WTF I hate Apple now!

WTF I hate Apple now!

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oh woah is the general tide of Sup Forums liking apple turning??!???!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?!?!?

Wow ive hated appel for years!

innovation

This no headphone jack shit is retarded. Tried bluetooth phones, they die at the worst possible time, and more adapters such. Nobody except a couple of tech bloggers and Apple thought that the iPhone was too thick and that removing the headphone jack was a worthwhile endeavor.

>implying it won't ship with an adapter
>implying it wasn't done on an android phone first

name one android phone

Moto Z
Moto Z Force

>implying an adapter is the answer to the problem that's posed
>implying you can listen to music while charging
>implying Bluetooth won't just drain the battery even more as it's charging
>implying you're not just a whore that settles for subpar products
>implying implications

LeEco

>Moto Z
>Moto Z Forc
literally fake iphone
>LeEco
literally fake iphone

The best answer is wireless headphones, hombre. Subpar technology is an audio jack that's nearly a century old.

i don't see any reason not to push for maximum thinness, but i do agree that losing the headphone jack was cutting off the nose to spite the face. i would prefer a thicker iPhone if it meant all that extra space went to a bigger battery.

i'm only posting this because my frustration with/dislike of apple isn't some blind brand zealotry, grasping for new excuses every day; i just don't see the benefit of this change, and i'm pretty sure i would prefer alternative ways of getting what i want (e.g. better battery life - if that is the driving motivation here, and the rumors suggest it is).

please don't be such an obnoxious faggot. phones in the camp we like do stupid shit as well. admitting that won't cause you to melt or your brain to explode.

I own an iPhone 6 (work, personal is a Moto X Pure) and this will be my last iPhone if future models don't come with 3.5mm jacks. I hear the corporate integration of the Android phones is far better than it used to be.

>a century old standard that literally everyone and their grandmother has used
>lol let's get rid of it for the noodle armed faggots that review our shit on youtube
Getting rid of practical technology for muh thin muh sleek is retarded and if you support it, you're a kikecocksucker.

If it ain't broke don't fix it.

There are USB type c headphones out now, though the charging thing I could see as an argument I suppose. But unless you're carrying around power packs with you, you're plugged into a wall. So just go listen to your fucking music on your computer.

>no headphone jack
>couldn't even presume they had that before
user it's what you wanted. You've been willfully locked in to their ecosystem. Deal with it like the moron you are.

Fuck, I wish old people would die already.

You guys are holding back society.

What does the analog conversation in USB headphones?
Are there regular pinouts for analog sound?

It must be hard to post on Sup Forums with an acoustic coupling modem.

>DA FOOTURE

do you REALLY need thinner iPhone? are you retarded or underage?

Is it really thinner?

>implying all subsequent iterations of modems weren't clearly better
That's the thing, if there was a clear and obvious advantage to using Bluetooth over 3.5, I'd go for it.

>muh wireless is an advantage tho
It's not at all discernible from analog. Fuck it.

i have a samsung galaxy s4 google edition from ~2013 i guess, right around when it came out. the promise from google was that it would be treated just about like a nexus phone (which, at the time, seemed to be the best bet in terms of getting updates quickly and getting them for several years).

the SGS4GE didn't get marshmallow over the air and definitely isn't getting nougat. the corresponding iPhone from that time (the iPhone 5S came out a few months later, but let's go with the 5) is still on the list for getting the next iOS update. there's no indication that they'll drop it for iOS 11, but even if we assume they do, that's still 2 extra years of "from the horse's mouth" continued updates without me having to go mess with custom ROMs.

so i've been burned by google, specifically android, and what has felt to me like a frantic propensity to drop support of devices to try and stay nimble. that can get/has gotten very frustrating, and has made me lose trust in android as a platform. i don't feel like i see android settling down and while that might be exciting if you plan on upgrading every year or two, i'm really content with a smartphone that i don't feel obligated to replace after 2 or 3 or even 4 years.

i'll grant that google services integration in my s4 was *much* better than in my iPhone 6, but the continuity between os x and iOS is getting really compelling - as in, overwhelmingly so.

Who the fuck cares? It's an iPhone. No sane being will ever buy it

sound quality isn't the sole criterion for headphones, and it sure as fuck shouldn't even be in the top 3 for headphones you're using with a smartphone.

if you're an audiophile and you care a lot about fidelity, fine, but don't pretend you'll be satisfied with anything less than tube amps and shit. and that's clearly not the use case apple (or any smartphone maker) is going after.

ASSUMING the low bitrate problem is solved in some way, this still leaves
>needs recharging
>has an inferior DAC and amp that cannot be bypassed
>more expensive for the same quality(and as of now, WORSE quality) due to the reasons above. Oh and getting rid of the jack doesn't get rid of phone's DAC and amp - speakers aren't going anywhere any time soon. You pay more for worse experience. Fits Apple to be honest familia.

You're right. But that would imply that CEOs and other phone designers are sane.
It's all about copying apple, didn't you know?

...

tell us more about your keen psych insights about ~beings~.

What the fuck are you even talking about?

I just don't want my existing technology to become obsolete for some retarded reason, but apparently you can only think of things in terms of old and new, audiophile or not. Fuck off. If you want to waste your money going wireless, go right ahead.

>sound quality shouldn't even be in the top 3 for headphones
So what should be? Oh, please, wise spender of money. Please tell me how my purchasing choices are retarded.

The headphones themselves have a dac. It's no different than regular USB headphones for your computer, just a smaller port.

>needs recharging
welcome to literally everything in our lives. people bitched about this when smartphones became more popular as everyday devices, when we started using tablets instead of e-readers more, when smartwatches started replacing watches, etc...

all this shit requires recharging. it's obnoxious. whatever camp has held out because of this is barely affecting anyone's bottom line (if at all)

>inferior DAC
so far the reasoning appears to be that DACs will be built for the headphones, which means more tailored DACs, which will (ostensibly) be good. if you're an audiophile who cares a lot about the audio quality coming out of your smartphone, then
1) what the fuck are you?
2) you will almost certainly be able to buy a standalone DAC at whatever price point you want to satisfy your troubling needs.

>more expensive for the same/worse quality
yes, welcome to literally all companies fucking us forever since forever ago.

>speakers aren't going anywhere any time soon
chromecast audio, apple's cast tech, etc... are rendering these obsolete. or is your argument that apple is uncharacteristically dropping support for ubiquitous technology? because i'd like you to go look for the shitstorm Sup Forums had over the MBA's initial debut.

>Fits Apple to be honest familia
i have no clue what you're trying to say here. is this some dog whistle to signal to redditors or something?

This is the year to get a 6S lads.

so if iphone users have to buy lightning headphones, how will they plug their lightning headphones into their macs?

Will they need a 2nd dongle?

Sounds expensive and dumb, with little room for expandability.

>people will eat this up

i think it's really clever of you to quote just the first part of my sentence and deliberately leave out the part about the smartphone, since that would make your argument pretty obviously retarded.

If you're listening to music on your phone you don't give a shit about audio quality in the first place, it's about portability and convenience.
Blue. Tooth.

You have headphones? That's wild, so do I!
You'll probably be able to buy a DAC. If you care about audio quality, you almost certainly have one already, so the concept shouldn't be that foreign to you.

so you're implying that all lightning headphones will have bluetooth too? Because that's not true

>2 dongles required

If you don't want your tech to become obsolete every other year you just shouldn't buy Apple. The company is notorious for removing and changing ports for no good reason and charging 20€ for simple adapter cables.

>Apple being Apple

not him, but how many headphones are you going to buy?

i figure *if* i buy new headphones, they'll be bluetooth headphones that allow me to connect to the device if necessary. the QC35 illustrate this concept with a 3.5mm jack that Bose obnoxiously (but predictably) botched with a proprietary jack on the headphone side (if i remember reading reviews correctly).

bluetooth headphones that can plug in to the phone and either charge and/or work as "wired" headphones seems fine to me. stop getting triggered over dongles.

The 2 ear buds I seen with a quick search were 200$. It'll drop in price as it becomes more standardized. As far as over ear headphones and on ear they typically have a removable cable. So you could just get a micro USB - the USB c cable and problem solved.

The Iphone is thin enough. I need more battery time

Even your jokes are old gramps. die already

I remember having a Motorola Razr with no 3.5mm jack. You had to use the supplied mini-usb headphones. It was hell if they broke because you couldn't just use any other pair of the ubiquitous 3.5mm kind.

Apple is taking the industry right back to those shitty days and the rest of the fucking sheep companies will probably copy them. Fuck em.

reason ain't gonna get you anywhere with zealots. someone brought up the moto z and a zealot literally dismissed it despite being the exact same principle/issue.

zealots are not rational.

You said two things.
>1. Audio quality isn't what matters in headphones
Go ahead, tell me what matters.
>2. Audiophiles would be the ones to cling onto analog audio, and they use exorbitant snake oil to listen to music
This would imply that I'm not already satisfied with my phone's audio and that I don't use a simple headphone + phone setup. But that's exactly what I do, I just don't see a good reason for going wireless and completely getting rid of 3.5.
I'm concerned that if apple starts doing this shit, everyone else will follow, excluding moto who have already done it.

I still don't think you'll be able to come up with more criteria for headphones though, I'm assuming you're some sort of shill. Probably do it for free as well.

In what way?

A phone has two functions:
phone calls and catching poke memes.
If it can't do either, what the fuck are you paying so much for it?

Without the headphone jack, you cannot use it with those cheap headsets that let you take calls, you can't hear music while running, you can't hear music with high quality headphones.

Maybe all those things are obsolete.

Maybe wireless is a good replacement.
Maybe this is a needed push so we can get innovation in wireless sound systems.
But wireless and wired connections can coexist if you were worried about innovation.

so are you going to charge these headphones with the lightning port from your phone? Or will you carry a 2nd cable to charge it through something that's actually available like USB?

sounds like utter shit. Can't wait to see the markup on these products for the lightning connector royalty

>all this shit requires recharging
Wired headphones don't.
>DAC
Did you miss the part where I said you can't bypass the built-in DAC and amp or something?
>yes, welcome to literally all companies fucking us forever since forever ago.
With wired I don't overpay for what I won't use(because there's literally nothing I won't use).
>chromecast audio, apple's cast tech, etc
And you're carrying it all in your pocket, right? Phone's buil-in speakers, man. You know, for calls, alarms, etc.
>he doesn't have noise isolating plugs
And wireless headphones are less portable anyway - you have to recharge them.

but that's actually impossible. we have wireless specs that handle audio reasonably well, and better iterations of bluetooth are in the pipeline. so worst case scenario is that you'll be stuck using a standardized wireless protocol to use your headphones. pairing devices is hellish, but nowhere near as bad as proprietary headphone plugs were.

and even if they try to push a wire standard on us, we're talking about a bifurcated de facto standard: either lightning or USB type C. smartphones are moving to type C and there's virtually no chance that manufacturers will introduce a proprietary port for audio. they'll push on that type C port being the vector for audio devices. that's not ideal, but it's a far cry from proprietary audio jack hell.

stop being so fucking melodramatic. you're not helping.

you literally contradicted yourself.

bluetooth is everywhere, not like your dumb motorola headphones

Not that sadcunt but what really matters to normies these days in headphones is overdone bass and the fashion behind some, ie beats by dre

Then you have the DAC problem being left up to headphone manufacturers instead of a single solution (ie. Apple's). Then you have replacing actual good headphones people own already just because for not enough justifiable improvement for the expense. Wireless entails having to charge fucking heaphones along with everything else these days plus added battery drain using bluetooth which means less battery life on the phone requiring even more charging.

So stop being a fucking apologist, you aren't helping.

It was a stupid decision. The devices don't need to be made thinner. On top of that, wireless headphones are just something else to charge.

Apple owners will carry:
>lightning to 3.5mm dongle
>lightning splitter for audio and charging dongle
>usb to lightning dongle so they'll work on computers
>Tim Cook's 10" dongle in their ass

Fuck bluetooth. Added power drain plus having to now replace already good headphones with some stupid wireless crap that will require charging. Fuck off.

the ipod touch is thinner than the iphone 6S but it still has a headphone port.

kek, BTFO

are you honestly retarded or is your internet cutting out and not loading the rest of that line and inexplicably picking up again to load the rest of the page? what's going on here?

audio quality on smartphones has never been very good. no high quality headphones have drawn out everything that you could get from an audio file through the DAC in smartphones. they're all pretty shitty. if you ever cared about audio quality, you would have owned a separate DAC and, more importantly, you wouldn't be having listening sessions piped through your phone.

smartphones are, for 90% of consumers, vehicles to stream shitty 128kbps audio from spotify.

for a lot of people, headphones just need to not get in the way (e.g. tangled cables) and to have some controls over the home device (pause, play, volume up/down, etc...). if you replaced 90% of people's earbuds with high quality earbuds in identical packaging, they wouldn't notice that they were using higher quality earbuds. a lot of them are just blasting this shit on the subway or bus to avoid talking to people on their commutes.

you've clearly decided at the outset that you're going to demand high audio fidelity from your smartphone and perhaps that you won't be okay with anything apple does (even if on paper the moto z was first through the door on this mistake). why should i take you any more seriously than a frothing zealot if you're dismissing me as a shill (as if literally anyone cares whether Sup Forums hates apple or loathes them).

>expecting reasonable answers from people that claim that a device designed to play music should't play it good
Some people just prefer form over function. They can't be helped.

>128kbps audio from spotify
Spotify and GPM stream at 320k

Apple is ~256k

All the retard Apple cult members will lap this up. Apple will say they have revolutionized everything again by being the first to remove a golden standard of audio technology. I mean, come on! It's not as if everyone is not already using the 3.5mm jack just fine already. Noooooo. It's not as if Apple's iPhone is already slated to be less successful going forward because the market it saturated and profits are now going to dry up - they can't surely need some other very necessary revenue stream like selling people headphones that they already own but with a different connector (that Apple will surely replace again in the future like they always do just to sell you more shit). But also, they can sell to those that do not want to "upgrade" their headphones by supplying an adapter to use what was already standard. Wew.

Fuck Apple and all its users. Choke on a dick.

yeah the old version was 7.3mm thick and this one is 7.2

t. apple shill that's okay with removed ports that are standardized

W O W A W H O L E 0.3 M M

Does the removal of the 3.5mm jack only make it 0.1mm thinner or does it make room for anything else in the phone?

wow super clever how you reflect my own rhetoric back at me. it's almost like you're clever, but you don't have to do anything annoying like think about how to argue a point.

the consensus around DACs is that they should be built around headphones. yes, there will be shitty, cheap headphones with crappy DACs built in. if you want better audio quality, you'll be able to buy higher end headphones with more finely tuned DACs. or if you want, you can buy a DAC and keep using your existing headphones. this isn't rocket science.

the charging panic is one we have with literally every new device category. people panicked about smartphones because it meant now we had 1 battery spanning our PMPs, phones, etc...; people panicked about tablets because it added yet another thing we would need to charge; people panicked about smartwatches because it was yet another thing that we used to only need to charge occasionally (or for which we needed to replace the batteries every once in a while).

i have a fucking 10-port usb power hub on my desk because shit has gone crazy out of hand. but noise canceling headphones and earbuds established this beachfront years ago. you're acting like this is all new to you - maybe it is, to you, but it's not new.

try again

>wow super clever how you reflect my own rhetoric back at me. it's almost like you're clever, but you don't have to do anything annoying like think about how to argue a point.

tl:dr

Cry more.

how do i into basic math

spotify's default rate is 160 and higher settings aren't even available unless you pay for premium service. many people i've spoken to who pay for premium aren't even aware of the difference because it's not automatically enabled (and they clearly aren't noticing enough to go looking for the option to improve audio quality).

most audio consumers are not discerning. they're neither predisposed to it nor in situations that cause them to stop and wonder why their audio quality sounds subpar. that's the point. nitpicking the numbers is missing the point.

The battery is bigger too, but I will definitely miss the headphones Jack is my phone doesn't have one...

>Apples users in this thread would rather have lightning only rather than lightning + a 3.5mm jack

>literally asking for a feature to be removed

you can't make this shit up

did you manage to read the rest of the post or did you need to take a break to cry? i feel like i was pretty even-handed with you till now, but if you're just breaking down i don't want to follow you into this childish back and forth.

>it's almost like you're clever, but you don't have to do anything annoying like think about how to argue a point.

Hilarious. You ignore all his points and continue being an ignoramus. Projecting much?

Fuck off you shill.

Still here? I think your mommy is calling you, sperg fucker.

>2016
>wired headphones

i don't think anyone is claiming this; i'm personally saying that this isn't the cataclysmic end of the world that melodramatic zealots are trying to make it out to be. it's not unprecedented (moto z) and there are obviously solutions and workarounds to all the apparent problems that arise.

somehow this is being misread as apologists and asking for the feature to be removed. i don't expect zealots to understand nuance, but this is so far off the mark that i wonder if you people are literate or just looking for key words to signal if people agree with your shit-throwing.

This is what a stupid person thinks being rational sounds like.

do try to read a whole multi-paragraph post. you'll see a pretty thoughtful, comprehensive argument being laid out and you might even find that you agree with some parts of it.

acting like a faggot isn't constructive, and i'm not sure if you think you're convincing anyone, but you're certainly not on this end.

if you can articulate a more substantive argument than "fuck off you shill" i might even be open to being convinced

>there are obviously solutions and workarounds to all the apparent problems that arise.
no workarounds are acceptable. Lenovo shat all over the Moto Z and the world laughed

look dude, i can't help if you're a retard who only sees things in black and white. go stomp around if you need to, but as much as we all want, apple isn't going to go bankrupt because of this, and i've explained why.

>tfw have very sensitive headphones(dual driver BAs) and all other hardware, including "high end" amps, obviously designed for high-ohm headphones has that constant hissing even at the lowest volume
>my shitty phone doesn't
Sure, I had to lower max volume with fauxsound app, but it still is extremely ironic. Especially when there are people saying "sound quality doesn't matter on smartphones". On my laptop I never raise volume above 30%.

can you point to reviews of it where it's been shat on? the overriding adjective i'm seeing in moto z reviews is probably "ambitious". that's hardly a term i would expect to see in a phone that's largely being "shat on".

>ambitious
no. nobody is asking for this.

Maybe the music industry is just so they can implement another layer of DRM

Don't get me wrong, I'm not for it personally. But I don't think it's anywhere near as big of an issue as people make it out to be. USB headphones are in fact nice, and can be manipulated through software and improved with firmware. You gain the benefit of far less signal loss since the analogue signal isn't generated until just before it hits the speakers. You can actually drive down cost on phones (however minimal or even null because much thin) by not having to have a dac and amp in the hardware. It's expensive right now, but so is every new technology ever.

By far the easiest thing to do is just not buy the product if you don't like it. And anyone talking about not being able to use a dac or amp because of this is retarded because it's a fucking portable device to begin with. Not only that, but maybe you should be getting a standalone player if you're that worried about it.

>b-but it's for phones
Fuck off.
Where do you draw the line?
Normalfags only use their $1000+ macs for facebook, so should computer manufacturers use less powerful components and still mark up the price as regular?
Removing features and standards is not okay, it gives consumers less flexibility and forces them into a niche userspace.
If you are okay with that, you're what's ruining western business practices.

yeah, but like i said zealots need to make this the end of the world, or else it's just one shitty thing that everyone is doing to varying extents and it means nothing and has no impact on companies the zealots hate.

do you need me to point to a review that actually uses the word "ambitious"? i think technigger said something along these lines as well, but i'm pretty sure i can find it in print as well.

>he said while trying not to regret his brand loyalty, knowing full well Android and Windows Phone users don't have to deal with shit like this

who the fuck cares what he thinks? Nobody is buying that fucking phone.

if you're keen on high quality audio from your smartphone, then vote with your wallet. you're arguing this as though you're being forced at gunpoint to buy an iPhone. are you? or are you bitching about a phone that you definitely wouldn't have bought anyway?

if apple totally fooled us and announced an iPhone 7 with a 3.5mm jack, it wouldn't be in the running for you for a next phone anyway. so why are you acting like this will HAVE to be your phone and like this will DEFINITELY be the end of the world as we know it?

it just sounded like he was skeptical that people were actually somewhat upbeat about the moto z (and that the 3.5mm jack was hardly the banner for all the things wrong with)

> adapter

What's the point of Apple devices if you have to carry so many adapters?

From the old iMacs to the new Macbooks, all I see is huge cable messes.

Where did you think I'm talking about audio quality?
Show me. I want to see where I'm talking about muh bitrate. No one said jack shit about audiophile quality until you brought it up. In fact, I said that wireless audio sounds the same as 3.5 mm, and because it has no advantage, it's not worth it.
I'm merely concerned about the loss of usability, the loss of preexisting and standard features. I don't care how it sounds, I just want to be able to use what I already have. That was my original point, you're the nigger that bought up audio quality.
And no, I'm not even saying that I'm an iPhone user, I'm just saying that, given how things are, it's very likely that Apple won't be alone in their decision to go digital. I lament this, because ultimately it only hurts users.

i agree user. baby boomers are cancer on society. because of them our internet infrastructure is shit because dsl speeds is good 'nuff for them. They also created this cultural marxist society they taught in colleges. Boomers deserve hell.

if you drink the apple kool-aid all the way, you buy wireless headphones and charge things at home somewhat infrequently.

if you fully drink the kool-aid and buy a retina macbook, you don't use the type C adapter very much - your devices are all connected to your laptop by bluetooth and whatnot.

apple's vision for how you use technology works really well if you buy in at 100%. if you wade in just waist-deep, the dissonance becomes incredibly frustrating. but all taken together, things like continuity between iOS and watchOS and OS X are all really nice.

the problems are multifold:
1) apple has lost some focus in its vision lately - Don Norman and Bruce Tognazzini (both pretty much leading figures in HCI/UI research/design) have written about this fastcodesign.com/3053406/how-apple-is-giving-design-a-bad-name

2) you really need to buy in 100%. and that's not easy (or perhaps even doable) given the lack of focus in apple lately.

>Where did you think I'm talking about audio quality?
what was
>>muh wireless is an advantage tho
>It's not at all discernible from analog. Fuck it.
about if not a point about audio quality? were you saying that wireless and analog are not discernible in some other way?