So...

So, I'm currently playing through Final Fantasy 7 (I never got past disk 1 when I was a kid) and I'm finding it really interesting...

Basically, most of the dialogue dialogue in the game is fucking mental.

I've just met Cid, an engineer who wants to go into space, right? I meet his wife, Shera.

I go back to their place. Cid storms through the door.

CID: Shera. What are you, blind!? We got gusts!! GET SOME TEA

SHERA: I...I'm sorry."

Cloud and the gang stand there, pretty awkwardly. "Really," he says, "don't mind us."

After essentially telling us to sit the fuck down and drink out tea, he shouts "Damn, I'm pissed!"

Aeries asks if he's always like this. She's consumed by self-doubt. "It's my fault," she says. "I ruined his dream."

Flashback to Cid watching his wife work away at the rocket, telling her to get her ass in gear and that she "works like a snail."

Everything's getting prepared for the big rocket launch and Cid's ego-fuelled space exploration adventure. His wife couldn't get something finished in time. She's still working away while he's attempting to take off. Obviously, he's wondering what she's still doing down there, and tells her she's obviously going to be killed if she's in this area while the ship takes off.

Her response is pretty much "I get how much you're into this. I'm cool about dying"

But hey, guess who pushed the emergency engine shut down switch and aborted the mission, saving her life in the process? Good guy Cid.

And now for some reason, he's justified in treating and talking to his wife like shit?

Am I meant to like this character? He really seems like a self absorbed sack of shit that will turn heel later in the game because of some silly bullshit

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Shera isn't his wife you fucking IDIOT

>reddit spacing
but yes you are meant to like him. he's an old man still working on his dreams, has fuck all reason to help you and does so anyway, loves Shera and wants to protect her but has a foul mouth, a smoking habit and wants to see the stars more than anything else.

If you had ever had a goal in your life you'd know being a cunt it's a detriment to getting it.

>>reddit spacing
You know this meme is used by Reddit?

For some reason I feel like this thread is bait and probably copied from a reddit post.

There's nothing wrong with the post or anything, it's just that Sup Forums is such a hivemind of edgy teenagers that OP's lack of autism, misogyny and Sup Forums buzzwords makes it look suspect.

Its revealed in Dirge of Cerburus that they are.

>reddit spacing
fuck off Buckley, no one really wants to read a wall of text.

Nah. Cid's a prick at first

He's meant to be a crotchety old guy, it's endearing. The lovable asshole veteran kind of like a Vietnam vet or some shit. Stop being so fucking pozzed up with your Redditisim that the first conclusion you jump to is "muh wifebeating" "m-m-muh toxic masculinity"

seems like a realistic portrayal of a dysfunctional relationship

They get married after ff7s events. They're not even together before then

>implying Cid didnt hate fuck Shera every night

Reading the OP just reminds me how much they'll probably fuck up Cid's character in the remake.

There's no such thing as reddit spacing, faggot. Write however the fuck you want.

>old

I never thought about it much as a kid but when I got older I realized how hilarious it is that the game treats Cid like some old washed up one foot in the grave motherfucker when he's only 32. And it doesn't even seem like the FF7 world has a particularly low life expectancy or anything.

>Basically, most of the dialogue dialogue in the game is fucking mental.

That's due to godawful translation

Well no shit you hate him. You're obviously supposed to. But you know, character development.

Is FF7 Cid best Cid?

Yes. Also best Highwind

Ariana fags are going to rip your ass apart

FF7's story is pretty overrated. The game is a weird mess of side plots that feel like total distractions from the main plot.

I agree. I seen fans cry at the loss of that one horrible character and I was laughing my ass off. I will never understand the cult behind this boring ass FF game. This might be one of the worst out there. Red 7?....the dog was cool.

Most FF7 fans don't praise the game for its story, pretty much everyone acknowledges that it's a mess. However in terms of setting and world building it's pretty much unrivaled compared to other games in the series, the materia system was pretty fun and the dialogue and characters were pretty damn charming, even with all their flaws. Couple that with a fucking amazing soundtrack and you got one of the most memorable experiences in gaming, at least to most people.

Cid is the true hero of FF7 he gets shit done when the fag of the team goes and gets himself handicapped.

They would be wrong to do so to him. Ricard is also better.

That singer they shilled in the mobile game?

What? Ariana Highwind from FFXV

>reddit spacing
holy kek what a cuck

Aranea

Yeah whatever. I didn't like anyone in the game besides Ardyn.

Who are you kidding? Yuffie is the real hero. The bitch is only 16 years old and has absolutely no personal stake in the conflict, but she dives right down into that fucking open wound on the planet to fight an insanely powerful alien invader and her husband's son, despite not even knowing if it would even make a bit of difference to Meteor. Yuffie has bigger balls than any other character in the game.

Yuffie is a dimwit with kleptomania

The Wutai side quest exists because of her she may not be the hero, but she is the villain

yes

no

No, Vincent is the true villain. His complete lack of a personality, a spine, and a set of balls caused his girlfriend to become so fucking thirsty and desperate that she slept with Hojo of all people. Hojo. All of this could have been avoided if Vincent weren't a pathetic sack of shit.

its a good game

Who needs a spine when you can kill the super boss with 1 shot. always trust the guy with the gun and everything will be alright.

>implying any woman could resist Hojo's mutant mega cock after the Jenova symbiosis

How can other specimens even compete?

Hojo never actually injected cells into himself until late in FF7, unless one of the shitty spin-offs retconned that or something. So Vincent, the tall, dark, handsome special agent with a cool suit, awesome guns, and good pay was so pathetic he drove his girlfriend into the arms of a scrawny, pale, hunched, greasy-haired, fivehead scientist with thick glasses and no jenova megacock.

My favorite aspect of the FFVII script is how it adapts hero's journey tropes into an existential crisis. Cloud vs. Sephiroth is man vs. his own idealized image of himself, where Cloud is a SOLDIER wannabe in the image of the Sephiroth (because he wants to impress a girl with big tits) and Sephiroth is both literally and figuratively God

To elaborate, Sephirot[h] is the very peak of the Kabbalah and the earliest premise for a God in the western/Judaic sense

I'm pretty sure Cid eventually realizes how much of a jackass he was being and apologizes. Give it time, OP. Of course he's still kind of an asshole but not every character is meant to be perfect. Flaws and differences in their mindset are just another aspect to their story.

>people got more upset over Cid treating Shera like the slow cunt she is than Barret killing hundreds of innocent people in terrorist explosions
What a world

This. People don't understand how smart FF7's story really is. All of the things you mentioned tie in thematically to the themes of identity and internal struggle. Identity is merely a vessel for traversing the world, and Cloud has his sense of self shattered multiple times, so he has to discover his true self (with the help of Tifa, and I guess Aeris) in order to solve the ultimate conflict.

Drives me nuts when people say Midgar was the only good part of the game. They don't know shit.

I've been giving FF7 my first honest playthrough (a couple times before I've gotten to the dress part, this is the first time I've been past that), and even though it's been spoiled to hell and back to me I really like the story. Actually, even though I'm riddled with spoilers I feel like that makes the game even better, since I've never personally experienced the smaller moments that people usually don't mention. It's really fun to see Cloud's memories or Tifa's careful questioning of Could and go "OHHH I SEE". I've often been of the opinion that a spoiler can't truly ruin a good story and this one seems to be holding up. The biggest problem is that I just can't shake the thought of "I wonder how badly they'll bastardize this in the remake" whenever I get to a boss or story bit I like.

The game's translation is pretty awful.

Maternity/matriarchy is a huge theme, too. Sakiguchi's mother died irl when he was planning the game and it became an inspiration. The Sephiroth/Jenova relationship is an obvious example, and I maintain heavily that Aeris' relationship with Cloud was mostly maternal (she never stopped being in love with Zack and at most was confused because Cloud thought he literally WAS Zack for most of the game). But the dream cutscene before the Forest of the Ancients carries a very maternal vibe to it, a kind of, "You just stay in bed and I'll handle everything" message.

I don't think 7's world building is that amazing honestly. The plot is probably its strong point imo.

Yeah. That makes sense, I can see Aeris as more of the maternal figure that Cloud was seeking, but in a way that was him validating his weakness.

A lot of it is how disjointed and separate the main plot points between Cloud and Sephiroth are from the world building elements with the Shinra. I can sort of see why some people think the game gets weaker after Midgar, through that entire section the threat and the player's motivations are crystal clear, but then you do the motorcycle part and everyone just decides to follow Cloud following Sephiroth for unclear reasons.

In a flashback Cloud's mom tells him he should find an older woman to avoid temptations. Aeris is 22, one year older than Cloud.

You finish midgar, walk 50 steps get to kalm watch the flashback and immediately have motivation to track down sephiroth.

When you say temptation, I think it is more like she wanted him to stay out of trouble. And IIRC she said he should find someone that would take care of him, because Cloud is the sort of person that wont take care of himself, or will get himself into bad situations.

I suppose the interesting thing about Aeris in that way is that she was the maternal figure while also the one sucking Cloud into a bad situation. She was like a paradox. So all of that stuff, her dying, is all along the way to Cloud finding his true identity.

If you never play past Midgar you miss out on the most pointless cheeky gag in the game, Barret's hometown being infested with bombs that carry right arms.

The only thing mental is your fucking spacing.

OKe oké oke, midgar and juno naval base

OP is a normalfag.
KYS PLS

Getting spoiled on everything is great for stories with a ton of foreshadowing.

all heroes have flaws

No I don't think it is. We're supposed to think less of Cid for how he acts. He even realizes she was right all along during the huge materia thing and starts treating her differently.

It's essentially Heidegger's Being and Time philosophy condensed into anime shit.

Imagine being so afraid of being called reddit that anytime you see properly spaced text used for ease of reading and comprehension, you spout buzzwords.

>"There are so many temptations in the city... I'd feel so much better if you settled down and found a nice girl. Maybe someone older than you?"

Quoting from memory. It's definitely a paradox, because his mother is making a romantic recommendation towards a character that ultimately serves a maternal role as well. Cloud-Tifa-Aeris is the love triangle where Tifa is the clear choice for having roots in his childhood as well as, you know, not dying. But it adds an oedipal angle to his relationship with Aeris that serves as all the more obligation for him to uphold her memory by the end of the game.

Still unclear if Cloud's means of meeting her again as he alludes to in the ending is referring to some ritual suicide shit since she obviously died and he obviously went into the planet's actual veins to meet her soul

Hopefully he won't have the pube beard he had in Advent Children.

Its just bad writing, all japanese games have it

The most important thing is that it depends on stories not just puling shit out of their ass. From the moment Tifa first "innocently" asked cloud about something from their shared childhood I could see what she was actually trying to figure out. The way she so lightly pressures Cloud for details and shirks when he gets stressed says it all. It's easy to tell the difference between a story that decided the twist afterwards and a story that planned it from the beginning, and with all the flaws this one definitely had it's twist planned out as far as I can tell.

Do you want every single character in fiction to the upstanding definition of morality?

How boring would that be?

You guys are so ready to pull the trigger on the "it's different they ruined it" shit. The original had such a shitty translation that I'll be pissed if they don't go back to the original material and retranslate everything.

Evangelion had a huge cult following at the time, can you blame them?

you fuckwit I'm gonna spoil it for you now

He doesn't believe her that the ship isn't ready to take off because she's checked the air tank already several times.
They can't reschedule the launch because that's not how space travel works and they'd have to wait several months and Shinra are fags.
So in disk 2 once you go into space cid finally looks at the air tank and sees that yes he was wrong and Shera was right and finally forgives her after he realises she was trying to save his life rather than just get in the way by over worrying.

Can you cite what's wrong with the translation besides typos?

I'm not antagonizing, I've been genuinely curious what differences in the script there are for a long time now. Could never find anything online about it.

oh for fucks sake I didn't notice this

Is there any point to left image besides scoring in-game brownie points for the dating part? I don't remember the treasure exactly but I don't recall it being all that great.

I don't speak japanese so I don't have detailed lists. But just go play through the game. Some conversations straight up don't make sense and a large portion of them sound like two ESLs talking to each other. The "This guy are sick" thing is indicative of a lot of the translation. Gungnir is translated as "Gunge lance" and there are many other issues.

I don't think they necessarily butchered original intentions too often, but it's just a pain to read through, I'm replaying the game right now and I had forgotten how bad it was.

>besides typos

a simple no would have sufficed

dunno why you're making it about Vincent when it's his gf's decision

phoenix downs

I think you are right about the maternal role and that there is some romantic recommendation which confuses Cloud, and yeah, the Oedipal angle where its like Cloud is trying to fit Aeris into the maternal role due to loneliness or weakness.

I think the paradox as to why Aeris is the incorrect choice is more complex but also more elegant than just her dying though. That would just make Tifa the choice by a meaningless default, but its not about that. Its because Aeris was a crutch to Cloud, keeping him from finding his true identity (all the complications with Cloud and Zack and stuff). So even though they had an affinity, it was not what he truly needed. Ironically its her death that does sort of rectify the paradox and push Cloud to finding himself (and Tifa)

That said, the blind defenders of the game are fucking hilarious. I once said "FF7 is shit" in one of Neverwinter's general chats and got blocked by four people on the spot.

It's on the same level as Shinra mansion's basement having an enemy that's one body with two heads, and the safe containing a boss that's split into different sides at the middle. And they even have names like Ying/Yang and Lost Number. And then the game does it again right before the crater by having a bossfight literally named Schizo, again with two heads. They really wanted to make it obvious.

Syntax isn't a typo. That's what I was indicating with the "two esl's having a conversation" thing. I'm not going to boot up the game and run around town to find an example. The conversations don't sound natural.

Yeah, I mean even the monsters in the game play on these ideas of identity, existentialism, and mental illness. I guess you could say the yin/yang or the Schizo boss symbolizes order and chaos between the truth and the lie. Thats why its crucial to find your true self, otherwise you wont be strong enough to defeat the dragon (Sephiroth)

Dude you know what I'm getting at. I'm looking for inconsistencies from the source material. The fact that the game was clearly translated by people with a tenuous grasp on English is, if anything, all the more evidence that Square of Japan translated it themselves (since Ted Woolsey got fired) and is MORE accurate to the substance of the source material, despite grammatical errors (read: typos. Stop being pedantic).

fun fact, a high pitched ringing of the ears is an irl indicator of an oncoming psychotic/manic episode. There's a high pitched ringing most times that Cloud suffers a breakdown in-game (the first one before planting the bomb in the first reactor comes to mind, complete with a text overlay depicting the voice in his head).

I meant it more literally, that Cloud has multiple sides/personalities that are being suppressed or locked away.

Yeah Square translated it themselves afaik. People who have a shitty grasp of a language will struggle to get their ideas across so it's hard to say how accurate it is. I also think that sounding natural is quite important. I don't like reading that stilted stiff dialogue that poor japanese translations contain.

You can read some of the issues that the dude who did the beacause translation found if you care.

What I want to know is whether the breakdown sequences are meant to depict Cloud confronting his own former self or the remnants of Zack that lie dormant in his memory. The optional flashback sequence shows them in two test tubes side-by-side; while it doesn't make a lot of sense in a strictly feasible science fiction setting, the imagery definitely lends credence to a sort of "supplanting one's consciousness for another" element. Was Cloud's identity crisis a product of the experiments done on him or the crumbling of his own ego? Was it both and the latter made him all the more prime of a candidate for the experiments? Did he imitate Zack with full cognizance and mislead his colleagues on purpose out of shame for how weak he truly was, and the guilt that he killed his personal hero with his own hands?

>Husbands son....
Yuffie's a KEK!?!?!?!

if Square translated it themselves then I'm not too concerned. I love FFIII, but the translations from those games are notorious for cutting out entire chunks of script so everything can fit on the cartridge. With a disc based medium this isn't a concern. So at this point, I'm convinced the script is fully accurate to the original writers' intentions and just shittily translated in a grammatical sense.

>Gunge Lance
This would be so cool if it was literally a lance caked in toxic gunge or something.

I love mistranslations like this despite them being objectively bad and dumb sounding. Golden Sun had lots of them. Adds some unique and mysterious charm to an RPG otherwise full of bland, boring, stale shit.
>"Fire Blessing" instead of Fire Breath
>"Death Size" instead of Death Scythe
>"Formina Sage" instead of Fulminous Edge

You know that if you poorly understand a language you're not capable of adequately expressing concepts right? Some japanese dude with piss poor english can't possibly articulate himself properly. And they obviously agree the translation was shit because they changed their methods.

I have no evidence of this being the case besides grammatical errors where the overall point is still clear. And I would still take this over content from the script being cut entirely, anyday.

I think we all desire more unique and creative names in RPGs.

Where was I suggesting that? I just said I want a new decent translation from people with a firm grasp of both languages.

An example I just found is Sephiroth telling Cloud "don't worry" when the original concept was something closer to "nevermind" or "it's not important". Don't worry has a context of sympathy in english that likely wasn't intended for the scene. Is that the kind of shit you care more about?

Most of these seemed pretty cut and dry to me.
Cloud is talking to his "real self" in the breakdown scenes, his inner child you could say. His identity crisis was probably both a result of both having a weak ego/low selfesteem at the time and being injected with jenova's cells turning him into a retard for a while. Zack dying on top of everything else after they escape probably made the whole experience extremely traumatic for him, which is why he ends up the way that he did in midgar, totally messed up in the head.

Zack and Cloud took out Sephiroth somehow which is why they would have been experimented on by hojo imo. or he could have just did it for kicks since he was a sick bastard anyways

And no, it wasn't on purpose, that much should be obvious. He didn't kill zack with his own hands, but he must have felt bad about it afterwards since he found it easier to "erase" zack and merge his experiences (or perceived experiences) into his own identity

you're in luck

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lol I don't understand this adversarial attitude. all I asked was if you knew of any significant differences in the scripts and you made it clear all you know is typos and cultural crap like this. FFVII's translation has a reputation for being WILDLY different from the original script yet there is no evidence for this anywhere

not defending the original work as Shakespeare or anything but I think it gets a bad rap. especially since PC ports fix most of this shit

Here's my take on it. His Identity crisis isn't strictly a product of either the experienents or the breakdown of his ego, but both together, as well as Zacks death. It's all the traumaization mixed together. From there, in an extremely weakened mental state, he has to craft a new identity, like some severely wounded animal hiding in a cave to recouperate. But it's not physical, it's mental, and it's not something like he did it purposefully and is misleading people, he did it in order to keep himself together and be able to interact in the world because his previous identity was shattered (like I said earlier identity is just a vessel of being). So Clouds "vessel" is quantifiably bits and pieces of Zack and himself and all sorts of fucked up shit mixed up together. The way to fix all this is to understand all of the fragments (this is where Tifa comes in, by jumping into what can be described as the sum of all identities and all existence, ever) and it's how Cloud is able to put everything back together. And it's not really that he is just Cloud again, he understands that Zack is a quantifiable part of him, but that is also who Cloud is.

>TFW play this as a kid
>"Laglace Sword" sounds really cool
>Lag-Lace, Lag-less, either is great
>become adult
>re-play FFTA
>get this weapon
>realize it's "LaGlace" as in an ice elemental sword

It sounded way cooler the first time...

I agree with this that the voices in his head that you see from time to time are his true self.