What is to be done about the growing problem of web bloat?
The death of flash was supposed to mean an end to the madness, but it seems that it was in fact the beginning.
We should come up with an 8-point plan for web reform, I would suggest purging all bootstrap using "web developers" for a start, or at least putting them into a labor camp. What do you suggest?
Other urls found in this thread:
stallman.org
jgthms.com
twitter.com
no wonder ram usage is so high
Is 8kb an acceptable size for a blog web page? Like the home page.
There's nothing that can be done.
We can only hope that since computers don't follow Moore's law anymore and their performance isn't growing by a massive amount every year this trend won't progress beyond what we actually have right now.
I dream about web-dev hipsters forcing a replacament trend when they'll all brag with how little html5+/css they could create a functioning website. But that's just wishful thinking and even if such thing would actually happened there's no fucking way the "big guys" would follow
8kb is 8000 characters in plain english.
I think it's okay.
The "web bloat" doesn't exist, YOU are the problem. Replace your old laptops from early 2000s and get a 1 gbits connection.
It is bloated though. Why do sites however shit and useless they are like Facebook and The Verge need a 6950X and 32 GB RAM to not stutter?
Hopefully something will bring about people caring about being light weight and highly optimized.
Gulag
>le throw more hardware at it
epic, truly epic
>there is nothing wrong with raping mother earth so i can have twice the pixels in my animes and C U S T O M F O N T S
Decent compressed on imagen.
Rational use of JavaScript Frameworks.
Avoid create webapp unless begin extremely necessary.
I know JS and websocket heavy websites that are fast as fuck, it's just a problem of incompetent programmers
Its called apps
"The death of flash was supposed to mean an end to the madness, but it seems that it was in fact the beginning."
A good quote from Sup Forums? Never have i ever
I fucking hate this. Even websites about minimalism are heavy...
>Replace your old laptops from early 2000s and get a 1 gbits connection.
That just encourages even more web bloat.
HTML5+CSS3+JS compilers. All code is executed as root for performance reasons, but it's digitally signed by Google so viruses won't be a problem. You think web bloat is bad NOW? It hasn't even begun.
Is there any utility that can cut out extra bloat from webpages, like how AdBlock cuts out ads?
ie: webpage minimizer?
Idk how realistic this is but I swear something is going to have to give with the way things are going. The current pajeet/ normie webdev revolution is inevitably going to compound the problem.
Also:
>Google fucking chrome resource usage
>digitally signed by Google so viruses won't be a problem
But botnet will be
You can block some cosmetic features using ublock origin. This ends up saving a small bit for sure. I don't know anything else you could use but it's a helluva start at least
Most of the webpage (the Javascript) is already minimized.
You can use a text only browser like links2 on gnu/linux
>2010
>you had 16mbit internet
>2015
>you have 100mbit internet
the real wtf is
>2010
>google chrome uses 100mb ram, 200mb for 5 tabs
>2015
>google chrome uses 0.5gb ram, 1gb for 5 tabs
this
on sites you regularly visit, like FB or news, use ublock to just remove html elements. Like you are reading an article and on the side there are 10 blocks of links to their other articles, or videos or whatever just block it. It's great
Web developers weren't THIS retarded back in 2010.
Emphasize minimalism. Stop using frameworks you don't need, stop using huge photography to get around actual design and stop throwing in needless fluff like sliders because your webpage is "empty", try to creatively use whitepsace instead.
There's the designers and developers that think they NEED Bootstrap/Pure/Foundation/jQuery/Dojo/XYZScript but on the other hand, there's idiotic clients that feel that minimalism = not finished/empty and specifically demand shitty fluff like the aforementioned slider.
You can't really win.
That's because chrome pre caches pages
/thread
>Bootstrap/Pure/Foundation/jQuery/Dojo/XYZScript
visual frameworks need to go, there is really no reason for jQuery to exist now that we have cc3 and html5. I really doubt any website needs more interactivity than that.
The average page of my website seems to be about 500kb. But it still takes two seconds to load. More than 20% of the loadtime is spend waiting on Google stuff.
most websites don't even offer speeds that fast
web """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""developers""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
The past due death of Javascript.
THEN STOP USING GOOGLE BOTNET
The addition of WebGL was a sign of the end times of the old way of looking at websites. People are writing 3D game engines in fucking Javascript. There is nothing to be done. Websites are now applications. There is no way to reverse this. We need to give in, buy fast hardware and good connections, and move on with our lives.
Alternatively, move to Tibet. It's quite cold and you'll be expected to set yourself on fire occasionally, but you probably won't have to worry about website file sizes.
>week 1: complete codecademy ruby course
>week 2: complete codecademy ruby on rails course
>week 3: "hey guys I made this startup, it's like twitter but for vegetarians"
>tfw no good 2D JS game engine
the thing about image compression is that while they reduce the amount of data needed to transfer the image to your computer, they don't reduce the viewing memory needed, as ultimately it needs to be decompressed to view it
that is, a 100k jpeg of a 3000x2000 photo will take up 17MiB ram, because that's how big the raw (decompressed) data is
what's up with that btw? I see people do the most amazing things with JS but no game engine?
Get a tripcode
There's Superpowers which I actually just found and Sphere which you can find at spheredev.org
>TypeScript
And of course.
Sphere is a bit fragmented, could use more documentation and always seemed a bit all over the place development-wise but it's the only one I know of. of.
How are you meant to argue against people who say that bloated webpages aren't an issue when modern computers and internet connections can handle it? Because while that is true, saying that just because they can be bloated doesn't mean they should is a pretty lukewarm argument against it.
rewrite our understanding of the web from an image on a screen to a bunch of ideas; data and facts.
The display would be left to the browser; and not sent across the internet every damn time.
Get rid of Arial, as a matter of fact just make Times New Roman the only font you can use on the inter webs.
Why?
so he can block you reliably
Adblocking helps reduce the bloat :-)
*so he can retreat to his safe space
;-)
I don't understand where the problem is.
Most complaints in this thread are addressed to shitty coding.
That is the original vision of the www
He should just stop browsing Sup Forums if he's so easily trigger.
>mfw in 2007/8 i naive enough to think that content quality will only go up
>mfw i was fascinated by win98 era of ezines and thought it would be cool if more sites would follow this way of delivering text
le download our ad-supported app that needs permissions for GPS/contacts/storage/internet/and sending texts
Many people have datacaps. I have a few customers that insist on using 3G/4G. You have those with datacaps on landlines too, but I don't know how high those caps are in countries where they are relevant.
Many people buy cheap and slow laptops and tablets that don't have enough resources to manage heavier websites. Even my i5 4690 with 16GB RAM struggles on some sites. People who bought the cheapest laptop that has a Pentium N3540 and 2-4GB RAM running the full version of Windows 10 isn't going to have a good time visiting your site if you make it too heavy.
Personally, I don't think there is much reason to include huge pictures and scripts to make a good site. You can get far with some creative use of css.
>Even my i5 4690 with 16GB RAM struggles on some sites.
Post them.
You think I care enough to remember which exact site when they're so poorly made they don't work well on an almost 3 year old mid range desktop?
I don't revisit slow shitty sites, so I don't remember their names. Same reason why I don't remember why I didn't like the software I tried to use last month. I stuck with the one I thought sucked the least, and forgot the rest.
It's mostly bigger (but still shady) commercial sites overloaded with ads, and some blogs with infinite scrolling and a lot of javascript that eat up cpu cycles and memory.
It's simple, we kill the ad man.
he's a bit of a zombie though, tends to come back long after you thought you cleft his cerebrum in twain.
>reddit spacing
>not a single fact to back his bullshit
I'm not even going to bother to tell you where you should go back.
Maybe marxism-lenninism is the solution
Not sure what reddit spacing is.
I'll keep a notebook handy for the next time I find sites that struggle on current computers. Have to make sure I can prove every single statement.
You didn't exactly prove that all websites are light weight either, that all websites works great on current systems. You're also the first one to resort to insults.
>why
The newness on this board is terrifying
Try leaving.
Reddit spacing is when you make a new line after every one or two sentences. People will throw the term around no matter how a post is formatted if they don't like the contents of said post though. So basically it boils down to the meme that is "if I don't like what you said then clearly you're from a different website" which barely makes sense in the first place but here we are. What's a little bizarre is that people have used this style of formatting for a long, long time, and it has nothing to do with Reddit or any other website.
>You didn't exactly prove that all websites are light weight either
Because I didn't make such claim to begin with.
Even if he does get a tripcode, he can easily post without it whenever. He can change tripcodes at any time too. The suggestion was fucking stupid and pointless.
If you call bullshit on my claim that some websites are heavier than some current computers can handle, it's logical to assume that you believe no sites are too heavy for current computers.
What is the lightest site you know?
Why is software 100mb now instead of 1mb back in the days? Times change with hardware and so does the software with it. Get over it. If you're complaining because your data is limited then you only have yourself to blame americans.
Hipsters ARE creating this though.
They love to brag about "minimal material design". They think it's minimal.
Perhaps we should red pill them on barebone websites like motherfuckingwebsite.com
100mb software is unforgivable if it has the same functionality as 1mb soft has.
[spoiler]install gentoo
we need to stop using hipster frameworks
trying to write our own stuff
we will be amazed how good it can be
Use webpack. Problem solved.
Let's start with our own backyard.
How do we de-bloat Sup Forums?
I so check stallman.org every week for political updates, it is a well designed web site.
Remove surveillance capitalism
>What do you suggest?
I suggest you kill yourself, you fucking retard.
>What is to be done about the growing problem of web bloat?
Stop using shit sites.
>The death of flash
Hasn't happened yet, shit for brains.
Netscape back in the day only were around a few mb, chrome today is around 180-200mb when it's installed on your system. As i said, hardware gets better and the software moves with it to utilize it. It won't shrink in size because of it.
I use leynucks with firefox. No flash. I use chrome maybe two times a year for the rare site that needs flash.
Moore's law is about CPU transistors, Sup Forumsirgin. Not CPU performance.
Whoops cited my self
Start by removing the unnecessary javascript.
Ban weebm files.
Replace google captcha with an in-house version.
1) Learn how to bundle assets correctly. Webpack/Rollup. Use them.
2) Always server-side render.
3) Dynamic imports.
4) Don't rely on JavaScript being enabled. Always have graceful fallbacks in place.
5) Never use `import * as Whatever from 'somehere'`
All my side projects only send one JS file and one CSS file over the wire. The beefiest server I got is sending a 346kb JS file and a 5.6kb CSS file. While critical assets are inlined and everything is rendered server-side. This is a full Redux/React/RxJS application.
If you're new to Above-the-Fold rendering/critical inlining/bunding/SEO with modern web frameworks look at the Electrode project. It comes packed with a lot of niceties for the beginner.
If you're using Angular stop. If you have to use Angular Server-side render.
If you're using React consider Preact/Inferno. These can be drop in replacements with only a minor change to your Webpack/Rollup build config.
If you're using ember stop.
6) Code splitting. Require.ensure. Figure it out.
webms are less bloated than gif. And website wise it doesn't matter what is served anyways.
Webm is far better than gif.
7.0% of public web sites use flash.
Down from over 50%
Just to double-check, electron/nodejs desktop applications are bloated shit that break UI and spy on you, right?
Uploading a video format to an imageboard seems pretty lame to me.
Keep gifs, but limit them to fewer than 30 frames in total or something.
Not most, just like most things dipshit.
Right, but it's inherently bloated because it has to run its javascript bs and it breaks UI because it has its own CSS. So you're wrong...
Most electron apps use local OS UI libraries just like traditional cross platform desktop applications. Go download a few. Electron apps tend to be less responsive is the only real neg I've experienced (Atom for example).
>web devs in a labor camp
I can get on board with this. We need to separate out real coders who were forced to do web dev though. I suggest a problem solving quiz in C. If you pass, you're OK. If you do not, labor camp.
>pic related: labor camp
Is that guy named "Lara"? Ha, what a faggot.
No, you should not have accepted the work and left them bootstrap user.
I feel like a schmuck because I'm finally upgrading my processor from a Core 2 to Ryzen just to make web browsing faster. That was the thing that finally made me upgrade, not games. I can accept not playing games, but modern web sites taking an extra 10 seconds to become responsive is driving me up the wall.
:)
all thanks to javascript libraries just for a simple fade in effect on some popup and dynamic cuntent.
>cuntent
mistake or not i like this word