Do distros like Ubuntu ultimately hurt user ability to fully use a GNU+Linux system due to there being no interaction...

do distros like Ubuntu ultimately hurt user ability to fully use a GNU+Linux system due to there being no interaction via the terminal but through the gui instead?

No

Yes

you're not the boss of me now

Being presented with a GUI does not limit the user ability to access the commandline unless the administrator of the system chooses to purposefully limit it.

It rings true even for Windows/NT operating system.

Friendly reminder that only turbospergers use terminals.

High IQ people use MacOS. Only spergs who think they're smart use Linux because they think being able to use a command line is a barrier to entry to being able to use one is a sign of intelligence when in reality it means you're just dumb enough to waste your time when you could be productive.

no.
Say you can do everything from a GUI.
The CLI then becomes something extra, a way to create the GUI tools you rely on or something you only use when typing it out is easier than clicking buttons.

I do a lot of my work through a variety of tools, some of them are CLI, some are GUI.
From this, I have learned that GUI tools are meant to teach the user how to do a task while they are doing it, where CLI tools are meant to be learned and then you use them.

Say you want to use a GUI tool to learn to navigate the file structure on your system, while learning to use a CLI tool to do the same.
Something like dolphin is a good tool, because you can see what is happening in the terminal, you can even type stuff in there yourself to manipulate the file manager or the files available.
The documentation is built into GUIs, eg. you can learn hotkeys by discovering the functions in the menus and you get a category sorted view of what the application can do.

Later learning that those functions can be called from somewhere else is not going to prevent people from learning later.

gnu/linux is a very simple system and it does not take a long time to learn how to use it.

What I personally believe IS hurting new users is the renaming of applications.
Calling eclipse "document viewer" is bad.
It should be "eclipse - document viewer" if anything other than eclipse.
If they are supposed to create a hotkey or something, obviously they could go into the help->about page or use a system monitoring tool to find the real name but I don't see why they should hide it in the first place.
This is basically giving them less information.

I believe KDE has solved this in a great way.
They use .desktop files when you launch stuff, this allows multiple entries, such as "name", "description", "comment" etc.
And when you search for an application, you can search the description or the comment and you will be shown the real name of the application.

>there being no interaction via the terminal but through the gui instead?
What the fuck are you talking about?

>GNU+Linux system due to there being no interaction via the terminal but through the gui instead?

wtf are you talking about. I run ubuntu and use the terminal for everything.

Why would it? A UI is ultimately supposed to make things easy, understandable and accessible. If Ubuntu aims to be a desktop OS, its GUI should be the average user's first choice to complete any task. For what a GUI simply can't do, there's the CLI.

Nothing's stopping you from using the CLI over the GUI, the CLI will always be there for users to use but the GUI should be successful enough that most users wouldn't use it as their first option. IMO if you're using the CLI for every little thing then your desktop GUI is a failure.

I think they're more an indication as to where operating systems like Linux (I'm not gonna call it GNU/Linux retard) that give the user a lot of control should be moving. The fact that there are still operations that require the Terminal is inacceptable. I'm not saying they should get rid of the terminal. It's just that the terminal should not be required for anything.

>tfw installing software via terminal is faster than downloading an installer or installing via some app store
>tfw terminal text editors leave more screen real estate for code while sacrificing no features. only retards don't use hotkeys

I can't think of any operation that absolutely requires the terminal, not for a casual user

The desktop files are a standard, any environment can use them.

>casual user
that's the point. even professional user shouldn't be dependant on the terminal. it's finally time to get the convenience into linux. it's a great, stable system but it's not really convenient for anyone yet. we need GUIs that are closer tied to the kernel and the inner workings of the system. just a quick example:

>have laptop
>sometimes wifi doesn't work after waking up from sleep
>have to reload iwlwifi via terminal or script

I have automated this but it would still be more convenient if I had a settings window which I could use to tell the system to reload iwlwifi every time I wake up the machine.

>do distros like Ubuntu ultimately hurt user ability to fully use a GNU+Linux system due to there being no interaction via the terminal but through the gui instead?

Linux is for shitty little kids to pretend they are 1337 h4x0rz

Try BSD kiddo and grow the fuck up

no, Unity hurts the linux system because their settings menus are garbage, wasting the user's time until they give up on linux or learn to use the CLI instead.

KDE actually does gui pretty well. I've never had to go through the CLI to disable mouse acceleration, change monitor refresh rates, etc.

No shit posting dude !
KDE is a bag of shit

Windows has GUIs for almost every operation but they are terrible, unintuitive, ugly and rarely get the job done. I don't use Macs so I don't know the situation there. I can't say that this is better than a CLI

as for your problem, that's clearly a bug. I don't know if any OS has a GUI setting that lets you restart drivers on wakeup. In fact, I wouldn't know how to do that in Windows by any means other than restarting

At least I can disable mouse acceleration through KDE. I had to use the CLI through Unity and Cinnamon. KDE is the only one I've tried that actually has decent multi-monitor support and isn't missing any really obvious features.

>hurr durr
>I need an overly complex OS to display my intelligence to everyone
>tfw I can't even show people how intelligent I am because I never leave the house
>tfw I can via Sup Forums
grow up. this is the order of priorities for the average user:

stability > convenience > features/customizability

nice fancy talk for "imama bettar than u!!!!!!!!!!"

Worst cancer for linux by far: "we must make it shit to keep the normies out"

Ubuntu has done 100,000x more than any of your quantum bullshit autism "recommendation" wherein you tell a newbie to use some piece of shit distro. Guess why they never got back, because 5 minutes into the terminal they gave up.

Fuck off with your "it must not change from muh 90s" shit, you aren't into computer science, and you certainly aren't helping, you are just making it worse.

you losers spout 999 different things about customizing de's and terminals but the second you install ubuntu you choose the main distro - you don't use the same standard and fucking do that when you choose your autism distro, you choose a fork of it with your DE that you like. Now you pretend ubuntu doesn't even come with a terminal.

fuck off

Startin the day with Ubuntu!
Mother f, get it right!
Best linux distro ever released.

then 9.11 happend :p
Immagine if they had polished the fuck out of it like os 10.

i'm not sure how you can get by with using ubuntu without ever using the terminal, so i'd say no.

Ubuntu MATE is the answer. MATE is everything GNOME 2 could have been

No, because
1. they have terminal preinstalled
2. run into some kind of problem or try do something "our of ordinary", when you search for a solution the first line will be "open a terminal".

this

Though I think it pays off to learn Linux, that's not the answer. Most people don't have the time or the energy to get into it. If an OS requires learning more than "where are my files" or "how do I change my wallpaper" it won't ever get a decent market share. Also it's pretty obvious that more people would be using Linux if it came pre installed on more computers. A lot of people don't even know what an operating system is. They just use what's on their computer and that's it.

I don't think so. I was happy to have GUI programs at my disposal to make the switch from Windows easier, but some things you can only do via the terminal. I was interested in learning it and now I can't ever go back to Windows.
And not everyone needs to be proficient with the terminal. Having the freedom to choose between CLI and GUI is nice.

> high IQ
> posts a picture of Trump

GNU/Linux*

How does using the terminal waste your time and hurt your productivity, mactoddler?

>nothing is as fast and goal oriented as using the CLI
>it's just text, no distractions
>also way more powerful than any GUI shit

In my mind, high IQ people make enough money and have enough varying interests that they often use different operating systems for different functions.

No. RMS is a disgusting manchild. I don't want to be associated with him.

That's the intended purpose of Ubuntu and distros like it though, so no it doesn't hurt anyone.

>le trump is dumb meme

RMS calls it GNU/Linux based on the POSIX definition of an OS. Guess what, RMS himself is a driving force behind POSIX. It's basically his definition.

How does one figure out what the latest gcc package or any other package is? Is there a meta package manager that installs gcc-6 when I'm still on gcc-5 or something?

They have money but they don't have time to mess around with different operating systems.

dpkg -l | grep "name of package"
to see installed version

apt show "package name"
information about package

apt search "package name"
search not installed packages

ctrl+alt+T

Terminal

what are you even talking about

>not using MATE

Is MATE better than XFCE? Also aren't they both using the older graphics which has a hard time processing animations? Cinnamon and GNOME are using the newer one at least.

>fully use
Most poeple don't need to fully use an OS

Some things are done better through GUI, some through CLI. If someone really requires it, he'll learn how to use CLI. But no one should feel forced to use a tool that way when he's really not required to or has the time to deal with GUIs instead.

Now, I've been in a class where people barely knew how to use a terminal and I can tell you that yes, at the beginning they're really dumb, but they get it like the rest after a while.

what the heck are you talking about? the terminal is readily available and quite necessary to familiarize oneself with, under every distro i've encountered, aside from elementaryOS.

Ubuntu doesn't stop you from using and learning to use a terminal/command line/bash. I'm not even sure what you're asking...

No, because it's 2017 and we stopped needing command line incantations approximately 2 decades ago.

If anyone wants to be more productive with bulk administrative tasks then they can still learn Bash or Powershell, but most people should not need to dick around with a command prompt to get everyday things done.

Unless they are babies everyone should be able to handle a different OS with a GUI like iOS and Android it's just that easy to figure stuff out for anyone with a brain same as for Linux (KDE/gnome) or windows.

If hes so dumb, how in the fuck did he win against all of the Establishment? and don't say Russia you antiquated shit who's stuck in the 80s

When OS stopped being a hobby and started being a tool I started running stock ubuntu, mostly LTS. This means I don't have to screw with stuff, it just works and it frees up time for more important things.

>my shitposting on Sup Forums up 300% even after generic firefox slowed me down 2%

This. As someone who grew up using DOS either on its own or as a part of Windows (or command prompt on NT) I'm no stranger to CLI by any stretch. But even despite that, if fucking around with one was a consistent, integral requirement to use Linux I can't honestly say I'd be particularly interested. Which is why I agree with the point tried to convey (not with the same hostility mind you) in that being more accessible/usable is not a bad thing, but rather a positive thing for the platform as a whole. It's not just casual users who can be deterred by the idea of having a CLI forced on them.

Like , I believe the key to a successful GUI environment is providing as much access to operating system functionality as appropriate; largely leaving the CLI either as an option for those that prefer it over GUI, or for cases where the GUI just can't do the job properly (and I'm not referring to a simple case of poor interface design)

As an aside, I installed Ubuntu just last night out of sheer curiosity (on a VM, not ready to fuck with dual booting yet). First ever experience with Linux of any form. Pretty comfy, I just need to figure out things to do with it.

>due to there being no interaction via the terminal but through the gui instead?

Blah, blah, something about "normie."
Blah, Blah, super secret clubhouse.
Blah, blah, Arch.
Blah, blah, Gentoo.
Blah, blah, something about "plebs."

>do distros like Ubuntu ultimately hurt user ability to fully use a GNU+Linux system due to there being no interaction via the terminal but through the gui instead?

> what is Ubuntu Server?

the dumbed down tablet interface sure doesn't help them not be tech retards

But you can use the terminal. I think the reason why Ubuntu has a GUI for most things is so it's not daunting for new users.

Life is too short to not use GUI

>due to there being no interaction via the terminal but through the gui instead?
Very few ubuntu users will not use the terminal from time to time.

If you don't use the terminal to quickly install programs you're just an idiot.

Want GIMP?

via terminal
>sudo apt-get install gimp

via other methods
>various fuckery with software centers, or downloading archives and executables

Once you get used to using the command line you will feel like the "old" way of downloading programs is hopelessly clunk and annoying

No, my first linux distro was SuSE and YaST was a godsend. It's extremely unlikely I would have bothered much with exploring linux and making use of a bunch of stuff if there wasn't a bunch of extremely useful guis for configuring & testing basic stuff.

>High IQ
Damn I have never been so happy to be stupid.

>that shitty mouse input lag on mate/gnome2
I think they should fix this, i mean lxde/openbox does it right and it's abandonware at the moment.
Also dark themes are the cancer of modern world.

this only works if you exactly know what to install, searching for package names and identifying software by logos is easier/quicker than apt-cache search , especially if seraching is so shitty that "web-browser" "www-browser" "www browser" "internet browser" give you totally different results

>Ubuntu MATE
It's a complete shit, I'm not even kidding/baiting.

he is the establishment you dumb cunt.

I have never experienced this problem. MATE is just perfect in every way on my computers.

>takes up only minimal screen real estate
>no unnecessary animations
>super slim menus
>responsive
>looks like GNOME 2

there is a literal delay ,just try to ragingly and autisitically select a box of the same size , and do the same on unity/gnome/kde/xfce/lxde. There is a difference, and its global , as if gnome 2/mate fucks with your input somewhere in between and its not very good at it. Mate is very comfy otherwise.

Then you're just dumb

nope. it's perfectly fine. feels the same on mate and xfce on the same computer with the same mouse and the same everything

No, because your ability to learn has far more to do with personal drive rather than forced necessity. If you want to do anything useful or even fun in even Ubuntu you better get comfortable with command line operations

No, if you truly believe there are no merits to using a GUI you're fucking retarded. People that autistic shouldn't be allowed to live.

you probably don't feel it, its fine user, its not a deal breaker if you don't game a lot.

I play CS:GO regularly. No problems at all.

>I play CS:GO regularly. No problems at all.
thats hardly gaymin you fucking casual

I believe you can access the terminal in ubuntu, or am I wrong? But it is something like the cmd or powershell in Windows.

this does not change the fact that 2 of my laptops and 1 pc experiences that lag, also my brothers laptop and random people on the internet do to. "Werks on my PC" is not an argument if a lot of people experience this.