Name one game in which weapon durability is actually a fun concept

Name one game in which weapon durability is actually a fun concept.

Weapon durability is never a fun concept.

I wish more games had weapon durability. I like the idea of weapons becoming weaker the more you use them and the tactical thing being to constantly grab new weapons as you fight like a full on kung fu movie

Demon's Souls
At least, when you're the one doing the scraping it is

Dead rising.

Stalker

STALKER since it's gradual and manageable but can fuck you over if you get lazy or spend your shekels poorly, at least before you become rich as fuck.
Rimworld for the reasons above and it gives you a reason to collect spoils and make your own weapons.

Monster hunter... I guess?

BOTW because of the critical hit system
peoples actual problems with it is the clunky inventory system

Slightly toned down degradation in Far Cry 2 is great. Nothing like having your trusty gun jam in a pinch.

BOTW
Mostly because you have a throw move to spend the rest of a weapons durability.
Godhand also did it well, since the objects you pick up do not last very long, and you also got a throw move to spend the last durability.

Botw

Demon's Souls, when I'm the one with a scraping spear

BotW actually does it worse than any other game.

I liked that in DS 2 I actually felt I should carry a second weapon, at least like a dagger or one of the smaller swords, or scimmy on dex builds. Made it feel more like roleplaying but eventually you start getting gear tht you don't even need to think about durability.

Breath of the Wild, Fire Emblem, Dark Souls

Breath of the Wild
Monster Hunter

This. It is always either too fast and just becomes a tedious chore to maintain, or it is too slow and becomes pointless. There is never a fun middle ground that actually adds something meaningful to gameplay; this is coming from someone who liked Far Cry 2's degradation.

These and Dying Light.

Monster Hunter and Dead Rising.

What do I win?

Streets of Rage / Fighting Force / any old-school brawler game where enemy weapon drops are an augment to the unarmed combat system that is your primary means of attack.

Really durability is a fine mechanic in any game where unarmed is a fun and viable strat.

Way of the Samurai, at least in the first two games. Which makes sense because you don't really block with a katana. Fact that you can only carry three weapons on you is what really makes you think HOW you're fighting.

>Have weapon durability
>Its only relevant for weapons with Special Moves that burns durability
>Introduce a resource for special moves
>Doesn't remove durability
why

I think it works fine in games like HALO, because you need to switch weapons because ammo types is not very universal.
I guess thats the only thing of value it brought to the genre of 2 weapon FPS games.
That said, games doesn't really do it as well as HALO ever did.

Dark Souls 1.
Weapons with ranged attacks like the Moonlight Greatsword use it as "ammo".
With all other weapons you pretty much never have to worry about your weapons being broken unless you come up against an enemy that specifically has corrosive attacks, which are exceptionally rare.

Idk, I like the way it works in New Vegas.

it's not supposed to be for fun. it's a goldsink.

>Breath of the Wild

I think it worked pretty well in the fire emblem games

This.
Also, breaking your opponent's sword is pretty fun.

Lol don't ever do a katana build then.

What does weapon degradation/durability have to do with HALO?

Durability isn't supposed to be fun.
It's a gameplay design for balance, and secondly in some games it might be there to appear realistic.

Weapon durability can be good if the game does not focus on progression and gear. The weapons must then be a means to a cause whether it is the story or some complex mechanical fighting system at which you improve and learn new moves.
In this case there is no need to be able to "fix" weapons. they just break and you pick a new one out of an assortment from dead enemies or allies/shops and each weapon has slightly differing moves.

>Durability isn't supposed to be fun.

Then why even include it?

But it's never like that. You just stop, open a menu, equip another weapon and repeat every time its durability get's low.

Botw tosses weapons at you so often that it's fun when your shit breaks also higher tier weapons often have better durability or damage modifiers so they break less often. Also there's armor sets that boost your damage with certain weapons making them break less basically you would have to be all all out drooling retard to bitch about durability in botw

Most people who complain about that mechanic are just plebs who want to rush into anything brainlessly, while the game is all about using your resources carefully and managing your inventory.

If weapons had infinite durability, then rushing to the castle after the tutorial would be no fun: just pick a high DPS sword (fairly easy to find in the castle) and you're done. But you can't, and you have to collect a good selection if you want to pass through the 4 shadows before Ganon.

weapon durability is never a "fun" concept its there to put some limitation on the player either by having to spend gold from time to time and/or forcing them to carry back up weapons from time to time.

>if you hate the mechanic it means you are bad at the game or stupid

I'm tired of this argument. It's just not fun.

Did you fail to read my post?
Obviously all game mechanics don't have to be there for fun.

What the fuck do you mean why.

Repairing weapons in the beginning was awful. Having to use 2 or 3 powders each floor. Got better later on but fuck was it bad early

Or they could have just not implemented the shit system and balanced the weapons accordingly, you mong.

But the goal should be that they are fun or satisfying in the end. It's plausible that a game that means more work, could be more fun through strategy, management, but this is not really the case with durability. If it never becomes fun, then what's the point

I wouldn't exactly call it fun, but Morrowind handled it well since there were several approaches to dealing with it. You could level up armorer and fix them yourself, repair at a shop or simply carry multiple weapons if you had the endurance. Your build affected how you dealt with it. Only thing to make it better would be an alteration spell to repair equipment.

>games are supposed to be fun
>intentionally include features that aren't fun in any way
>this is somehow a good thing

Go fight Ganon without upgrading health/stamina and without doing any divine creature. Then you'll understand what's the point of this game mechanic.

Ultima Online
>Repairs done by fellow players
>keeps the economy vibrant
>durability wears slowly
>unless hitting acid elementals
>>incites you to grab a friend who can deal with them OR pack more swords

Weapon durability is the least of BotW's problems, but it doesn't add much of anything.
>But you can get weapons to kill enemies to get better weapons to kill enemies to get better weapons...
I mean it's a pretty basic Sup Forumsidya cycle, the problem(s) being that BotW has very little in the way of actual instances where combat is required... so weapons aren't even a necessity, which would be cool, if I was playing an RPG and avoiding conflict was what I was RPing. Of course the elephant in the room is the game's legendary lack of enemy variety, which is the biggest nail in the coffin. Cleared one bokoblin camp, you've cleared them all. The room for the unexpected is nonexistent, the game shows its entire hand within the first 10 hours. The only difference is you'll have a different colored hand later on.
Also Flurry Rush is annoying. Not only does it not require any timing whatsoever, it slows down otherwise frantic battles, I.E. the only times when the game is good or at the very least thrilling.

Wish they would have come up with a funner method of traversal than pressing x to free climb.

Fire Emblem

The problem in that weapons in BotW have such little durability, that it becomes less about managing your inventory and more about just picking up whatever you see. It's ridiculous how quickly weapons break, your weapon will often break in one enemy encounter or two. Whenever I received a weapon reward (like for beating a divine beast) it's never that exciting because you know it will break in a few hits. It's like they knew combat in this game was very basic so they had to add fake-complexity by making the items break so quickly.

A much better sequel.

yeah it could work but you would need real fluid combat and some badass kung fu moves when you cant get a weapon

Fallout 3 & NV

I don't understand your post, you are talking about a totally different mechanic, upgrading hearts and abilities. That has nothing to do with weapon durability

Because you can usually use the weapons for quite a while before they require a repair, and repairing it actually gives you a "buff" since the gun will never jam above a certain percentage

The goal of a mechanic can be anything the dev wishes it to be.
Fun or entertainment are relative to what the game's inhibitors are - e.g. weapon durability, which can be used as a challenge.

I fuckin love me some NV but I still think they could have done durability better.

lets see...Diablo 2
Weapons with better quality had better durability and Damage/Defense Ouput
there was ONE skill that made a weapon lose a big chunk of durability in
you died, you lose a percentage of durability
exchange for a nasty ass damage multiplier
there were ethereal weapons that had sockets and better magic proprieties but could not be repaired
there was the a chance to make a weapon indestructible if it had high level or having the thing socketed with the most expensive and rare item in the game
but the fucking costs repair of high tier items were demential

it could had the potential to be honest, like a resource like in dark souls

Is death fun? Why do videogames include it?

While I agree that the combat system is basic (if anything, the weapon durability actually makes it more interesting for me), I think you exaggerate on the durability. Besides a few exception like royal guard weps which are meant to break in a few hits, other weapons are pretty durable and can be used for several encounters (royal soldier weps, those which are golden, are a godd example) or a whole boss.

The idea is that in that scenario, you will have to plan things carefully or even fully explore the Castle because you can't use the master sword. In that scenario, you are actually more active than just picking a good weapon by chance, then doing the boss rush and that's it.

but it's designed as an inconvenience

Actually yes it is fun because it would be less fun without it

Such is not the same with weapon durability

What does success feel like when there is no chance of failure?
Its bland, empty and meaningless

Games that include weapon durability as a feature would be less fun without them. Is what happens when you design a game around a certain quality.

I really liked weapon durability in the latest Zelda (except for shield surfing which damaged shields too fast).

If that’s from the Witcher3 then you’re fucking wrong lass. That was the most overly complex unfun and fast durability system of all time.

>save all of my high-tier weapons for late-game because I might need them
>save all of my money because I might need them in the late-game
>end up overequipped for the final chapter with plenty of money on hand still

Its just not fun to always have to go into the inventory when playing the game. For a game focused so much on exploration its really annoying

you are now back to level 1 weapons because that golem broke your weapon in one hit. Bye-bye, Lamb sword.

Most games with weapon durability would indeed be more fun without it.

Kung Fu movies very rarely change weapons because they break. They get knocked away, dropped to move onto a different scene etc.

Theres no real way to replicate that in video games other than having an ammo count that can't be replenished forcing you to pick up any old shit on the fly.

Its really just fucking lazy design like always, its a short cut.

Durability bar needs to be generous enough that you can vanish in to fights for ages and ages without worrying about it. You also can't make it so the person feels like they have to go way out of their way to fix it. Portable options at least are a necessity even if they exist at some sort of premium, but not an overly costly one. Make going back in to towns for repairs, compared to portable options, either very cheap as to be basically free or genuinely free.

Basically, balanced so someone isn't constantly revolving their adventuring around the idea of it, but enough so that if you TOTALLY IGNORE IT you'll suddenly find yourself with a problem you can't fix an hour or two later or something. So easy to keep up with that it's easy just to FORGET it's there and screw yourself with plain negligence.

Weapon durability isn't a fun "challenge" though, it's just tedium that pads out a game and makes the combat less fun and finding new weapons less rewarding (this is especially the case in BotW)
It's up to a player whether they die or not. Shit like weapon durability is up to the game, about an arbitrary gauge that determines when a weapon the player is using becomes unusable.

System Shock 2 had an aggressive, but otherwise functional durability system. Infinite durability pistols and assault rifles aside, it was a mechanic that very strongly motivated you to use the melee weapons, saving your guns for more important fights. Normally, this sort of crutch walking would be a negative, but it tuned well to SShock 2's survival horror arrangement.

It was total bullshit, don't get me wrong. Literal artificial difficulty. But SShock 2 was never really meant to be a fun, fair game.

STALKER.
An ideal weapon durability system would involve weapons breaking down and becoming permanently worse through wear, but in the same vein it would allow you to improve and repair your weapons through care. Moreso than just banging on it with a "repair hammer".

>ammo is a type of degradation
Holy shit

Well, we can discuss whether X game did it right or not. But the point is, adding challenge makes playing a game more exciting, that's why game designers experiment with WD. Sadly, it is usually a dissapointment because it requires a lot of adjusting.

1(ONE) mechanic turns BOTW from a fun adventure game into an inventory manager simulator and yet you actually defend it.

>do 10 swings with a weapon
>already need to repair it, even if your hits missed the target

controversial opinion
durability was fun in breathe of the wild

they made it so shit that you never got attached so it felt great when you lobbed a greatsword at some fucks dome and had it shatter into pieces and doing a ton of damage

Monster Hunter, since weapons have stages of sharpness that determine how much damage you're doing and what you can and cannot hit through. Also re-sharpening a weapon isn't expensive or a hassle, it's a risk/reward system where you can decide whether you want to stick with your current sharpness to deal slightly less damage or to sharpen your weapon mid-battle to do the maximum amount of damage.
The sharpness usually lasts long enough to not be tedious and it rewards you with being able to hit through tough parts of a monster that usually results in your weapon bouncing and losing sharpness more quickly. The bouncing feature also limits what parts of a monster you can hit, rewarding you for acquiring sharper weapons.

>weapon gets destroyed straight away when it hits 0% durability
>it doesn't just get put in your inventory so you can repair it later

>bouncing
>ever

>games are supposed to be fun

The mentality of a child everyone.

This is literally the only game I know, and that's because it actively punishes players for not being strategic.

>they made it so shit that you never got attached
Nah, I always hoarded good weapons for when I came across lynels/hinox.
I just used shitty weapons to beat down any small monsters I needed to.
Actually come to think of it, the durability system lead me to avoid combat in BotW because the rewards for breaking a couple of weapons were so meager that I only ever fought the larger monsters for the better rewards.

I like weapon degradation is Far Cry 2. Made things interesting.

Fire Emblem. Makes you think twice before using that super awesome weapon with only 15 durability. Awakening and Fates lost some of the charm by being able to use your best weapons all the time.

>"durability forced players to be tactical"
>low durability on ultra high output weapons
>literally EVERYONE favors sustainability over a few more points of attack power
>no one picks low durability weapons

Fine, if you don't like the word "fun", we'll use "entertaining"
>games are supposed to be entertaining
>intentionally include feature that is in no way entertaining
>this is somehow a good thing

>New vegas apologia on Sup Forums has gone THIS far
This needs to stop PRONTO

>Halo
What the fuck are you talking about? Running out of ammo doesn't count as weapon degradation.

...

Weapon durability can be entertaining.

Don't forget better damage, and the game provides IMMERSIVE methods of keeping things repaired if you bother to skill/perk in to repairing. You don't just take it to a guy and forget about it for another few hours of gameplay.

Jury rigging isn't immersive at all.

Hold E to equip

When it's done correctly, maybe.
But very, VERY few games do it correctly.
In the vast majority of games that include it it's tedious as fuck and adds nothing but frustration