Is it true that c is better than c++?

Is it true that c is better than c++?

Ah fuck here we go again...

meh.

any programming language is what you make of it.

Depends on the application. That said C++ is pretty bloated so best practice is to strictly use a subset of it from my experience.

they are both garbage unless you are doing shit close to the machine. Don't use either unless you absolutely have to. Having that amount of freedom is where 90% of security vulnerabilities in OSs come from

I'm really tired of this shit. No language is any better or worse than the other. Its the tool for the job that matters.

I wouldn't make a house out of pillows if it needed a strong foundation, nor would I power a single light bulb with a nuclear reactor. The point is, learn what you need to get the job done.

If you have a specific project and you're wondering what is the best tool for the job, ask that instead.

It's a fucking multi paradigm language you idiot, you're SUPPOSED to use some subset of it.

hurr durr code that actually does shit has more security vulnerabilities.

Both are pajeet tier crap. Learn Scala/Clojure/Rust/Elm/Lua

Everything I admire is written in c
Everything they admire is written in c++

/thread

other high level programming languages are just as Turing complete as lower level ones

>rust
>calling c/c++ pajeet tier

>Litterally the dumbest thing I've read in decades.

I'm done with this retard board. I bet none of you can code.

>rust

Samefag. Rust is like getting herpees on your eyeballs.

Also, c/c++ is crap for pajeet monkey coders who can't programming in declarative style. In normal languages you just use .map() or .flatMap(). In c-shit to loop through array you must fucking create another variable and increment it until it will be size of array.
>I'm pajeet, I like crap from the 70's because I'm too dumb to learn modern system developing language like rust. I'm retarded monkey coder therefore I'm incrementing fucking variable to loop

show me your shitty rust loop

You have to be a fucking retard to not realize that most languages are based on C. That and C, being as old as it is, is still used and can do everything a higher level language can do, so long as the programmer is competent.

Enjoy your Rust. It will be another hobby language stuck in Mozilla's ecosystem. I bet you think Mr. Robot is cool too.

std::iter::flatmap

>Rust
My sides.

>C can do high level programming
Cool pajeet monkey coder stories. Go increment fucking variable to loop
>It would be
Like a c-crap that is stuck in shitty legacy code and shitty embedded shit because in modern world no one will use this poo for new project?

>rust
Get the fuck out of here you pussy hipster sjw CUNT

That's your only rhetoric isn't it? Calling people that disagree with you an indian person. How pathetic.

Please go develop a system in rust and fuck off.

So why are you sjw, commie?

>C/C++ is Pajeet now
I'm not joking, our offshore Pajeets can literally only program in Java. I would not trust them to understand pointers and memory management.

You don't have any arguments and you failed in this debate, pajeet commie.

I would not trust anyone who is writing on c if it's not embedded and c++ if it's not games/qt

That faggot is just a Rust shill. Anyone in the tech industry knows that Java is the real pajeet language, and C is the language of Gods.

Rust is for fecal-matter loving people.

>Litterally the dumbest thing I've read in decades.

low level OS operations have been done in C for a very long time. The freedom of allocating one's own memory is a huge a potential security issue, even for experienced developers. Where other compilers would stop you and say your array is out of bounds, C just lets you keep writing. There was a linux vulnerability a couple years ago that had been there for a very long time where underflow was not checked on the password input, meaning a user could backspace out of the password input, back into memory and overwrite key values at different points, giving them root access. The only real benefits to using C is your close control of the space you use and manual garbage cleanup shit, but that comes at the cost of needing to check everything that any other languages compiler would already do for you. That said, you are so fucking dumb that you don't know how dumb you are. Do you have any idea what you sound like to the rest of us? gb2 free code camp bub, maybe you can design an app that will post stupid shit for you so you wont have to.

>h..hey guys I like rust
some one disagrees
>y..you're a pajeet commie

This is why we need abortions.

Lol okay kid.

Language of Gods is Clojure and Haskell [spoiler]I don't know Haskell, only basic concepts[/spoiler]. C is pajeet monkey language for pajeets who increment variable to loop because their language is shit from 70's

Commie, go increment variable.

That same vulnrebility was fixed. C is as good as the programmers that write it. It may be dated, and I'll agree with most of your post, but You're fucking retarded if you think rust is the end-all to systems development. When you learn to program, you'll know that you can use C to manage memory in a competent way. Enjoy your shit posting.

We Sup Forums now.

lol i have no idea what you are talking about with rust. I never mentioned it. I've never even used it. But with regards to C, it's negative aspects make it only worth using when you can heavily rely on the benefits of the language

Pol is shitloaded by these nazi left-wingers.

I see, and I agree. C is depricated as hell, but it's still one of the best languages to use for embedded and systems development. I think most issues with C isn't really the languages fault however, but more so on the programmer. C and Assembly are still the mecca for low level work.

Only because rust compilers for stm32/pic/avr and other shit are not good enough

No. Because no one outside of the HN + /r/programming filter bubble gives a shit about Rust

>That reeing of pajeet monkey who projecting and thinking anoyone in 2017 gives a shit about c

I work in that industry and this is correct. However, there's a push to use more C++ and also higher level languages for doing code generation (taking a hw spec and converting it to a C driver, for example).

Yeah, I've been using Rust to experiment with a cortex m4 and the binary sizes are ridiculous.
It will be interesting to see if the major comercial compilers jump in the Rust fad.

nothing wrong with C bub, but have fun coding in your trendy language

>4th reply
>rust shill
That was fast.

>The language is dead
>Nothing is wrong

>haha fucking C programmers they have to create a variable but my abstraction layer does it for me!!!! XDDDDD

Thats not why lol?
Rust uses crap like "traits" which can't really access the minimal work for abstract functions.

Rust also relies heavily on C bindings for basic implentations. If I need to use C to use a languages core features, I might as well just program the software in C.

Rust is also slow in comparision to C or C++. If you're doing systems development, why risk memory safety (a problem that can be easily solved in C) for less speed.

I want to like rust, but it really sucks. Its just another attempt at killing what already been done.

>Pajeet can't into FP

see
why does everyone think im arguing for rust? ffs

Wow this post is so try-hard.

Pajeet commie, why you can't into FP?

Left is trap
Right is landwhale

Sorry dude, you're getting sucked in with that Rust shilling faggot that ruins every programming thread. Its a hate that most of Sup Forums shares. But I know you're not him. You're actually intelligent and expressed your posts quite well.

Programming languages are tools to do programming.
It is like comparing a screwdriver and an electric screwdriver.
It is different tools and you build different things with it.
C++ is easier in a lot of ways and you can make libraries that is a lot better and easier to use.
C++ is better for desktop applications where you need to make something that is fast, yet easier to make.

C is only superior for individual project.

>This amount of buttmad
Sad

Rust >> C++
There, I said it

>Left is trap
C it is then.

Idris > rust

Uniqueness Types > your "safe" pointer garbage

No GC > GC

RAII is better than your GC garbage

No
C++ has tons of more features than C. Why would you use C?

Of course not.

Linear Types will remove the GC for several cases and there's an interest in running on arduino which means no GC will happen. There's already interest in reflecting on MLKit

Not very convincing

Look at Control.ST, we're already managing resource usage. It won't be long until we manage more without the mess of C

Keep working and come back when you finally remove GC, until then don't involve in arguments that don't depend on GC. It's not your ballpark.

Why would you need more features?

Do you have a mere idea of the consequences of having some many features crammed into a language?
Compilers are too complex, no one C++ dev understands each other and finally what will kill C++ is the cost of both training devs to program in C++ and maintaining software by only highly-qualified programmers. Businesses are avoiding C++ like the plague now...

ok, let me just write my own string, list, dynamic array, hashmap, filesystem (cross-platform too), and then get to the actual work

>my own string, list, dynamic array, hashmap
You should use library, although implementing those is trivial.
>filesystem
Why would you implement your own filesystem?

>You should use library
Or I could just rely on a well-tested, well-implemented, standardized C++ standard library
>implementing those is trivial
I don't give a damn how easy these things are to implement because I can't waste time with this kind of work. I have actual projects to work on because I have bills to pay. No wonder Sup Forums is full of NEETs who feel superior because they can implement a linked list in C and then run around screaming that the C++ STL is bloated.
>Why would you implement your own filesystem
Filesystem functionality is what I wanted to write, but I missed a word or deleted it by accident.

>can't in2 pointer arithmetic
>rust
nigger pls

Did he say he can't into pointer arithmetic?

you'd be better off writing your own hashmap desu, std::map and std::unordered_map are specced to run like shit

both are shit desu

also both are too old

>ye olde boogeyman
Just say they both suffer from the same common design drawbacks, that would be more believable.

Fuck off Pajeet

also

>Rustfag ITT

embarassing

You all know that "C/C++ killer" languages die eventually and never go mainstream. Rustfags are either too young or too stupid.

>remember D and other attempts
>Where are they now?

Same shit will happen with Rust. Large companies used it few times only to play around, they do that with every fucking language.

Rust will NOT succeed in any way.

D could have worked if it weren't for the heavy GC reliance. Its C and C++ interop is excellent.

we learned a lot about language design and actually useful and necessary features in the past 30 years, so yes they suck because they're old

a shame no language exists that is as versatile as C++ while being more cleanly designed

>so yes they suck because they're old
>but all mainstream language runtimes are still written using them
>all large applications with speed and optimization requirements such as relational databases are still written in them
>oy vey they suck

Do you have really really BETTER alternative? Not marginal Rust used by 0.5 anons or some stuff like that. No? then fuck off.

>remember D and other attempts
>Where are they now?
D has been around since 2001, and while it isn't exactly a widely used language, it's still alive and growing, despite having no corporate backing at all.
I tried it and I loved it, I find it a bit of a shame that it hasn't become more popular yet.

Is it true that Queen's English is better than ebonics?

just think how ridiculous safe(er) programming looks like in c/c++, what you must do to ensure that a+b+.., a-b.., a*b... etc don't overflow

c/c++ must be banned from OS development desu

C is more widely used to be honest. Majority of C++ code is "C with classes", modern C++ such as C ++ 11 / 14 is rarely ever used.

It became too fucking much bloated and hard to learn/understand. STL and boost are pain, smart pointers, RAAI and etc. Its just too much for most people.

So yeah, if you ever come up with real life project in C++, its probably C with classes and not modern C++. Even in gay(ame) development.

Not to mention that OS and large software such as PostgreSQL and virtual machines etc all are written in pure C

So yeah

basically

>Pure C, C++ with classes > modern C++

In terms of Sup Forums pajeets and schoolkids C is better because writing hello worlds in C makes them look like reddit-tier hipsters. In terms of senior engineers both of them are good tools, both serve their own purposes and depend on a problem.

>C++ with classes > modern C++
absolutely disgusting

* Sup Forums -> Sup Forums

> Do you have really really BETTER alternative?

everyone can think of ways to improve them, add shit or change ridiculous syntax no those primitive fossils

but it will never be done for obvious reasons and new language designers want to be "different" so they go too far also

>all large applications
this is a bad excuse and it's not even true, there are many very important large java apps ... basically the entire computing infrastructure above OS

>Java
>Important large apps except ENTERPRIZE XDDDD Pajeet shit

> normal languages you just use .map() or .flatMap()
And you think those functions don't have a loop inside them?

yeah yeah, totally dude

keep being ignorant

What did you expect from Pajeet

Those can be transparently parallelized.

Yes. Without a doubt.

...

...

If the function applied doesn't have any side-effects, yes. If it does, however, they cannot.

The order side effects are applied should be undefined in a map function. Otherwise there's no point in it.

>The order side effects are applied should be undefined in a map function
That's a good point, I didn't consider that.