Get a job

>get a job
>have to sign contract that company owns everything I work on even in free time

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Where the fuck do you work? China?

It's called lying.

This is pretty common across any corporate or serious company. You probably won't find this in a newer tech startup or modern tech company where they value their workers though.

>get a job
>realize none of the code is open source
>bring this up to multiple people and at meetings
>finally complain that I cannot contribute to proprietary cancer
>get let go within a month

America

I've only heard about this happening to developers from maybe 10 years ago or more. Most companies don't ask for this

It's a large tech company.

Which?

Who are these drones who just bend over and pull down their trousers? Refuse the contract. Take a sensible job offer.

I need money.

You did the right thing, user

decent steady paycheck and benefits command a premium.

stop complaining and just sign it. it's not a big deal.

I'll just ask a related question since I doesn't deserve its own thread.

How pragmatic are you when it comes to being forced to use any particular technology on your job?

For example - I hate Discord and Slack with a passion and refuse to use it. Most people seem to think I'm crazy but I really believe they're crap.

I am seriously considering quitting my job because they use Slack, Skype and Gmail.

pls advice

based

In most of the US that's pretty standard.

California is one big exception, since those clauses (and non-competes) aren't enforceable here.

That's one reason the tech industry is so concentrated there.

Apple does this.

Kek. I'd hire you.

I'm in a graphics job (more or less) and I'm pretty sure thats in my contract.

What are they gonna do, take my $20s worth of YTPs?

Not OP, but General Electric tried to pull this shit on me.

Wait so what if you worked on shit but kept it hidden, then quit and then decided to sell whatever it was you were working on? Can they still take you to court?

Don't work for startups then?

and maybe this can make slack more comfy: github.com/wee-slack/wee-slack

Not OP, but I'm pretty sure it's google.

If they can prove it.

If they can prove it was you and made while you were employed, yeah. Use a pseudonym.

You're right that I have worked mostly with startup-esque type of companies.

Are you saying larger corporations don't use the same type of software?

I get the impression they are just as bad. E.g. MS Office, no *nix systems allowed.

Remember what with Occulus Rift and Bethsheda. Happens all of the time in tech industry. Episonage wide spread and people often use their knowledge from their job to make businesses.

They go as far as making you sign contact that states that you can't do business in the same sector as them.

>even in free time
Kek, no.
Never heard of such sith either in the free world.

what are your preferred alternatives then?

What's the problem with slack at work?
If company is paying for it and it's not my personal data who cares?

>California is one big exception, since those clauses (and non-competes) aren't enforceable here.
Only if work is unrelated to company's business which for large tech companies can include a lot...

>Who are these drones who just bend over and pull down their trousers?
People who like having food

it's a meme proprietary technology based on electron. it's unethical to promote such crap

What did you do?

Just ask them to change it. If they actually value you they'll do it, If they refuse, find another job.

My first job out of college tried to have me do this, but I had another offer so I got ballsy and told them I wouldn't agree to that. They were totally fine with it and just sharpied it out of my contract.

"Sorry, we're not going to change our entire infrastructure and make 30 people adapt to a new messenger because 1 person doesn't like it."

It was an acquisition, and several people were unhappy with the overbearing terms of the GE contract, so there was some leverage to get a redlined version.

>that's pretty standard
It very much isnt.
It's standard at some of the giant ones like MS and Jewgle, but any medium-to-small sized company won't include that clause because they know they don't have enough clout to do it and still employ people.

please be true

Under 500 employees and my company made me sign that

seconding.

why the hell would you sign that? you realize that means your only source of income is that company now right? i hope you're making bank there.

I have friends who work for studios under EA. This clause is in all their contracts. Wanting to work for video games and there being no other options fresh out of university, they all signed. Their circle develops tabletop stuff now, because apparently it's not covered by this clause.

> Be in the same situation
> Ask HR if I'll need to stop working on open source stuff
> They say no, you can still do that, we'll write up a new agreement for you, since your open source contributions were one of the reasons we wanted to hire you.
> New agreement doesn't have that shit.
> Sign it.

However, any job that would have such an old shitty contract is most likely a shit show. The place I worked at was.

Where was it?

sauce
?

They basically don't want you to start your own company while you're on their roster, otherwise they will sick their legal team on your ass.

An enterprise software shop. Built some products for hospitals.

>calling software "products"

He meant he built licenses

for large companies: depends on the place (some might be windows/ms exclusive places, some might be all about macs or other meme shit)

startups are all about using flavour of the month web cancer because they don't want to be left behind on the circlejerk train

one smaller established company i worked for a decade ago used fucking lotus notes and their cancerous messenger shit, that was even worse

i hate slack and gmail and all that other web crap but if i'm being paid to waste my time with it, who cares?

out of curiosity, what type of project is your department is doing?

>America
Ah yes, the "work for hire" clauses.

Basically you are done for. Just make sure the clauses terminate with your employment and that it does not extend beyond your retirement. I have seen contracts like that.

How enforceable are they?

Fuckin Lotus Notes. This is the first time anyones brought it up since the company I was at rolled it out and gave us a weeks training on it. (Rather train us for a week on shitty software than pay for MS.)

how can a clause not be garbage collected after the contract terminates is beyond me (including NDAs). But I have seen stuff like this too

>Sign with GNU
>Sign with M$
>Windows now owned by GNU

>make program that generates illegal combinations of 1s and 0s
>????
>fun

Yeah i signed a contract like that, but i aint giving them jack shit if they dont ask or see it

do it, that art install that generates random grayscale images on 100 screens.. one day a screen will have a 7 year old giving hitler a bj
but only if you saw it, shrodinger's cp

>company owns everything I work on even in free time
That you produce on company equipment.

>a decade ago used fucking lotus notes
har har har har

im a dod contractor and thats still used

(((contract)))
It's shit. They've probably been caught stealing ideas and patent trolling.

Pull that stick out your ass.

>Slack, Skype and Gmail.

surprised you have no problem with windows

Ow shit, fuck that Lotus Notes piece of shit

What? This is about terms in the contract, not which messaging app the company uses. What the fuck are you talking about?

>New job
>Ask about non-compete agreement
>"Well, as long as you're not working on the same kinds of products we're working on, I don't see why there would be any issue."
What kind of shitty company are you working for?

All tech companies try shit like this

I guarantee if you dig through the contract you'll find a clause stating that the other bits of the agreement stand even if one part is thrown out of court

>we are an INTERNET company

srsly, why do people obsess over instant messages? Email solved this problem decades ago much better

You better have that non-verbally as well.

>slack
Man fuck slack it gave the bigwigs big ideas with Cisco Spark. I just got done deploying Jabber with Expressways then I was told literally right afterwards "Start looking at Spark CUCM integration, we're not going to use Jabber anymore."
Literally months of trying to get that shit to work in between other shit abandoned as soon as I finished.

Is this normal?

They don't.

This is why you lie.

You do it on a laptop / tablet / phone and tell nobody.

When you leave company and come out with some project all of a sudden, your previous employer has no evidence of said work being done at their premises.
Company status: fucking ruined.
Well, unless you are American, in which case they will just make you poor by proxy.

Just like all those letters and cv, they just copy samples from internet. If you ask about it, they would modify it.

Imagine working for a company, discovering stuff and filing patents on your "free time".

Truly the Gnu way
Rather be a need than work on proprietary software

Can't change anything about if you leave though

I use 99% FOSS at home (other than blob driver's cause nouveau sucks) and GNU/Linux on my personal devices.

Use the entire Microsoft offering at work. Lync, Outlook, Office, Visio, the only things not MS are some Oracle products and Eclipse. Just the job.

>get a job as a structural engineer
>uk
>fresh out of university
>clause in the contract that states that if i quit, I cant work within 5 miles of any of their offices in the same sector for a period of two years
>they have offices in nearly all major cities and even some small ones....
>would literally decimate my career if i signed

Told them to suck a dick.
Got better offer from a different company the next week anyway.

Wouldn't there be more possible combinations of pixels than there are individual electrons in the universe though? It'd take so long for a human recognizable image to be generated that it's likely the whole universe would have gone "big rip" long before then.

>singing a contract like this
>not getting a better job somewhere else

I bet you're Asian op.

> Is this normal?
Yes. Also when "set up a test server for us, just to see what it can do" becomes "it's mission critical and literally must not go down" is apparently also normal.

>Also when "set up a test server for us, just to see what it can do" becomes "it's mission critical and literally must not go down"

lmao every single tme

do not do this. you're not a trained spy and your poor operation security will get you caught - that is, something stupid will out you. and getting fired for cause over something like this would basically make you unemployable going forward.

if you work in tech and you're moderately competent, you should have plenty of degrees of freedom to work with. if work hour flexibility is important to you, you should be able to optimize for that. if, instead, the freedom to work on side projects (or existing OSS projects) is something that matters to you, you should be able to find those opportunities as well.

lying to your employer about intellectual property issues is insanely ill-advised.

Usually it only applies if you use their shit OP.

Become a welfare parasites.

Every contract I have seen so far had this shit (Not USA btw). I'm still unemployed.

Jill from VA-11 HALL-A, a cyberpunk bartending VN with waifus made by some hue hues on Sup Forums

this, it it is applying updates for 30 mins, that is me playing table tennis for half an hour. If it takes 5 sec to open a doc in office365 I switch tabs and look at codes I want to incorporate into my pet projects

They might as well say 'we only want to hire people without ambition'

/thread

Is such a clause even ENFORCEABLE IN THE FIRST PLACE?

Because, oh wow, nice freedumbs Ameriga, land of the cucked, home of the slave, LMAO.

>Is such a clause even ENFORCEABLE IN THE FIRST PLACE?
Remember when D compiler frontend partially belonged to Symantec?

>program a bunch of extremely vulgar, pedophilic and racist games, release them and let a rabid group of SJW's know that they support racism and pedophilia as they by contract own my games
>????
>PROFIT!

>working for IBM

Enjoy shit management and no job security. Glad I left them ages ago.

These clauses typically have nothing to do with "premises", they often just wholesale claim ownership of everything you do, on any machine at any hour.

Nonsense, if you can't manage not publishing files with dates on them you have no business being in this industry anyway.

These stupid things are very common and very enforceable. The reasoning is that for creative or semi-creative work such as programming, ideas could come to you at any time and they want to get all your ideas, not just the ones you have from 9 to 5.

Of course it's an absurd monopoly encouraging idea that should be stamped out like the plague, but a bunch of people with lots of money prefer it this way.

This industry is actually making me want to kill myself. A job is supposed to provide for you so you can live but my purpose in life is to work on my side projects. All contracts have this cancer in them and I am qualified in this field so have almost no other options. I want to die.