Why is "savescumming" looked down upon in games that are so dependent on random number shit...

Why is "savescumming" looked down upon in games that are so dependent on random number shit? Pulling a lever on a slot machine isn't skill.

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ufopaedia.org/index.php/Accuracy_formula
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Because the games aren't built around savescumming. They're built around taking into account as many variables as you can to push things in your favor and rolling with the punches when they aren't in your favor.

Because if you dont enjoy a bit of RNG then why the fuck are you playing a game with significant RNG elements? The point is to make do with the hand you're given, if you remove that for yourself its a different game

Savescumming takes away the "joy" of randomness or unplanned events. Makes games boring imo but satisfies the perfectionists.

Just git gud, UFO defense doesn't even have that much battlefield rng, you just put yourself in bad positions if you miss a shot.

It shouldn’t be. It’s more fun to savescum and try to get the best outcome in those types of games rather than just to eat shit due to randomness

>play DND
>need to roll 11 or higher
>roll an 8
>"no no no no, hold on"
>roll again, it comes out as 11
>"I wonder what would happen if I got 15"
>keep rolling until I get at least 15
>eventually roll 14
>"its better to play like this"

you chose the absolute worst example of a game, X-Com is the example of how savescumming ruins the fun of the game and specially since as long as you know what the fuck you are doing there is very little rng to fuck you up in X-com, 99% of the shit that happens to you is your fault

the nu-xcom is a much better example, but only for the first few missions

Because it's about risk management

ufo defense is actually a better fit for ironman than the reboots because losing is far less punishing, despite the originals not even having ironman as an option

RNG is nothing compared to the power of explosives

ufopaedia.org/index.php/Accuracy_formula

It has nothing to do with positioning.

...

>It's a monster house!
>4 fearows surround you
>Fearow used Agility!
>Fearow uses Fury Attack!
>dead from the first fearow
There is nothing you could have done about this. Risk management is fine and all but when the game can just randomly kill you with nothing to be done about it, that's bullshit

>99% of the shit that happens to you is your fault

did you even read the thing you posted? accuracy determines how wide shots will deviate, a 50% shot targeting an alien a single tile away will hit a lot more then a 70% shot from 15 tiles away due to the # of angles that would hit.
psi aliens target soldiers with the weakest psi, either figure out which is the weakest and equip him with nothing to act as a lightning rod or leave TUs at the end of each movement for your soldiers to drop their guns, then have the non-mind controlled ones pick their guns back up next turn

get 2 unarmed rookies with low psi strength to soak up the psi attacks and you are done

the only rng on it is the first time finding a psi ayy since finding the psi weak ones is trial and error, but you have more than enough resources to take some losses to find them

Yeah no. If you get your first squad wiped midgame you are pretty much fucked. So you have to savescum a bit.

you should have had a room clearing orb on you.
Mystery dungeon games are mild rougelikes so you getting fucked by being underprepared is on you.

Now do it from how Wizardry 4 works were you are the great evil and you can't control your monsters fleeing from a fight with theives who steal from you

1. why would your entire squad of veterans be on the same skyranger? the bonus to morale for high ranking officers only applies once while the morale hit for each officer death applies for every single death. It's best to be rotating out soldiers so you have a wider pool of experienced soldiers when a few of them inevitably die.
2. why would you squad wipe? the most dangerous missions are snakemen terror missions at night, but you have agency to either do the mission during the day or just ignore the mission. losing a few while breaching clearing a UFO is almost certain, so bring rookies to go in first and soak up damage.

>step one 4 sticky traps in a row
>lose all your room clearing and getaway orbs
RNG can sometimes be incredibly gay.

I'm new. How the fuck am I supposed to find the enemies and get close to them?

well then wear a no-stick cap fag.

smoke grenades

>so mad at losing that he calls it 'nu'

Literally just git gud

>step on trip trap
>then a explosion trap is activated
>no-stick cap is destroyed
>step on several grime and stick traps
>die to starvation/monster house
wowwwwwwwwww

>If you get your first squad wiped midgame you are pretty much fucked.

Why do you not have like 80 soldiers at that point to pick up the slack?

Throw smoke to cover yourself when leaving the sky ranger and any time you have to go out into the open.

Early on try not to get anywhere near the ayylmaos, they have a significant advantage over you with stronger more accurate weapons. Use rockets or grenades to clear them out of hiding then pick off the rest with the rifle from a safe distance. Use aimed shot when you're across the map and absolutely cannot miss. Use snap shot for every other long range shot. When you're up close use full auto. You should have people with the best accuracy sit back and provide cover for people up front who are acting as spotters.

git gud

what version of the gamei s this

>Use aimed shot when you're across the map and absolutely cannot miss

I never have over 50% aim chance though. I can't even see the aliens until I'm right in their face.

because savescumming is for casuals that want to breeze through a game as quickly as possible

Yea, it's a virtue to waste 5 hours on RNG. That takes skill.

during the day you and the ayys both have a vision of 20. during the night you have a vision of like 8 without electroflares while the ayys still have 20. holding more then 1 thing will reduce accuracy, only hold a rifle while kneeling for max accuracy.

Rookies will never have great accuracy, good firing accuracy for a rookie is like 65 and above. As you work with them they'll improve their accuracy quite a bit though. The first rifle can be very inaccurate there's not much you can do except try again which is why snap and auto should be the most used options. You get 4x as many snap shots as aimed with the rifle, auto uses similar amounts of TUs as snap but the accuracy is fucking awful at moderate distances.

Try to get better armor and better weapons. The first level armor is actually quite a significant improvement. Also laser weapons kick ass also.

>holding more then 1 thing will reduce accuracy, only hold a rifle while kneeling for max accuracy.
I forgot about that. The rifle and various launchers are two handed weapons, you cannot hold other things in the other hand without harming your accuracy. The pistols are one handed weapons, you can hold other objects in the other hand and they do not affect your accuracy at all.

Should I not bother with terror missions at the start?

Terror missions significantly affect your ratings with the various nations. You should at least go to them and then abandon the mission if it looks too rough. A "poor" rating is better than a no-show.

it isn't about skill; it's about immersing yourself into the game and its world. People savescum for different reasons. For example, there are people who can easily accept that their loss was due to a fault in their strategy, but for whatever reason that ails them, some people cannot accept a defeat that has anything to do with any such component of luck.
people look down on others playing how they want to play because they believe that their own way of playing is the proper and correct way of playing.
ultimately though, if a person is savescumming, all they're doing is cutting out the time it takes to restart the game from the beginning fresh. In that way, they just want to finish the game faster.

I disagree with rushing armor. Personal Armor is an improvement, but for the most part your soldiers will still be dying in 1 hit because of how powerful plasma is, personal armor just makes it so that rarely they'll die in 2 or maybe 3 as well as costing alien alloys to produce. lasers are much better to rush in my opinion because lasers have better snap accuracy plus damage, and not having to carry spare ammo lets you bring more explosives. Usually I go laser rifle-> motion scanner -> personal armor -> firestorm/hyperwave decoder -> Plasma since Plasma is such a huge research investment and you usually won't have the resources or manpower to produce plasma in the first 2-3 months.
depends on the mission, floater terrors aren't that bad, sectoid terror missions are hell with cyberdiscs

wait, I thought this myth got debunked and the ayylmaos were just really good at walking forward for a couple tus to get vision and running away to blast you

ufopaedia.org/index.php/Night_Missions

>playing dnd
>not playing literally any other tabletop rpg besides gayfinder.

>Pulling a lever on a slot machine
It's not completely random retard the player makes a calculated decision

I don't decide what the Rookie's stats are

What's wrong with Pathfinder? I haven't played in a while.

This is the same game where you can get reaction shotted through a smoke screen

It's dnd 3.5 with alot of furry shit.

It's got alot of dumb rules and man I can't stand the ac system dnd lite rpgs use. Magics still not balanced and is even worse in some cases. It still bloated with rules and limited as fuck when it comes to class restrictions.

>OMG poker is just luck! Anybody could win it if they just get good cards >(

Not all games are supposed to have perfect runs or are not build around them
Problem is when savescummers complain about the game and they are playing with an unfair advantage
Video games are all about how you experience them and savescumming takes away a lot from the game.

Coming up with a plan that is not easily affected by an unlucky roll of dice is the skill.

If RNG ruins your plans, then your plans are shit.

If a missed shot is enough to throw your plan down the drain, your plan is a bad one, that's the point of RNG, you have to plan around it.

Imagine being the designated psi bait.

>Pulling a lever on a slot machine isn't skill.
Adequately preparing for the possibility of an adverse result is skill.

If you savescum you might as well put on a God mode cheat.

Such as??? Prove to me that this isn't just a case of the sunken cost fallacy.

thats because you are a child that does not bother to even learn how things work, smoke has density, the thicker it is the more LOS it breaks and the closer enemies are to the smoke the more into it they will see

if you got reaction fired in the smoke it was 100% your fuckup, as a matter of fact, all reaction shots are 100% your fault, this is a perfect example of somebody needing to git gud

Why do you pretend that you're godlike omnipotent players who can perfectly predict everything? You act like you've never lost a single soldier ever.

You're a child who spends too much effort on videogames.

why do you pretend that you're not a lazy retard who can't be fucked to use proper tactics or problem solve? you act as if every single soldier you lost was because of bad RNG.

just because you are total failures that can't put even a little bit of effort into anything you do, it doesn't the rest of the world can't, stop trying to justify being filthy fucking casuals

you don't have to predict anything, you just have to think things through instead of clicking anywhere like a retard and expecting to work, the game has pretty clear mechanics and being turn based you have all the time you could fucking want, fucking up is entirely your fault, the fact that you complain just shows how much of a bunch of casual children you are

>You act like you've never lost a single soldier ever.
What? Losing a soldier is like missing a jump or gettinh hit in an action game, it happens, you deal with it and move on, by savescumming you are effectively skipping parts of the intended gameplay experience.

Dealing with the situation, as bad as it can get, is skill and fun

>Using the Skymarshall at all
>Still using Black Ops weapons when P-90 and the Arasaka is better

Oh so I'm supposed to know literally everything about the game from the outset? I guess this game is casual shit then.

I absolutely cannot stand playing roguelikes because of rng. Even on a normal mode, exploring an entire area thoroughly before continuing cannot fully prepare you for the upcoming floors.
The games basically continue until you happen to roll bad luck enough times that progression is simply impossible due to your resources available from the rng. You need the status buffs to win, but it only takes a few status debuffs to completely sink you, effectively capping how far you can even go from the beginning when the dungeon is generated.
Player skill is still inbolved to get to the theoretical limit, but the rage inducing aspect is that the player will have no indication when the game is going to end, so it is impossible to tell whether you or the game were at fault in the end when you INEVITABLY LOSE BECAUSE ROGUELIKES HAVE NO "WIN" SCENARIO.
This is incredibly unrewarding for the player unless they are experienced enough to get a general sense of how much they could've actually achieved compared to what they did, which basically undermines the value and experience of your first playthroughs, which is as far as your typical player will go because why would you continue playing when there are no goals in sight?

you aren't, you are supposed to lose, learn and then try again, like anything worth a shit in life, its literally getting good

if you can't do that it just means you are a casual shitter, you should be playing something made for children, some new AAA title would probably be better for you so you can get handholded like a special need child

Its called trial and error. A good game has Trial and error, UFO and Roguelikes are built around this concept of trying something and having learning experiences. There is no ultimate failure until you give up. Soldiers die. Runs end, but a true commander uses these experiences to continue on and win.

Modded Commander's comin back boys. Had to take a hiatus to gather computer parts and the like, as well as settle in for the holidays.

But savescumming is more time efficient for learning.

>what is risk management
t. faggot who can't minimize risks

it isn't it just spoils you and ultimately you become a giant faggot who can't adapt, you learn by making mistakes and fixing them, savescumming takes the latter part away so if you depend on it you will never be able to play without it

the only times you should ever be savescumming is to test game mechanics that might not be properly documented or too obscure that nobody knows about them

Sure, if it's used for just learning. If you end up abusing it to the point that your time machine becomes a crutch that you can't play without, then what's the point of learning.

I don't think so, Tim.

t. Someone who actually posted an ironman superhuman run in real time here and got my finest squad taken out by two barns full of ayys, and still got to end the game.

are we getting finally fighting proper ayys or are we gonna get snibbity snabbed ?

>one of the risks is the possibility of just dying of something you can't prepare for or avoid
Not all risks can be dealt with. A roguelike with a 1% chance to instantly game over you isn't a fair roguelike.

Speaking as someone with experience. I'm sure you all have seen my TFTD run, or currently remember my ongoing run.. or remember Siggy and that absolute failure.

Rest in peace soldiers of Earth. You have earned it.

We aliens boy. We just gotta deal with a Dark Moon event and various other things along the way.

As soon as this is done, we get Lasers.

Using movement detectors can save you lives when trying to get into a closed building or UFO.

There have literally been 3 playthroughs on Sup Forums that had around 90% casualty rate and still succeeded, so clearly you don't have to

and one of them was TFTD and somewhat recently (a year back if im not mistaken)

Lol what a fag

we tftd posting now

Roguelike isn't about strategy and tactics, roguelikes are about generating story for player by complete randomness.
And in tactical and strategy game you can easily deal with all rng bullshit game send in your way if you play it right.

You mean this one?

so, lid's when? i want to see them in those silly new terror maps full of tall buildings and narrorw corridors

yeah, that was fun, well not for whoever was playing and the rookies, but it was fun to spectate

Thats the thing.

I don't know. Through testing, all I know is Sneks don't have em anymore. I think they may be related to Zombies and MIB.

That would have been me.

you don't know true terror until you encountered the bug where lobstermen and tasoths would spawn starting in january

perhaphs

>roll 30 misses in a row even if you maximized accuracy potential for the entire fight
>game over because of 1% chance to miss rolling 30 times
wowwwwwww

FUCKIN HELL.

Roguelikes have always a win scenario. Get the Orb of Zot, the Amulet of Yendor, kill the Spider Mastermind, etc.
You must be confused because you haven't advanced enough on a roguelike or because you didn't spoiled yourself about the winning conditions of any game, which wouldn't count, anyway, as the games usually tell you about what's your target if you want to beat the game.

i forgot Cato sicarius survived, not even X-com can get rid of him

I AM WRONG. I STAND SO WRONG.
SCORCH THREW ME FOR A LOOP.
SNEKS STILL HAVE LIDS

It would be a miracle to remember. Certainly more memorable than the times when luck had favoured (You)

I think they have a reduced chance to appear or something like that, i had an issue like it with FMP, i won the game without ever seeing a lid, and i think i had like 2 missions with snakemen in the whole game

>roll 30 misses in a row even if you maximized accuracy potential for the entire fight
You'll never get 30 misses in a row if you're playing right
Getting your chances to 100% (at least in xcom) is very easy

Without consequences we don't learn from mistakes. This has been a documented fact for years. This is why you keep savescumming, because you haven't learned anything.

>recruited: 113
>lost: 91

Never ceases to amuse me.

Its actually much worse. Sneks, Sectoids and Ethereals have variant Terror Missions.

Ethereals with Disks
Sectoids with Sectopods
Sneks with Salamandrons, AKA Triscenes with Flame thrower cannons