Why is Obamacare so shit...

Why is Obamacare so shit? Please explain it to me because I have no idea what it is or what it replaced or why it is so shit?

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Something something something gibsmedats

forces people who are healthy and don't need health insurance to buy health insurance or get fined, but the health insurance is so expensive nobody is buying it and taking the fines and it just got like 25% more expensive on top of that

Americans are too cucked to have proper universal healthcare so Obama made it was illegal not to buy insurance and this is somehow a compromise

Everybody who was paying before now has double the cost and half the coverage. Everybody who wasn't paying before now has free coverage.

They charge you a fine if you don't have healthcare that's cheaper than actual healthcare.

you either go full privitization of the insurance industry or go single payer

this stop gap bullshit is terrible and literally nobody likes it

Someone correct me if i'm wrong, but it taxes small and medium businesses and uses that money to pay for poor fuck's healthcare. It also cuts into the private sector, obviously.

There's also little regulation enforcing the mandatory healthcare.

It's shit because it has the nigger's name on it.
Not even joking. Republicans hate him. That simple. Had it been called only Affordable Care Act, it'd have been just fine.

> be 25 healthy and fit
> self employed and decent money
> have to pay $300 a month for Healthcare I don't need and coverage beyond anything I'll need
> just so someone can pay $10 a month and work as many hours a week as I do in a day
> when we already had medicare which was free healthcare for the poor

This shit is a tax on the middle class. It's a law passed to make those that take care of themselves pay for the ones that won't.

Note these are 2014 statistics, well into Obamacare.

>be 25
>still qualify under your parents insurance thanks to obamacare

:^)

Shut up retard my premiums are thru the roof with a deductible so high I can't use the insurance unless I get hit by a fucking train. Affordable my ass.

obamacare or rather known formally as the Affordable Care Act

was a piece of legislation that made it soo no insurance provider could neglect an individual or turn them away from getting health insurance if they had preexisting conditions

soudsn good on paper however

with obamacare in place insurance companies now take significantly more risk in covering people because insurance works off the Possibility of someone using it not that people will use it all the time

because of this everyones original plans were revoked and replaced with plans now costing double or triple the original price while also now having a much much higher deductible (go to doctor normally its paid for if u spend 500 bucks or something, now for me its 5000) and now premiums are raising on them as well as the deductible because the insurance providers are defaulting and falling apart because of bankruptcy

so we have the major problem of keeping a failing system thats pissing everyone off and making them poorer but keep people who are dying and will most likely die alive for a bit longer

tl;dr - removed old cheap healthcare that didnt cover AIDS and Cancer patients but now costs exceptionally more and covers those people

This.

Go away, Poo in Loo.

you need to employ like 50 people before that kicks in, but it has also led to a lot of full time jobs being axed because that's one of the requirements before they have to provide you health insurance now

I and like 750 million other europeans enjoying free healthare is rather astonished that US citizens do not get he best healthcare available.

he works for someone so he most likely is under his companies plan

you also have anti pharmaceutical measures from gouging prices not to mention american doctors go through a much much more exhausting system of schooling and we're facing a shortage in doctors set to those standards by about 50% of the original pool

well the fact is that try to force public healthcare in America is a disaster, there healthcare is busisnes, and they don't want more taxes so they don't want that, if you want that u have to pay

>be 3 person family, 2 parents, 1 adult child
>go on website to see prices after huge launch of obongocare
>something like $800/month
>"affordable"
>pay fine

>Why is Obamacare so shit?

It was designed by health insurance companies to extract the maximum possible revenue from the population.

see
Just because you have a free healthcare doesn't mean it is a good thing.

basically because insurance companies only function if they turn a profit, meaning its universal healthcare, but with the extra leg of requiring a bottom line to be met

Because from it's inception, it faced opposition from even congressional democrats. Everything that could have made it work was decimated by lobbyists and Republicans, and it ended up being a largely ineffectual placeholder for what would have been a better system in the future. But now it's gone and it will be replaced by nothing.

in Europe the State is the insurance company, all pay the public healthcare monthly, if u want better u can't stop paying that u have to had both

TL;DR: The standard insurance model is a poor way to pay for healthcare.

Insurance as a model counts on the 'event', in this case having to visit the doctor, as a low risk event. Getting sick, getting injured, or visiting the doctor for a physical are not low risk events. One or more of these are practically guaranteed to occur within a given year.

Also, it is far less expensive for 20-30 year-olds to pay a fine for no medical insurance and then quickly jump on a plan should they get ill, than to continuously maintain their insurance year round. The entire premise of insuring high-risk or pre-existing conditions patients requires those 20-somethings to pay year round to offset the high risk groups costs. Since this is not happening, everyone else who buys their own insurance is picking up the slack.

This has explained things in a way where I understand the majority of people's frustrations with it.

But the act itself put no restrictions on what insurance companies could charge despite restricting them from being able to turn anybody down? And if you don't get any insurance at all they fine you? So if you were on a good plan before, that price increased dramatically and if you no plan before but do now, you can still only afford to have a really shitty insurance plan that doesn't actually cover much?

The average lifespan of a european is like 90 years and increasing every year, very soon we will pass 100 years average lifespan and full vigor until the end.

The average lifespan of a US citizen or a Russion is like in the 70s (US) or 60s Ru.

We are talking to to peoples who is like 200 to 300 years back in european history.

They lived short lives, they were brave but they died young.

it was supposed to create a single payer system in the US that would allow anyone to get insurance at a reasonable price

once the lobbyists finished with it it's now simply a website where you can compare insurance plans from private companies (which are making tidy profits) and you are LEGALLY REQUIRED to buy in, if you don't have insurance from somewhere else.

now those insurance companies are saying they're not making enough money and need to either drastically increase prices or pull out of the market entirely

What happens with the money the government collects in these fines?

Yeah, the fine btw is $780 a person.

if you were on a good plan before, that plan no longer exists and you're paying twice as much for a new plan with half the coverage or less

>have good healthcare
>get dropped like Sup Forums drops games
>try to go back to same company because it was good healthcare
>lowest possible thing is over twice what I was paying
>guess I'm gonna be paying the fine and praying now
still mad

> Just because you have free healthcare doesn't mean it is a good thing.

You're right. Their spending far less of their GDP (in 2010, anyway) for a lower infant mortality rate and more doctors per population than we have makes it a good thing.

Our average lifespan is in the upper 80's, I have no idea wtf you're talking about

Americans enjoy the highest standard of living on planet Earth

I have no idea what point youre trying to prove to me

I said we had a more rigorous schooling system for doctors than Sweden

now if you wanna talk about life expectancy yea, we have tons of mexicans and africans that have shitty genetics that have them die young as well as them killing each other not to mention an obesity epidemic which also lowers our lifespan in comparison

so i dont really see youre point

American logic is hard to follow sometimes.

>Let's fund universal healthcare through taxes!
>No. That is unfree.
>Uh.. okay. Why don't we force everyone to buy health insurance, and if they don't we fine them?
>Yes. This is what freedom looks like.

>american logic
>jew logic
pick one

Offsets healthcare spending in the ACA, Medicare, and Medicaid, according to the government's website.

obamacarefacts.com/questions/where-does-tax-penalty-money-go/

Yeah it's pretty nuts. The NHS is falling apart but I'd still much rather have it than this measure.

It's the Dutch system as well.

Sorry the US average lifespan is 78 ad the Swedish or europesan is 84 years.

> Chief Justice Roberts agrees it's a tax and constitutional
> Roberts is now a Jewish name

It adds a considerable expense to small business owners by compelling them to provide health insurance for their workers. Health Insurance has driven up the cost of healthcare much in the same way student loans have driven up the price of a college education.

its funny, the uk press is constantly whining about how bad nhs is because their corporate bosses what to privatize it and turn it into shit

Why not just get single payer?

Both Russian and US is like in the 70s so an average european lives like:

6-9 years more than an average American
14-17 years more than an average Russian

It makes it extremely expensive to lower income people who could originally afford it.

Also, a god damn nightmare for accountants. No uniform guidelines, irs discrepancies according to a family member who is an accountant

Basically this.

>all taxes paid go into a single fund which gets used to run our economy.
>a single fund

Really?

- Large increase in government spending
- Likely rationing even beyond what we see today
- Corruption and bureaucracy common to federal programs

Whether these are worth the offset for a system that does not appear to resemble a free market at all is up to you though. The math is beyond me.

Its a simple point actually, europe is a much more human and developed country than what you live in.

It caused my already expensive health care plan to fucking *DOUBLE* in price, for NO BENEFIT to myself.

Fuck Obamacare. I'm 27, healthy as fuck and go to the dr. once a year at most. Yet I pay more just to have health care than some fat fuck who goes to the dr. twice a week. My insurance premiums keep going up and my company has to change insurance providers every year to try to keep the costs down. It's nothing but shitty attempt at a socialized program that makes punishes the middle class and makes the healthy financially carry the burdens of the sick.

look up the lifespan of white americans, then get back to me.

cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6335a8.htm

Problem is Americans are unwilling to pay more taxes because who gives a fuck about everybody else. This is especially true for something that was always optional just a few years ago.

It allows insurances companies to have basically a monoploy over certain areas and anyone that doesn't want it gets raped by fines

I just dont like being forced to pay for something i barely use. I actually prefer sub-standard healthcare because I prefer to spend those dollars on other quality of life factors.

Also, i can tell you that having spent my entire career so far (about a decade) in public safety, presently in management, the best way to make something expensive besides granting exclusive patents is to make government funding available for it.

Here are the other ways it's insulting:

>Prohibits charging sick people more in premiums

>Prohibits charging men and women different rates. I pay more in car insurance for being male, yet I have to pay my fair share because womyn's health.

>Requires coverage for shit that some people will never need (a 60 year old woman has to pay for maternity care coverage)

>The goverment provides subsidies (as a tax break) to pay for premiums based on income. The cutoff for subsidies is around $45k.
>Suppose you sign up for subsidies thinking you'll make $44k next year, and end up making $46k. When you do your tax returns, you'll have to pay back all of the subsidies you didn't qualify for. This can be thousands of dollars.
>Of course one can argue it's money you shouldn't have gotten in the first place, if you'd known you wouldn't have qualified for the subsidies, you might have made the decision to opt for the penalty.
>You feel especially stupid paying it back if you end up not using your insurance at all.

if we just let the free market work, healthcare would be available, at reasonable prices, to the vast majority of americans.

But politicians are too tempted to meddle with healthcare in order to win power, that the industry has been corrupted for 100 years, robbing americans of any real experience with a free market system.

you cannot get healthcare until you pay your premium for that year. your premiums are lower when your househould income is at a certain (low) point. but the premiums for middle class families with higher household incomes scale exponentially higher, and that money is given to those under them paying cheap (or sometimes NO) premium so they get healthcare from your money.

if you cant pay the premiums, you have no healthcare. my premium is $7000 dollars every year, and if I don't pay it I get no healthcare for that year, or the next untill i pay access. 7k. every year.

its rediculous. im also stoned as fuck writing this. howd i do

It's a shitty mix between socialized and privatized healthcare. It allows insurance companies to make record profits since people are required to have insurance.
It's a result of the clusterfuck that is US politics (Obama wants socialized healthcare, congress/senate doesn't = obamacare).

>sweden¨
>good health care

That is if you don't die while wating in line.

>Europe
>country

Because nowhere in the Constitution does it say i have to purchase something from a private organization to avoid taxation.

Fuck Obamacare

I wish. When was the last time you walked into a doctors office and they had the 10 most common procedures listed with prices on a chalkboard?

Doctors are quitting.
Nurses are taking over primary care.
Monthly premiums are skyrocketing.
Deductibles of $16,000 per person
Insurance companies are going out of business
Many states only have 1 insurance company left standing.

And there's a fucking PENALTY for NOT buying it.

>>Be you
>>Driving home one night and a drunk nigger smashes into your car and all of you are in the hospital
>>You're now $500,000 in debt from all the treatments because you had no insurance.
>>You declare bankruptcy because there's no fucking way your going to afford that
>>Credit is destroyed, you will never buy a home, a car, or anything again

but that $800 a month that is tax deductible looks good now, don't it?

Very true, and the papers are helping them. We're so fucking cucked here.
I hate Corbyn
I hate the tories
I hate UKIP and farage
if only we had a viable centre left party I'd go for it, but right now... it's shit.

Obamacare forced everyone to buy insurance or pay a fine, so health insurance companies and health care providers are now free to jack up the prices of everything because they know people have to pay for it

>Insurance companies are going out of business

I'm reading stuff and this seems to be coming up a lot.

Understandable coming from a Kiwi. Allow me to explain why the USA was stupid for letting Democrats ever introduce this flaming piece of shit legislature.

The ACA came to be before we could introduce and put in place a little thing called tort reform. Yes, in the USA, you can be sued for causing someone emotional trauma. Punitive damages can carry arbitrary amounts, and be rewarded astronomical payouts. Just ask the chick that sued McDonald's for the coffee burn on her lap.

Here's the worse part. 3 separate occasions, Supreme Court Justice Roberts (a "conservative", btw) asked the proponents of ACA whether the penalty portion of the individual mandate (whereas, you get FINED if you fail to buy insurance) was a tax, or just a fine. The first 2 times, he said "a fine". The last time he asked, the proponent very begrudgingly said "Yes, it's a tax".

The reason the fucking thing passed isn't because our constitution was flawed in the sense that we could MANDATE EVERY CITIZEN BUY SOMETHING THEY MAY NOT NEED. It passed because IT IS WITHIN CONGRESS' CONSTITUTIONAL AUTHORITY TO INTRODUCE NEW TAXES ON THE PEOPLE.

ACA = a TAX that is proxied by insurance companies.

Now you know why it is shit, and nobody wanted it to start with, and why a single payer system will not work in the US (until after a thoughtful tort reform is introduced and passed).

It's hard to stay in business when you have to take a guy's $198 per month for 2 months and then pay for his quadruple heart bypass.

protip: those people now covered that have preexisting conditions are nowhere near enough to justify the enormous price inflation on health insurance. The only reason prices spiked after the ACA is because insurance companies are literal crooks and look for any excuse at all to steal money from people.

In a superior system we would just fund each other through our taxes and would lynch/behead all those who used to work at high levels in insurance companies

:)

It's not American logic; it's Obama logic.

You poor souls.

(and yes, this is a real anecdote.)

The reason it's failing is because the healthy young people aren't dumb enough to buy health insurance they don't need. And the penalty is far cheaper than the insurance.

Especially when you have to shell out $16,000 of your own money before they pick up 1 cent.

In a superior system, we would all voluntarily join social clubs like the Kiwis, Rotary Club, Moose Lodge, Elk Lodge, Masons, and Churches that all pooled their money and paid for their member's care, with bonuses for having a doctor in your group.

Like we used to do here.

>Why is Obamacare so shit?
Because it tries to be universal outside either a proper market system or full communist state system.

Why can't America just copy the NHS?
>tfw crooked tory bastards are trying to destroy one of this country's best institutions.