginable.

He painted Wally. The kimgdom come flash is Wally merged with others.

He did Wally in many other works.

Only drawn Kyle once and he said he hated it.

Johns is a company man. If WB/DC says "Do this" he'll do it. But hes not the one who brought Barry back. EVS pushed for it and Morrison did it. It probably wouldn't have happened if Flash's sales weren't in the toilet.

Ross is such a fucking crybaby. He's also a fucking hypocrite since he has zero problem drawing actually shit characters like Whor, Riri, and Miles.

Don't blame the wrong people. The problem is that DC did not listen to them in the first place. Johns and Waid wanted Wally to stay the Flash but DC thought they were smarter and launched Bart's run. Then after Bart failed they still weren't content with just having Wally around so they forced Barry's return as a panic button.

Alex Ross drew him to look like Jay, dude. He wasn't referenced as Wally until AFTER Ross was completely divorced from the Kingdom Come universe. Waid has outright said they had a disagreement on The Flash. Ross wanted Barry, Waid wanted Wally, so they settled on not naming him in the story and making him look like Jay. Exactly like how they had Alan Scott instead of Hal or Kyle.

Ross thinks of Wally as Kid Flash because he's the biggest Silver Age fag around. He never draws Wally. All the Flash based cover work he ever did for DC was Barry (like on the DC Comics Presents or Greatest Stories Ever Told -- both Barry).

To be fair, Kyle is a terrible character with a hideous design. He had dumb reasons, but I don't blame him.

He thinks marvel is ok with new costumes and characters.

Hates most 90s characters and nu52 designs.

The only other story for Flash War I can think of is Wally’s relationship with Linda is fixed and Jay Garrick returns

Yeah but there were some pretty bad retcons, like Barry creating the speed force and that Jay one. I agree with that he shouldn't have come back. Barry's return basically crippled Flash comics from Final Crisis to today. The real solution is to keep the legacy intact by not fucking up Bart so hard. If they had thrown Johns or Waid on pic related rather than making it one of the worst fucking comics I've ever read in my life, we wouldn't be trapped in the Barry status quo we have today.

If I ever work for DC and gain a significant amount of pull I'll let Bart finally run his race

Flash War can be as simple as Wally and Barry disagreeing on how to treat criminals. Barry just said he doesn't believe in giving The Rogues anymore chances which we know is something Wally was really passionate about.

Williamson could've been teasing that recently with the Iron Heights arc where Barry said as much to Kristen.

We know Wally's going to replace Barry for an issue as Central City's guardian so it could also be as simple as Wally thinking he's earned the job and him and Barry disagreeing. Something they could've happened in the old continuity but never materialized.

>Jay Garrick returns
I hope we get a lenticular Flash of Two Worlds cover. I actually have the Flash Comics #1 from The Button framed on my wall.

Johns liked Kyle though, it's why Kyle got to stick around after GL Rebirth instead of getting tossed aside, he was one of the guys now

The weird thing about Bart is he would never want to be THE FLASH. It's why turning him into Kid Flash was so dumb -- Bart's not wrapped up in the family business ideal like Wally was. Bart's a superhero because it's the most fun thing to do with his powers.

Taking on responsibility in the mantle, I don't know how you do that while keeping Bart true to his character. Bart doesn't idolize Wally or Barry, after all. If anything Bart idolizes Max.

I don't have any evidence, but given how involved it seems like he and Waid were at the time in those discussions, I woudl not be surprised if he turned the Bart book down on principle. (Which would also explain why he took the Barry book back even if he didn't love the idea, better to not trust anyone else to write a shitty idea if you think you can make it less painful.)

But again it's just intuition. Never heard anyone say it before.

He's a DC fanboy, he doesn't care what marvel does

I don't think either of these fits the "gets shocking memories from another world" thing the solicits mention, though it wouldn't be the first time solicits lied.

Now this might work though. He could get flashbacks from all the Identity Crisis fallout. But literally rehashing that Johns arc would be shitty and I'd be pissed.

Ic never existed.

The Button proves it existed. It's just not canon to the current timeline. Wally could still get visions from it.

Ross is a DCfag so he'll care more about what's going on there, whereas he's largely apathetic with most of Marvel.

Bart should have his own Flash suit like Wally does now, with a combination of the Dark Flash, Kid Flash, and 90s Waid costumes. It's never made sense to me that they put Bart in a literal copy of Barry's suit. Even Wally made the identity his own after a while, and I think Bart should be able to do the same thing. Just give him the lenses from his Impulse costume, and maybe the lines down the front. You could potentially implement some elements of Max's suit too, but I'm not sure how to do that without it looking cluttered.

He won't see it. And Barry already dismissed at stuff not mattering.

Gotta wait for doomsday clock end.

He only brought Wally back so he could use his return to market his Rebirth book. If he actually cared then Wally wouldn't have been useless for the past year and a half with zero direction.

Yeah this It exists via Hypertime but isn't canon anymore.

Wally agreed with Barry in Identity Crisis. Though that's primarily because the writer was fucking stupid the whole way through.

You might be right, but we'll see. I do think the kids theory is more likely.

He brought Wally back because he loves Wally. He has done it twice now. It's clearly not his choice. He literally had completed Wally stories not published because of WB pettiness, why doubt they're doing it again?

>He only brought Wally back so he could use his return to market his Rebirth book.
?

They didn't advertise Wally's return at all. Johns likes Wally and thought bringing him back was a good way to convey the story he was eventually planning to tell.

Yeah Meltzer is an idiot. In the Flash book he struggled with the revelation.

IdC really should have been an Elseworlds from the start.

Morrison brought him back, not Johns and it was because Didio and the other editors wanted to restore the Silver Age characters.

If Barry wasn't necessary then why bring him back still? They already planned this before Johns touched the character.

They planned it all at the same time. They used it to try to hype up Final Crisis and had Flash Rebirth in the pipe at the exact same time -- which EVS still hilariously still put on delays with an ample head start.

Why bring Barry back? Because DC execs wanted it and The Flash was doing poorly under Wally. Much as I love him Wally wasn't selling and they figured a Barry return might fix it.

Looks like they were right since sales are at a sustaining high.

>It's why turning him into Kid Flash was so dumb -- Bart's not wrapped up in the family business ideal like Wally was.

True, Wally was the true heir of the Flash mantle and the equivalent of Barry's first son, even the tornado twins acknowledged it.

>even the tornado twins acknowledged it.

Don being a cuck in every way is great btw

Don could never compare to Wally and he got mixed with a Thawne so he doesn't deserve the Flash mantle.

while we're on this train of thought

>if Bart's run wasn't shit maybe someone would have acknowledged that the new Captain Boomerang was his brother

still mad this will never play out

Don't you diss Meloni she is a wonderful girl.

Wally was also jealous of them because they were Barry's biological kids and he thought of Barry as his father.

But Barry never met his kids (until Johns retconned it, I think it was Johns).

But Wally should be Barry's heir, Don isn't interesting, and they tried with Bart and no one liked it.

I'd appreciate it more if Abnett didn't completely shit the bed with Titans.

The problem with that hart is that his entire personality was butchered. He was more like barry for no reason. Same with barry now, who's literally wally west with barry's name attached. There's literally nothing about him that represents the original barry allen.

>Wally took the spot of favorite son in Barry's eyes.
>Pahjeet took his twin sister.
>Meloni fucked Captain Boomerang and had his baby.

Abnett doesn't do well with drama or whatever he was trying to do with Titans. He's more into doing giant sci-fi or fantasy stories and building lore. It's why he's good for Aquaman.

>t. Digger

>who's literally wally west with barry's name attached.

I'll never understand why people say this.

Wally has never been portrayed as a fucking loser.

>>Meloni fucked Captain Boomerang and had his baby.

Whose bright idea was that?

I did like Owen Mercer though, at least until Blackest Night. Fuck Johns.

Why do people think Geoff Johns has a thing against Wally?

They act like he didn't do a long ass run on Wally Flash.

Probably because of Flashpoint

That BN plot was really fucking rude and the one thing I'll probably never forgive Johns for. At best I think it was just wanting to use him as the Thawne heir for the speedster war thing, but man. Awful character assassination.

bitter Kylefags trying to start shit in another fandom just because their boy isn't "omg super special" anymore and casuals accepting it blindly without doing research

Yeah, I was loving that character in Outsiders and in Supergirl and I was hoping for him and Bart to meet and their relationship to come out in the open.

I mean Digger didn't want anyone to know who his mother was because he was afraid the Rogues would retaliate and Thawne doing something bad to Owen.

Posting this every day until you believe it.

What is this even saying?

>Flash hasn't been good since he left
>We have to deal with the most boring and bland character in the series with no progression for the next 60 years

The comic industry as we know it won't last 60 years. It'll go the way of OGNs after awhile. The floppy industry is already close to its last legs.

What are you talking about?

Rebirth as a term/idea was originally used by Johns in GL. Everything's been riding that wave of name recognition since.

>The comic industry as we know it won't last 60 years
COMICS ARE ENDING FOREVER, JUST LIKE THE LAST TIME THAT HAPPENED

MARVEL HAS SINGLEHANDEDLY DESTROYES THE INDUSTRY BY PRODUCING BAD COMICS

Bookstore sales are growing, but you're overstating the idea of floppy death coming anytime soon. The mainline audience OGNs alone only make half as much money as the floppies+trade release schedule and they need that guaranteed money to pay creative teams. The only really big potential is the kid market.

It's a shame digital doesn't work. If sales were comparable to floppies there obviously the change would happen quicker because they could just move the floppy sales expectations to the digital market.

I wish the floppy industry went away. $4 an issue is a lot. If single issues were digital only they can charge a lower amount. But we're stuck with digital prices matching physical copies because publishers don't want to piss off comic book shops.

The problem with digital is that it's garbage. The model isn't necessarily bad, but I'll always prefer holding the book in my hands to scrolling down the page. I only get scans because it would be a pain in the ass to get entire runs piecemeal via trades.

BARRY IS SO FUCKING SHIT GET RID OF HIM ALREADY DEE CEE

I'd settle for getting rid of the fucking lines.

NU52 IS OVER

WHY ARE THEY STILL THERE

I don't think it's wholly a LCS issue. I remember seeing someone say that the background costs for digital were comparable to physical.

I hear you, I don't like digital especially with the shady "lol you don't actually own it" nonsense. But you'd think the normies would just go on Amazon and impulse buy some shit. But it just doesn't happen.

I don't even understand what I'm so supposed to be believing here?

Floppies are way more expensive to produce and require a specialty store to properly distribute. Comic stores aren't opening these days, is my point, and the trend is going downwards.

Remember he said SIXTY years. I wouldn't be surprised if it all went online with special orders for floppies or something but if you are really putting all your eggs in a monthly print media then good luck.

Yeah 60 years isn't unrealistic, I was mostly arguing against

>The floppy industry is already close to its last legs.

Flash wasn't good when he came back, either. I swear Wallyfags just have amnesia from 2007-2009 when Wally was still leading that awful book with his awful kids.

You guys complain about Barry being boring but Wally was basically in the same place when they got rid of him. And it's not like he's been good since he came back this time around, either.

Maybe, just maybe, it was the writers and not Wally who made those books good.

Yeah, bad phrasing on my part. I should've said the LCS model is not holding up very well in recent times. But being on Sup Forums brings out the hyperbole in me.

The only reason that run was bad was because Waid can't write kids. The concept was solid and Irey and Jai were decent in other stories (cutest in the Convergence mini).

There's no real concept in Barry existing and... whatever the nothing is they've done with him since the reboot. Barryfags should be just as pissed as Wallyfags at this point given how much he's been wasted and they're supposed to accept it just because it is new material.

Didn't Barry coming back ruin what Waid had laid out to begin with? I remember reading that Waid only did that run because of his friend working on it and how DC screwed him.

happens to the best of us

I've seen people say that on here, but I haven't seen a real source for it. And I'm not sure I really buy it. Giving them messed up powers was stupid and their personalities were obnoxious. These were problems from the start that can't have been related to the plot getting derailed unless he found out before the issues were due that he was just writing filler.

It's funny that both of those things happened on the same day too. It was a good day to be on Sup Forums.

Didio had to be pestered by EVS to let Barry return so he wasn't on board with to be begin with either.

Hypercrisis or some shit, probably.

Bump

The thing is I thought he wrote Wally's kids in a really interesting way in The Kingdom: Kid Flash.

From his recount he said Didio told him to try to write The Incredibles, which is what he tried to do and failed at.

>Wally remembering his kids and not getting them back > Wally remembering his kids and pulling them out of the speed force >>>>> never addressing it

Fixed.

The only reason I disagree with you is that I don't think Iris and Jay could be written decently by Abnett or Williamson.

And because in order to have a decent writer / story, they would need to have their own book (Speedforce) with Wally and maybe Jay Garrick, but DC definitely doesn't want that.

But with Wally just remembering them, you could actually get very interesting development for him, emotionally and psychologically. I'm not even talking depression, maybe a newfound will to move forward with Linda by seeing the possibilities.

Then again, I really doubt DC wants that for Wally as well.

At the moment I have no idea what they are planning to do with Wally, or if they have any plans at all (after Flash War, which IMHO will end up being another Barrywank).

It feels like they want to keep him unimportant, just "there" for Wallyfags to have something and to not completely throw away that Rebirth moment.

The only book I can remember them advertising Wally's return was the end of Titan's hunt but I'm pretty sure that flew above people's heads.