Zelda games have HORRIBLE controls

I need to vent because I'm really butthurt, I do however want to have a thoughtful discussion about this.

It's useless to go to nintendo and give my opinion not only because I doubt they give a fuck but also because it's about "old" games

Alright, so, as the title indicates, zeldas (and also the metroid prime series) have really bad controls.

Now when it came to Ocarina of Time or Majora's Mask, I was willing to accept this simply because the games are old, they didn't know yet how to properly implement 3D controls because 3D games were new, okay, fine.

But then I played Wind Waker, Twilight Princess, The Metroid Prime games on Gamecube and after, their Wii versions and I'm fucking baffled, dumbfounded.

Number fucking 1: allow controls to be customizable / remap button layout. None of the above games have this, yet this is BASIC fucking shit right there, what the fuck

Most importantly, n.2: here's how you do proper control for a 3D game

>Left stick for movement; directions move the player in that direction, you DON'T make left and right rotate the player in place

>Right stick for camera; directions move the camera in that directions, you DON'T make up and down have inverted effects, it's not a goddamn helicopter where you need to pull to go up, you press up to look up, that's how you fucking do it, and you DON'T put inverted camera rotation on the "x" axis WHILE having first person view on up and zoom out on down, that's fucking terrible

>Main buttons on top of controller, so you can use both thumbsticks at the same time WHILE also performing actions

>D-pad to navigate in menus, NOT the thumbstick

PART 1

PART 2

Number 3 (metroid primes only): From Gamecube to Wii, the games had apparently "better" controls and when I tried them, I couldn't believe they could make such a huge fucking mistake

>In a FPS, the aiming reticle always remains in the center, when you move the camera, it's like you are moving your head, you DON'T make the reticle move inside the screen and need to aim in the corners to move the camera, what the fuck, holy shit, who thought this was a good idea, it's so fucking bad

I didn't try the Wii version of Twilight princess but I'm sure it's the same bullshit

I wonder how the latest Zelda, Skyward Sword controls, I know there's "z targeting" in it again, so that's already a bad sign because you don't need to lock on an enemy if you can move the camera, the player and perform actions at the same time

Twilight princess was made in fucking 2006, 2000 fucking 6 and they still don't know how to make games properly, same shit with metroid prime 3 in 2007 and the trilogy with "improved" controls in motherfucking 2009, holy shit son

end of rant...

You have autism if you have a hard time with Zelda controls

Not reading you blog, faggot

ITT: PC player getting used to console control schemes

Literally everyone and their mothers, except for you, uses the camera as a sort of manual movement on 3rd person open world games because most of the time, your character will move the direction the camera is moving in.

Plot Twist, I do have autism

and that's bad

Is this bait? There is literally nothing wrong with the controls and every one of these points is flawed.

Do you not realize how "reticle remains in center" aiming would absolutely not work at all, period for Wii Pointer Controls?

no this is not bait

how the hell can you say that there is nothing wrong? now that sounds like bait

tell me how those points are flawed, really

I can't believe people are Ok with this, I guess the average person doesn't want things to be the best they can be, they just accept things the way the are

why not?

the screen might become shaky but that will still be miles better than pointing in the corner to move the camera

Tell me how you're going to turn more than 180 degrees with this system

increased sensitivity?

anyways, if it does absolutely not work, they could still have mapped camera controls to the joystick and movement to the D-pad but that would mean rethinking all the other controls...

the Wii pointer and nunchuck are bad, similar to how the n64 controller was bad design has well, most n64 games don't even use the D-pad and "L" trigger

>increased sensitivity
So in order to look behind you, you're going to have to point way to the left or right, risking moving the pointer out of range of the sensor bar, fucking everything up. Not to mention the fairly awkward ways you'll have to hold your arm for long periods of time while running around exploring or fighting.

You're a genius.

oh, and why the fuck do they make their joysticks rest in a octagon slot?!

the point of it being a thumbstick is 360 degree control, why make it "lock" in a angle

Zelda has some of the best controls of any console video game. I don't know what the hell you're smoking, OP.

On the flip side, the sensitivity could be increased so much that the simple act of trying to turn around could cause your camera to flip around wildly as you spin in a circle five times before coming to a spot at an angle KINDA close to what you wanted. And then the same points as above with having to hold your arm in that position lest you get another nausea inducing whirlwind.

okay but my point that the Wii controller is bad remains

they should have stuck with the gamecube version then

>bad
But the Wii controls are infinitely superior to the GameCube ones for Prime. They're also (in regards to aiming weapons, not for sword fighting) infinitely superior in Twilight Princess.

I get it

the original prime controls for gamecube are worst yes, but has mentioned in the OP, they could be better and THEN may be superior

it's hard to say without testing it first hand but I'm confident

Customizable controls aren't needed because there's nothing to customize. What are you going to do, put your Action button on C-Left? Put Jump on Y and Morphball on B? The controls work fine as they are.

Prime had it's movement system out of necessity. Yes, it's odd, but the game never requires you to have to turn around quickly. This is your only point that's valid, and it gets rectified by the Wii version.

Inverted Y is superior. Get with it. And there's nothing wrong with having C-Up perform two functions. You only go into first-person view when Free-Cam isn't active. It's ridiculously simple to turn it off so you can look in first person, and on the flip side it's ridiculously simple to just move the stick in a different direction before holding up to zoom in.

I don't even know what you're trying to say here.

There's literally no issue with using the stick to navigate menus if your menus are programmed correctly, which they are in Zelda and Metroid's cases.

And finally handled your last point.

Customizable controls are still important, take metroid on Wii, you use D-pad down to shoot missiles, someone could easily prefer mapping it to "C" OR "Z"

Prime has enemy AI made so that they just sit there and way instead of always trying to attack you, because of the poor controls, otherwise the game would be too hard, I disagree that the Wii solves the problem

having the option to choose between inverted Y axis and regular is what should be done, not forcing someone to get used to it

right stick should only rotate camera, having different actions mapped to it is not the proper way to do things

it's possible to navigate menus with a stick of course but because menus are 2D, a D-pad feels better

*sit there and wait*

what are you doing...

Prime has enemy AI made so that they just sit there and *way* instead of always trying to attack you

made a typo, meant "wait"

my bad, i thought you were telling us that you just sat there and were waiting
and i was going to ask you if i could sit with you...

the proper way to do things is to have as many actions as you can tied to a single button, or, in this case, stick.

I absolutely agree that having more than one action mapped to a same button is good, however, not the specific actions to the stick

for example:

R2 (PS3):

1. In game - shoot missile
2. In map - next area
3. While Jumping - space jump
4. while space jumping - screw attack
5. In water - gravity boost
6. In Ball Mode - boost ball

but not, FPP and zoom out with rotate camera

(going a bit off topic but sure, why not)

If you want to sit with me, I would not refuse but I am not a social person, you can ask questions, I'll answer but I won't start a conversation

this thread is an exception however... it's on the internet, in real life, I remain polite and distant

alright, one bump, in case someone is thinking of a reply, I'll let it die after

false flagging sonyggers need to fuck off
do your job fucking mods

what?

why do you think this thread needs deletion?

mokou's sadness very big

what do you do?

>metroid prime
>bad controls

nope. they're different. that doesn't mean bad by default. I've always enjoyed the first prime game and i've never had a significant issue with the controls. it sounds like you just have trouble adapting to them. i can kind of relate. i could never play those guitar hero or rock band games because i can't process the notes coming at me the way they do. i don't know what it is. i just can't concentrate and hit the notes as they pass by, but i've never heard anyone say they have that issue.

Prime's abuse of lock on considering there's literally a fully fnctional second stick on the Gamecube controller always confused me (Did they fix that in Collection?).

Ur a faggot if you think Zelda controls are shit though.

also, the gamecube controls for prime 1 and 2 were fine. i refuse to play the wii ports because i fucking hated the way prime 3 did it.

pat on head and ask why crying

>All 3d games should play like Datk Souls
Also, you conveniently left out the 3d Mario games which have some of the best controls (save for camera issues) of all time.

Prime came out in a time when FPS were just becoming big on consoles, the controls weren't nailed down yet. You also have to understand that Prime is an adventure game first and foremost, and for that the controls are fine.

Zelda's control scheme will never change significantly, nor should it. It's a part of the series and you just have to get used to it, it worked great on the N64, it's just been modified since then to work on other consoles.

different does not mean bad, sure, but tank controls are bad, even if they have a genuine function in fixed camera games like resident evil, moving in the direction of the stick is better the majority of the time

Wow, you are a complete fucking retard.

Literally all your points would have made the controls worse. Not to mention some of your complaints are even factually wrong.

Learn to play faggot.

*Dark Souls
Fuck this phone keyboard

〉Japanses anime
〉 simplified chinese words

man these sum legit chinese cartoons right here

i never had a problem with it. the c stick allowed for quick switching between beams. i always felt like the first 2 prime games weren't about aiming your gun. sure, part of the fun of an FPS is testing your skill at aiming, but prime channeled that potentail fun into exploring and puzzles like all metroid games have. in fact, metroid has never been that focused on aiming your shots. when they switched to FPS, they decided to keep that tradition and in doing so made the game even more unique than it would have been otherwise, and they did it successfully.

it would be bad if you had to make a complete stop before you could turn, but this is not the case in metroid prime.

>All 3d games should play like Dark Souls

I've barely played dark souls but yes, essentially

kinda the same way a guitar's design is pretty much the same regardless of brand, video games should all control almost the same, they need to change only if the gameplay is vastly different for example you can't apply FPS controls to a strategy game but if you're going to do a FPS, you do it the one and only way

zelda should control pretty much like uncharted for example

When it comes to Zelda, I just want alternate controls, not replacing the traditional ones, hence having customization options

I never played Mario...

So explain to me why you're bitching about Ocarina of Time not having the same controls as a game series that came out about 15 years after it released.

OoT set the standard for years because it was the first of its kind, it was in the experimental stage for what did and didn't work along with many other game series that tried and failed, and it came out on top because the controls were intuitive for what you were doing. Remember, the N64 only had one stick and 4 C buttons.

Once again, for Prime the GPS controls on the console were still being figured out as that generation was the first to have 2 analog sticks on all controllers, and Prime's controls worked for what it was trying to do.

So you want all games of each respective genre to have one and only one respective control scheme? Can you say stagnation and boredom? This would kill the industry and it's part of the reason that so many AAA games are incredibly boring and why CoD gets its bad reputation for having annual releases, except your idea would make the entire industry have little to no room for innovation as well as driving down the difficulty for many games. Just look at souls, if you've made it through one the next is easier, and the next is easier, until you get to the point where you can breeze through the games with little to no issue. The you have Bloodborne which has its own unique controls, while being similar to aouls, and makes for a unique experience.

Read the OP again, I'm not complaining about Ocarina of Time or Majora's Mask, that picture is something I made simply out of desire, though, I know the 3ds version has not improved on the n64 controls much

I just completely disagree with controls being the same meaning stagnation and boredom, it rather means things are the best they can be and no longer need improvement or change

Innovation is in gameplay, controls only serve the purpose of you doing what you want to do, in fantasy, you would control a game with your mind and not a controller, controls, should NEVER be about learning to master something, only serve as a medium

oh and no, I don't want to make games easier

if controls become better, then the game needs to be made harder to compensate