Forget about horror. How in the FUCK do we save the stealth genre?

Forget about horror. How in the FUCK do we save the stealth genre?

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Based Aonuma will save it with his thief game.

manhunt 3: manhunt harder

This genre is far deader than survival horror. At least they got their walking simulators. We get left with nothing.

They need another manhunt.
Man hunts a pretty good stealth game.

Aren't stealth like horror games a niche? Kids these days are used to instant gratification, what makes you think in this day and age and this market that it will be profitable to make a stealth game?

Bring back Chaos Theory and its multiplayer

Invisible Inc already exists so the stealth genre is pretty much over. The perfect game for it has been made, no one else need bother.

We need a Stealth Horror game

it would be so Lovekaesque

Syphon Filter Reboot.

the styx games, aragami, and shadow tactics: blades of the shogun were all great though. what is there to save?

You have to neuter the player. The reason thief was so great is that garret is grounded, and honestly really sucks at combat. Modern ""stealth"" games make the protag insanely OP because players are on a power trip. You also CANNOT design the game around "choose your playstyle!", fuck that people will always take the easier route, design a fucking stealth game from the ground up retards.

Styx is complete shit

>Remove marking enemies
>Remove Batman vision
>Limit of 1 or 2 weapons
>Enemies scream/struggle while dying, alerting their allies
>Punish crocodile players (the ones that kill every single enemy in the map to be able to run around with freedom). Enemies form hunting parties when they know you are close by, they can smell you if you have blood on you for killing enemies and you die easily. If there's a 2 vs 1 situation, you should die in most cases if you decide to fight
>Remove perks and abilities. The developers should reward skill, not time spend on a game.

>horror thread was completely on-topic and has productive contributions that reference a variety of games
>404s

F O R
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F R E E
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just play S.T.A.L.K.E.R. :^)
beste stelth horror game there is

lmao STALKER has horrible stealth
horror is alright, though, mostly because it doesn't make any real pretenses about being "scary" (ignoring CS)

Salvation of stealth is in progress.

>indie shit
>good

the game crashes are pretty fucking scary my dude and stealth is just fine with mods to fix it :^)

Make a new Tenchu game and make it awesome. Bring back the composer from Stealth Assassins too.

how so?

>copy thief 2
That's literally all that has to be done

Stealth genre is dead. Bury it. Consider this mercy.

Pic related is everything wrong with modern gaming. This is why you can't have your hardcore stealth anymore. Some faggot was actually even defending this a few days ago.

What's niche now is the mainstream of tomorrow and stealth horror isn't niche anymore. Zombie and the horror genre in general is gravitating towards stealth recently. Dying Light, Day Z, NMRIH, Contagion, Dead by Daylight, Friday the 13th, that Alien game.

Thief already exists, copying it would be hackish and pointless - especially since there are still people making levels for Thief with the new dark engine and TDM.

shadow tactics is a god damn masterpiece

Th44f is on sale for $3. I think that's about the most I'd pay for it

The only reason stealth games exist is because it was difficult to program good action or combat on older hardware so a game where the player actively avoided that was ideal. They are a relic of the past that only manchildren still enjoy, just like JRPGs and rail-shooters.

The thing is, when you remove those things now people complain that the game is obtuse.

...

What game is this?

>tfw splinter cell is fucking dead
>sam's voice actor is old as shit so he won't come back for the blacklist sequel
>it'll likely get rebooted instead and sam will be a black trans girl with an afro
J U S T

Pretty much agree with everything you said. Especially how enemies should be even more aggressive when they know you are around. MGS2 actually did this but Raiden was still really strong because of how the games mechanics worked and his large health bar. The smelling you part is strange though unless you meant some dog type enemies.

In general what made the genre fun was being vulnerable or not having super powers or batman vision as you put it. Stealth should always be incentivized even if they want to allow you to go guns/swords blazing. The game would still need to reward you for stealth rather then sloppy play. MGS also has a good mode with euro extreme forcing you to have no choice but to stealth.

A new Metal Gear that is actually good.

>We get left with nothing.
Shadow Tactics came out last year, and the sequel is supposedly coming out next year.

>better graphics, sound ranges and overall immersion
>pointless

Just to have a base on this subject so I know how to form my ideas on this genre, whats the best stealth game there is, or what makes a really good stealth game, is it something like Hitman, or MGS?

Stealth is a game mechanic, not a genre, what are you guys talking about? If you want stealth go play any sandbox rpg, pretty much all of them have a stealth mechanic.

WHEN I WAS
youtube.com/watch?v=JKVSyGvSQR8
youtube.com/watch?v=wlUujCx_yoA

Make the player die or lose very easily if enemies are fully alerted to your presence.

I don't know how we got to the point where full-blown Rambo tactics are viable in any stealth game. Being spotted should be practically a guaranteed death or at least a serious hindrance that must be avoided at all costs if you are going to actually progress through the game, not just something you can brush off by hiding in a closet for 60 seconds while the retarded AI searches for you in vain then immediately gives up as if nothing happened while their comrade is dead of a bullet wound on the floor.

Death should also have a real penalty associated with it and not just send you back to the last checkpoint 3 minutes ago, it should permanently fuck you up or set you back a significant amount, not just be a reset button for when you screw up too badly, otherwise getting spotted isn't really even penalized at all, the player can just trial-and-error a path directly to the objective by dying repeatedly like a retard.

No guns or long range tazers, easy hitscan headshots and knockouts have broken modern stealth games. Instead of coming up with creative solutions to sneak by the AI, players simply eliminate them as quickly as possible from a distance, and spend the rest of their time running through empty hallways without any threat to deal with.

>new campaign for Thief Gold

Into the trash it goes.

Get rid of non-lethal takedowns. They trivialize the genre.

That is exactly what the guy I was talking about did. There was others defending this shit to. There is no way stealth as it used to be can be made with these people around. Critics would also pan such a game as way too hard. So instead they will make more action games with "stealth" elements.

Thanks, but this looks like a project that won't come out ever.

Splinter Cell Chaos Theory

>shooter is a game mechanic, not a genre

chaos theory and thief 2

Either a stealth MMORPG or a stealth ASSFAGGOTS obviously.

This is bait.

I liked Alien Isolation, not sure if that counts as stealth though. Ashamed to say the latest Hitman entry isn't to shabby either. I keep going back to it.

Very accurate pic.

It's nice to fantasize but realistically, you know that no dev would put in the effort to get sound right. And who needs graphics.

It wouldn't be the first Thief fangame, and the authors working on it already reliably churn out missions like it's nothing. It's entirely possible that it could fall through but they're a dedicated bunch.

let the player be the bad guy

Thief
Hitman
MGS
Splinter Cell
Tenchu
Styxx

This is only as far as franchises goes. Some have also mentioned some indie games but as far as popular franchises the genre doesn't have much at all. The ones that are are all pretty much dead now to due to latest entries being watered down shells of their former entries.

Assassins Creed is-

Okay I couldn't post this one without laughing. Those are the most casual ass stealth games there is. Bastardizations is what they are actually.

>Stealth is a game mechanic, not a genre
>this shit again

Criminally underrated

I think the problem is that stealth by itself is kinda limited and slow paced, and every developer is trying to innovate somehow to maker their brand recognizable, and thus dont try to go back to the simpler ways of the games that did it first. This is a problem that most genres have, trying to fix whats not broken, but since stealth (and horror) needs to be slow paced to feel the way its genre should be, then it cant catch as much attention to the public eye like with, say, a FPS.
btw why did the horror thread get deleted, I thought we were having a legitimate vidya discussion, well, some of us.

all stealth games should be permadeath

Jannies seem to think "how do we fix horror" is a meme shitpost now or something despite the fact that it usually produces good discussion.

There is not a single incorrect statement in that post.

>velvet ass
>no ass in
Was this character designed by the same person who designed lightning?

party rockers in the houuuuuse tonight

A lot of people in this thread are like "get seen once, game over, save file deleted, console bricked" but stealth doesn't need to be hardcore.
I remember Chaos Theory as: wall hug, learn patrols, knock out guards, continue. It wasn't hard even if being spotted sometimes meant getting game over. I definitely preferred Blacklist just for the fluid movement. If you handicapped yourself (as in, not using the ranged stun crossbow and knockout grenades), Blacklist was a decent stealth game.

I think to make a good stealth game nowadays all you have to do is use the fluid movement from splinter cell, give your character no weapons but rocks for distractions and a short knockout attack, a variety of settings indoors and outdoors with dark and light areas.
Easy.

Do people still play this? I remember it being fun as fuck.

you can't fix it. stealth games are frustrating because they're usually 50% trying not to get lost, 40% memorizing guard paths, and 10% actually sneaking around, but if you try to give players better maps or a way to keep track of guards they cry that it's dumbing the game down.

The funny thing is that you could actually play the game like the bottom pic, I did that a few times and it's surprisingly fun.

>Blacklist was a decent stealth game
Not this shit again. There was a video of sam running around, in the open, headshotting everyone as a command prompt. The player didn't even have to aim because the game did all that automatically for them. Absolutely ridiculous.

I think you make a fair point. I would also argue that this constant desire to pander to a wide audience is going to keep killing more genres until we are left with only a few things. Its already gotten that way though I do think its going to get even worse. So basically the casual wider audience is as much to blame for having bland taste in gaming.

>needing a coherent map
Plebs these days

believable enemy AI that doesn't just follow its normal routine when the lights turn off and all its buddies disappear.

Escape from Tarkov captures the stealth feel even better.
You have to go in, loot, then slowly crawl out finding an exit around praying some geared up ganker doesnt hunt you down with his armor and fully geared out AR.
The npcs can also fuck you up if you get surrounded by em.

nice
the hidden

Did you even try it? You were ranked based on play style. You did have the option of sprint everywhere and shooting guns and whatever but that was for mouthbreathers.
The ghost play style was a good balance of challenge and fun.

>no cyberpunk ghost in the shell type setting stealth game with gameplay like chaos theory but improved
I swear I'm going to make this game myself one day, I promise

>they make a licensed ghost in the shell game
>it's a f2p counterstrike clone

The problem with Stealth games
>Give player all these really cool weapons and abilities and customization options
>Never give them an excuse to use them

I hated this in thief. it wasn't a game about stealing. it was fucking tomb raider where you were supposed to hide from enemies. it even had dinosaurs.

That's a bad stealth game problem.

Normies ruin everything and the only remaining source of legitimate talent in the industry is going to be low-budget indie shit made by people who actually enjoy video games, as with nearly every medium. Freemium mobageshit and casual multiplayer games with abhorrent quantities of paid DLC are the future of mainstream gaming, in fact they already dominate the industry entirely from a profit standpoint, good luck finding any AAA developer willing to develop a game even half as complex or interesting as Dwarf Fortress, if a drugged out ADHD crack baby won't steal his Mom's credit card to buy your cosmetic DLC it isn't going to be made.

Yeah, Dishonored had great stealthy gameplay but it suffered a lot from the fact that they tell you right off the bat that you shouldn't kill people and will suffer consequences for it. It's the only game series I know where your second playthrough is ALWAYS more fun than your first because you don't feel bad about fucking up or just killing everyone.

And is dead too.

>Did you even try it?
I've played every splinter cell game. Blacklist and Conviction, while I enjoyed them, were not as good as CT. As a stealth game, conviction was a bit better than Blacklist on some parts but Blacklist overall was better but they followed the same trend: Instant kills. You could build up with your meter and insta kill a room full of enemies while hanging from a pipe above them. The shit was completely fucked and these new systems are only in place to appeal to casuals.

Well, yeah, I can't imagine why they thought anything else would happen. Every counterstrike clone dies.

Pretty much.
But i believe death of the outsider you are free too kill everyone with no problems.

The market will be saturated eventually.
You can't have an twenty esport mobas existing simultaneously, people are going to gravitate towards a single one just to be in.

I haven't played that yet, only recently finished D2 and wanted to take a break before my second playthrough where I'll blast everyone to bits for funsies.

Dishonored is fantastic

"""Stealth""" takedowns were a mistake. Being able to easily take out any enemy (that isn't directly facing you) with a press of a button removes all tension and difficulty.

By baiting a triple A megacorporation video game syndicate like Activision or EA to make one. Expect
>Open world survival stealth game
>Silently creep through miles of empty terrain then die of hunger
>Craft stealthy gear
>Stealthy base building

>it's a f2p cod clone
ftfy. It would have been half decent as a cs-clone.

Emily far reach is fucking shit.
I should have played with corvo.

eh, her powers are more interesting

What about pic related?

Why is this pic related so underrated?

>implying take-two would approve of such a controversial IP in this current climate
You're right tho, Manhunt 3 would be pretty dope.

You can of course remove those elements but you run the risk of your game being ignored by the masses. Your whole studio could go up in smoke over a design decision like this.

Why not play it safe, then?

Telenovela-tier plot with decent gameplay, it's also legitimately unfinished and will never be patched, i wouldn't pay more than 15 buck for it.