VM as main computer

Using a VM as your main machine - anybody do this?

The advantages are obvious but do the disadvantages outweigh it for everyday use?

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twitter.com/AnonBabble

its like crossdressing couple times a week without going full 24/7 fag

Why on Earth would you do that?

I've seen Anons claiming doing that.

Not op but if you can't imagine a single good reason for that for yourself you are probably on the wrong board and should kys yourself.

If you don't do gaming it's actually really cool
One VM with no always on internet, doing important offline things like taxes or office
Another throwaway-VM, for web browsing and shitposting. Snapshot to instantly go back whenever something is fucked up
A secure internet VM for online banking
And nothing installed on the main computer except VM software and Updates

Qubes?

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I don't think the people in this tread are smart enough to know about that.

What has Sup Forums come to?

Are you able to completely upgrade your hardware also without re-installing any of the VMs?

I've considered this as well but less flexible than actually having a VM setup which can run any OS, or being able to move those OS images to other machines.

You mean upgrading the computer itself or the individual VMs?
Both works completely fine in my experience

takes a bit of RAM and CPU horsepower though

probably for nostalgia, and to isolate yourself from internet hazards

sometimes for safety too. to isolate main OS from VM. I wonder if it's possible to disable the internet on host OS, while tunneling it through the VM. that'd be interesting security-wise.

The hardware / computer itself.

What do you mean by upgrading individual VM hardware?

Yeah this is my only downside - my main machine isn't a beast, but I would only run 1 VM at a time.

Like changing how much RAM or CPU cores a VM is allowed to use

You can also change out your VMs GPU to anything else, might cause some driver bugs if you're going from AMD to Nvidia or the other way around, but yeah, pretty simple to change the passthrough.

Is your VM underneath windows? It doesn't have issues if it detects a different CPU/memory combination?

And what VM do you use?

no benefit unless you are doing cross platform faggotry, because of userspace software. if you think you are secure that way, you are wrong

underrated

I'm thinking more for sandboxing (in b4 sandboxie), and for more easily upgrading/moving these VMs to another machine, without reinstalling the underlying OS's on the VMs.

Main OS is Windows 7
VMs are etiher Windows 7, 10 or Linux
In my experience the host drivers for Linux are shit, that's why I use Windows as the host OS

Are you talking about changing the actual underlying hardware GPU?

You can change GPUs on native machines without massive issues too IIRC, so what am I missing?

Thanks, and what VM software?

I use a W10 PCI pass through VM under an Arch Linux host as my main gaming machine. I don’t think the disadvantages outweigh the advantages, it’s really nice wresting control of your hardware away from Microsoft.

Have you done any sort of bench marking with this setup?. For example using some Win10 gaym native then running it in a VM. I would actually like to know if there is any serious penalty for running a gaym in a VM over native.

well, if you keep a snapshot for whenever your guest is bloated and you need a fresh windows, sure. to me it looks more like job creation scheme, i see no benefit in managing multiple OS as guest, unless i develop cross platform.

also breaking out of vm guests these days ain't so hard.

VMware Workstation, has the best video performance in my experience

I would get so used to the vm i would forget it's there. Then, one day, I 'd have the clever idea of running a VM as my main computer. Oh God...

There obviously will be since you add an extra layer, passthrough or not it'll never be the same experience as running on bare metal

>well, if you keep a snapshot for whenever your guest is bloated and you need a fresh windows
If you care about keeping bloat off your OS and going back to "clean" snapshots you may as well use a LiveCD/USB

not the user you were responding to, but :
> "kys yourself"
lel
Also i have though about it and it is mainly good for running linux guest while having windows host for the purpose of using windows programs such as Autohotkey in linux.
Anyway, there is a reason I have never hearth someone doing it for real.
Also remember that we are talking about using VM as a main mashine. VMs are useful for specific purposes, but not really for main mashines unless you have powerful enough PC.
Also you could run and install macOS easilly on VMware so maybe apple fags could find a second use

>wresting control of your hardware away from Microsoft

Can you elaborate? Why is it better to remove control from msft?

ps/ai/id adobushit works for me aight in a vm.

now trying to figure out this KVM thing so i could keep all the local webserver stuff completely separate from the host debian installation (especially when i'm asked to install and work with some 'enterprise grade software' that irreversibly shits up the installation). so far AQEMU seems like an easymode GUIeey tool for tards like me.

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I'm moving to a VM soon because I still need MS Office (specifically Outlook), but want to isolate that bullshit from the rest of my system.
Most anything else I can do in Linux.

Don't think you'd run a hosted hypervisor at home though? Seems unnecessary and probably worse performance than something like VMWare Workstation.

But still a million times safer. You won't get a VM software targeting virus through normal web browsing. Unless someone specifically attacks you and only you

I remember having to emulate windows on fucking 68000s and PowerPCs

stick your windowed operating system up your ass for reminding me of the pain

Literally no point at all if you are a home user. Unless you own a pre ME Intel processor, all the people you don't want to be able to spy on your shit, are able to spy on your shit. Pre ME-processors are slow by today's standard, so the extra overheard caused by the VM will make them barely useable if you do anything else but browse the internet. If you have an AMD processor and you think you're safe, guess again. There are bound to be an equal of amount of 0 days just waiting to be released. These are the 0 days they don't want you to know about. So if you are realistic at all, privacy isn't an aspect. You wouldn't run a VM as your main machine for security reasons.

A VM is a good sandbox if you really want to delve in shady shit, but you wouldn't open that shit in your main machine anyway. VM or not. So again, sandboxing is a moot point in this regard. If you manage to get viruses on your computer, you probably aren't sharp enough to use a VM.

A VM will just make your computer run slower and you'll always have to fight problems (like PCIe passthrough) if you configure your VM to run with minimum overhead. You are 99% likely behind a NAT router so nobody is going to hack into your system from the outside net unless you outright invite them to.

Where you need a VM, as a home user, aside when sandboxing, is when you're running a server. Your server will have to have access to the outside internet, so you don't have NAT to save you from the most basic bots. You don't want to share files to the outside net without a layer of foolproof protection. This is where you do what I do, run a VM with all the files in read only privileges from the host machine. Someone breaks into my shit? Tough like, server is expandable and I already have backups. No identifying information is stored.

With GPU passthrough, sure. It would very much be a seamless use.

>secure
>host os IS compromised

I've done gaming benchmarks and on average I lost one whole fps.

The difference is so negligible that it's virtually the same experience. You're not going to notice the difference.

Really?

i pass through gpu to windows. you wouldn't know it's a vm

You say "literally no point at all" but then only talk about the security aspect of VM.

Think again, weeb losers.

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Ive been exclusively using windows 7 vms for daily use for about a year now.
I do everything from browsing 4chain to playing vr games.
ama

beautiful, what distro is that user

you cute?

a-user s-stop

>namefag
>calling someone else a loser

cute

What the fuck? Stop pretending it's muh top CIA hack shit, Qubes is entry-level reddit stuff.

>2018
>virtualization
>not containers

If youre that concerned about privacy you would use a live usb of tails

What VM software?

And what hardware are you running it on?

Are you just referring to docker and if so what benefits does it offer?

well I guess it runs like sandboxed and self-contained, so you don't have it 'installed' so to say, and you don't have to set up a whole new OS either.
then again, some things are better/easier with virtualization. so, basically, use the right tool for the right job.

using a remote VM in the cloud, like what OVH offers or Paperspace, kinda makes sense. maybe Shadow.tech - you have a decent desktop and you just thin-client.
but that's about it.

>What VM software?
qemu+kvm, usually use ovfm bios but on occasion will use the stock seabios when the os cant run in a uefi environment.
For games Ill use pci passthough to give the vm a real graphics card.

>And what hardware are you running it on?
i7 6700k with a shit ton of 3ghz ddr4 ram to run a dozen vms at the same time.
the host gets the intel hd 530 graphics while the gaming vm gets a 1060. I would have got the 1080TI but nvidia decided to be a bunch of cocksuckers and release literal irl botnets instead of the thing everyone was there to see.

I do it on my desktop computer because it allows me to seamlessly switch between multiple operating systems for both work and personal use. I use OpenBSD and QEMU as the hypervisor software because it's fairly lightweight and secure and extremely easy to configure and use. I also run IceWM on OpenBSD because I'm lazy and not worried about overhead, since it's a workstation PC. The host OS and WM are small enough to run on any toaster, so they do fine with the iGPU and as little as 250MB of RAM. I give each OS a whole or half SSD for the virtual boot disk,4-8GB of RAM, and 2-8 cores. Some of them also get a GPU passthrough to one of the two physical cards.

I wouldn't do it on a laptop though. You'd get shitty battery life and overheating.

> Qemu
Why not Bhyve?
Does Qemu have hw accel on OpenBSD?

Different user, I've got a similar setup myself (iGPU and 1080Ti) except I run w10 VMs one isolated from the network and the other connected to the internet just to play some games.
I use multiple image files, one contains the OS install and the rest contain my programs that way I can easily swap to a new image to update the network isolated copy.

Which VR HMD are you using?
Vive was a little tricky to get working had to passthrough a PCIE USB controller due to QEMU's device limit.
Hooked the USB controller and KVM switch to the front ports on my case so I can hotswap devices into the VM with relative ease so it wasn't a total waste.

Most of the time I use my host OS and want to make use of the dGPU for mpv mostly.
I have scripts setup to switch my dedicated GPU between host and vfio by swapping Xorg.conf files on login only disadvantage is that the script logs you out but it is as simple as typing a single command.

>Why not Bhyve?
Because QEMU can run Mac OS X (both Intel and PPC) and can also emulate other obscure architectures like MIPS or SPARC, and also more common non-Intel architectures like ARM. This is useful for testing out software and just in general having access to the widest range of options. I also know how to use it and there's nothing else worth learning how to use.
>Does Qemu have hw accel on OpenBSD?
Yes.

>Also you could run and install macOS easilly on VMware so maybe apple fags could find a second use
Could it finally be possible to run hackintosh without constantly worrying about updates? Abstract the hardware to the point where macOS just werks?

OSX runs like shit for me. tried virtualbox, vmware... but all are just slow, sluggish. hackintosh is also no-no for laptops.

OS X runs kinda slow on vm's. I have a high sierra vm rn, and its ok. Im surprised its as fast as it is, but dont go comparing it to the speed of os on a stock mac.

>ain't so hard

uhhhh yeah it is

Just use Qubes ffs
Hardware VMs are way better, security and privacy is better. Theres no reason not to use Qubes if you use a VM as your main.

i managed to figure out the thing and for what i need it launches on login, neatly sits in the background consuming fuck-all in terms of cpu and ram (should probably reduce to 512M), serves my shit and that's really what i care about.

when it comes to heavy resource allocation and more windows-y, gpu-accelerated things vmware probably does a better work, but what do i know..

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* meant for

Why qemu if gaming? Thought VMWare Workstation was pretty much the best performance + better driver support.

What if you need certain Windows apps?

You thought wrong.

Its just what happened.
short version: its just what happened and now that Im settled into qemy+kvm so heavily I dont want to bother remigrating.

the long version is that when I migrated to linux I started using vmware player, but there was just too many issues getting it to run on its botched installation.
I switched to virtual box which was buggy as hell, and then ultimatly settled with qemu+kvm.
I have other headless stuff running in the background on qemu+kvm and using kvm doesnt work when you mix hypervisors (like virtualbox and vmware clash and the second one lacks features. same thing applies to all combinations of the 3 unless you have the features turned off).
I only got back into gaymin after I was already settled into qemu+kvm and I really just dont have the time or care to start sampling anything else again.
I still like vmware and would be interested in trying them for gaymin at some point in the future.

On qemu+kvm I have nvidia drivers installed and can play my vive on a 1060 without any noticible lag. when playing on a normal shit monitor on ultra settings I can get 60 fps with drops down to the 40s during high content bullshit level cut scenes which is the performance I expected from a 1060 in the first place.

Ill be replying in order as I read your message.
I almost switched to windows 10. I use wes7 myself. I was having issues with virtual desktop. I accidently lost access to my image files, and after making a new one, virtual desktop wouldnt install. I assumed I botched the install and could never get it to work again. As it turns out, at the same time the developer of vr desktop blacklisted win7 from working. Since then (near) full support for win7 has been added back to the program, so Im still on wes7 vms.
I use multiple vms, one for each task. 2 gaming vms, one with no network access for cracked things, and one with internet access for legitimate games which may require wan access + multiplayer stuff. Everything is firealled on multiple virtual interfaces and spread across about 5 networks, a few of which are real.

I use the vive. Youre right, it was a pain in the ass. I got a (i think) rosewell 4 port usb3 hub, and was lucky enough to have it wind up in the same iommu group as my graphics card. There is a workaround to roll your own iommu groups, but it sounded like an even bigger pain in the ass. My mobo has 2 onboard usb controllers, but I couldnt sucessfully pass the one I needed to into a vm
The base station is like 15 different devices and it seems some ids change so it really is hard to impossible to get that thing to pass though properly using the easy usb passthough methods. Ive been looking for a good remote kvm switch but they are all so expensive.
Ive found that I can start the gaming vm with the -vga qxl line and get a black starting windows screen to draw on my host, and I can full sceen it and grab input, and it will actually controll the gaming vm. If you dont use the mouse or keybaord in vr, then you can actually get by with vr gaming like this without having to switch over your mouse and keyboard.

1/2 fuck spellcheck

I've tried. It gets annoying dedicating a modifier key to VirtualBox.

I have stopped using my host for everything but me media play back and photo editing at this point. I really miss my mouses back buttons but Im use to using it as a basic mouse now. very miserable, and I also miss using real keyboard shortcuts. rip alt+f4
Ive not used my dgpu for video playback, and dgpu is shit for encodign so I leave it vfio bound or whatever method I used this last time. I have a 6700k so it handles whatever media I throw at it pretty well.

I think I talked to you before. Are you the one I had upload your scripts so I could read through them?

2/2 /blog

nah aqemu is outdated as fuck. Use the redhat gui for qemu. don't remember the name.

Nice Numbers

>female dev

>lol why have a firewall, dont you know that bots work with a reverse connection now
>like just turn off your firewall nigga

Nothing Ultra-Satan!
You know whats going on stop kiddin' haha, your always in control

>Ive been looking for a good remote kvm switch but they are all so expensive
I just got a cheap EDIMAX 2port for around $20, comes with 2 weird COM-like ports in the back that terminate as VGA and USB but it works well enough for me although I have no use for the thicc VGA cables.
Only function they serve is swapping my keyboard and mouse between 2 systems (VM and host in this case). Can switch using one of the two buttons or by pressing NumLk 3 times in rapid succession.
Worked out of the box for me for both arch and w10.

I have used -qxl option prior in my startup script, didn't really notice the input lag but I still prefer the KVM switch since it is so much faster to switch back and forth.
The thing is so ancient I am surprised they still sell em here.

Lan parties

I unironically enjoy elementary os in a vm

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What are you hardware specs?

I looked for the edimax, the only thing I saw was some abortion from the early 2000s selling for 60 usd.
Id rather buy a gook arduino knocoff and a bag of chink relays and make the damn think myself.

I use qxl for every vm except for gaming.
I have second script that does say vga so tha tit will draw the window wich will allow me to seemlessly pass though mouse and keyboard to the vm with a dedicated gpu. It works fine for webrowsign but if you go in game the mouse is useless. In game it only moves to extremes. while piloting in a space sim almost resulted in death with major financial setbacks by simply trying to leave dock.
Its like the mouse works differently in game. But it works fine on desktop so you can start vr games and use the vive controller or brwose web just fine.
>here
you never specified what "here" is.

also you the the guy Ive been talking ot? you only replied to a part. I had asked if you were the one I spoke to months ago that uploaded that crap for me

>you never specified what "here" is.
My bad, bought from umart in Australia, they had several different models one of them was around the price you stated. The one I got was the lowest end cheapest one available. the model number is "EK-UAK2"
>umart.com.au/Edimax-EK-UAK2-2-Port-USB-KVM-Switch_33945G.html
it is around 30USD.
>also you the the guy Ive been talking to?
probably, if you mean the scripts to unbind/rebind GPU I did upload paste bins once.

>what is ESXi

i have to reboot and switch to the secondary gpu with kernel parameters to actually play that game though

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>not using an os based entirely on this retarded concept

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Checked on ebay quick and you are right its is being sold for around $60. Pretty odd for once, usually electronics are far more expensive in shitpost central.

we had a pretty lengthy conversation about our setups before.
I started to read your scripts but it got way to serious for the timeframe I was working with. I still have them bookmarked somewhere and intend ot read though them when I get the time. I will probably implement them into my setup. I cant recall exactly what it was but something seemed incompatible with what I do.

>switch
I just wish someone made a quality usb 3.0 switch with 2-4 hosts and support for ~5 devises and has a remote switching method for a reasonable price. The only thing that comes close to this costs $600.
Ill probably either just stick to locking myself out of host control for gaymen sessions or just make the damn thing myself with a bag of relays or transistors.

checked out that model number. Mixed results. They all seem decent enough for what they do, not 60 burger bucks worthy though lol

Yeah I just love having latency on user input. It is the best!

t. someone who has never used a vm

Every part of my job involves RDP-ing into VM environments, fuckface.

>I have to do shit over a network
>obviously virtualization is the source of lag
when I hit the windows key, my vm start menu shows up before the host's does.
>Every part of my job involves RDP-ing into VM environments, fuckface.
fuck off pajeet. why are you so mad that you only get to connect to vms anymore? get a real job and stop trying to scam people.

Im about to go to sleep. Im sure this thread will 404 by the time I see your reply.
I wish you the best and look forward to our next run in.

good night.

If you are still up, it was a little fiddly to get working the first time for me as well.

I vaguely remember running into one issue on the host itself where I wouldn't get openGL4 support anything requiring 3D acceleration flat out wouldn't work.
Was wracking my brain for a while on that one until I found a solution online which involved replacing one of nvidia's openGL modules.

I admit my solution is far from elegant and a little hacky borrowing bits and pieces online and sewing them all together.
Good luck with it, hopefully I'll bump into you again if you run into trouble.

yea Im still up. I havnt messed with any of that stuff to any significant extent.
If you want to drop an email we could stay in contact.
Thanks. It might be a while before I start messing with things again due to circumstances. Ive been forced into a "if it isnt broke, dont fix it" situation.

yeah I mean I last used an iMac Core2Duo version, and the desktop Dell Core2Duo (similar CPU and all) was much stronger.

I just mean it would be great if I could test software on it and all.

Don't have any throwaways at the moment rather not post any personally identifying information.
>"if it isnt broke, dont fix it"
That's what I have snapshots for, but I understand especially if you have no devices to fallback to.

It does take a good while to sort out, the only major barrier is time. There is enough information online to piece it all together, you seem smarter than me so I think you will manage.
Are you an electrical engineer?

Well my laptop supports VT-x and VT-d, so I run Geh-noo Lih-nuks as a host and work in Win10 with KVM. Does that count?