Common core

Alright Sup Forums everyone over at Sup Forums is losing their shit about this photo. Using the order of operations I get the answer 1. That is correct right?

Other urls found in this thread:

algebrahelp.com/lessons/simplifying/oops/
mathworld.wolfram.com/Precedence.html
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

In common core there are no order of operations.

Oh my god what the fuck is this shit

>Using the order of operations I get the answer 1. That is correct right?
No you idiot. The answer is 16 in both the "old way" and common core. That picture is retarded.

How the fuck would you ever get one?
20/5*(2*2)
2*2 is 4
20/5 is 4
4*4 is 16
And before some autist says multiplication takes first priority no it fucking doesn't.

It's fake, you idiots. Stop it.

Even with BIDMAS (UK) I'm getting 16.

I don't get it, how do you ever get 1? What is common core?

Why they think its 1 is cuz they see it like this

20
_____
5(2*2)

aka 20/(5*(2*2))

But its just utterly retarded.

just use fractions like a normal human bean

When you use the symbol /, it's implied that everything on the right divides everything on the left. At least this is the usual convention on physics and maths papers.

That's how the entire world did things and how the rest of the world still does it you dumb fuck.

Only america adopted the bullsht common core crap because they're retards.

I thought it was just an americlap equivalent for รท

Ir's retarded though. If you're writing a fucking fraction write it properly so there is no ambiguity

If you prioritize multiplication over division, you get 1.
If you prioritize them equally and prioritize left-most operator, you get 16.

That is not the convention in anything IT related, I personally find that 'your' way is much more inconvenient.

speak american europoor

The Common Core is a set of standards. It does not specify teaching materials. This slide was made by an incompetent teacher, not by the Common Core.

The answer is 16 both the "old way" and under the Common Core.
But the question is stupid because you should never write an expression like that. Parentheses and fractions exist to avoid this sort of confusion.

> 20 / 5 (2 * 2)
> 20 / 5(4)
> 20 / 20 = 1

What the fuck ever happened to PEMDAS? Kill yourselves.

Oh, no. Those two symbols are interpreted differently.

Fractions are the less ambiguous, but if you have to write something inline in a paragraph and not a separate equation, it's usually written as a/b, implying that b divides a. No matter what a and b are.

Depends what you are used to read. I find it normal.

I think "old way" was referring to the students' methods for solving the problem, which is fine and all for teaching purposes.

The part that should piss you off more is the "equally correct' bit.

No you fucking retard.
> 20 / 5 ( 2 * 2 )
> 20 / 5 ( 4 )
> 4 ( 4 )
> 16

That's true when you write it as a fraction, but writing a / does not work like that. / is left associative and has the same precedence as *.

No its not you retard nigger.

* and / have the same priority, just as when you'd write 5-3+5 you dont mean 5-(3+5) i dont find any reason to get 1

How are we supposed to know this is fake. On first glance, it seems like a real enough picture so this suggests that we can interpret it at face value.

I'm sorry you don't like it, but that's not how papers are usually written.

No, it's not because the slash can represent a fraction and each side of the fraction is essentially within a set of parenthesis.

So basically it's

(20) / (5(2*2))
(20) / (5(4))
(20) / (20)
1

>Oh, no. Those two symbols are interpreted differently.
No they aren't. I have never seen anyone who consistently uses / the way you are describing.

Were this problem fully written out on two lines, like so,

20
---------
5 (2 * 2)

the 5 and the (2 * 2) would be implicitly grouped. This is what causes the ambiguity when it is written out on a single line, as that would be equal to 20 / (5(2 * 2)). However, that is not what is written here.

The problem as shown contains a syntactical error which even different models of calculators will try to resolve differently. The CORRECT behavior would be to tell the operator to fuck off and enter the problem correctly.

20 / 5 * (2 * 2)

20 / (5 * (2 * 2))

Pick exactly one.

...

I don't get what you're implying here.

I agree with your reasoning, but I don't think kids would benefit from this. Until they get some experience, this way of writong things might confuse them further.
Still, math is not a field where you should be able to apply feminist logic

PEMDAS you stupid motherfucker.

Parentheses: 2 * 2
Exponents: None
Multiplication: 5(4)
Division: 20 / 20
Addition: None
Subtraction: None.

Therefore 20 / 5 ( 2 * 2 ) = 1

Kindly off yourself.

Do a reverse image search on the original. It's a screen shot from an XP theme software, not a common core slide.

> I don't think kids would benefit from this
I don't either. Keep in mind that the image is fake tho.

She's a dumbass, dumbass

I didn't think you had to do the multiplication before the division for PEMDAS.

>"Parentheses, Exponents, Multiplication and Division, and Addition and Subtraction"
To me, this means do multiplication first if it comes first or do division first if it comes first. It doesn't mean multiplication has a higher precedence over division.

Yeah, right.

C, Python, Haskell, WolframAlpha, and my TI-84 all disagree with you. Find me a single programming language or calculator that interprets / the way you are describing. I'll wait.

Many people get confused when they see a /, but no one consistently interprets it like you are describing.

Have you never seen a school projector!?

Not really, usually if that's the case it's written like 20/(5(2*2))

Multiplication and Division have the same priority. The only reason both answers are correct is because it is unclear whether the symbol indicates division or a fraction, period.

This guy gets it.

They use the acronym in that way for a reason. It helps to do them all in order. Trust me, I have passed many algebra tests simply because of PEMDAS.

Have you ever been to school retard. That's just the projector not perfectly aligned on the screen

Multiplication and division have equal precedence. When things have equal precedence, you just perform them in order from left to right.
It isn't
>parentheses
>exponents
>multiplication
>division
>addition
>subtraction
It's
>parentheses
>exponents
>multiplication AND division
>addition AND subtraction

I'm shocked that so many people on this board should have failed the third grade.

Division and fractions are the same fucking thing. 1/4 is 0.25, just as 16/20 -> 4/5 = .80.

Haven't you read what I wrote? When it's written inline in a paper, it's written like a/b. I don't care how your programming languages interpret it.

Calm your tits. I was pointing out the image is fake, look at it. Not the alignment of the projector.

Good job mindlessly repeating shit from elementary school without actually understanding it.

Multiplication and division have the same precedence, you fucking retard.

American education, everyone

Take your tinfoil hat off

>American education

>They use the acronym in that way for a reason.
They use the acronym because no one has come up with a better one. It's a terrible acronym because it leads to exactly the misconception you have.
algebrahelp.com/lessons/simplifying/oops/
A good teacher will make it clear that the order does NOT imply that multiplication precedes division. Clearly your teacher was not good.

The only thing retarded about this is that "educated" middle school teachers don't know how to add simple mathematical formulas to a document. Whatever they wrote in that picture is not standard mathematical notation. In standard mathematical notation, you would use brackets, which eliminates any ambiguity.

Okay m8, I totally didn't pass middle school and high school algebra because of doing pemdas in order. I'm totally not taking a math class right now to put credits towards graduation. I totally don't use it everyday and get the correct answer EVERY TIME BY DOING THEM IN ORDER.

/thread

> it is unclear whether the symbol indicates division or a fraction

You're a fucking retard. The division symbol is pretty much the same thing as a fraction's line that seperates the top and bottom numbers.

But you just got the wrong answer because of it.

...

Aussie here, I was told multiplication and division had equal priority so you just did it left to right.

I think it's just old people using it now, my grandpa told me it was how they taught it back in his day.
I hope you're either trolling or you don't have a job where fucking up calculations can cost lives.

No!

>P
Parenthesis
>E
Exponents
>M and D
Multiplication and Divisions, you do them both at the same time, starting with which ever is furthest to the left, then you do the next one furthest left
>A and S
Same as above, they have the same priority and you do them left to right. If addition is furthest left do it. If subtraction is furthest left, that's what you do.

>1/4-5
(1/4)-5 and 1/(4-5) are not the same, and without parenthesis is is unclear which you are indicating if you don't write it as in: The problem is you don't know if the 4 is supposed to be the denominator or 4-5 is.

No one interprets it like you are saying. There are some journals where implied multiplication has higher precedence that division with a slash, but NO ONE uses it as "/ means everything on the left is the numerator and everything on the right is the denominator."

And it's a stupid question anyway, since you should just write it as a fraction or use more parentheses if there's any potential for confusion.

Now try the same expression on a lisp interpreter. I bet you'll get 1

It's not about which one first there, it's that it becomes 5(4), and because of the parenthesis, you multiply first.
Christ.

You'll get an error, Lisp doesn't do infix.

Don't try and talk sense into these idiots. They'll just keep shitposting.

Not technology. You have to go back.

Sorry guys, but I was confusing in how I worded my message. I meant to write what you actually wrote.

You may have passed, but you shouldn't have. Every actual authority says they have the same precedence.
mathworld.wolfram.com/Precedence.html
The fact that your teachers don't mind just means you need better teachers.

And are you SERIOUSLY claiming that taking a math class makes you an authority? I'd bet most of the people here are college students currently taking math classes, friend.

I guess I can't. This thread is Facebook tier bullshit though, these pictures get posted with a caption like "ARE YOU SMARTER THAN COMMON CORE 4TH GRADERS?" and the comments range with answers like 5, 2, 1, 16, and then some asshole saying 50

Implicit multiplication does not take procedure.

2 * 2 = 4
-> 20 / 5 * 4
20 / 5 = 4
-> 4 * 4
-> 16

What is Sup Forums about common core
Please tell me Jewboy

It is

BODMAS
------------------
20 / 5 ( 2 * 2)

1. (brackets) 20 / 5 (4)
2. (division) 4 (4)
3. (multiplication) 16

To get one you'd need to prioritise multiplication before division...

1. (brackets) 20 / 5 (4)
2. (multiplication) 20 / 20
3. (division) 1


Who ever thought it was a good idea to bring about "Two possible answers" to linear equation is deserving a bullet

>PEMDAS
Cancer, thank God we didn't have this shit.

>replying to a college student taking a math class thinking other people in college classes means they're an authority too

>there are people that think it's 1
How does it feel to be worse at math than a 12 year old?

You mean precedence.

SOMETIMES it does, but not usually. It's ambiguous enough that you should never write the expression like that.

>The part that should piss you off more is the "equally correct' bit.
Eh. It depends on the exact precedence rules you follow. They are both totally correct in different situations.

In mathematics, you can do whatever you like as long as you define the rules first.

Brackets
Indices
Division
Multiplication
Addition
Subtraction

This is like pre-GCSE stuff.

You're not prioritising shit. Implicit multiplication takes precedence for the same reason 5x is not the same as writing 5*x. The former is considered a single entity, the latter isn't.

I cited Wolfram Mathworld, not myself. Nice try, though!

>a college student taking a math class
Is that really supposed to impress me?

You get the correct answer (16) if you interpret PEMDAS correctly

...

Parentheses
Exponents
Multiplication
Division
Addition
Subtraction

Please gtfo and go to school

Proof that american education is shit. Your degree is worth nothing more than a toilet paper.

>waiting for the incoming wave of europoor cognitive dissonance

>Implicit multiplication takes precedence
It might take precedence or it might not. There isn't a real standard. Different journals define the precise precedence rules differently.

>> No No No No No
1. 20 /5(4)
2. (20/5)*(1/4)
3. 4 * 1/4
4. fucking 1 No 16

What are you rambling? This is not the order.

It's just an ill formed problem, kids shouldn't be wasting their time studying something so insignificant

20/5(2*2)
20/5(4)
You multiply 5 by 4 first, because the 4 is still in brackets and that takes precedence.

I was responding to the end of your post, dipshit. I AM one of the college students you were talking about, retard.

I find it hilarious that so many people are using PEMDAS as if it's some killer argument when they don't understand what it means.

Multiplication and division are the same precedence. Period.mathworld.wolfram.com/Precedence.html
Period.

It still causes more problems than the ones that it solves.

>not the order
Where are you from exactly

But that's wrong you tard.

In a lateral term yes they are but in this format its using PEMDAS

You're more retarded than anyone else in this thread. Your math is not even up to discussion, it's just wrong. In what tard universe is 4 = 1/4

You mean BEDMAS?

If you have an equation with only division an dmultiplication, and no brackets, you do it left to right.

It causes problems for retards.

The parentheses that remain after (2*2) means multiplication takes precedence.

>be american
>get shot