Why have so few games stood the test of time while offering endless replay value like the classic Doom games...

Why have so few games stood the test of time while offering endless replay value like the classic Doom games? Don't you guys wish more games had this kind of longevity and support?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=NoU3gtF6w94
twitter.com/AnonBabble

simple its very easy to mod and it can be on almost anything that is powered by electricity some day doom is going to come to a 60 watt lightbulb and its what todd howard dreams he could do with skyrim

doom 2 is fucking shit and the only part of it people care about is the laughably overpowered super shotgun

>2D sprite enemies that have repetitive animations
>can't look up or down
>no vertical movement
>shitty sound design
>weapon animations have like 3 frames
>bland samey environments
>repetitive objective on every level
>HUD takes 20% of the screen
>little enemy variety
>enemies are slow as fuck and shoot slow projectiles

Shit game

(You)

DOOM offers something modern day games don't: ease of creating content. It's easy as fuck to whip stuff up for DOOM and it's the kind of environment where creativity can pretty much run wild.

>laughably overpowered
>singleshot
>long reload time
>utterly worthless at long range

>2D sprite enemies that have repetitive animations
As opposed to 3D enemies with repetitive animations?

>can't look up or down
It's not 1993 anymore, yes you can.

>no vertical movement
It's not 1993 anymore, yes you can.

>shitty sound design
Shitty opinion.

>weapon animations have like 3 frames
I'd rather have 3 frames of ungodly wine than 900 frames of shit-smeared cancer.

>bland samey environments
Bland samey opinion.

>repetitive objective on every level
There's AN objective, with optional objectives which may sometimes lead to secret levels.

>HUD takes 20% of the screen
Learn how to use + and -

>little enemy variety
Little opinion

>enemies are slow as fuck and shoot slow projectiles
Not as slow as you are.

Enjoy this, I rarely take the time to respond to shit-posts worth so very little of my time, but here you are.

I was actually going to respond the user but you did an absolutely great job, how user will ever recover

>Repetitive animations
Not an argument they look fine
>Can't look up and down
Mods exist to make it so and are easy to get and the game isn't design for it and doesn't feel like it needs it
>No vertical movement
Not an argument plenty of shooters nowadays don't even have Dooms speed and don't let you jump and Doom levels would be a mess with jumping
>Shitty sound design
Wrong
>Weapon animations have like 3 frames.
And yet still better then most shooters where its the same but Dooms animations look better
>Bland environment
Never got past the first few levels huh kiddos or episode 1.
>Repetitive objective
Again modern shooters no different. But Doom doesn't lie to you. Modern shooters tell you to do X which 99% of the time leads you to just going through and linear level where X is at the end
>Hud takes up 20%
And it looks great and impedes nothing
>Little enemy variety
Wow someone likes lying. The game has like 11 enemy types and mixes them in and out perfectly especially on UV. And modern shooters have either half that or just generic soldiers
>Enemies are slow as fuck
Because levels/enemies are designed to be fought in bulk and in situational designed levels not 1 v 1 over and over.

Keep shit posting its really cute.

>bland samey environments

lmao, oh man, you had me going until this one, try and disguise trollposts better

>try loading wads with ZDL using GZDoom as sourceport
>works once every 10 wads, usually just gives me errors
it hurts bros

You just don't deserve Doom. You can go back to whatever you find appealing to your shit taste and opinion. Doom already has an dedicated and expansive fanbase, we don't need you. Go away

Stopped reading at repetitive animations being fine, i don't want to see the same enemies die the same exact way, newer games have ragdoll and gibs that go in every direction

Yeah those empty brown rooms are completely different! See a good game like half life you can tell what level you are on based on a single screenshot where as your shit outdated trash you can't tell

Just use ZDoom, not GZDoom.

If both fail, turn to Zandronum.

>retards replying to obvious bait

>empty brown rooms
ecks dee

>It's not 1993 anymore, yes you can.
Using sourceport features to defend a game is like using ice cream topping to defend an apple pie.
>inb4 food analogy

This. Making a map in Doom vs making a map in Dook is a massive step in difficulty.

How could you fuck up this bad? Are running something like D4D that requires a dev version? Or are you a brutal doom i.0 shitter.

Doom is about gameplay and level design, not fancy graphics.

>fire up doom to test something
>end up playing for 3 hours

Every time.

Retard. If the pie was shit no amount of ice cream would make the pie good. A good pie with ice cream is the best, and a good pie can standalone on itself.

>oh, i'll just make a quick map for fun, it shouldn't take too long
>12 hours pass like nothing

>See a good game like half life you can tell what level you are on based on a single screenshot where as your shit outdated trash you can't tell
Lol
I can do that for doom.

> not fancy graphics.

Its graphics were state of the art at the time.

Wow nice screenshot of E1M3...or is that E2M1...or......

Too bad the gameplay is bland and repetitive with no skill or advanced mechanics

Show me a game that you think has "advanced mechanics". Bet you don't even know what chaingun-tapping is.

>Stopped reading at repetitive animations being fine, i don't want to see the same enemies die the same exact way, newer games have ragdoll and gibs that go in every direction

Ragdoll sucks 95% of the time unless it's mixed with animation, because programmers have no idea how physics work apparently and can't design proper, or aesthetic ragdoll effects and the bodies just end up flying all over the place and have me laughing more than playing.

>i don't want to see the same enemies die the same exact way

>W-W-We don't need you, g-g-go away
>Y-Y-You don't deserve doom

Fuck off retard. You're not smart enough to play doom, let alone enjoy it.

Doom is the original "it's good with mods, I swear" game.

>or is that E2M1?

So you admit that you've never played it? Got it.

Doom 1 is great on it's own. Doom 2 was the one that needed mods to be fun. Doom 2 was awful from a level design standpoint.

Doom 1's main problem was its lack of enemy variety.

>>i don't want to see the same enemies die the same exact way

Forgot to respond to this.

Then go play a game where enemies don't die the exact same way, faggot. I don't care.

>Doom 2 was awful from a level design standpoint
kys

Nigger the game came on 5 floppies in 93. Sorry they didn't include gigabytes of death animations.

>Doom 2 was awful from a level design standpoint.

I agree with this for certain levels. Personally, I hated tricks and traps.

McGee made some of the best levels in Doom 2 (and Doom as a whole). Dead Simple practically defined a genre of levels.

It was fine for the time. Look at the enemy lineups of other FPS games before Doom 2 and you won't see much better.

> i don't want to see the same enemies die the same exact way,

May I recommend "smooth doom" or "Brutal Doom" for you then?

Titanfall 2
Tribes
Pretty much most shooters

Sorry the game is so forgettable

>"hey this whole modding deal looks like shitloads of fun"
>2 weeks later client calls asking about how that project due in two days is coming while you've been doing nothing but write in that godawful script language for some shitty mod that only you'll ever use

The real problem with no vertical look or real verticality movement-wise isn't the limitations on what the player can do, but the limitations on level design. Doom levels have to be outward-sprawling mazes because there's only so much interconnectivity you can have on a 2D plane and still have some sort of progression.

Only For Episode 1.

Cacodemons and Lost Souls were introduced in the following episodes.

Then Doom 2 came out and added a whole bunch of shit in, like Revenents, Mancubi, Chaingunners, Pain Elementals, Hell Knights, Arch Viles....Arch Viles are, I must say, the most "vile" enemy in Doom. Please don't throw bricks at me.

>Titanfall 2
Wallrunning which is neither interesting nor unique and also done better.

>Tribes
Rocket ski'ing and is a dead franchise for a reason.

>Pretty much most shooters
Meh.

>Making a map in Doom vs making a map in Dook is a massive step in difficulty.
>mfw trying quake and learning about triggers and leaks

Wallrunning is not advanced user. Try harder.

>limitation on level design
no it was a limitation of the engine due to how it rendered walls.

The argument is that it's just a pie. user says no, look, there's ice cream on top, but the ice cream came two decades later and isn't included with the pie.

Still more interesting than doom

> but the limitations on level design.

You would be surprised.
youtube.com/watch?v=NoU3gtF6w94

t. sandy

More advanced than doom

The only thing I dislike about Doom 2 is that the levels aren't split into different episodes.
And Doom 1 levels are less bullshit.

>no it was a limitation of the engine due to how it rendered walls.
work on your reading comprehension user, the cause of the limitations isn't relevant, just that the limitations exist

t. romero

Not him but the SSG is ridiculously OP. It outshines every weapon in the game in almost every instance. It can even make mince meat of a cyberdemon in a pinch if you know what you're doing. The short range is irrelevant when Doomguy runs at the speed of kenyans, and shotgun ammo is plentiful so you're almost never without. The reload time is also irrelevant given doom guys speed since you can duck in, blast the fuckers, and run back out while he reload, and you'll still be putting out more DPS than most other weapons in the game.

There's a reason why WADs that give the SSG right at the start are made fun of in the community, because it removes all challenge and turns the WAD into a SSG grind since you have very little reason to swap weapons from that point on, besides using the BFG maybe once or twice per map.

people myself included shit a lot on d44m snapmap, but all things considered, the truth is that making a map doesn't look like an easy task in today's engines/games compared to doom or old fps in general

and I can't imagine current modding either
>remember modding the shit out of quake using that QC thing as a dumb kid
>"oh neat now quake 2 is out, I wonder if they improved modding tools!"
>they did
>now you had to use actual C++ and all its weird shit at least for a dumb kid back then
>dropped because dumdum

....Are you talking to me, or yourself? I don't care what game you think is interesting. Never will. Only care what I think is interesting. Thanks, come again.

My point still stands. Doom could've had room over room functionality, but it the engine couldn't handle it. Engines like GZDoom have already added it.

doom was fucking shit though and became completely redundant when Quake was released

...

you have no point, you're just going "b-but it could have!" i could have been born rich and been fucking malaysian femboys every day, but instead i'm arguing on Sup Forums at 1 AM while taking a shit
>Engines like GZDoom have already added it.
plus it's still janky as shit compared to build or id tech 2

the game was revolutionary when it came out. If you're gonna (foolishly) judge it using today's standards you'll have to accept today's solutions as a counter argument.
>>enemies are slow as fuck and shoot slow projectiles
the game wasn't balanced to play with a mouse. You can balance that out by activating fast monsters or just playing on nightmare. Btw, your post is completely retarded and screams underage.

>the levels aren't split into different episodes.
Why's that bad?

>Doom could've had room over room functionality, but it the engine couldn't handle it.
what you said is a direct contradiction

This, also RNG on absolutely everything

>the game wasn't balanced to play with a mouse.
Doom had horizontal mouse aim from the very start.

>the game was revolutionary when it came out
No it wasn't

hey everyone, look at this contrarian faggot

yes it was

Now you're just being retarded.

>nu Sup Forums
>Everyone wants to be le edgy contrarian

Woah. You are just out of your mind. Just the concept of an FPS having interior and external areas in a single map was revolutionary at dooms release. It was impressive and new.

>today's standards
But Quake was released only two and a half years later and blew Doom completely out of the water innovation-wise, laying the groundwork for both rendering and networking tech that would be used by games for decades to come.

How would you know?

>REEEEEEEEEEE STOP RUINING MY CIRCLE JERK REEEEEE CONTRARIAN CONTRARIAN REEEEEEEE

Personal taste I guess. I like being able to start at more difficult levels rather than having to start at the first level every time.

doom had better gameplay than quake

You're a miserable shitposting fag, go back to whatever board you came from (Its reddit)

...

It was also 2 and a half years later. What the fuck was your point?

do you have a single fact to back that up

No it wasn't, it was a trashy rehash with shit gameplay, shit graphics and stolen music converted into shit quality beeps and boops, it was the cawadoody of its time only played by underage casuals that the mainstream got its hooks into.

1/10 made me reply.

And it's still less fun...huh, amazing how that works, isn't it?

No it really doesn't. The Minigun is good for sniping and stunlocking enemies and dealing with large groups of enemies in 360 degrees, the plasma gun is essentially a better minigun, except for the wait period when attempting to fire after stopping fire, which makes one-tap-firing harder unlike with the minigun, and also eats ammo faster. The regular shotgun is good at every range for any reason. Solid damage dealer, can take out multiple enemies at a distance, fair fire rate. If I'm up against a hitscan enemy, I'm more inclined to use a minigun, shotty, or even a plasma gun rather than the double shotty, since especially for regular zombies and imps, it's just a waste of ammo.

Super shotty is only really useful for clearing out pinkies quickly and dealing with caco's and hellknights. Or Lost Souls. The stun-lock factor is too big of an issue for the super shotty to take precedence, especially on higher difficulties.

the doom modding scene is way bigger than quakes

You are becoming hysterical.

That you don't need to compare a 25 year old game to today's standards to make it look like shit, you can compare it to a 23 year old game.

doom players are brainlets who get scared off by brush-based mapping and the bsp/vis/light multiple compiling tools setup, and would rather struggle with various sourceport-dependent cobbled together languages instead of just fucking working in C

doom is considered one of the most revolutionary games of all time on par with mario
it was probably the biggest hit game produced by the US in comparsion to the size of the audience at the time
it's a fact, not an opinion

I will say that DOOM had far better enemy design than Quake. The Ogre's are just not fun to fight.

>Sniping
Don't need to if you can run at the speed of Doomguy
>Stunlocking
Don't need to if the enemy is dead. You will only use the chaingun to stunlock if you are trying to conserve shotgun ammo, or if you find yourself in a rare situation such as fighting a caco in an area where you can't dodge for some reason.

mapping for both games is easy and don't forget that all the doom scripting languages were actually created by fans in the first place

>The Ogre's are just not fun to fight.
Ogres are one of the best enemies in the game and the perfect combo of map and enemy design, what are you smoking?

>muh C

[grenade bouncing noises]

different guy here
ogre is obnoxious as hell and its the most common enemy

>But Quake was released only two and a half years later and blew Doom completely out of the water innovation-wise

It had room-over-room functionality and lots of vertical aspects, which by that time had already been done and was no longer an "innovation". The only real "innovation" of it was the fully-3D graphics, no more 2.5D.

You realize that even John Romero complained about the brush-mapping, calling it "time-consuming" and "tedious".

doombabbies are constantly kludging together features and backports from later games (i.e. quake) because they know their game is completely outdated, primitive shit with ridiculous limitations otherwise and their hacky source port dependent solutions don't make it much better

Those 2 and a half years were a huge leap in game technology. That’s half a generation and that meant even more back in the 90’s. Of course Quake is going to have many features not present or possible in doom but how did that make doom. Again I have to ask, what was your point?

>doom is considered one of the most revolutionary games of all time on par with mario

and the reason they do that is because doom is a better game despite it being outdated

Then why do all quake maps look and play the same?

Wow, it almost seems like you're reaching for ways to attack a game with a larger, more creative and inventive community because you're merely a fan of one game that never became as popular.

It's almost like, woah, "jealousy".

No, it wasn't.