Being relatively new, I never cared much for the whole systemd war, but now I'm about to try to install Gentoo, so between the handbook and other resources online I've learned the difference between them, and why they came into existence. I've found out gnome doesn't run without systemd (I don't mind, given how gnome is an unusable piece of shit) but I was wondering what else doesn't run without it? Do Kde and openbox run without it? More importantly, how do you find out?
A lot of surveillance tools break without systemd. Don't betray your own people and install systemd or the terrorists win.
Landon Ramirez
Systemd might seem okay at first sight bu then you have to remember whose the lead programmer. Poettering went to implement basic command line tools and implemented rm in a way that it would also delete .. which goes against the POSIX specs. Then the faggot claimed that his implementation is the correct one. He cannot be trusted.
Leo Watson
I thought Systemd was frowned upon because it is a Red Hat botnet?
Jayden Johnson
Just read about one of the latest systemd features to understand why people love it. It is long but worthy read
Having an init system that gives you that power is awesome. Maybe the same functionality could be implemented less monolithically, I don't doubt it. But so far, only systemd actually cares about being a great init system.
Shit inits like openrc is useless and underpowered, but you are supposed to like it because it is "minimalistic"! Literally they want you to love their init system because it is useless.
Alexander Diaz
ok it takes away a bit of configuration, but i don't see how this is such a revolution. it might be a bit more comfortable but if you build your application correct and set it up with a dedicated user right from the start, i don't see a reason to have this feature.
if xorg wouldn't been patched to be able to run without root, i'm sure this feature would have broken desktop functionalities
Andrew Reed
>if you build your application correct and set it up with a dedicated user right from the start, i don't see a reason to have this feature.
Are you sure you understand it? It's not about designing apps right, it's about making easier to write services for it. It also provides functionality that traditional init services don't, like having different usernames for different instances of the same service, and much better isolation in the filesystem. They have done quite a lot of homework to get it right.
Of course, you can claim you don't need it that complex functionality for your desktop. But software is increasingly writing service files that use these advanced functionalities by default without you being aware of it.
Oliver Carter
so every fork has a different user too? then i withdraw my previous statement, that's actually pretty nice.
Jose Gutierrez
launchd
Dylan Nguyen
SystemD is a project of Red Hat, whose biggest customer is the US government. If that doesn't at least raise and eyebrow, I don't know what does.
What doesn't help is how it's wormed its way into Linux to the point where its almost as essential as the kernel.
Kevin Nelson
half the shit around linux is all thanks to redhat you ungreatful fuck. and everything rh does flows back to the community and is open source. instead of mindlessly repeating the shit that some tinfoil shills spout you better read some code or stfu
Lucas Ward
Calm down Lenny
Jeremiah Nelson
>his init system handles containers
I never liked any of your poetterware lennart.
PulseAudio can die in a fire. Udev too!
Lucas Ortiz
you are just an uninformed mongloid spewing shit. go shitpost somewhere else
Daniel Scott
udev existed long before systemd, retard. pulseaudio used to be really terrible but now days it works, even though the configuration is god awful.
Justin Mitchell
>tell someone to calm down >spewing uninformed shit Kill yourself.
Evan Harris
>post from the poettering's personal blog about how awesome systemd is OK kid
Carter Butler
Read the article you sperg.
Sebastian Jenkins
The only reason anyone ever uses systemd is because it comes with a distro they like. If you have the choice, systemd is never the answer.
Gavin Parker
if you are unwilling to learn, yeah. a lot of things that systemd introduces are actually pretty good. downside is that poettering always justifies terrible flaws with ignorance and he tends to bloat software into proportion which are genuinely unhealthy and messy
Anthony Hernandez
It's never worth bloat or WONTFIX
Brayden Hill
Why not Runit (void Linux) ?
Alexander Sanchez
Poettering is a Red Hat employee.
Brayden Kelly
Void is a meme
William Smith
It's actually not. I've been using it on my laptop for the last few months, and it's pretty nice.
Joshua Wilson
Another useless and over-engineered Poettering hack to solve a non-existent problem just to add another item to the list of snake oil sold by systemd.
Nathaniel Kelly
Use Lubuntu instead
John Morris
I was going to install that but I chose finally learning how to use arch instead, what are the pluses and minuses of Void?
I might go ahead and put that on an external hdd to mess around with and if I like it I'll put it on the main hard drive
Nicholas Cook
see
Wyatt Lopez
Gentoo with system dicks is pretty comfy.
Luke Sullivan
>anything having to do with ubuntu I'm cook
Landon Baker
cool* damnit
Samuel Long
Bake me a sandwitch
Wyatt Ortiz
Why tho >comes with LXDE which isn't even my DE of choice >comes with systemd, and would probably require a ton of hacking around to replace it >is Yet Another Ubuntu/Debian Derivative (tm) (r) (c)
In a nutshell: I've heard it called "gentoo for people who don't have the time to compile and configure gentoo". It's an independent distro intended for people who know a bit what they're doing. It's easily riceable and configurable, although it also works well enough out of the box.
I chose it because I wanted something mostly independent and without systemd. Rolling release was a nice bonus.
Pluses: >independent This may be subjective, but it does mean that it doesn't depend on any upstream projects. >rolling release This is also subjective, but personally I don't see why you should have to "upgrade" your system on the maintainer's schedule, when you can just get newer package versions as they come out. >runit Is an excellent, simple and intuitive init system. That said, I haven't used OpenRC myself so I can't compare to that. >xbps Is also built from scratch, and is nice and simple. I've heard it praised a lot, but I don't know if it's something you'll really notice in day to day use though. Comparing with my experiences with debian, though, it's definitely more elegant than having dpkg, apt, and aptitude for different contexts doing different things.
Minuses: >rolling release As I mentioned above, if you want an unchanging system this won't be for you. >lack of documentation Exacerbated by the fact that it's independant, and uses its own init system and package manager. If you don't know what you're doing, or if you're only able to follow a guide but don't have a good understanding, you might have some trouble figuring its quirks out. In a way, this might make it more difficult than arch, because things on the Arch wiki won't necessarily apply as written and there's a much smaller community of people to ask for help.
Noah King
>baking a sandwhich >"sandwitch" Not to mention, why the fuck is the first thing you ask of a cook a fucking sandwich?
Juan Perez
No.
Ian Myers
they're yummy
Kevin Hall
Then make one yourself retard. What do you need a cook for
Easton Cook
for cheese to melt
get civilized
David Sullivan
That's called a toaster, not a cook
Jason Thomas
The problem with systemD is the same problem that Linux and other foss software in general has. Big monolithic programs that are effectively too large to audit. It makes very little difference if the code is open but it would take 3 years to audit and they release an update once a month. What makes systemD worse is that it isn't something you can just tear out and replace with something else. For example, I dropped firefox due to a lot of the politcal BS surrounding the company right now and felt I could no longer trust them. I can do that simply by uninstalling their web browser and wiping any configuration files it left behind. Now, try and do that with systemD. What redhat is doing is trying to force the entirety of Linux to use a redhat product. A bad redhat product at that.
Levi Ortiz
No, that's not a cook either, that's a poettering
Jackson Garcia
Surveillance tools? Mind sharing some so I can start to hate systemd more?
