Alright lads, let's take a look at some numbers.
In my city:
>A full-time minimum wage earner clears $1500/month
>A room with heat, light, cable, internet included: $500/month
>$200/month for groceries (a princely amount for a single person)
>Cell phone: $40/month
>Bus pass: $70/month
That leaves $690/month, or $172.5/week, as disposable income. Can someone explain to me how this is not a "living wage?"
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Different cities, different living costs.
Dingus.
Jordans are $300+ a month. That's why.
>$1500 a month
That's how my studio apartment rent costs every month.
>A fucking leaf
Figures.
You could live and work outside the city for much cheaper
>A room with heat, light, cable, internet included: $500/month
Where the fuck is that?
I lived in a student apartment that had all that for $384/month
Of course, I had 3 roommates, but it beat the piss out of living in dorms.
What fucking apartment costs 500?
>$500 a month rent
In leaf land maybe but not in the real world
My province also has the second-lowest minimum wage, but these costs don't really change much throughout the country. Unless you live in the far north, but if you dont have a good job you have no business living up there in the first place.
car insurance, health insurance, cell phone bill, wow subscription, etc etc etc
shit adds up you dumb nigger
A shared apartment with roommates.
Nah dude I live in good old QC. Point is, places like New York have very high living expenses, so the psychology degree morons who work at Tim Hortons can't even begin to approach that required income.
The issue is that people who have no business living in a high-cost city are living in cities.
You left out:
Health insurance ~$70-$120 a month, maybe even more depending on health.
Retirement saving, should be 10% of income bare minimum. $150 a month.
Transportation? Bus/Metro $5~$10 per diem. Car insurance minimum $100 a month. So thats $100-$300 a month.
And you're broke at this point with no disposable income.
I cant comment on health insurance because we don't need that shit in Leafland, but with $690/month in disposable income you can easily afford basic public liability car insurance, which is about $150/month.
single people can generally live on minimum wage, but you can't support others.
That's why you should get a real job.
Also, the main problem where I live is rent. Freaking expensive
>A room with heat, light, cable, internet included: $500/month
You want to live with other people? I smell underage here.
you didnt account for the cost of an ounce of weed a week, donations to poorer countries, the price of gluten free and "healthier option microwave ready to eat in 2 minutes" foodstuffs, they dont buy tampons or birth control though so thats a plus, welfare taxes to make sure gerome doesnt starve and Canada's daily tribute of money and white women to their islam overlords. Also they gotta double time all this because your PM whos previous jobs were drama teacher and snowboarding professional is crying that trump got in and now he cant just lean on the US for support in every facet of life.
Most minimum wage workers are young. As you get older you get better job.
>bus pass
Also, rooms cost more than that in some areas and you're forgetting that US has to pay for medical.
No one wants to live with other people you knob, but you don't have a God-given right to your own place either.
>>A room with heat, light, cable, internet included: $500/month
lies
>>Cell phone: $40/month
debatable
a one bedroom apartment in the ghetto where i live is 900 minimum and that's unfurnished and not including cable or internet
I live in a 1 bedroom apartment for 400 a month. with electricity and internet its about 500 a month. they key is to not live in a city.
With minimal education, skills, training, experience, or credentials of any kind you should expect nothing more than a MINIMUM wage. The clue is in the name. Also, if you're a guy who is single in his 20's, there's no reason you shouldn't have a roommate or two regardless of the money you're making.
That's expensive insurance. Mine is $40 a month and I had a DUI.
>LOOK MOM I'M DEFENDING THE RICH!
The right needs erased as a political wing. Fucking seriously.
>not living with your folks until you can afford to buy a modest home.
I pay €360, studio, incl heat electr. Use of washing machines.
>LOOK MOM! I VOTED FOR HILLARY "Goldman Sachs" CLINTON!! OK I'LL SEE U LATER I'M OFF TO MY OCCUPY WALL STREET RALLY!!!"
>a fucking leaf
Openings. That is my only argument. The better job is not available to everyone and the technology for robots to take our orders has not been perfected. Until then, everyone deserves a living wage.
>$500/month
Here, a good neighborhood will run you a grand. Guess where you'll find cheaper.
No I did not. Republicans and democrats are the same plutocrat-owned filth. There isn't a party in this country that represents the, you know, actual fucking citizens.
>That's why you should get a real job.
All Jobs Matter
> $500/month
Maybe for a rusted out U-Haul trailer or a hand-me-down RV that's been paid for.
Apartment rent is a _minimum_ of $1500/month for a literal hole in the wall (around here, anyway).
If you are rooming with non-family, you are going to go nuts. If you are living in an apartment with less than 800sqft, you will eventually develop cabin fever (or it will manifest itself as various behavioral disorders).
At that $500/month, the conditions are comparable to living in a prison cell.
Source: Me. Left crappyfornia and never looking back.
Seriously though. How is this debatable? People have to work three jobs and get food stamps to pay their utilities and THEY'RE the problem? What the fuck happened to politics in this country? Can a person literally spread ANYTHING as propaganda and millions will not only believe it, but fight with their very lives for it?
>>A full-time minimum wage earner clears $1500/month
so like 12 bucks an hour?
>200 dollars a week for groceries
thats 50 dollars a week or about 7 dollars a day, not terrible but it can be less
>tell me this isn't a living wage
because your rent isn't even standardized, you just made up a number based on your own anecdotes or feelings. It isn't stratified against real circumstances.
Your calculation also doesn't include the cost of other necessities including clothes, toiletries, car (if any), car insurance, health insurances, taxes (remember 1500/month is definitely NOT after tax), reciprocal costs such as emergency costs whether you need something replaced, something new or any reason really. It also doesn't include any deductions from the wage that include retirement, or other extra deductions outside of taxes which include HSA's or health insurance, any life insurance policies, 401k's etc
Your numbers are such a fantasy that you actively refuse to observe phenomena where savings IS possible but then it is inadvertently wiped out with one of these emergencies. Its not unheard of for an entire years of savings to be wiped out with one issue of any kind.
>"""living"""" in a flyover state
Because people are susceptible to confirmation biases and cognitive dissonance.
For example, people lost their shit when the Rolling Stone Magazine lied in an interview saying how one kid was apparently a rapist even though it was later proven that the rape didn't even happen. People doxx'd, threatened and smothered the suspected rapist with death threats beyond your wildest dreams all because some retarded people read a magazine article and believed it blindly
Leave the fucking city. I thought 650 was highway robbery
>A room with heat, light, cable, internet included: $500/month
What hole-in-the-wall town do you live in?
because that doesn't let them move up the social ladder since one semester is around 5k in schooling
But cities are where the jobs are at. In a small town, there aren't nearly as many opportunities.
>Alright lads, let's take a look at some numbers.
>In my city:
>>A full-time minimum wage earner clears $1500/month
>>A room with heat, light, cable, internet included: $500/month
Hah, in your dreams. I've lived in LA, NYC, and Tokyo but that won't even pay the rent for a shoebox. Let alone utilities and internet.
What backward city do you live in? cheap rent in Ottawa is 800-900 dollars for a one bedroom >_> and well over 1000 for 2 bedrooms so yeah good luck living off minimum wage. oh and hydro is not included
Very few of those jobs are in areas witg such prices, ergo OP has trouble with the chasm between simplistic calculations and reality, to say the least.
>full-time minimum wage earner
NO SUCH THING
>because your rent isn't even standardized, you just made up a number based on your own anecdotes or feelings. It isn't stratified against real circumstances.
I own a rooming house for university students. $500/month, including utilities, is what I charge, and I know it is about what other landlords charge in my area because I keep an eye on my competition.
>Your calculation also doesn't include the cost of other necessities including clothes, toiletries
I would include that in a $200/month grocery budget. My apologies if I was not specific enough for you, but keep in mind that my calculations include a healthy amount left over as disposable income.
> car, car insurance
This is not a necessity, but people can and do afford this on minimum wage. Remember, $690/month disposable income, which goes up to 730 if you don't need a bus pass.
>1500/month is definitely NOT after tax
Yes it is, based on the minimum wage and income tax rates in my province. Minimum wage earners also get their income tax back in a lump sum as an annual rebate, but I guess it's too much to expect them to save that and budget it out through the year instead of blowing it on one weekend out on the town.
No one who gets minimum wage gets full time either unless you work two jobs to make "full-time"
The question is:
Should someone flipping burgers be paid the same (or more than the current rate) of welders or roofers or other jobs that require skill and are substantially more hazardous?
If someone atn mcburgertown is making $8 an hour right now.
Some welder is making $12 an hour.
If minimum wage is raised to $15 an hour- then why would someone sacrifice their health with toxic fumes and heavy lifting by being a welder when they can just flip burgers for the same pay?
I'm living it right now. I'm a young, single man with no wife, no kids, no alimony. I have a single room in a house with roommates. I live in a medium-size town, not a happening metropolis. I make ~$1000 a month and pay $400 in rent (a little high, honestly, but I like living closer to downtown).
The way this is not sustainable is if you're living in the big city trying to make it big, or if you were stupid enough to have children when you couldn't afford it, or if you have high medical costs because you never put the time and energy into getting promotions or going to school.
If you're either too dumb, too lazy, or even just plain unlucky enough to never advance, then that's the breaks.
If you can't afford a family, that's too bad. Reproduction is a privilege, not a right, and it should be a privilege afforded to those intelligent enough to make enough money to afford it.
Nigger $1500 alone is a studio in my city.
You can find studios in Tokyo for 1k a month.
>500/month rent
>200/month food
Lmao where did you find this deal hungry skellington
One would assume that the welding company would increase wages to stop workers from going to flip burgers, or you could just be retarded and let your workers leave to flip burgers.
> I've lived in LA, NYC, and Tokyo
If you live a bit outside of huge expensive cities, rent decreases drastically. Also, less noise, pollution, more pleasant people. Major cities fucking suck to live in if you're not at the very least upper middle class.
And now you have welding company's closing down because they can't compete with Chinese and Taiwanese labor costs.
Jack-in-the-box started a self ordering kiosk trial 5 years ago. It was succscessful and approved for use nation wide.
Current work is being done to use automate robots from auto manufacturing to make fast food orders.
These can also be used in retail stores- simply use the stores app on your phone to select an item and a robot arm in the back grabs it off the shelf like a friggin red box DVD and it comes out on a conveyor.
Raising minimum wage will end jobs.
Put tariffs on international goods, make it so its cheaper to use American labor.
It won't stop the automation, which may be inevitable anyways.
Either way, minimum wage jobs will be a small portion of what they are today.
>Health insurance ~$70-$120 a month, maybe even more depending on health.
young people dont need health insurance
>Retirement saving, should be 10% of income bare minimum. $150 a month.
wait until you get a better job
>Transportation? Bus/Metro $5~$10 per diem. Car insurance minimum $100 a month. So thats $100-$300 a month.
OP listed bus pass
Did you miss the fact that you're fined if you don't have a qualifying health plan in the U.S. now thanks to obongo?
the fine is not $70 a month
Maybe it's different in Canada, but here, costs vary a lot. In New York City, shitty, dangerous apartments can go for 2,000 a month, but on the other side of the same state, you can get a decent place for 500 a month.
99.9% of America?
Basically anywhere except New York (middle of city) and middle of Seattle or los angles.
and in that case; live 3 miles away and the prices drop that far.
Only after certain threshold, I don't remember what it is, but I remember thinking I could work 60 hours a week in a state with the second highest minimum wage in the nation and still not have to pay the fine.
well of course automation is the future but that doesn't mean we should be shooting our min.wage workers in the foot while supporting country's that refuse to pay workers a living wage.
>200/month for groceries
>FLAG
Either you live somewhere in bumfuck Sasketchewan, or you're forgetting that this is fucking Canada and that food costs fucking rape the living fuck out of your wallet
Maybe it's cause I eat a lot (Gym every day, bulking) but $200 a month for groceries is fucking Auschwitz unless you're a 140lb skeleton and eat 3 tiny meals with no snacks in between
As long as you make
Also where the fuck can you live for $500 a month? Again not everyone lives in small towns in the middle of bumfuck farms and forests in the prairies
People conflate wants and needs. They need to eat and want a $600 iPhone, but to them, they need them both equally. So, buy the phone and get food stamps.
>Gym every day, bulking
Well there's your answer. I don't spend much more than that on groceries and I'm a big guy who likes to eat well. When I was in school and broke I could get by on much less. It's a myth that you cant eat well on a small budget.
> living in a big city because of the "big city is trendy xdd"
Fly over states are the best, low cost of living compared to Jew york, Jew Jersey, Commiefornia, also we can actually conceal carry and gun rights are honored.
But enjoy paying more
reporting. NC here.
I actually live in North Carolina, and about 7 miles outside of the city of Greensboro(population approximately 250,000)
500 for all that? Where the fuck do you live?
>DUI
Degenerate go back to /soc/
>I own a rooming house for university students. $500/month, including utilities, is what I charge, and I know it is about what other landlords charge in my area because I keep an eye on my competition.
So its a university subsidized housing near a college campus. Great, not only is your anecdote anecdotal but its also college students who are barely working while going to school full time.
>690 dispossable income
assuming this number is still valid in your clearly skewed bias
>yes it is because I said it is
You're still projecting your magical assumption of your college town housing subsidy paired with kids who apparently go to school full time and work 40 hours a week full time.
Again you didn't even address the point of unforeseen circumstances of things that need to be paid for that easily wipe out meager savings. You're just projecting your situation onto the lives of everyone else and assuming it fits regardless of situations you ignore
Stfu dingus
Im 3 and a half hours from the beach and 3 hours from the mountains, my place is about 6 miles from I-40/I-85. Feels fucking good man!
The same arguments used for why the minimum wage should be increased can be applied in the same way with the same logic to why we should give everyone everything for free for no reason.
If you're stupid and shitty then you get a shitty job for stupid people and then you either stop being a shitty stupid moron and get a better job or you die.
Sure i do, i have an IQ above room temp.
Where in fuck is rent 500 a month with everything included? and who only eats 200 dollars worth of groceries a month. What are you a fucking bird?
For all you retards- think about this.
>burger at mcburgertown
Someone made you that burger when you ordered it, however-
>someone delivered the meat patty's, buns, lettuce, tomatoes etc to that restaurant.
>someone packed each of those items.
>someone made the buns
>someone milled the flour to make the dough for the buns
>someone delivered the flour to the bakery.
>someone packed that flour after it was ground from wheat.
>someone grew and harvested the wheat for the flower.
>someone delivered the wheat to the mill.
>someone made the fertilizer for the wheat crops.
>someone packaged that fertilizer.
>someone delivered that fertilizer.
>someone applied that fertilizer to the farmers field.
Now multiply that for every ingredient in a burger.
Now give every person $15 an hour to do their job.
Now give everyone else more money that isn't in an entry level position.
Now how much does your burger cost?
>But I need a car
>But I don't want to live with roommates
>But I don't want to save any of my disposable income for emergencies
>But I need those Air Jordans and the new IPhone
Jesus fucking Christ what a bunch of entitled snowflakes you people are
What is minimum wage for you? Here its 7.25, you'll make maybe 1000 a month after taxes
>living by yourself while earning minimum wage
what are you, retarded?
Three bedroom house in rural Ohio. $700 a month
Post
I've already addressed your concerns. My numbers are valid. Fuck off.
i get 1500 a month after taxes.
but i make 12/hr.
Straight from Healthcare.gov
The fee for not having health insurance in 2016 & 2017
The fee is calculated 2 different ways – as a percentage of your household income, and per person. You’ll pay whichever is higher.
Percentage of income
2.5% of household income
Maximum: Total yearly premium for the national average price of a Bronze plan sold through the Marketplace
$695 per adult
$347.50 per child under 18
Maximum: $2,085
So either you get a plan or you pay AT LEAST $695 a year not to have one.
that's what you get for being a city nigger. I live in a 1500 sq ft apt for a little more than half that. I also have the luxury of only having to drive 15 minutes to get to work.
>unpopular opinion puffin
Back to 9gag you go faggot!
>Listening to podcasts/ reading books en route
>Not adding to your stresses by being caught in traffic
Commuter master race.
> a leaf
Even a broken clock is right twice a day. Wtf.
And I'll bet you don't flip burgers.
Guess what happens if minimum wage is raised to $15 an hour....
You won't get a raise for 10 years.
And your rent will go up because the property owner has to pay more for maintenance.
And food prices will go up because they have to pay the stockboy more.
You'll more than likely wind up with LESS money at the end of the month, all because sjw's don't understand economics.
>full time at minimum wage
this is where you fucked up
minimum wage jobs are all part time, if they're full time then they cover your insurance too and nobody wants to do that
It is the end of days my friend, minimum wage will seem like utopia I fear...
Mine is $339/month (heat and water included).
Used to work in base-level support for AT&T:
not only do these poor dumbfucks always need the newest iphone or iwatch, but they never manage their minutes and end up with anywhere between $60-150 in overages.
Since they're leasing to own the phone, that's another $30 added to the bill every month, and their base bill is probably $90 for a family plan.
this, they'll actually try to force you to work like 35 hours or something or pretend they have to get special permission for you to hit 40 and then discourage you from accepting mandatory offers for health insurance
That's if the manager even allows you to hit hours without dropping you from shifts