Now that the dust has settled. Can we now agree that this was worse than DS2?

Now that the dust has settled. Can we now agree that this was worse than DS2?

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Yes

Honestly, yeah.

I've recently been thinking about how utter shit the level design in DaS3 is.
You've got an absolute shit-conga lineup of levels in the form of Road of Sacrifices through to the Catacombs/fiery lake area that is probably some of the worst content in the franchise, the secret/optional areas are all lazy as fuck and even when the level design is "good", it still never compares to the better parts of DeS, DaS or BB.

Shit game.

yes, and it attracted an unusual amount of normies too for some weird fucking reason.

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mmmmm no.

No.

Kys DS2 apologist and stop with this thread every day.

DS2 will always be the worst game in the series

Nah, DS2 has even worse mechanics than DS1
DS3 fixed most, if not all mechanical and technological problems the other titles had, including Bloodborne.

DS1>DS3>DS2

With the rising popularity of memes and videogames in general, there's no wonder chads run around as sunbros

Even if DaS3 is better in some objective sense, there is zero reason to play it. The combat has been changed from something slow and methodical into mediocre action schlock with a spamable iframe button; the branching paths of prior games are now a nearly linear experience; the unique locals of DaS2 and BB have been thrown out and instead we get more swamps, more catacombs, more castles, and more ruins; build variety is a joke; etc. etc. It's got more in common with Devil May Cry 3 than Dark Souls so why am I not just playing Devil May Cry?

DaS2 might be the worst in the series, but unlike DaS3 I can't point to a different game in a different series and say "this game is better than it in every way".

Fell for the b8

YES. NOW STFU ABOUT IT.

>DS3 fixed most, if not all mechanical and technological problems the other titles had, including Bloodborne.

Did absolutely nothing of the sort.

>dropped the perfected BB backstab to one more comparable to DaS2
>poise is still fucking useless. Even if you think it was broken in DaS1, they've made fuck all attempt to improve it.
>this is turn makes heavy armour a complete waste since all it does is potentially slow you down for absolutely zero benefit whatsoever (even BB gave you reason to equip different sets for status effect resistance)
>same issue that BB has with dodges consuming too little stamina, only at least it was justified in BB given that it was a faster paced game with no shields
>this combined with rolls having an absurd amount of i-frames makes roll-spam worse than it's ever been
>shields may as well not exist because blocking most bosses is likely to result in you having to eat a 10-hit wombo combo because the whole fucking game is built around roll-spam
>weapon arts are a total joke that only exist because plain old DaS weapons look tame as fuck compared to what they did with BB. Half of them could have been regular spells and they even use the same resource

Explain to me what exactly DaS3 "fixed".

DaS3 though did have some balancing issues with enemies

>Those sword enemies in Boreal Valley that are fast as hell and does those long 6+ combos and hits hard
>Those other enemies in the prison with that smog that temporary drops your max HP(which can kill you) and getting hit with the branding iron makes you unable to move for a few seconds which it can also kill you when you are stunned

Who the fuck at From though this was a good idea? Fuck those enemies hard!

The boss fights in DS2 were fucking abysmal compared to the ones in DS3, especially the DLC bosses.

Yes

No

This is bait. DS3 was so refreshing to play after the absolute SLOG that was 2. Tighter movement, fluid combat and it just FELT so much better to play.

2 plays like ass. Like a literal fangame

Darklurker, all of the DLC bosses except for the triple gank boss in Shulva, the Persuer, Velstad. Yes DS3 bosses are better, DS2 ones are not bad though

To add:
Estus is now lightning fast. So fast that they may as well removed it entirely and just tacked an extra 1000 HP onto your life bar. Bosses are now designed around taking you from 100 to 0 in a single wombs combo because anything less than that will just be healed up instantly (and only the DLC fights last long enough for running out of estus to be a concern).

If DaS2 did anything right, it was making heals slow as fuck.

Fuck no, DaS2 was absolute garbage.

>heavy armor does nothing
it heavily reduces damage, retard. and poise is much better balanced than retards with max poise stunlocking you with fast attacks.

>dodges requiring too little stamina
this is a good addition because it encourages dodging. the combat isn't fun when you're turtling.

>shields are pointless
they're not. you're meant to use them to block difficult to dodge attacks, not just sit there blocking until you feel like attacking. the game is more proactive.

>weapon arts are a joke
maybe you should try actually using them before you develop an opinion. :^)

>Lack of bosses.
>Half the bosses are shitty gimmicks.
>Other half are the same bullshit over and over.
>Vordt, Pontiff, Dancer, etc. All require the same strategy and have the same feel in that they're enemies that just swing wildly off into the distance.
>The aesthetic is washed out and muddy.
>Enemies act like they're from a real action game, like DMC, being overly mobile and aggressive, but it doesn't work in a Souls game so they usually end up running off cliffs or just getting stuck on terrain.
>Massive pathing issues in general.
>Worse A.I. than the previous two entries. Enemies regularly just pat in circles or walk off cliffs to their own deaths.
>Massively over-uses the same fucking enemy types again and again, with most areas having Undead Settlement Hollow variations + One new enemy, maybe.
>Pointless fucking areas like the Cathedral of the Deep.
>Being able to roll fifty times and Estus instantly.
>Whole game feels like a shitty anime trying to be Dark Souls. Nothing has any weight at all, even 12 foot knights in armor swing ten foot swords around like pool noodles.
>The bosses magnify this even worse, with a lot of them moving around like retards, such as Dancer, who is supposed to be unnerving, but just looks bad because every time she moves she just clips into herself.
>The mocapped animations were replaced with amateur robotic garbage where your head can turn over 180 degrees away from your torso.
>The story blows dick and the NPCs are largely non-existent.

Dark souls 3 is shit aside from the last dlc unpatched. 2 was a better game overall I never understood the dark souls 2 is bad meme, sure it's not better than 1 or bb but it's good

>>poise is still fucking useless. Even if you think it was broken in DaS1, they've made fuck all attempt to improve it.
Poise was going to be implemented but Miyazaki decided to leave it out, how would someone having havels armor set and max poise be fair in a fight? You guys are worse than the people that go on forums and start writing out an entire post on why their favorite item isn't op and why they shouldn't nerf it.

>Nothing has any weight at all

But this is literally DaS2. Dark Souls 3 felt amazing, the character had weight again and moving felt grounded, unlike the buttery slippery shitty floaty mess of DaS2.
>Mocapped animations replaced with amateur robotic garbage

Sorry DaS2 apologist but nobody thinks that shitty game has good animations.

All said, if DaS2 had DaS3 graphics/movement feel, it would be much better than 3. But it feels like shit rendering largely the cool areas/some bosses pointless because it's such a slog.

>Half the bosses are shitty gimmicks
Name all the gimmicks, Casual Das2cuck.

> I'll defend this game with sentences that sound good but are not logical
Dodges need to require more stamina, stops spamming and makes the player think and develop a playstyle towards intelligent stamina management. Heavy armor does reduce more damage but without poise and everyone spamming rolls is just shit. Blocking shields are shit in DS3, unless you use magic shield spell or go full retarded with stats. Weapon arts are a great idea, bad implemented; most of weapon arts are bad comparing it to a 10% of weapons who have overpowered weapon arts

>it heavily reduces damage
You are thick as shit and are objectively wrong.

youtube.com/watch?v=W4Q8tlPOCPo
youtube.com/watch?v=ThMBbBFS41w
youtube.com/watch?v=2MKc9ejlUYs

>this is a good addition because it encourages dodging. the combat isn't fun when you're turtling.
It encourages mindless smashing of the roll button while the boss shits out his 10-hit flail.

>they're not. you're meant to use them to block difficult to dodge attacks
Literally no such thing as a difficult to dodge attack in DaS3. Just mash that roll.

DS1 Des and BB were good
Ds2 and Ds3 were money grabs and just garbage shit

Sorry, baby

definitely not

I disagree, only thing DS2 had was more weapon/armor variety, twinblades, and powersyanving. If it weren't for the lifegems, soul memory, and areas like the ones around brightstone caves are worse than lost izalith, which was at least cool because by then you reach the point where you're killing early game bosses as mobs. What I hate most about ds3 is how stamina and endurance aren't 1 stat, and the ninja flip boss movesets

Dark Souls 2 is ugly, has some really bad enemy placements (SoTFS), mostly boring bossfights and some forgettable NPCs.

No, 3 was much better.

>But this is literally DaS2.
No it isn't. DaS2 has the most weight, that's why it feels unresponsive to most people. There's delays and wind down times, just like in real life. You can't swing three times and then break into an animation-calcelling roll chain afterwards.

>Sorry DaS2 apologist but nobody thinks that shitty game has good animations.
They're still better than 3's, by a metric fuck ton too.

>Yhorn, get sword, 4 shot him.
>Greatwood tree is literally "ATTACK THE WEAKPOINT FOR MASSIVE DAMAGE"
>Wolnir is the same shit.
>First phase Nameless King is the same shit.
>Ancient Wyvern Boss is the same shit.

Then there's trash bosses that are coventous demon-tier:
>Crystal Sage
>Deacons
>Old Demon King
>Aldritch

This is nearly half the bosses in the game btw.

>>Yhorn, get sword, 4 shot him.
Or you could prove you have actual balls and fight him without the stormruler.
>>Greatwood tree is literally "ATTACK THE WEAKPOINT FOR MASSIVE DAMAGE"
1
>>Wolnir is the same shit.
2
>>First phase Nameless King is the same shit.
So killing the dragon he's riding is a gimmick?, and the best part is its not even that hard.
>>Ancient Wyvern Boss is the same shit.
You dont need to do the plunge, that was your choice.
I literally only see 2 bosses that were gimmicks.

>Or you could [spend all day fighting through his absurd defense while dodging his simplistic attacks if you] fight him without the stormruler.

Unless you're autistic and enjoy doing boring, repetitive tasks, he's a gimmick boss.

They can make more.

>Or you could prove you have actual balls and fight him without the stormruler.
I did you retard. The Stormruler gimmick just made the tedium of that fight even worse. It's not even a good fight.

>So killing the dragon he's riding is a gimmick?
Yes. Everything about that first phase is a gimmick. It's there to pad the fight.

>You dont need to do the plunge, that was your choice.
You realize that the fight has a gimmick whether you choose to do the gimmick or not, right? The fights were designed with that stupid gimmick in mind. No amount of reaction images is going to change that.

>>Unless you're autistic and enjoy doing boring, repetitive tasks, he's a gimmick boss.

No he isn't man, Hit his hands to deal more damage. The way you want to take down two of these bosses is your choice, you just choose the easier way and there's nothing wrong with that.

I need my daily shitting on Dark Souls 2 to get me through.

Das2 sucks dick. And 3 is just okay.

3 is what we SHOULD have gotten after Dark Souls 1. Fuck Dark Souls 2. It's garbage and it was being made at the same time as Bloodborne too. I guess all the talented people were working on BB instead.

you only like dark souls 3 because it has bonfires every 5 minutes

you only dislike dark souls 2 because you can't handle enemy mobs

dark souls 2 wins here because it doesn't treat you like a diapered baby

Reminder that PVP is the only replayability these games have, and if the PVP is garbage, then there's no reason to play the game again.

Let's not forget ">playing for the story / PVE"
Dark Souls 3 has NO story and every area is a linear brown and grey shitfest.

>Reminder that PVP is the only replayability these games have
but that's wrong

So tell me is this supposed to be something?

It feels like they just took bloodborne and ripped the soul out of it.

DS2 at least felt interesting and had heart put into it, if a little flawed.

Explain.

Reinstalling Scholar. Ask me anything.

pick a different class, use different weapons, take other starting gifts

I can agree that you're a massive faggot who should kill himself for making a "now that the dust has settled" thread.

>Unless you're autistic and enjoy doing boring, repetitive tasks, he's a gimmick boss.
almost every single boss in DS2

RIGHT DOWN THE ROAD

But what's the appeal of making a build if you can't share it online with other players? In fact, if you're online, you'll always be making sure your build is PvP viable because of the fact that you can be invaded at any moment.

the fuck is a gimmick boss

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>But what's the appeal of making a build if you can't share it online with other players?

playing the game?

Oh yeah
and Ds2 is better than Ds1

But you've already played the game. What now? Attack enemies, but this time a blue buff of smoke comes out of them?

>But you've already played the game. What now?
I play it again.

Listen, kiddo, back in my day, we used to give games multiple playthroughs, especially when they give you options for playing the game differently. We didn't just rush through the game for the cheevos and send it back to gamefly.

Except when it comes to a bland soulless game like DS3, not even the Souls fanbase wants to touch it again. At this point, it's full of normies.

You don't know what a gimmick is my son. It's OK to feel embarrassed, just try harder next time.

At least as a blue sentinel I could invade sinners in ds2, i enjoy 3, but holy shit blue summons are so rare it's insane.

And the darkmoons and sentinels do the same thing. Now if there'd been a blue orb for the darkmoons and summons for the sentinels...

Also, weapon arts are cool, but power stance was cooler.

I'm playing it for the first time at the moment, at nearly 40 hours in I'm pretty confident that I like it more than 2, which I think was blatantly inferior to 1.

>Hit feet.
>Deal ~50 damage
>Hit hands
>Deal ~110 damage
>Boss has 27k health.
Quality DaS3 boss fight.

Not even the most disappointing either. Everyone on Sup Forums constantly sperged over Pontiff and he was one of the easier fights in the game despite his random anime attacks. I didn't even know he had a clone phase until I watched a friend fight him, because it dies before he even finishes summoning it, or he doesn't summon it at all because he dies so damn fast.

>Also, weapon arts are cool, but power stance was cooler.
It helps that Power Stance was useful and cool, while most weapon arts are completely fucking worthless.

Ds1>ds3=ds2
Ds3 is superior to ds2 in so many aspects but is way too linear and no fun to replay.

I didn't even know Soul of Cinder could change his weapon in his first phase because I melted him on my first playthrough. I also thought the Gwyn transformation was fucking stupid and saw it as nothing more than even MORE fanservice that the game was shoving in my face.

>Ds3 is superior to ds2 in so many aspects
How so? Serious question.

>all the games in the series did something really well and unique to other dark souls games
>they will never be combined into the true dark souls experience
feels bad

Nope.
DS2 is still the weakest game in the soulsborne collective by a large margin.

DS2 children are now old enough to write their shitty toddler opinions on the internet, nothing to see here.

not that guy, but just to name a few:
better graphics (not sure if it's that important though)
better bosses (generally)
better world cohesion

They'd have to get rid of so much of 3 to create a well made Dark Souls combination game. DaS3's combat is so far removed from anything else in the Soulsborne series that it's basically just some wanna-be action game with shitty controls and no jump button.

It completely lost the spirit of what made DeS and DaS1 so memorable, and even though DaS2 is pretty "quality" it at least tried a lot of new and interesting things and went in its own direction. DaS3 was just pandering combined with the table scraps from BB.


>DS2 children are now old enough to write their shitty toddler opinions on the internet
DaS1 and 2 are barely more than two years apart you chucklefuck.

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>2
shit core gameplay but innovates on a lot
>3
great core gameplay (apart from a few issues) but adamantly refuses to take any kind of risks

Such is life

>better world cohesion
I will never understand this in regard to DaS3. The areas in DaS3 weren't handled any better than DaS2's, save for the fact that you can see them from one another, sometimes. Which has no impact on anything. The lore about them is also nonsensical and no zone directly impacts the other anyway. There's also the fact that you are forced to teleport to various other areas because they're not even physically linked together.

"World cohesion" is a completely moot point that's only even mentioned because DaS2's world layout made no sense.

>gwaffix

>better world cohesion
>one long brown turd
>superior

>Dark Souls 3 did something really well and unique to the other Dark Souls games
Yeah like uh...
um...
er...

It was unique in that it had nothing to add.

the only thing it added was not looking like complete ass and having some semblance of a lighting system

the only Souls games after Demon's Souls that actually did anything new were Dark Souls 1 and Bloodborne.

wait a second, isn't that laser identical to Midir's?

yeah, but I think Midir's is more of an homage to Shin Godzilla.

>some semblance of a lighting system
And yet it managed to be the most desaturated and washed out of all the games in the series. How does From fuck this shit up?

Powerstance, Ascetics, and useful covenants, were all hallmarks of DaS2 that no other Soulsborne games have.

Dark souls 3 have epic bosses creative shortcuts deep npcs and good design overall. That is why ds2 falls short, keep crying ds2 fags have some taste

Remember when you could powerstance in Bloodborne? Remember how if you wanted to fight one of the many great Bloodborne bosses again all you had to do was use an item at the lamps? Remember how you could choose to still get invaded in an area, even after you killed that area's boss?

2 had objectively the best covenents in the series, while at the same time fucking up reds and blues worse than they've ever been
although they never even attempted to fix blues in 3, despite giving them 2 whole covenants
Rats and bongbros should have been brought back and I'll never get over how FROM thought the wolves and faithful were good substitutes. Hell, they're not even as good as the hunters from 1 because the areas aren't designed for pvp defense at all

Just an Action RPG with a few good level designs and bosses is a pretty shallow thing to ask for in a Souls game.

DS2 is shit.
>movement is complete garbage, like a drunken turtle in comparison to the player characters of the other games, from the weapon impact sounds to the simple movement, rolling and swinging weapons. No weight to it
>bosses are complete filler
>fanservice everywhere, with bosses having descriptions that remount to " 'member this guy from DS1? i 'member" without anything else
>Lots of bosses with boring, uninspired movesets that feel almost identical to the normal mobs throughout the level, and to each other.
>soundtrack is embarrassingly bad
>levels are boring. There are a lot of them but none of them have any real amount of branching paths, secrets, shortcuts, etc (except the Gutter). The majority of them are nothing but glorified hallways filled with nothing but dudes to fight. No reward for exploration.
>environments are repeated texture ad nauseum with no decorations
>Fucked up geography.
>Soul Memory

I really love DS3, but am I the only one who hated almost every single boss fight? They were almost all terrible and frustrating, or ridiculously easy. I died to the Demon King at least 20 times, not because he's a hard boss, but because I couldn't see what was happening on the fucking screen with his fire effect. That happened on too many bosses too, lothric princes were annoying because they would always teleport off screen and hit me, same thing with the nameless king, during his first phase I literally couldn't see his swings because the dumb dragon filled up the screen. It was either that, or they were piss easy. I beat the Saint of the Deep fight on my first try after accidentally stumbling into the arena with 2 flasks left, and I beat the high lord without even getting hit once. Great game, but really fucking disappointing boss fights.

DS3>>DS2>>>>SHIT>SotFS

2 wasn't just a bad souls game
It was garbage game in general

>teleport off screen
Pretty sure your lockon stays locked on when he teleports most of the time, and when it doesn't he's doing a big wind up so you've got time to find him
demon king, nameless, and midir all have the issue of breaking lockon for no reason, but none of the other bosses do. Maybe throw in cursed greatwood since his arms are above the camera when you're in close

>basically a normal fag with secret niche autism
>If I don't like the end result of my character's progression and primary weapons at end of game I must redo it
>for example, a primary pole arm user that suddenly uses something like a ultra great sword on the side
>replayed the entire game at least 4 times in a row with 95% of the same weapons and build to get the right feeling
I'm aware of how much time I'm wasting for something so meaningless with no variation,
and yet I can't stop being compelled.

>fanservice everywhere, with bosses having descriptions that remount to " 'member this guy from DS1? i 'member" without anything else

You and I both know you're just baiting with a deflection of a common complaint about Dark Souls 3. There are no overwhelming examples of this outside Old Dragonslayer and Oswald whereas in Dark Souls 3 they reuse whole locations and infinitely more characters.

>soundtrack is embarrassingly bad

I used to think so, honestly because I hadn't made it very far into the game and hadn't heard many of them, but I can tell now it's certainly not a weak soundtrack by any means especially as the game goes on, which I recall is also the case in the first Dark Souls.

>levels are boring. No reward for exploration.

Dark Souls 2 has nearly as much blind exploration as DaS. More than most other games in the series. There's chests and hidden jumps and breakable walls out the ass and I have 2 saves where I completely finished the base game and DLC and I'm still finding shit. Exploration is definitely not an issue at all in the game.

The only game in the series I can honestly say I cleared out completely my first playthrough is Dark Souls 3 and that's because there are no fucking chests and no secrets. Items are directly in front of you the whole time.

still no. contrarianism knows no bounds

You know you can respec your character right? There's no need to replay the game.

>implying fatrolling isn't enough of a nerf
Havel set isn't an easy win, it's the result of a well-made strength build. After dying twice to O&S, I said fuck it, put on the full set, tanked damage while moving slowly and playing as aggressively as possible, and won with a sliver of my health and no estus. It was an incredibly tense boss fight, not an easy win.