Voltron: Legendary Defender

What's her endgame, Sup Forums? She's helping Lotor in secret and wants to get all up in Oriande, but for what purpose? Is she trying to pull a Nox?

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So she can take it all back! TIME TRAVEL!

Because Lotor is still her little purplish bundle of joy and the motherly love is the most powerful force in the universe.

BACK TO THE PAST

>What's her endgame, Sup Forums?
She'll resurrect Zarkon and become top waifu of this show

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What exactly did the quintessence do to her? I never really understood that part? Basically magic cocaine?

Who will win Keithbowl?

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When are we gonna get a Team Voltron/Lotor/BoM orgy?

To be in that room and smell all of those disgustingly delicious smells...

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It seemed to corrupt her (already kind of obsessive) personality to the point it was all she could think of or care about. Post-rift fuckery it completely fucked her memory time, until all she really had was the quintessence research obsession and slavish devotion to Zarkon.

*over time. She gave birth to Lotor and then completely forgot he was her son or that she was even married to Zarkon.

>When are we gonna get a Team Voltron/Lotor/BoM orgy?
>Lotor
I want team Haggar or Sendak instead of him.

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So it amplified her OCD, fucked up her memory and made herself to be Zarkon's bitch?
I'm only up to EP3 of the current season and it appears like she wants to do something with Lotor again.

Supposedly it wrecked her health before turning her into a quintessence vampire, but the coat hanger/loss theory being very close to confirmed has muddled that a bit

>coat hanger/loss theory

What.

They all forgot about Keith

no one, game was called due to lack of interest

Honerva will disappear when she marries Zarkon!

Seems to meZarkon became her bitch. She's the one who started the research and pushed it into dangerous territory. Zarkon only became obsessed after she was waist deep in it, and then he an hero'd to save her and they both rezzed as quintessence obsessed vampires. Zarkon was the face of the empire but it's Haggar that made it what it is. And now that he's gone she seems to be doing her best to maintain the status quo. I don't think she can even stay alive without dat sweet sweet life juice

Something like that. Zarkon on the other hand was still corrupted but remembered everything, probably due to his insane willpower. The same reason he still had a strong connection to Black despite being separated from it for ten thousand years.

He was utterly devoted to Honerva before the rift incident went down, but after that the script was flipped and she was basically his dog. She still did a lot of the heavily lifting with the Robeasts, Komar project, etc. but it was all for Zarkon.

Repeated failed pregnancies may be what degenerated her health, and that may be what pushed her into quintessence obsession, ultimately resulting in Lotor

Its a weird one since she was pregnant before she was revived it seems. So I wonder how she ever saw Lotor.

Did she have a bit of time before it all really took hold.

Or did she just watch Lotor grow up through surrogate puppets.

i really hate this theory, it makes Honerva's obsessive quest for power all about MUH BABY instead, and totally ignores that she was heavily into the "scientist who will go too far for science" role before even meeting Zarkon.

And what did Zarkon want? To get more quintessence for Haggar's experiments. He'd listen to her over all his other advisors. The only time he went against her were in the issues of his galrautism over the black lion and over his hatred of their son because he sees it as Lotor's fault they're like this. He called the shots but they were both reaching for her goals.

I wonder if her calling out Lotor was to push him over the top and succeed and her bringing another was just to further that push.

She'll be interested to be sure to see were her quest goes. Maybe she wants to restore herself. Get Space Detoxed.

I think the memory loss was actually just because they're 10,000 fucking years old. The brain can't even hold a century of memories; they've just forgotten everything outside their quintessence obsession

A bunch of galra soldiers after he is captured and mindbroken into a cum addicted whore who cries himself to sleep moaning for Shiro.

>"scientist who will go too far for science" role before even meeting Zarkon
Did she even have any scenes before meeting Zarkon?

Remember that Zarkon knew about their past together but never told Haggar once it was clear she had forgotten, so he knew for certain that she was going to be the most loyal of his minions. He still had no problem shitting all over her when she did something he didn't like even if it was reasonable, (like calling in Lotor when Zarkon was in a coma). No doubt that if she had ever shown signs of rebellion while he was alive, he would have gotten rid of her as easily as he did any of his other commanders that crossed the line.
He only "respected" Haggar in that she was his most powerful and reliable tool.

her first scene is Alfor introducing the two of them and Zarkon dropping his spaghetti, and in that one she still comes across as an obsessive scientist type. it's true that her obsession coincides with her relationship with Zarkon, but all those traits are present in her character before they get together.

He HATES Lotor with the full fury of his galrautism. Of course he'd shit on her for bringing him in no matter how reasonable it would seem. I don't think that's a good indicator of how he views her in general. I would argue hekept her around for more than practical reasons, but there's really nothing but his past self to suggest that. The staff suggested he still felt some little emotion in the same moment they said he still remembers, so there's that.

in other words Honerva would have still been doing insane dark science shit if she had never married Zarkon, she just wouldn't have had the full backing of the Galra leader and his empire by extension.

I don't think the loss theory denies that, just integrates it into her MUH BABY motivation

Right, and where did Lotor come from? And yes the staff did say he might have felt some kind of fondness for her, but in the very same interview they point out he did nothing to re-establish that as well as kept her in the dark, and then they call him a true villain. At that point Haggar was more like a very useful pet than a person he felt any respect for.

and that's why I don't like it, it really only serves to dilute her motivations with mommyshit and undercuts an otherwise interesting arc. especially now that we see her remembering Lotor and maybe starting to experience those motherly emotions that she had forgotten/was too fucked up and obsessed to really experience. it's a shitty cliche that the flashback episode gives zero indication of in any case, people just want to tack it on because mom characters have to boil down to being moms in all aspects for them.

Because he's insane and feels no drive towards romance or affection. This doesn't suggest he doesn't respect her or views her in the same light as a pet, it suggests he has a single minded focus on his objective to the expense of all else, even if some small part of him is strangely satisfied by just having her around.

Eh, to each their own. Where you see dilution I see "multifaceted". People can have more than one trait.

>Remember that Zarkon knew about their past together but never told Haggar once it was clear she had forgotten, so he knew for certain that she was going to be the most loyal of his minions.
Wait, why would her not remembering he literally died for her insure her loyalty? You'd think the knowledge of all they did for each other would make her more loyal if anything. Her brain being scrambled eggs would make her motivations foggy and unreliable. She might even turn against him for no reason he'd ever know.

in both cases she has both traits, because like I said Haggar is now clearly struggling with her emotions w/r/t Lotor. it's just that in one the mommy stuff is part of her primary motivation and plays into really tired out hysterical mommy tropes. it's way more interesting if she is only discovering these feelings now and starting to understand what her obsession cost her.
I feel the exact same way about the "theory" that keeps popping about Lance not having a dad because he didn't mention him, when his brain-window clearly shows us his father. the reasonable conclusion, if you INSIST on reading more deeply into that moment, is that he's a softie/momma's boy, but instead people want to make the most boring take and turn it all into muh langst. fyi I'm not really trying to shit on you specifically here user, I just sperg out when people insist on taking the most boring read on things

I think you misunderstood what I meant user, I'm saying that Zarkon had the knowledge that she was an incredibly loyal person because of their past and thus knew for sure that he could trust her more than his other Galra commanders, who he couldn't have as deep an insight into. Haggar might have lost the understanding of her real motivations regarding Zarkon, but she was still clearly acting on them and he took advantage of that. Or that's my read on it, anyway.

2bh I think the biggest strike against the idea that Zarkon still felt any genuine love or caring for Haggar is his intense hatred of all things Altean. He talks about how hype he is to kill Allura and wipe them from the face of the universe in front of her, he constantly maligns Lotor's "tainted" blood and calls him his biggest mistake, etc. It's like he wants to erase everything related to their previous relationship so he can finally forget the shameful memory of ever loving her.

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>He HATES Lotor with the full fury of his galrautism
It was so beautiful

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But if he also knows she doesn't remember, he can't be certain what she's acting on. She could feign loyalty but be plotting to replace him with Lotor or Sendak behind his back and he'd have no assurance other cause her head is full of fuck. If she remembered he could at least trust she'd favor him for more reasons than "well I've always obeyed him". I just don't see what he has to gain by keeping her in the dark. I can only imagine he did so because his head is also full of fuck

He hates all things altean because alfor blew up his planet, an act he was far too insane to realize was neccessary. His entire life since zombifying has been flying from one autistic sperg out to the next. He's crazy.

That's why I said he trusted her more, I don't think he actually trusted her completely. I believe that if she had stepped out of line even after thousands of years of loyalty, he would have had no problem killing the shit out of her. Reminding her that they were married might have made her think too highly of herself and cause her to presume too much of her station, in his eyes; remember that Zarkon wanted absolute submission and would fuck his own commanders up for being TOO ambitious.

Lotor was born after Diabazaal was destroyed and he sees him as a personal failure, yes he's insane but there are multiple facets to his hatred of Alteans. Lotor is living proof that he was once a caring person capable of love instead of the stone cold embodiment of a powerful conqueror.

You know in most cultures wives are specifically the only people a man is supposed to expect submission from

So the red marks probably are a "mutated" version of her Altean markings? Neat.

Which doesn't have much of anything to do with Voltron: Legendary Defender, where the producers specifically set about building a universe where a lot of "less progressive" social aspects of society are not present. They even deliberately changed their mind on having Zarkon be overtly patriarchal, and deliberately gave him more female high-ranking commanders later on.

Maybe he just hates Lotor cause he's a dandy little shit instead of a burn maim kill conqueror like Daddy. It could indeed just be a personal problem he has with the kid unrelated to his wife or altean. I mean he did insist the kid be saved even after his rezzing

I got the strong impression Honerva was wearing the pants in their pre-rift relationship desu

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I figured her whole mutation was that altean shapechanging trick gone haywire

He hates Lotor for all those reasons. And I think the post-rift thing was more of a slow decline over the millenia, since Haggar gave birth afterwards but eventually forgot. Zarkon still had the memories but his emotions are what faded away instead.

>Can't even give bad guy societies less progressive ideals
Man, world builders these days are so boring. What's even the point if everyone's the same?

that stuff is low hanging fruit though, everyone cringed at the Korra comics when they pulled the "the fire nation was progressive until the mega meanie Sozen banned same sex marriage" shit. I'm glad they're not pushing too hard on Galra discrimination against half-breeds for the same reason, that shit is overplayed

They cringed because it was retroactive and included dialogue like "sozin was the worst!". There was no problem conceptually, just little effort involved. Neither way is the answer.

>retroactive
i don't even see this as a negative since sexuality and attitudes toward it weren't even touched on in the original material, so it just kinda falls under additional lore. I can see where you're coming from though, I'm just of the opinion that depriving creators of that low-hanging fruit forces them to get more creative in how they present things. whether they actually do that or not though, ehhh

And you could get creative with the low hanging fruit too. "Sozin promoted large families to fuel the war effort with soldiers, and consequientially placed a stigma on homosexuality". You could even apply it to all cultures across that era and point out it wasn't just bad people doing it out of hate, but everyone doing out of societal pressure. There, now it's not just bullshit to make the bad guy badder.

Oh wow, Shiro went from best boy to worst boy real quick this season. I just find his personality to be quite annoying even though he's not entirely himself.
So what is he really, a clone? Is the original held captive somewhere?
Haven't watched the full season but I don't mind spoilers.

that would be an interesting take for sure, though I don't really expect a saturday-morning type show to go that deep over motivations for prejudices. are there any examples of it actually happening? it sounds like a topic too spicie for most execs to want to touch.

>Oh wow, Shiro went from best boy to worst boy real quick this season.
But user, the opposite is true.

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>He doesn't like scrambled eggs Shiro
Worst taste

I vote for Sendak over Haggar. I... I think we have enough "elderly" bussy/pussy in the mix...

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Shiro is still one of the best

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I mean, people are gonna fuck... So, I think that would really hard to enforce with everyone spread out and stationed so far away from their homeworlds.

I get why they aren't super hyped about "halfbreed" people (mainly because they were a socially stratified society prior to the whole Q-energy race) and it doesn't help that Zarkon is screaming about how much he hates his own mixed child but I am sure the normal, lower class Galra don't give two shits. They want families and children too.

"expecting" and actually doing that are totally different things... and really do not happen unless reinforced with violence.

why? No one told Zarkon to fuck his wife raw and nut into her Altean uterus/egg sack/whatever. That's like the ONE THING you can't really get mad at your child about.

Waiting for more Krolia and the eventual relationship-repair/bonding episode with her and Keith.

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Zarkon was mad at Lotor that he, if Lotor's telling the truth, became all friendly as fuck with a race whose planet the former gave to the latter instead of brutally sucking the quintessence out of it (Lotor instead befriended them, co-opped with them and harvested enough of it so that the extraction/recovery ratio would be balanced).

For that he exiled Lotor (for not blowing the planet and its inhabitants) and blew the planet either way. Also he hated Alteans after Alfor blew up his home planet (due to that scary quintessence dimensional fuckery that couldn't be controlled, so Alfor was justified here) and because his post-resurrection self regarded them as weaklings in many ways, so he had extra hate for Lotor.

Right but that's not the point I made... which is Zarkon can get mad at him FOR not doing as he was told/order to but not for being born... Lotor - like everyone else - did not ask to be conceived/born and Zarkon made it clear that he hated that him for both... which are purely Haggar and Zarkon's fault.

And you can't hate him for being Altean when you fucked an Altean woman and her people blew up your already dying planet (after kindly evacuating everyone and helping you find a new homeworld) after the fact that you married her, fucked her, and knocked her up.

But to be fair, Zarkon and Haggar are fucked up and cray cray so...

Assuming the Polluxians will be introduced sometime in the future, what are your hopes and expectations for them, Sup Forums? Is it possible they will be introduced as antagonists who refuse to ally with the Galra empire, and want to continue the war because of their Altean heritage? Why haven't we gotten any hints about their existence yet, when the show is usually pretty liberal with dropping plot breadcrumbs early on?

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>Oh wow, Shiro went from best boy to worst boy real quick this season.
This is a masterplan to make us hate Shiro so that they can finally get rid of him.

>But to be fair, Zarkon and Haggar are fucked up and cray cray so...
i mean this is the fucking point right here. of COURSE Zarkon can have unreasonable hatred for Lotor. he was insane and inherently unreasonable.

>I vote for Sendak over Haggar
But team Haggar have cute generals

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At this point Zarkon was not the adorable Emperor who did stuff for the sake of his people and still fought for goodness like in the flashback of S3.

The Zarkon that exiled and hates Lotor is a malevolent shadow of his former self that was corrupted by the evil entity from that quintessence dimension. Also he's clearly a crazy dude due to quintessence overdose.

Well in S1 it was mentioned that ONE ship from Altea managed to GET THE HELL OUT OF DODGE when Zarkon was steamrolling them. Maybe later seasons will show it. For now they are a secret.

>Narti is dead
A WASTE OF A PROMISING CHARACTER

People have incredibly strong beliefs about all kinds of things for stupid, illogical reasons all the time user. That's like, a basic part of the human condition. Our emotions can be as big a part of our motivations as anything else.

Shiro will always be the best boy. Kuron, on the other hand--whether an implanted personality or a clone-- is a bad rotten boy, but he's very handsome so i'll allow it.

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t.Coran

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Swordmaster Keith training his new idiot apprentice episode when?

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keith uses a faggy little katar, Lotor will train him instead as he has deep knowledge of Altean culture and a true appreciation for the broadsword of an Altean knight, which is made of space-steel that has been folded over ten thousand times.

Never cause Keith's weapon isn't actually a sword.

I don't think it should be all about that, but something like that pushing her over the edge she was already teetering on does make sense.

The character designers were just trying to draw something new that hadn't been seen before, so they gave Keith's a retarded weapon, but it is and has always been a sword in the word's broadest sense.
Arguing that it's an elongated push dagger or something similar is just being pedantic.

>Gets flaws and makes mistakes
>WORST BOY NOW
I hate fans sometimes

Zarkon can hate him for that when any semblance of rationality and love has been destroyed. It's not rational because the whole point is he's corrupted beyond repair. Something Haggar seems to be having an arc to break out of. You know, before she bites it.

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I have always thought that the Alteans capable of shape shifting had used this ability to hide themselves among the populations of other planets and forming a diaspora. After a certain amount of centuries, they will have begun to gather in a remote planet Pollux. I would not mind at all if they will be introduced as antagonists who refuse to ally with the Galra and with Allura.

it would still have a completely different fighting style than a broadsword, user. I think that's the main point, Keith's particular expertise would be useless for Lance.

>Ulaz
Damn I miss him along with alt!Slav and Sven.

>Krolia and McCree
I honestly want to see them how they ended up with each other. Especially what made Krolia appear on Earth. Accident or mission given by Kolivan to her? And if the latter, then what was the mission?

How did McCree even managed to attract someone that is essentially an alien purple-skinned space ninja amazon babe that is taller than him? Let alone have a kid with her.

Actually I think it's more like a combination of both sword and katar. It's actually closer to a sword, but the way it's wielded is that of how a katar is wielded. It's actually strange.

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>Keith
>training anyone
This nigga don't even know how chants work

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Of course but again that was not the point I made. I totally acknowledge Zaggar is cray cray bananas for hating their only child over things he did not do/could control.

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Ok... Team Haggar but NO Haggar. I would rather have.... Shay's grandma or Ryner. I want some old lady alien pussy diversity, please.

Which current characters would make the strongest fusion

The autism is strong here.

I don't get your point at all then, because you were saying he couldn't hate Lotor for X reason when clearly he does. If you're just trying to say Zarkon is being unreasonable then duh, there's nothing to argue about there.

This was actually proven by a /vld/-user.

youtube.com/watch?v=dNboQGH79ME

>noting that two characters are using different weapons is autistic
MERELY PRETENDING

I am not arguing... I just wanted to make my point clear...

My theory is that she was scouring planets in search of the Blue lion.

>commenting because what's obviously supposed to be a sword doesn't live up to the exacting standards of neckbeard experts
>not autistic