Debian

what does Sup Forums think of it

it's lunix so its shit

i like the logo more than ubuntus. I feel the ubuntu logo has a certain "casual" stigma about it, but not so much the debian logo. This is why i dont post in neofetch threads

Pretty solid, it's my go-to, but mostly because I don't feel like spending time fucking around with my OS. I also don't use it as a desktop OS.

It’s my go-to distro. I do a netinstall and build it up so it’s light, stable, and dependable.

This. Ask for genuine Microsoft software.

Been running my NAS/torrent server for over 5 years with no issues. Very reliable. As a workstation it's a bit outdated for me, and I especially wouldn't want to use it on a laptop

So, in terms of security, would you say it's one of the best? Yes, I know that security largely depends on the user, but in terms of it's design

its an over all solid OS. useful when I need to get something done and use apt to install what I need. On that note I don't particularly like package managers or distros with them however debian is my preferred for both

Genuine question, what makes Windows/Microsoft products so superior (apart from support) ?

Amazing server OS.

systemd garbage

What about Devuan

Is Devuan usable yet?

P O E T T E R I N G E D . C O M

Stable has outdated packages. I don't like having to manage environments, or install packages manually or through 3rd party repos to be able to do my webdev.

Linux Mint xfce is better. I'd use Xubuntu but for some reason, it doesn't just werk on my machine.

That said, I'd trust Debian stable above all for production.

I'm a dumb fuck, what is it about systemd that everyone hates?

I think it's a great server os but for desktops I prefer doing a mini.iso ubuntu 17.10 installation and then selecting xfce core and openssh-server with tasksel. It's just better preconfigured for desktop usage. Because all my servers are AWS EC2 only, I don't use Debian but Amazon Linux though. Would prefer Debian or FreeBSD for servers at home.

What about home use?

I'm interested; what's your opinion on OpenBSD? Is it just a meme?

Stable repo uses a Kernel that has some issues with older Baytrail CPUs, other than that it's great

The first distro i ever used and i have fond memories of it.
Still one of the best all these years later even if i am biased.
But, you know, use whatever the fuck you want :^)

Do you still use it?

apt-get install sysvinit\*
cp /usr/share/sysvinit/inittab /etc
apt-get remove systemd

nah nvm that's too hard

go to their page. It's a dead project.

I run Devuan b/c Debian no longer respects init choice

They released jessie 6 months ago, ascii RC1 coming in a few weeks

Not dead at all

No, now i think about it, i am dual booting lubuntu and kali but i do far less nowadays

Shitty distro with old bug ridden packages, and an insufferable community that is always acting superior. They also depend on Ubuntu for all of their fixes.

well on an init system that isn't garbage, all you do is edit rc.local, and you can do whtaever you want on system start up there.

personally I log in as root, run wvdial, start x, then shove a cactus up lenny potato ding's butt

because I'm just that sort of person

who knows what you do on systemd & who really cares? lol

You should probably pin systemd in apt so other packages don’t reinstall systemd

Windows is a great OS for general usability and productivity. It also has a huge list of compatible software and a good documentation. IMO the UI could be improved (however its seen as user friendly) and a lot of bloat shit in win10 should be removed (specifically, cortana and other ad ware) but at the end of the day Windows tends to be the superior system, just because of simplicity and productivity.
Unix systems tend to be oriented towards developers who need to either run servers and program for other Unix systems, or computer enthusiasts. There's a lot of learning hurdles for beginners especially for those who think computers are magic and do everything for them. For average computer user even, the UI can be confusing and there can be a lot of uncertainty about how to actually use the OS. This fundamentally makes it unproductive and cumbersome for anyone slightly inexperienced with unix systems. To add on, Windows has slowly been adding things like bash support to close the "uniqueness" gap and the obvious programmer OS vs user OS gap. IMO I prefer Unix systems, and I think windows is far more unproductive that Unix but thats coming from a heavy user of non Windows systems.

I agree, but what do you prefer?

Again, interesting. What do you get up to in Kali? I'm intrigued

If its so good then why do businesses use RHL instead?
Checkmate
debianfags 0 fedora 1

There are thousands of threads on this

It depends on your use-case. It's a high security server OS. If you want high security on a desktop better use Qubes OS. I like FreeBSD because of ZFS. My home servers are normally File Servers and ZFS is the best filesystem available.

It's okay I guess if you install a DE like GNOME, KDE, or LXDE on it.

Okay. Thing that gets me about Windows 10 is the amount of spying it does (telemetry etc). It also seems, in comparison to Unix-like operating systems, very insecure. And yes, I am aware that Unix-like systems are not used as much as Windows which is why it's regarded as more secure (less malware developed for it), however, doesn't this still give it an edge? And I agree with you, I feel and am, far more productive on nearly every Linux distro I use when I compare it to Windows.

>ascii RC1 coming in a few weeks
Only one year after the blazing fast debian.

sorry user :(

if it turns to shit I tear it down & build from 0

no fears, no regrets

>(apart from support)
What support?
You can't ring up Microsoft and get help.
Community support is vast for both Loonix and Wangdongs.

Why not on a laptop? what would you use instead?

It's better than most distros:
- nice software selection
- low maintaince
- security team does a good job
- mostly sane defaults
- large community support

Running most prod servers on it.
Initially ran it on a laptop, but I'd say it's more of a server; still, a workstation will be fine with testing repos.

The worst thing is that you'll have to work around upstream configs when you want a customized setup, but it's still miles better than the clusterfuck that is SLES. Oh, and packaging DEBs is no fun, but RPMs are so even less. There's also a bit of FOSS propaganda and bureaucracy in everything the project does, but that's fine with me.

So overally it's a solid choice.
.+BSD may be comparable/better, but my experience running that in prod is too limited to compare them here.

No no, I don't mean Technical Support - I mean Application Support :)

Thanks for the informative reply, user! :)

For most dev things everything but bleeding-edge rolling releases is too out of date to some extent.
E.g. my Ubuntu install was 1–2 major versions behind on Node, NPM, Mongo, etc (pls no bully).
I just compile most dev things now.

Something with a more recent kernel, easier access to proprietary firmware, and an up to date DE. Right now I like Kubuntu on my laptop and desktops. Ubuntu Budgie is looking nice, too.

Oh right.
I do non M-dollar sign software dev so I don't even think about that.
Those poor Micr*soft® Off*ce™ users.

How is Kubuntu? What DE would you recommend?

so easily swayed by the gays on desktop threads.
sad

Personally I'm not exactly a security specialist but I think you may be confused on the security bit, so I'll try to clear things up a little. Just because unix has less malware developed for it doesn't mean anything about its security. (well, it does a bit :-) ) Even if a distro has impeccable security measures and well tested software, top of the line ring signatures encrypting your traffic (and other security whatevers) there's a likeliness that either
a) You install exploitable software that you don't know can be exploited (unreported/unknown security flaw)
or
b) you configure something incorrectly (ex. you give wrong file permissions to apache) (unintentionally adding an exploit)

I can't think of more situations off the top of my head, but those are the top 2 things I look out for. There's many other things to look out for and a lot of systems you can implement to increase security as well. I suppose this is what makes unix more secure, is the insane amount of levels you can add to your system in terms of authentication and access control. In Windows it's different. When something like downloadable malware puts itself into your system there's a lot of unknown because of the proprietary model windows is built around, hence antivirus and such exists. But in most regards, I don't use antivirus on windows at all with UAC disabled because I know that I won't be either installing any suspicious software.

kek

Thanks for the clarification user. Would you hold agree with the idea that Li(u)nix users are generally more security conscious, and in general, smarter than Windows users (and as a result, it is less likely that insecure software will be installed etc)?

Loving the fork of Devuan called Refracta.
>lite
>versetile
>out-the-box great and werks
alsa is still shit tho

Is systemd really that bad that Distros are popping up just to use system v?

It comes riddled with bloat by default.

I'd say no, but it depends. I suppose most linux users would be more savy than most (more likely to spot a phishing site, lets say) but unless you are aware of your system I think you will simply have a disadvantage. I'm sure there are many who program and use linux systems every day but dont know anything about file user/group permissions and generally easy security mistakes.
To clarify on easy security mistakes, consider the following: lets say someone that uses a unix system program a php website. the website accepts files (such as images) however the programmer hasn't restricted the upload to only accept files which are image formats. lets also say this programmer stores the image files at (test.domain)/images and has execute permissions incorrectly set up in apache. I'm fairly certain at this point I could upload a php file called hack.php and have it run any script I like when i connect to (test.domain)/images/hack.php

What distro do you use user?

yup... I know what you mean. I've been meaning to look into sec recently, thanks for reminding me user :)

np, its been good talking. a great place for getting an idea on web security is the hacker news security page, if your interested (its a bug tracker p much but shows how many exploits exist)

Love it. Simple, quick, easy to use without sacrificing capability. It's been around for quite some time now and it probably will keep being around for as long as Linux will be. Can't say the same about many other distros.

It has been really good actually; and okay, cool, I’ll have a look into it, I’ve been researching malware analysis recently but I’ll definitely check it out. Thanks user :)

I like how you can easily create a Debian chroot using debootstrap. Great for building stable packages.

I have never tried this! I'll look into it user

>>who knows what you do on systemd & who really cares? lol
it comes with an rc.local compatibility unit. so you enable that and then continue putting shit in rc.local.

short answer: yes

alsa will always be shit

>Looks good, doesn't work

Debian is some good stuff

...

It's a great stable system for servers and workstations. It has large community and rich repositories. For daily use it can be too conservative, but you can use backports or mixed repos with apt pinning.

Surely one of the best GNU/Linux distros available.

>my Ubuntu install was 1–2 major versions behind on Node, NPM, Mongo
All this stuff can be installed, in their latest versions, via 3rd party repositories provided by vendors.