I want the rundown on Net Neutrality. Is it going to go down? If so, will anything change...

I want the rundown on Net Neutrality. Is it going to go down? If so, will anything change? I'm tired of Redditors blowing things out of proportion and making a big fuss, so I think I need actual information on this.

Other urls found in this thread:

transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2017/db1122/DOC-347927A1.pdf
twitter.com/NSFWRedditVideo

>Is it going to go down?
Net neutrality is going to happen. It's basically been PR'd into becoming partisan politics, so only democrats oppose it. They can't do shit as a minority in both houses plus a minority on the FCC board.
>If so, will anything change?
Costs will go up. Possibly for your internet service but more likely for secondary services like netflix who will have to pay protection money to ISPs and pass the costs on to customers.
The ISPs will be able to push their products in other fields, e.g. Time Warner may throttle competing streaming services while allowing HBO GO (which they own) to run at full speed. Same for Comcast and NBC's streaming service, etc.

Notably, they are still NOT legally allowed to block content, only throttle.

>I think I need actual information on this.

Have you tried looking it up?

>is going to happen
I mean the repeal is going to happen

Oh yes and I forgot to mention:

Deregulation will give the mostly-monopoly ISPs will get even more power and let them get even more entrenched in their positions.
New competitors in the internet market will have an inherent disadvantage in cash flow -- Comcast et al get user subscription fees plus "don't throttle me bro" protection money from big internet companies, whereas new ISPs will be too small to demand the latter and be at an even larger disadvantage than they already were.

>Look up Net Neutrality
>Get nothing but ill-informed tweenagers complaining about how it's going to be the end of the world
No dice, user.
Thanks, user. I found this very informative. It doesn't seem quite as cataclysmic as people are making it out to be, although it's still kinda shitty. I don't think I'm going to get as fucked as most people, too. I'll spare you the details, but I'm running solely on Sprint. I don't think they'll throttle nearly as much.

There are other questions left on this topic like privacy and how will be affected the web services, apps and other websites in other countries outside the US.

>prices go up, possible additions to charges
While that is true, it could be said that if a company chooses shitty actions like that the comsumers can switch to a company that does not do that. Just like mobile carriers, competition in mobile is great right now.

This is true. I hope it doesn't come to that, but if it does I'll just kill my internet service and use my phone. Got unlimited data with T-Mobile I can just use it as an internet access point.
It would also save me close to 100 dollars a month.

Only works if there is competition. Many/most(?) US consumers only have a physical connection to one ISP at their home.

They show misleading statistics to the FCC trying to downplay this by focusing on e.g. the number of total ISPs in a city rather than the number who serve each neighborhood, when in fact rather than each customer having 3 choices, there are 3 different local monopolies in 3 different sections of the city.

For most Americans, the only option if you don't like your ISP is to move to another house that's serviced by a different one.

>costs will go up if the goverment doesnt get invovled
Yes and they would be much higher if they sisnt get invovled. They already have us subsidizing welfare internet plans and more red tape sure as he wont make it cheaper or help market competition

If they did get invovled*

Generally, a good rule is whatever the ISPs are shilling is bad for you, and the ISPs really hate net neutrality.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend, kind of thing.

In the short run, nothing will change. In the long run, the only people who will probably be affected are 24/7 streamers of Netflix. Remember OP, it costs time to make deals with many different forms, and also costs a ton of money to set up contracts. In terms of the low traffic websites, nothing will change, as they don't cost a lot for the ISP, and to avoid losing customers to other Isle, none of them will throttle these low traffic websites. Reddit will obviously get throttled though, since it generates the 8th highest internet traffic, but doesn't give the ISP a dime, heavily taking advantage of them

there is no market competition to help user
monopolies do not follow free market dynamics

Get the government out of the process and maybe we could hsve a free market instead of government enforced coorporatism

free markets are not magic
in an unregulated system, monopolies naturally tend towards consolidating their power and making it ever harder for new competitors to enter
if you want a low-regulation solution to the ISP monopolies, forcibly split them up a la Standard Oil, force the split up bits to actually compete with each other (no local monopolies), and then step back and let the free market do work
the other solutions would be very heavy regulation to keep them from using their monopoly status for anticonsumer or antitrust shit, or entirely nationalizing them and having a commie internet utility

Comcast isnt a monopoly. People can law wire. The wire comcast laid is their property. If you dont want to use their wire use the phone company or dish to get internet

>force the split up bits to actually compete with each other (no local monopolies), and then step back and let the free market do work
What about the case where it is more efficient to have a few large ISPs than a hundred small ones? You didn't think this through user

what are the early american railroads?

Free market needs regulations to keep it free. That may sound counter intuitive to you, but imagine if one grocery company grew so strong that it had a virtual monopoly. Then, after market dominance was established, started selling sub par food, or charging egregious prices. Free market wouldn't take care of it since most consumers couldn't "vote with their dolor" and would be forced to buy from the grocery store.

>dolor
Yuropoors detected

The private companies we have now can and do take advantage of the economies of scale, but they don't pass those savings on to the consumer -- because of their market position and lack of competitors they can charge 10x or more what it actually costs them to provide service. Despite being more efficient they have no reason to lower prices. Making more money is better than making less money. The extra savings from the economies of scale all go to stockholders, or to bribing regulators.

Now if you zapped the CEOs with a magic Karl-Marx flavored mind control ray and they started making decisions for the consumer's well-being instead of trying to maximize profit like any normal capitalist company, then sure they would be cheaper than a many-small-competitors market would be.

>Notably, they are still NOT legally allowed to block content,
That depends on the content.
Article 23 makes it clear that they don't have to allow you to ever connect to a VPN.

>free market needs regulation to keep it free
>free market needs government guns to and gmen to enforce made up laws for the market to be free
Wew

A lot of this info here is great and the takeaway is really that the monopoly is the problem. NN has become a reddit meme but the real issue is described here
If the ISP's don't get their way through this legislation I would imagine they will just up their prices because there's nothing stopping them. They've spent money lobbying. They will need increased revenue to maintain profit. To be honest, I'd welcome a tiered internet system and just buy the VPN package which would probably be the same price as what I'm paying now (or less than what it would go up to if they don't have their way). Grandma can have the 10 dollar internet package just to check email.

Normies dont understand how often people use a vpn for their job. They will not block vpns for this reason

>They will need increased revenue to maintain profit
This is not, as far as I know, true. They aren't pursuing this deregulation because they NEED the increased profits to survive. They just see a way to make more money and are pursuing it, which is perfectly normal behavior.

Their prices are most likely already as high as their economists say they can raise them without harming profits.

I didn't mean they were barely scraping by. I am thinking more like how having lobbyists is an expense item. So if you commit some expense money into that and it goes nowhere, that's a bad investment. You can go to the board and be like, "well, you heard the news too" . The company would want to show steady future profits so it would come from somewhere else now. Obviously there would be lapsed contracts if prices were spiked a ton, but there's a bunch of nickel and diming they can do that adds up.

Sure they will.
Big companies will just pay the major ISPs for a special VPN pass for their employees so that they can telecommute and whatnot.
Small businesses who aren't using a business plan will have to upgrade first.

Even the smallest companies i have worked for have business grade internet, but you missed the point. People go home and vpn into their work networks all the time.

No, I did not miss the point. I specifically addressed it.
Not all small businesses have business plans.

I was never talking about business plans, you are. I was talking about personal plans, people have to vpn to their work from home internet.

No kidding. I addressed that.

You made up a retarded theory about vpn vouchers

>made up bullshit
No ISP is forced to change anything if Net Neutrality goes away.

Net Neutrality didn’t exist in 2007, didn’t exist when Sup Forums came into existence.

You are speculating in order to give the government an iron grip over the web.

We need less control over ISPs so that smaller ones can form. Competition is lacking in ISPs and that’s why we get no breakthroughs.

Back before net neutrality when there WAS competition we had innovation like Verizon laying FIOS.

That was pre Neutrality. You are a real dumbass.

Just because a company has the ability to commit seppuku does not mean it will retard.

Your point is mute because being legally allowed to kill your own company while another one that doesn’t suicide replaces you is a good thing.

In fact, right after Verizon did all that NN became a thing, and then ten years later people still are getting the same speeds available in 2004

>vouchers
Call it what you want, but I did address telecommuting, which you claimed I did not.
Regular users won't be allowed to use a VPN unless they get a business plan.
Companies will be able to upgrade their employees plans to a special plan that permits VPN usage. This plan isn't available to consumers.
Try that again in English, please.

In a competitive free market, yes those actions would be suicide.
In a monopoly they are not.
This is the problem.

Offering lower prices than your competitors is a hard fought capitalist practice you idiot.
Communist practice is give only let the peasants have 56k or to ban internet from everyone but the elite.

monopolies are a product of the free market.

The monopolies are extant due to government interference and regulation.
A small ISP can’t serve YouTube equally like a mega giant isp can.

Net Neutrality’s true result is literally nationalization.

What free market? You aren’t allowed to start an ISP.

>regular user wont be allowed to usr a VPN
Just making shit up sempai. They wont stop it because millions of people use them for work

Sure. Just because my lemonade stand can pour tobasco in the juice before being served doesn’t mean I’d be stupid enough to do it.

Why can't small ISPs serve YouTube equally?

Strange how people could use VPN just fine before Net Neutrality.
It’s almost like you are making shit up.

Because then they’d have to serve everything at a shit tier speed to keep it Neutral.

So they can, but only non competitively.

things'll be rocky for a bit, then the true price wars will commence

Nobody used nuclear bombs before ww2, so we did we make international laws against them afterwards?

>reading comprehension
They're going to stop it for people who don't use it for work.
I still have no clue what you're trying to say.
The FCC disagrees with you. Read it yourself.
>23
>Broadband Internet access service also does not include virtual private network (VPN) services, content delivery networks (CDNs), hosting or data storage services, or Internet backbone services (if those services are separate from broadband Internet access service), consistent with past Commission precedent. 69 The Commission has historically distinguished these services from “mass market” services, as they do not provide the capability to transmit data to and receive data from all or substantially all Internet endpoints. 70 We do not disturb that finding here.
transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2017/db1122/DOC-347927A1.pdf

Small ISPs don’t own the pipes. They lease them from the Big ISPs.

>bad business practices hurt businesses
That’s pretty easy to comprehend right?

The FCC censors swear words on TV and controls content. Also the chairman of the FCC agrees with me.

Just because an ISP isn’t forced to do something doesn’t mean it won’t do it. Just because it isn’t forced not to do something doesn’t mean it will.

Can you show me a picture of this FCC individual who disagrees with me?

>bad business practice
In what sense is it bad for a monopoly to charge more?

We used them and then told everyone else they can’t use them.
Those laws are meant as a way for us to be able to look into the secret undergoing of foreign nations under the threat of force without hippies thinking we are being cruel.

We dominate the world with force.

because raising prices without cause drives customers away even if there's no alternative, and also encourages the development of a competing entity that would not only negate any profits seen by a price hike, but also cut into the profits you were already making

In the sense that unless it’s illegal for competitors to appear, they will.

Net Neutrality doesn’t set price limits so why doesn’t Comcast charge ten million dollars a month for service?

Are you really this stupid?

>FCC individual
I don't know what you're talking about nor why you can't read the quote from the convenient link to the FCC document I provided you.
The big companies will pay. Small businesses will have to figure something out for themselves. Small businesses lose out all the time in case you weren't aware. The ISPs will be better off.
It's illegal for competitors to appear.

They dont know who uses it for work or not you moron. Quit making shit up

sure pal, big companies will definately pay, it's not like google fiber will actually become a reality, or that other corporate giants wouldn't weigh the choice between rate hikes which due to the companies size will cost them in the millions, or setting up their own isp and putting the bastards that tried to rip them off out of business

>they can only charge ten million dollars
Because customers can't afford that much, user. There's no need to be a roodypoo. Please learn how monopolies work.
You're missing the bigger picture which is that ISPs don't want regular users to use VPNs to view competitors' media content without paying extra to do so. They can therefore not support VPN service. Businesses can pay a small fee (not ten million dollars a month) per employee or however they want to work it out.
No shit. That's why regular plans won't allow it at all. They'll will have to get upgraded through their employer just like any other company benefits. Is this that hard to comprehend?
Google fiber is dead. They're in transition to becoming a hybrid wireless provider.

Fuck u retatd

...

Go lie on reddit fag

I'm not the one who wants to fuck retards so I suggest you do so instead, user.

when exactly does the shit hit the fan

how long do i have to pirate what i can before the isp are allowed to block/throttle me

You should have already started, user. You probably still have time but plenty of anons have amassed more than a few TB.

People are forgetting that despite the fact that the FCC can pass this rule, there will still be numerous challenges to the change in court. Net neutrality has already been upheld in the court of law multiple times since it was first put in place, and there is ample precedent for courts to stay the order. Telecoms are lobbying for this hard, but equally massive companies like Google and Amazon are lobbying the other way. Ultimately it will come down to who can get genuine legislation passed beforehand. Nothing will change for the foreseeable but still we should be ready to burn the FCC building to the ground.

Anyone shilling the competition line is dumb. The only thing that forces competition is the law requiring big ISPs to rent their lines to smaller ones. Less regulation means monopolies will form and strengthen as the smaller players are bought out or crushed.

This will affect everyone. Redditors blow everything out of proportion with regularity, which is particularly vile when the matter they happen to stumble upon actually /is/ important- their constant hyperbole lessens the impact of every issue they touch. This is, however, an important issue.

Do you use Netflix or other streaming video services? ISPs are typically owned by, or own themselves, large media conglomerates. Your streaming services will be throttled aggressively, and you will be required to make up for the money they used to get from you in the form of cable TV fees to unrestrict it.

Are you a pirate? Of music, TV, movies, books, or porn? Ethicality of piracy aside, this will affect pirates heavily. Piracy and p2p connections of any kind (legal/illegal) will be throttled to the point of uselessness. Large online games often use p2p connections to distribute updates between users- p2p connections will be locked behind a very expensive "gaming" package, if they even offer that. Again, ISPs are conventional media companies. Expect all forms of file transfer systems to be affected by this. (S/FTP, SCP, bittorrent, NTP, etc.)

Do you use a VPN for work, or do you plan to use a VPN to bypass these or other restrictions? They explicitly will be able to throttle and block VPN connections, most likely unless you pay for an expensive "business access" package- since business users will be the only ones deemed to be legitimately utilizing the technology. Expect all kinds of remote connections (RDP, VNC, SSH, etc) to fall into this category.

Do you play video games, using Steam, Xbox Live, or PSN? Expect to be required to pay for an expensive gaming package to be authorized to download games from their CDNs at any reasonable speed. Your Steam, Xbox, and PSN game downloads and updates will be very slow, potentially uselessly so, unless you fork over cash.

They never succeeded with this before, but they've tried. This is their newest attempt to do this.

My roommates and friends think I'm being paranoid. But when they can't afford to keep streaming Netflix and they turn to my local 20TB collection of media and games, I'll be sure to add a watermark in the corner of every streamed media file: "Told you so, faggots."

If it comes down to legislation, NN is dead. It's become a partisan issue and the party that opposes it controls the government.

The courts are less involved in retarded party politics though, and they could decide either way.