game is fun

> game is fun
> somehow this is not a legitimate argument

...

> game is shit to mediocre in pretty much every aspect
> say you had fun like it means something

Subjectivity can't exist in the vacuum of Sup Forums objectivity.

Fun is subjective and an argument needs to be based on fact. So because of that claiming a game is fun is not a solid base or point for an argument.

...

its
fun
with
friends

It doesn't count if it is nu-fun

>Sup Forums spergs the fuck out when people say "it's fun" but don't realize "it's shit" is just as much of a non-argument.

You guys are biased as fuck.

I hate this.

An argument for what?

It's not an argument for game quality or reason for others to play it. "I find it fun" may be an argument for why YOU play a game, but it doesn't mean anything to anyone else.

You can have fun for a lot of reasons.
People have fun playing mediocre games with friends.
People have fun playing absolute garbage trainwrecks because they're so bad that they're good again.
etc

You have to at least say why you find the game to be fun for it have any meaning at all.

>Fun is subjective
>gameplay mechanics are objective
>you have to ask yourself if you take out the fun elements that you like is the game still good then?
I can't understand why this is so hard for people

Calling game shit is a good argument when the game actually is shit.

i'm having fun with this shit thread

finding something fun is more of a personal opinion and not a quantifiable fact to use in a discussion

if your "argument" is that you find the game fun you're an autistic gay dipshit

>Nu-X

And here we go again, no it isn't, if you want to make any argument you need to go "it's fun, because (...)" or "it's shit, because (...)", without extrapolation you aren't making any argument besides "personally I think it's fun/shit".

Just because you faggots default to "it's shit" on a common basis doesn't mean it suddenly becomes an argument, a game isn't just shit because you say it is.

>subjectivity can't exist on Sup Forums
Holy top kek.

WATS A POOR FAG?

> game has absolutely zero teamwork elements
> MP with friends is just like SP but several times more breaindead because you just revive each other when you die


what an ugly meme

Here's my review guys

The game is fun 10/10

Shit and fun are not on the same scale.

A person is free to have fun with anything, since fun is subjective.

You're free to have fun with a shit game, but people with better taste are equally free to look down on your for it.

Calling a game fun is a good argument when the game actually is fun
See what I did there?

No it fucking isn't
That's an opinion faggot.

You have to state why it's bad.

But it is a valid reason to like a game.

>why do you like it?
>I had fun with it
>that doesn't count

for a medium to reach the point where it becomes art and is therefore subject to exclusive judgement based on subjective opinion, it must first pass all levels of objective criteria.

however, it is perfectly okay to enjoy or like media that is critically bad, so long as you recognize that it is bad in such a way.

GTA Online
Halo
Battlefield
Resident Evil
Minecraft
Smash
Mario Kart
Overwatch

>All mediocre games when played alone
>Built around multiplayer
>Somehow having more fun playing it with people you know instead of strangers is an invalid argument

>why do you like it?
>I had fun with it
>what parts of it were fun?
>I dunno lol

It's a valid reason to like the game, but it's not a valid reason to say that a game is good.

>why is this game good
>I had fun with it

That's not quite right.

What is objective criteria?

Halo and Minecraft has amazing single player

>posting in a bait thread

>it's fun
>what's fun about it
>I dunno it's just fun

checklist of basic elements that all forms of media share and adhere to to be a part of said collective.

Sums up fun/comfy fags pretty much

Why are you having argument about video games tho

Nintendo thread

I wish humans had as super objective mode where we just cut off all personal feelings to determine if something is bad or not.

Then after we have come to a conclusion would could argue whether or not the game is worth it on a personal level.

As long as everybody could agree that the game is either good or bad i would be fine with this.

But how do you know what good mechanics are?

If a "game" is defined as "a form of play or sport, especially a competitive one played according to rules and decided by skill, strength, or luck", then wouldn't individual game mechanics be "good" based on finding them fun or not? "Fun" isn't a quantifiable term, and people have different ideas of fun. Would this mean that calling games "good" or "bad" is meaningless, and that instead games should be defined as "fun" or "not fun" solely on an individual level?

Is there a way to debate the merits of a video game mechanic that doesn't boil down to finding it fun or not? If not, then surely a single person finding a game fun would mean it could not be called "good" or "bad".

>I can't articulate why this game is fun
Only then the "fun" argument is invalid.

>say that a game is good.

If someone had fun with it then it stands a good chance of someone else finding it fun. If you have fun in a game, that's good.

The problem is that it's vague and non descriptive, but it remains a point. It is an emotion felt by the player and it deserves to be able to be described, but not on its own.

>Halo CE, 2, Wars, ODST,
>bad Singleplayer

>checklist of basic elements

What basic elements?

>Fun = good
I hate people like this. Just admit you like trash from time to time, I do it with vidya and movies constantly.

You gave the worst examples in the world

>I like it
>10/10

>I hate it
>0/10

>I can't get the game to boot up so the game isn't fun for me
>0/10

> trash is fun
Are you retarded?

I agree with that actually, I've hadd fun with some games that I don't count as good.
To say some, Splatterhouse (remake/reboot) and Castlevania Lament of Innocence.

cant you read?

the basic elements that make up games or movies or whatever it may be

for games its gameplay, story, graphics, etc.
movies is story, acting, editing, camerawork, etc.
and so on

>comfy

I'm sick of seeing that word. Retards here will use it to describe fucking anything.

Post a picture of a rotting shack in middle of the woods covered in snow and you'll get some faggot calling it comfy.

>fun
It isn't a reason, it may be part of why you enjoy something but using 'fun' as the totality of the basis of your opinion is pretty flimsy, just explain WHY it's fun, easy right?

It's not trash if you enjoyed it though.

Are you? I enjoy Z-tier movies and they're hot garbage.

>rotting shack in middle of the woods covered in snow
that does sound pretty comfy desu senpai

>for games its gameplay, story, graphics, etc.

All of these things are subjective.

>this meme is going to be pushed to hell and back for the next year until it becomes a normal thing to say
You could stop it. But you won't.

yea because that's your fucking opinion, who wants to argue fucking opinions when you aren't set on fucking changing it you retard

You can go enjoy games but if you think "fun" cuts it you are legitimately autistic

>Someone else tells you something is bad
>You believe them and don't want to feel bad for liking it so you call it bad because someone else did

That's not how this works user. That's not how any of this works.

It's more of a question of noticing blatant ineptitude but still enjoying it regardless.

There's no such thing as objectivity.

There's not one thing in the world that everyone can unanimously agree upon.

Everything is subjective.

We're all idiots.

@348477491
>screencap please
>retard actually does it

And you are a faggot, this isn't something worth screen capping topkek, not even deserving of my (You) that is some other fags job

>Post a picture of a rotting shack in middle of the woods covered in snow and you'll get some faggot calling it comfy.

That is OBJECTIVELY comfy though.

NMS has the shittiest flight controls. You can barely control your ship and it doesn't ever go where I want due to a restrictive anti crash behavior.

This is objectively bad.

But just because something doesn't hold up to common convention standards doesn't mean it can't be desired or approved of, AKA good.

Anytime someone refers to a game as "comfy" all I see is them trying to say the game is boring without using a such a derogatory term.

Well, no.
Fun is a consequence of a game having good elements. These elements are the cause of why it's fun, hence they constitue arguments, while fun doesn't.

It doesn't matter if someone disagrees on something, the point of objectivity is to call anyone who disagrees a fucking retard.

It's an art form it's not supposed to be fun

I used one of those word changer scripts for a while and I got it to change "comfy" to "boring". It made a lot of posts way more accurate since it was around the time everyone was playing Euro Truck Simulator.

Youre the type of faggot that would get punched in the dick hundreds of times and argue that I doesn't hurt out of spite. Kill yourself.

Fun is a buzz word people use to defend bad games.

Game is a buzz word people use to defend bad movies.

>playing games for fun
>not playing games for money

When you say "This game is fun." you are describing your emotional life. You are stating that playing the game brings you joy. One cannot derive any information about the game from that. You have to follow up and explain what about the game appeals to you and why, which would be a real argument regardless of whether people agreed or not. Just saying shit's fun is useless because it cannot be evaluated.

>graphics
>gameplay
>story
>subjective
Maybe how much you like them, but those can all be evaluated completely subjectively.
>This game has higher res textures than this other game
>This game has no noticeable pop-in
>This game has twice as many levels as its predecessor
>This game presents multiple methods of progression during these levels
>The supporting character is not present for the second arc of the story
>The villain's motivation is the same as the last game

You can say so many things objectively about games that help establish how good they are.
You can even go into subjective but completely obvious territory.
For example, the strength of Bowser's character in Super Mario Bros is subjective, but you can make subjective but clear arguments about aspects of it. You can state with good certainty that his motives aren't complex.

>You can barely control your ship and it doesn't ever go where I want due to a restrictive anti crash behavior.

Sounds like programmed control behavior, clearly it was designed to fulfill it's specific purpose. Think RE tank controls but on a more vague level, it's hard to control but it adds a new thing to gameplay. Better yet, think of Castlevania, the controls are stiff and bloated, but it adds a new dimension to gameplay. Sure it sounds like defending shitty controls, but shitty controls have been used for decades to make games play differently and for positive effect.

Yes? If it doesn't reach the standards it won't get approved of. You can like it, but you're liking something that's bad, how is that so wrong? I do it all the time with my nieces drawings and stories.

To say that you had fun is to say that the elements that made up your experience were just so, that they allowed you to have fun, or did not stop you from having fun.
Fun is a goal. Nobody starts at 'fun', or throws 'fun' into development at some midway point or at the very end. "This is fun" is always preceded by "What is fun?" You don't skip steps.
Occasionally you might ask "How or why is this fun", and the answer goes back to those elements. That's what people should be asking, and should be asking themselves.
Which will help when you run into something that isn't "fun", and you can move onto "How can this be made fun?"
FUCKING DEVS.

my god the autism in this screenshot

You misunderstand.

If you can't articulate what makes something fun then you're probably borderline retarded so nobody actually cares about your opinion.

1. Fun is subjective. You can have fun with an objectively poor game and that doesn't make it objectively better. When I was a kid I played Glover for hundreds of hours, but it's still a bad game.

2. Fun can be easily manipulated. People convince themselves they're having fun when they grind reputation points in WoW because they get a little dopamine hit each time it goes up. Does that make it a good experience that should be recommended to others? No, it's just manipulative game design, expertly crafted to waste your time and trick you into thinking you're accomplishing something.

Okay then lets take Street fighter as an example

People here on Sup Forums have very mixed feeling about V because it is by all means OBJECTIVELY simplified over IV
>the characters have less moves over all
>less modes then in IV
>not as meny characters as in IV
>the characters that are returining are generally simpler then their IV iteration

This doesn't mean that ultimatly more is better, that is not the case as we have seen so many times.
The point here is that even with V being simplified people can still like it more because there was a lot of stuff in IV that was simply not fun to do or play against, and the focus in V have been narrowed down to being really tight making the overal game balance way better then it ever was when IV came out.
I don't think anyone can dissagree with that becuase Sagat was so fucking broken at the start of IV it was almost impossible to win over him if the person playing him knew what he was doing.

So even though V is in fact objectively a wores game thecnically then IV is, it's a better over all expireience.

After this you can go into if the characters are more or less fun in V then in IV which is subjective

Buzzword is a meme term Sup Forumsfags use to decry words that trigger them.

>Youre the type of faggot that would get punched in the dick hundreds of times and argue that I doesn't hurt out of spite. Kill yourself.

What a worthless response. Next time you get the idea to post something like this, hang yourself from your ceiling fan instead.

>give a reason why something a boss does is bs
>"hurr durr git gud fgt XD"

Meme is a meme meme meme meme a meme
t. Anthony Burch

>b-but the game is unfair!
You probably should git gud, tho

ITT: autistic underage that know nothing beside games.
Now tell me how you play game without having fun

>Designed to fulfill a purpose

And it's bad. I don't give a shit what it was designed to do, it's bad. Also no, being unable to control your ship properly in a dogfight isn't fulfilling any purpose. It doesn't provide anything positive at all to the gameplay. Nothing. It just makes you mad that you missed a target or you were shot down by AI that doesn't have this restriction.

And it's shit controls do not compare at all to games like resident evil.

You just explained 90% of JRPGs

>The sun objectivly keep us all alive
>no it doesn't
>But without it we would all die?
>how do you know it has never gone out?

Stuff can be measureed objectively.
It's just a question of if the person you are talking with stuff about is willing to look at it from an outside view

I disafree. For exemple legend of grimrock is super comfy- it's just four dudes in a tower/on an island, but it's far from boring.

>Game is fun

When you say that, what you actually mean is:

>I had fun playing this game

>but you're liking something that's bad

Because if you like something, it's good. Maybe not to everyone else, but it is, in its existence, good instead of bad.

A parent can love her retarded child. Just because he doesn't appeal to common convention doesn't mean her child isn't good.

I'm sure you'd say that hanging yourself from a ceiling fan feels good, wouldn't you you contrarian faggot.

Same thing lol

>implying it's limited to JRPGs
Nuh-uh.

>And it's bad. I don't give a shit what it was designed to do, it's bad.

Actually it's just not what you like. Sorry.

>game is boring as fuck and practically plays itself
>"it's comfy"

I just assume "comfy" means "shit" now. Afk fishing in FFXIV isnt comfy, No Man's Sky farming isn't comfy, and grinding the newest Korean MMO against the same mobs for 10 hours isn't comfy.