A friend of mine asked me is mgs5 was better then mgs4 and I honestly didn't know how to answer

A friend of mine asked me is mgs5 was better then mgs4 and I honestly didn't know how to answer

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What a stupid fucking thread.

I hope you die OP.

MGS5 is a bit better by virtue of having more gameplay. The rest is equally appalling. Although MGS4 had Act IV which I enjoyed for nostalgia's sake.

Mgs4 had its flaws but it was a good close to the series. mgs5 is an abomination

Easy: it is.
Better writing, pacing, gameplay, MP, and REAL weapons.

I honestly don't know what to add to your post, OP.

idk user it jsut feel more of the same with out being more challenging.
i satrted the no death all capture challenge from the first playthough at new game but after like 10 hours nothing realy changes gameplay wise and it doesnt reward your evolving skill

Here's a fact: Kojima stopped caring about the story of Metal Gear Solid after 4. He wrote a complete conclusion to the story and then just fucked around with gameplay elements.
4 isn't great but at least it's a Metal Gear Solid.

MGS4 had charm in its story. It was a clusterfuck but I enjoyed it.
MGS5 had more gameplay but both it and the story suffered greatly from it being open world. Also the story felt extremely unfinished.

MGS4>>>MGS5

H-how did a game that came out in 2008 have better facial animations then mass effect andromeda?

Mass Effect from 2007 has better animations so that's not an accomplishment.

Retconning half the story and ending on the wedding of Meryl and Diarrhea Soldier is a good close to the series?

Well... You know what, I think you're right after all.

You know what, I'm a bit ashamed of admitting it but I think that MGS1 style gameplay with the soliton radar is my favorite type of gameplay in MGS.

Sure it's a bit lame and unrealistic, and you end up playing half of the game looking at the radar on the corner of the screen but it feels a bit like a hold school game, a bit pacman-style in a way.

Modern MGS have all these cool mechanics and possibilities but it becomes a lot harder to keep track of everything and it feels more like trial and error to me. It's especially bad in MGS5 IMO because the camera is very close to Snake and the FoV is pretty narrow, so it's very easy to miss something going out of the field of view of the camera.

So they had these HUD effects to make you aware of enemies about to catch you but at this point I wonder if I wouldn't prefer a good old pacman radar.

What exactly was retconned?
>muh MGS3 team can't be baddies
The wedding was just a small part of the ending and the part with Big Boss was great.

idk what that you said but i agree mgs1 is better then 4 in tearms of gameplay since when you progress your skill needs to follow, not liek in 4 where its jsut the same for the first 10 hours.
i feel liek dropping this game as i havent played it for a week or two now and i feel like the gameplay isnt doign shit.
its just like th enew tails game no skill progression and its all about a shitty story i couldnt care about

>the part with Big Boss was great

>Snake I'm alive
>Exposition
>Exposition
>Exposition
>Exposition
>Kill Zero
>Snake you live now, I'm dead for real
>"muh boss"

MGS4 only carries value as a piece of art, a tired sequel with a tired old protagonist, trying to chase past glories, the very thing MGS2 critiqued.

As a game however, it's shit. So MGSV wins.

MGS3 team being baddies was the least of my concerns. It just that nothing made sense. The fucking "nanomachines" meme pushed to the limit. Vamp was nanomachines, bigboss is dead but not really but now he's an AI but now he's dead but now he's back.

It's days of our lives level of writing and yet fanboys still take this shit seriously.

MGS1 had a relatively tight and self-contained story (it referenced events outside of the game but wasn't necessary to have played the previous games to understand it). The end was pretty nice, with Snake not being killed immediately by foxdie and Naomi telling him to keep living, that was a pretty good way to end the story. You didn't really know if snake was going to die or not, it was pottery.

Then after that Kojima though he was a good writing and kept stacking more shit on top of the existing shit until he reached the MGS4 turd mountain. With MGS5 I think he just stopped trying halfway through and it's probably for the best, otherwise it would've ended with Venom Snake being Liquid being Mei Ling being Big Boss(female).

MGS4 was a finished game with resolution. It wins by default.

>MGS4 is the first one with exposition

MGS4 is pretty shit, so yes, MGSV is better than 4

MGSV is a game that I wanted to see finished.
MGS4 is a game that made me wish it was unfinished.

Other games don't give you a 1-hour exposition cutscene at the epilogue on its own pace with metaphor and analogy out the ass

That's like asking if dog shit tastes better than cat shit. At least mgs4 was finished and we got some nostalgia moments but it still shit on everything with muh nanomachines.

how does that even work?

MGS4 has one of the worst endings ever, and the game in general is just tedious, so the sooner it ended the better, but it just kept going on and on with the retardedly long cutscenes.

It's the very end of the series (minus MGR), if you can't handle an hour of cutscenes maybe it's not the series for you.

MGS4 is at least 50% exposition though. I don't see how anybody could defend literally hour-long cutscenes between gameplay segments. And they keep repeating the same fucking shit again and again and again.

MGS always had an excess of cutscenes and exposition but MGS4 felt like a parody of itself. When your dualshock controller manages to shut down while you're playing a game you know something is wrong.

They are good and interesting on your first playthrough and on the next playthroughs you can just skip the parts you don't care about. What's the problem?
If it was like Max Payne 3 for example, it would be more annoying.

...

mgs4 is great lol its just mgs3 boss waifu fags who get all wah wahhhh crying about how nothing can compare to "muh boss" story

MGS1's epilogue is Ocelot revealing his "true" allegiances, FOXDIE, and Snake fucking off somewhere with Otacon/Meryl

MGS2's epilogue is Solid lecturing Raiden and reveal something fishy about the Patriots (the "they're all dead" thing)

MGS3's epilogue is Snake becoming Big Boss, Ocelot and Eva reveal their true allegiance

All 3 of them reveal an important twist that change the players' view on the game drastically

MGS4 is just Big Boss coming back in Marvel-fashion revival, summing up every games in the series, more nanomachines retardness shoved into other games' plot, killing Zero in an anti-climatic way and cry about The Boss again

Hey, those eggs looked fucking amazing
Graphic wise atleast, sunny couldn't cook for shit

5 has the best gameplay of the series, but 4 breached the ludonarrative boundary in ways no other game has: forsaking the unspoken rule that games have to be "fun," you play as an old, tired, confused man and both the narrative and [lack of] gameplay force the emotions of weariness, exhaustion, and confusion on the player through excessive cutscenes [lack of bodily control], repetitive fights [every day blends into one another], and an intertextual narrative rife with rations and other absurdities [the inability to discern what is real].

While MGS4 is not "fun" or "a good video game," it is the most stunning, complete, and impressive piece of artwork in an otherwise lowest-common-denominator medium. It is The Human Condition in a sea of superhero movies.

>better then mgs4
>then
Learn english, you ignorant obese loser

Was sunny brain damaged?
I mean, snake did shoot Olga with enough tranqs to knock out a fucking whale

Both have shit stories, but at least MGS4 has the Metal Gear identity going for it, and that is arguably the biggest draw for anybody attached to this franchise. I'm not sure anything in MGS4 offended me more than Big Medic, it certainly hurt that MGS4 just steamrolled MGS2, but at least it had a purpose for doing so.

When I play The Phantom Pain, it never feels like I'm playing a Metal Gear game, feels like everything I loved from the series was taken away from me, it does have the best emergent stealth action gameplay out of any video game ever, but everything else is shit.

So, I'd say MGS4 in the end means more to me, even if I fucking hate everything that story did, at least when I sit down and play it, it feels like I'm playing a Metal Gear game. Another blow towards TPP is that the game is fucking incomplete, so there's that too.

MGS4 is a fantastic game, there just isn't enough of it.

Good post.

MGSV had the white whale thing (moby dick allusions) so could easily be read as a way of chasing something for the sake of it. Literally going to hell for no good reason.

Perhaps even a criticism from Kojima for those looking for even more MGS after IV.

>Mgs4 had its flaws but it was a good close to the series
Laughing my fucking ass off.

It was most certainly a good death kneel for the series. MGS 1 through 3 were excellent and then that trash came out and completely killed it.

youtube.com/watch?v=bsE8D9nGu_k

>Cut scene starts
>Le funny useless diarrhea guy THIS IS ACTUALLY A KEY ELEMENT TO THE STORY SO PAY ATTENTION
>Meryl shouts "drop your weapons and surrender"
>Literally 1 minute of soldiers pouring in from everywhere by car, boat and helicopter and then aiming at the boat
>Literally 2 minutes of soldiers pouring in from everywhere by car, boat and helicopter and then aiming at the boat
>Literally 3 minutes of soldiers pouring in from everywhere by car, boat and helicopter and then aiming at the boat
>Meryl shouts "all of you drop your weapons and put your hands up"
>Literally nothing happens for one minute, liquid/ocelot grunts
>Liquid raises his hand
>Meryl shouts "aim".
>Meryl shouts "fire"
>Nothing happens
>Nothing happens more
>A dud??!
>5:30 into the cutscene, liquid/ocelot starts talking
>NANOMACHINES SON
>Let me point out that you have no control over your weapons, because clearly you're too retarded to have figured that out by now
>"GUNS OF THE PATRIOTS". This is the title of the game, get it?
>Liquid makes the helicopters crash, something is finally happening
>One minute cutscene to show us each helicopter crashing one by one, just to make sure we get it. It's only noname soldiers so we don't give a shit anyway, but at least we get cool explosions
>Le diarrhea guy again THIS IS IMPORTANT
>Liquid/ocelot makes "tatatatat" sounds while the guy next to him fires at the good guys
>"tatatatatatat"
>"tatatatatatat"
>Liquid makes all the soldiers die/shit themselves/whatever
>"Behold, GUNS OF THE PATRIOTS" in case we went to a bathroom break 1 minute ago.
>Noname soldiers we don't give a fuck about get shot
>9:54 end of the youtube video (but not the cutscene, it goes on for quite a while after that)
>Directed by Hideo Kojima

Fucking quality exposition right there. This should definitely not have lasted a second less.

MGS V is unfinished
MGS 4 is unplayable

MGS4.

I know it's stupid and it retcons one of the biggest parts of the series, but that one on one fist fight with Liquid Ocelot is better than anything that happens in TPP.

I love how ridiculous that cutscene is. Makes me laugh every time.

>There are people that treat MGS 4 seriously and not as the absurd joke it is
Kojima couldn't have possibly taken a bigger dump on the series, and I admire him for his thoroughness in ruining everything that is good about MGS, if nothing else.

I cannot think of a more thoroughly enjoyable autistic villian than Liquid Ocelot.

Its so over-the top its great.

Liquid Snake is autistic which leads to Liquid Ocelot

Making him "It was Revolver Ocelot all along using NANOMACHINES to copy Liquid Snake" ruin him

>GAMEPLAY

MGSV is better. MGS4 plays pretty well, but once you're done with ACT 2 there's nothing left. TPP on the other hand has fine tuned some of the greatest emergent gameplay ever, there are no stealth action games that come close to being as rewarding as this one, on the negative side, the mechanics completely carry the game because the actual mission design is terribly lazy 80% of the time. YES, you get to choose how you do things, but it would have been nice if more than 3 missons were a little more involved than going to a place and taking out a person/destroying thing

>STORY

MGS4 is better. Neither are good, but at least MGS4 is complete and while the Big Boss twist at the end of 4 is dumb, it's nowhere near as dumb as the Medic twist. TPP repeats the same mistake that MGS4 did, metallic archea and parasites are the new nanomachines, they're just easier to ignore because it's all hidden away in tapes, which by the way was maybe the worst trade-off ever, "Heard you hate all my long, but polished and well directed cutscenes, no worries we're taking away all of them and now you have an equal amount of exposition in there, it's just all tapes now" TPP sucks.

>SOUND

MGS4 wins. MGS4 has the best sound design from last generation, it is so far ahead of TPP, what a disappointment it was playing it and realizing it sounds like complete shit compared to the last entry

>ART

MGS4 easy win. TPP looks horribly uninspired, the character designs are maybe the only decent thing about it and even that feels awkwardly restrained at times, and also oddly limiting due to the fact they face-scanned the actors. The world map is an embarrassment and puts me to sleep just looking at it, everything in MGS4 looked better.

MGS 5

I play MGS for gameplay, not story. MGS's story wrapped up continuity after the first Solid game so 2, 4, and TPP don't matter to me, but 4 plays the worst of all of the home console games. Its frame rate is bad, its graphics are ugly, and the codec is absolutely useless as the gameplay is so dumbed down you don't need any hints when playing blind. The idea of unlocking weapons in an on-site procurement situation feels too much like a chore, and many weapons aren't worth the time investment.

5 is so criminally underrated. It's story is no more retarded than anything past 2 but it's the one that gets the guillotine from fanboys.

I agree, it's a bit like the "midichlorians" in Star Wars, if you have over the top shit in your lore trying to come up with "scientific" explanations is probably not a great idea, it's just going to make it even more difficult to accept. Just say "it's magic!" and it's fine.

Liquid/ocelot is pretty bad in that regard, but Vamp is even worse. In MGS2 they don't really explain his powers (or Fortune's, to a lesser extent). There appears to be a paranormal aspect to it, and I'm fine with that. Clearly nothing rational could explain Vamp's powers.

But then comes MGS4 and IT WAS NANOMACHINES ALL ALONG! Completely ridiculous. At least it made for an interesting boss fight gimmick with the syringe I guess.

>all along
No.

I'll take the tapes over the cutscenes to be honest, at least you can play while listening to the tapes.

Yeah that cutscene sucked dick, the fucking soldiers pouring in part should have been way shorter

mgs4 was fucking based, the long dumb cutscenes were entertaining as fuck

Couldnt snake have just used one of his guns that were laundered to him by drebin?

He was busy groping the GILF apparently.

Why do you even like this series? How did you ever get past the first entry with all the interruptions in gameplay?

I don't get the MGS5 good gameplay meme. Yes the gunplay is good but the stealth is awful you literally have to stand right in front of someone for them to see you, and don't get me started on the reaction time bullshit the whole game is easy mode. Then there's the bland open world with the same copy paste side missions. It was a real slog to get through all that just to have koijma slap me in the face with his micro penis with that 'ending'

>MGS4 is just Big Boss coming back in Marvel-fashion revival, summing up every games in the series, more nanomachines retardness shoved into other games' plot, killing Zero in an anti-climatic way and cry about The Boss again
That's not the fucking stinger

The stinger is about snake and otacon talking about snake's last months

That's like saying MGS3 didn't have a stinger because the final conversation was eva's speech and not ocelot's

Jesus I forgot to take off the topic name I created

Time to an hero user

Honestly I think the fact that I was 13 when I played MGS1 massively helped. I had more patience for bad storytelling at the time (as my huge pile of JRPGs of the time can attest).

But still, I replayed through MGS1 not long ago and I maintain that it's not nearly as bad as MGS4. There are a bunch of cutscenes but individually they're shorter and have a lot more gameplay in between.

I find that the story overall makes more sense as well. The series had less baggage back then, they don't spend half they time reintroducing elements from the previous entries. You have FOX, miller, big boss and things like that, but Kojima knew that most people (especially in the west) wouldn't have played through MG1 and 2 so it doesn't rely on that established lore as heavily as its sequels.

The plot of MGS1 is: you're sent to a military complex to stop a bunch of terrorists from nuking the USA or whatever, you progress through the complex, make friends and enemies and at the end you realize that you've been used by the terrorists to actually unlock the nuke and you end up fighting the Godzilla nuke launching robot to stop it.

Then on the side you have the deeper philosophical stuff but at the core it's fairly straightforward and engaging.

MGS4's main storyline is... uh... Snake had a hard life? Oh and your previous side kick is a cyborg ninja now btw.

I guess to be fair I should've added the foxdie element of MGS1 that's fairly important, but that's still pretty straightforward, at least by MGS standards. It also creates a nice "double twist" at the end, as you understand that you've been used to carry the deadly virus and tricked by the terrorists to unlock metal gear.

Still, it's all fairly simple and relatively straightforward compared to the things we have in the sequels.

Yeah, I agree that MGS4 is shit, and hard to even compare to the first game, because the first was paced so much better and didn't have nearly as many cutscenes.

I meant more the part where you say you'd rather have tapes than cutscenes. Did you mean that as in, you'd rather have tapes than another game like MGS4?

I'd have to go with 4 overall, the story is retarded, overly complex and convoluted, but it's complete and closes most plot holes, almost to a fault. The gameplay had too many urban locals for my taste, but it had the best controls in the series until V came along and made a control scheme for human hands.

V is a great game, but I'll fight anybody who claims that it was "complete". The game needed a third chapter, there is no room for debate. Also making the game openworld really didn't add anything.

Yes, although I'd also take tapes over overlong codec exposition, those are not particularly visually interesting (except when you make the titties bounce I guess).

MGS1 has tons of these, although at least you can fast forward them if you just read the text.

>Retconning half the story
Kojima tried to write himself out of a self-imposed corner. People didn't NEED to know why vamp has dumb vampire powers or what happened to characters like Raiden.

I agree. That's what I tried to say here No explanations is better than ridiculous suspension-of-disbelief-wrecking explanations.

MGS IV is a flawed but enjoyable MGS movie/game.

MGSV is a pretty good open world stealth game, not a good MGS game.

Why do you fags keep calling mgsv ''5''?

I think that gameplay and mechanics get mixed up a bit, and mechanically TPP is a very nice game. Movement, shooting, etc. feels fantastic but after actually playing it for a while you realise it's a boring grind over relentlessly recycled environments. Oh and the parasites thing is fucking awful, I can deal with a good amount of BS from a Metal Gear game but seriously, the whole plot was just bad.

It's just too kino for your simple tastes.

Maybe one day I'll be worthy.

Thing is, I don't even think they're a good trade-off for codec stuff.

Because Codec played an important role in fleshing out contextual stuff going on in the story as you're making progress in the game, the tapes since they're all optional and just appear in your inventory feel haphazard by design, a lot of it also feels dry and removed from the narrative.

Tapes that work are the fun ones, as soon as it delves into exposition they lose me, I always found the codecs more engaging than them. I'd rather sit through a 5 minute codec call that is tangibly related to what is currently going on in the plot, than 3 2 minute tapes that exists only because the cutscenes didn't bother to bring any meaningful exposition to the table.

If you think about the characters in MGS1,2 and 3 all of them stand well on their own, you don't need to listen to codec calls to understand their motivations or quirks. PW and TPP on the other hand, tapes are pretty much a 100% requirement to get anything out of any of these characters because their screen presence do almost nothing to advance any kind of character development.

There is a middle ground of course, but I don't think PW or TPP executed on this.

Yeah that's fair. I'll admit that I have very little patience for exposition in games nowaday, I have a job and a girlfriend, when I play a game I don't want to spend 30 minutes listening to people talking before I can actually play. That's why I enjoyed Dark Souls so much, just pick the controller and start hacking at monsters.

What annoys me most in MGS is that they keep bashing you on the head with the same plot points over and over and over again. Most of the time you could condense a 10 minute cutscenes in 30 seconds while retaining all of the information. I'm not ADHD but Kojima should seriously hiring a competent editor for this stuff. If I had the time and patience I'd record all of the cutscenes in MGS4, trim all the fat and I'm sure I could end up with a 30 minutes short telling the story with all the details.

I mean look at this: You could easily condense this in maybe two minutes at most. The only thing that happens is liquid sabotaging the good guys using nanomachines and then shooting at them. The rest is just Kojima masturbating to how great of a director he think he is.

TPP could have been so much better with better designed areas. Open world was totally wrong direction to take it.
Even the newest 2 Splinter Cells feel better, simply because the levels were actually designed. TPP offers you freedom but when you don't even have simple things like difficulty settings, there's really no feeling of accomplishing anything no matter how you tackle the missions.

Well said.

Tapes are less interactive as they are always prerecorded. Codec was real time information making it much more relevant to your current task. It was also helpful information for gameplay tricks. I think tapes could have enhanced the experience but they failed to be solely reliable info to the player.

>I have very little patience for exposition in games nowaday

Fair enough. I never had this for any games, MGS is the only exception, and that is only because of how seriously Kojima takes it all. I can see how that might bother a whole lot of people, but his obsession with everything that exists in his world having to have a reason for being there is just lovely.

Excluding MGS4 from all of this, because I don't think that game did much of anything well, it completely butchered most things I loved about the series, when I fawn about this stuff I am talking about MGS1, 2 and 3.

>There's really no feeling of accomplishing anything no matter how you tackle the missions

Spot on, this is exactly why I stopped playing the game. The plot is so abysmal it gives you no reason to bother with it, and the whole meta-game of Fultoning everything loses purpose because accumulating all that "stuff" really ends up serving no purpose at all.

How many people are seriously going to pick to arrive at a mission driving a tank when by the later stages of the game you're essentially "punished" for going lethal because all the enemy soldiers are A++ rated and are worth more to you alive?

It's not. You see MGS4 is a MGS game. Not a great one but still one. MGSV is a different game all together that is pretending to be MGS.

Well for what it's worth I played through Ground Zeroes for the first time not long ago and I thought the cutscenes worked pretty well so I suppose Kojima can still pull it off when he wants to.

I glad I haven't paid for this "game" though, I knew it was supposed to be short but I was still baffled when the credits started rolling. It's a fucking disgrace and an insult to his fans.

It isn't V is a shit metal gear solid game

I extracted just for GMP and R&D. Tanks and soldiers were worth the trouble.

Part of me really fucking hates 4 because it ruined my favourite MGS character.

It's Vamp.

ENEMY SNIPER

I liked MGS4 despite it having a terrible framerate. It was kino. It went overboard with the cutscenes vs gameplay, but it was more memorable I think.
MGS3 is still unmatched. It has a good amount of gameplay and lenghty, good cutscenes.

Two completely opposite games.

If your friend is invested in the storyline, MGS4 is better, but honestly you can probably get the same experience from watching the cutscenes on YouTube.

If your friend wants good gameplay and doesn't care if there's little to no story, MGS V is far and away better.

If your friend wants both, play Snake Eater.

im playing through the mgs games with my dad

should i skip 4 and the ones after?

your retarded friend wouldn't understand anyways

MGS2>MGS3>MGS1>MGSPW>MGS4>MGSV

Mgs4 retcons mgs2 so you both have shit tastes playing anything after 3

Raiden had a harder life than Snake

MGSV is of course better than 4.


It's the second best game in the series after all.
Behind MGS2.

accurate

the only debate-able part being whether mgs3 or 2 should be at top

dude parasites lmao

anyone sets a VR simulation above the other titles can only be autistic
kill yourself

it had the tightest gameplay in the series tho

and i liked raiden as a character

the big shell was fun to infiltrate too

le ironic reference post

MGS5 is the better game, MGS4 had a complete story, better bossfights & possibly the best gun porn I've witnessed in vidya though.

>unplayable
i got the platinum

le 9gager back at it again

I agree my man it was the better game!