Mac

Programmer buying first mac.
Which one would be better cost and performance wise? The pro is $1500. The Air is $1349.

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bump

The air is cheaper and seems to have the same specs, but the hardware is older and I heard its getting replaced soon

a "programmer" making "apps" on his "macbook"

Yes, are you trying to learn English or something?

basically doesn't matter but i have the pro model because it has better screen (last time i bought it)

You don't need a lot of power for programming :)

You should be considering the keyboard unless you're going to use an external one.

I highly recommend the new Macbook Pro. The screen and touchpad are fucking fantastic.

Yeah I read the new Pro keyboard isn't too good. I'll use an external sometimes, but I think I can manage.

You want the 15-inch Pro for quad-core i7 action.

Posting this from a non-touchbar 2016 pro.
Not a programmer, but I write a lot.
One of the best devices I've owned, in general. The keyboard is leagues better than the 12", but still a bit hard on the fingers if you type for a long time. You can get used to it and just not press the keys so much, but I'm probably end up getting a screen + keyboard for when I'm at home.

The Pro, because the keyboard is far better than those of their predecessor, even accounting the lack of travel.

I just wanted to clarify, the keyboard feels great, the feedback from each keypress is really satisfying and the keypresses register flawlessly, it's only that it seems hard on the fingers for long sessions. I had the option to buy the previous generation, but I decided against it after trying out both.

For $800 you could buy a 357 magnum pistol and some hollow points. Do so and then shoot yourself in the head with it.

>posted from my Core Duo TM Chinkpad

Why a Macbook?

Why not a macbook?

It's a first gen i5 you plebian

Actual Apple salesman here. (No, I'm not going to automatically sell you the most expensive thing.)

Don't buy the Air. Here's why:

1) For all people's bitching about the new ports, they *do* offer 40Gbps, which is much better suited to 4K than the 20Gbps available via the Thunderbolt 2 connection on the MBA. If 4K is in your future, the Macbook Air shouldn't be.

2) I realize that the keyboard on the new MBP is very polarizing, but I personally like it a lot. I'd advise you to at least get a hands-on with both before you decide for yourself.

3) Larger trackpad is objectively better.

4) Holy shit, that screen. Seriously. The Air's display is the worst panel Apple puts in *anything*. It'll make you want to kill yourself.

5) My general philosophy when recommending people laptops is that they should leave room to grow. Never get *exactly* what you need *today*; if your needs change tomorrow, you run the risk of your laptop not being up to the challenge, when, for $100-200 more, you would've been fine.

Because you can get something of better performance for the same price

) Larger trackpad is objectively better.
Why? I've never used my old MacBook Pro and thought "I wish I had a bigger fucking trackpad".

>first gen i5
That's like having a Core 2 Duo in my book.

Performance on paper is far from the only measure of quality. My fiancee's laptop was much better than my MBA on paper. Didn't turn out that way in practice, the MBA aged much better.

>I've never used my old MacBook Pro and thought "I wish I had a bigger fucking trackpad".

That's because you've never had a bigger fucking trackpad. I've had the Magic Trackpad for the iMac for a long time, and -- trust me -- mo' bigga, mo' betta.

if its only those two that you can choose, go with the pro, you might find using dongles painful though, ymmv.

but if you ask me, get the older 13inch retina ones (not the touchbar generation), has almost all the ports you want, plus sd card slot for those extra storage and a bit cheaper price overall.

>buy a beaten up used office laptop
>probably didn't fully disassemble it and give each cleanable component a multi-pass forensic deep clean
>calls someone else a plebian

You fucking disgust me.

Better performance for what?
Raw performance alone isn't sufficient for me.
At same Price, Windows PC's still come with shitty batteries, shitty screens and still trying to rip off the Macbook Pro without understanding why Apple does that in that way.

maybe if you're a web dev.

don't get a mac, they are complete shit for doing anything serious on. i have a pro that struggles to run multiple IDEs at a time, let alone more than 20 browser tabs.

i just put lincucks on it because it was unbearably bad. everything is so much better now (except for the fact that i still have to use the shitty hardware)

>MacBook "Pro"
>dual core
my sides

>not using a mouse
you're fucking retarded. ignore this guy

>I want to buy it because it's magically better than a non-Apple laptop
>muh numbers on paper
>muh lifespan
A programmer should value the fact that this stuff is an exact science, not preferring one over the other for the arbitrary reasoning of "it's just better"

windows, shitty battery. I will give you that, but screen, performance, you can get it from dell xps 13

in before dell xps shill, try it, you will be surprised.

>t. mactoddler

>IDE
Bloat. Also it's the thing web devs do use (or a bloated editor like Electron/VScode/whatever). Also you only need maybe like 5 tabs max, more is bloat.

>i have a pro

I'll bite. What year?

No, man, trackpad is astonishingly legit on Mac. I get where you're coming from, I really do, but I swear there're merits to it.

That it provides a more pleasing user experience for a longer period of time is hardly arbitrary or magic.

>in before dell xps shill, try it, you will be surprised.

>autobrightness that cannot be turned off
>300 charge cycles on the xps battery vs 1000 cycles on the Mac before it kicks the bucket
>Coil whine
>massive flex on keyboard frame

They had 4 generations to fix the coil whine and autobrightness, Dell doesn't give a fuck and rather just sell you a laptop that will only barely last beyond the warranty, which is the only good thing about XPS warranty (regular Dell warranty is garbage) if you get more than 1 year.

>screen in dell xps 13
They don't measure the screen in terms of DPI, only in terms of absolute resolution.
Besides that, Windows and Linux distros still sucks doing scaling correctly.
I tried the dell XPS. I don't like it.

Not sure if you're , but that's a fair enough reason, if you're happy to pay for the overall experience and don't really care about value for money

>A programmer should value the fact that this stuff is an exact science, not preferring one over the other for the arbitrary reasoning of "it's just better"
First: 0x5f3759df
Second: What do you mean with that? That's absolute empty words.

Pretty sure the air has like half the resolution plus the touchpad is super small compared to the current MBP.

...

I'm not him. But I still think you're in error when you talk about "value for money". As I've said before, there's more to "value" than what's on the spec sheet. Like longevity, build quality, form factor, aesthetics, and support network. Especially that last one, there's no ASUS store for you to visit when you have trouble.

>2006-2015
>trackpad impossible to click near upper edge
>extremely loose near bottom edge
>overall flimsy diving board piece of shit
>even applel admitted it's shit and went back to solid non-click touchpads
>still has no real buttons
>relies on pressure sensitive gimmick bullshit
>if you press too lightly or too hard it does something completely different than what you intended
>shit tier 1mm travel chiclet kb
>OSX is a steaming pile of shit with horrendous battery management
>applel's solution is to cram in a massive heavy 95WHr battery to make up for it
>even XXXTREME GAMER cancer like razer blade with 4X the CPU/GPU power and 70WHr battery matches it in battery life in same tasks
>gets BTFO by 55WHr Yoga 2 in battery life in same tasks
>the battery takes up the space where a cooling system would've been in a laptop not designed by the world's thinnest and lightest gay hipsters
>overheats constantly from abysmal crippled cooling system
>throttles to 800mhz due to chronic overheating problems
>retina meme for "pros" have have gloss mirror coating impossible to use with overhead lighting
>blurry as shit retina meme scaling
>shitbook air even worse with glossy 1366x768 TN eye cancer
>systemic battery explosion problems for over a decade

>2016+
9to5mac.com/2016/11/03/2016-macbook-pro-thunderbolt-compatibility-issues
youtube.com/watch?v=NYVjIjBMx6o
>can't use any existing TB3 devices
>can't use USB and wifi at the same time
>ultra shit tier zero travel kb
>keyboard louder than WWII cricket
>memetouch emojibar
>no USB-A
>no escape
>soldered ram
>soldered SSD
>tamper tape on battery screws
>applel falls for their own thin meme and uses 54WH battery
>2 hour battery life

howtogeek.com/198043/how-to-merge-folders-on-mac-os-x-without-losing-all-your-files-seriously
>it's 2017 and moving files around in finder will STILL cause massive data loss

>macshit is good
Can we finally put an end to this meme?

>using a touchpad for serious work
I hope this is bait

if you ever work on a serious project you either use an IDE, or you pack vim with so many plugins it is also practically an IDE

2015. I prefer to use my x220s trackpad or trackpoint any day over the mac trackpad. but really, mice blow all those out of the water.

for comparison, the x220s trackpad is less than half the size of the MBP's. Size really doesn't improve usability.

I work in an office full of macs, and i've never seen anyone efficiently use one of the trackpads (or the magic trackpad), in comparison to a mouse+keyboard.

but my biggest gripe with the size is the impedance on typing. it forces you to either hold your wrists up, or have them on a ridiculous angle, otherwise your thumbs/palm touch the corners of the touchpad at which point the cursor moves and you are now typing at some random point elsewhere.

That's because ASUS actually makes good products.

Ever wonder why Applel has 1% marketshare, yet every single once of them is packed with waiting lines from sunrise to sundown with people coming in to get their malfunctioning crapple shit fixed? Applel NEEDS those stores.

Value is somewhat subjetive. And also you can paid for raw performance and still get shitty user experience.
My old ideapad has the same CPU as the thinkpad I'm using and the ideapad is worse in all ways. The thinkpad still sucks in some ways, but it's overall better.
Epic pasta bro. Half of that shit is false or exagerated.

>Windows and Linux distros still sucks doing scaling correctly.
Window has been fine at scaling since the Anniversary update last year, stop this stupid meme.

For legacy apps, it enlarges them with minor blur, a lot of major software companies already updated their programs to take advantage of scaling.

On MacOS, the scaling is incredibly wasteful. With perfect 1-1 scaling, you get very small workspace, if you want a virtual 1680x1050 workspace, MacOS renders it at 3360x2100 then downscales it to fit on a 2560x1600 display. Battery life suffers incredibly as a result.

Using tiling wms in your basement isn't serious work too.

I have no issues with scaling on my 4k displays running Fedora 25

>Window has been fine at scaling since the Anniversary update last year, stop this stupid meme.
>For legacy apps, it enlarges them with minor blur, a lot of major software companies already updated their programs to take advantage of scaling.
>stop this stupid meme
Stop contradicting yourself.

Are you using gnome?

stop projecting

>hurr hurr muh shitty meem pasta

Classy.

Speaking as a person who actually services iOS for a living, most of the people in that line are there because they're retarded and locked themselves out of their iPhones by trying to brute-force the password and/or forgetting their iCloud credentials.

No, man, scaling on Windows is still shit. I have mine plugged into a 4K TV and it completely flips its shit every time.

Leave your mommy's basement, lad.

>but my biggest gripe with the size is the impedance on typing. it forces you to either hold your wrists up, or have them on a ridiculous angle, otherwise your thumbs/palm touch the corners of the touchpad at which point the cursor moves and you are now typing at some random point elsewhere.
It's very obvious that you don't come anywhere close to any mac, the palm rejection is almost fucking perfect and almost nobody has an issue with it. Even your Thinkpad king Louis Rossmann admits this.

>being a helpdesk monkey
sorry to hear that

This.

>replying to yourself

Mainly for the OS. I know I could dual boot, but I'd rather not. Plus I feel like macs have better longevity.

I do program with IDE's sometimes, so I don't want it running slow. Maybe I should shell out for the i7 on the pro.

Nah, I work a sales floor at an Apple Premium Service Provider. I really like it. I get to see everybody's weird-ass iPhone problems, I get to use all of Apple's spiffy diagnostic tools, and I get paid to get certs that I can take with me when I leave. Plus, I get good employee discounts and tuition subsidies. For a job that doesn't require a degree, it's pretty damn awesome.

Lad I wish that I have that job.
I'm in one where I have to scream the shit of people trespassing private property. I still like it because I get 4 days out and 4 days in and getting a decent salary for that.

Right!?

get a xps or a older macbook that apple didnt cuck.

This, I never had an issue with Asus products. I have a monitor, motherboard and server by them, never skipped a beat, hey're fucking excellent.

Yeah. I like sales, too, because I actually enjoy my Apple shit and like talking about it. Not really a shill, per se, just an enthusiast. I've recommended specific Android phones to people while working the sales floor in an Apple shop.

All applel products are cucked, you fucking pleb.

>le epic cuck maymay xD

>t. iCuck

>being this mad for no reason

>liking Apple for no reason

>gaslighting this hard

>gas bagging this much

>being cucked by cucks

>projecting this hard

>being cucked by cucks
Said the fag willing to pay Apple Tax

>being this cucked for no reason

>implying that I pay taxes

See

Point and laugh at the NEET who thinks he can afford Apple products

>projecting THIS hard

Pro, the air will shit out on you

Pro is just massively more powerful, from having more battery to insanely better screen. It also has Iris Pro which is almost as good as a 940M

Get a student discount

>NEET
>not having a good tax lawyer
Stop projecting this hard, NEET.

>t. mactoddler

>still mad for choices that other people makes using their money

>still mad other people don't agree with you when you try to post-purchase-rationalize your fruity toys

>policing the choices of another person made with their money

Refurbished 2016 MBP

The 2017 MBP sucks ass

The new design is the 2016, dumbass. You're thinking of the 2015. And judging by your lack of eloquence, you're probably just regurgitating an uninformed opinion. Quit that.

>MBP sucks ass
Fixed.

/thread

>threading yourself

>get neither
>use windows

I wouldn't get the Air unless it's at a relatively low price.

You could probably get a lightly used,

Unless you need to dev for apple and can''t make a hackintosh, don''t. You''ll be getting shit performance for your price.
You will need a reasonable array of adapters though, so if you do need a mac, get the pro. Preferably without the touchbar, it's pointless.

>muh performance
>posted from a X220

Also, make sure to get a decent sized ssd in it. You won't be able to make upgrades.

Posted from an i5 6600K and GTX 1060 6G, the guy asked for performance anyway.

Gonna say one final thing, the keyboard is a dead ting and if you rest your hands on it, you will trigger the touchpad.

>Macs better longevity
>overheating issues
the GPU failure on every alrernate years model
>the fact that the fight drop/knock they're going to charge you $800 repair for the screen
>replacing the whole thing if a componant dies because muh solder
>genius bar to do anything
>charger will need to be replaced once a year
>xcode

I'd much rather use vim or something than xcode.

Literally describing a thinkpad