America is leaving Europe to defend itself

How will the Europeans react when America leaves and they have to fund their own army

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>they have to fund their own army

I don't comprehend where this ideea that the us funds european armies comes from. This hasn't happened since the fall of the soviet union. You're not giving anyone free shit, you're just moving troops around.

>have to fund their own army
I'm pretty sure Germany is the one funding European armies given how almost fucking everyone has Germo equipment tucked there somewhere. France/UK Notwithstanding.

Because Europeans have not been meeting the minimum amount to fund their armies. You guys have become complacent in letting America take charge. only 5 of 28 nato members are putting forth the required GDP. And one of them is Greece for fucks sake.

>Because Europeans have not been meeting the minimum amount to fund their armies.

Irrelevant to what I said . You're still not funding shit .

> only 5 of 28 nato members are putting forth the required GDP
The same outdated fucking statistics. You can't change the military budget overnight , countries have been in process of upping their military budget since crimea. Romania for example will reach it next year.

>very outdated
money.cnn.com/2016/07/08/news/nato-summit-spending-countries/

How do you not see that if you rely on a country to contribute more than their share then they are funding you. No wonder your country is poor as shit if you can't understand basic economics.

It's outdated in the sense that it gives the impression that that's the expenditure of the countries and that's it. It's not , budgets have to be balanced in order to change it and that takes years. Most of those countries are again , increasing their expenditure.

>rely on a country to contribute more than their share then they are funding you.
What the fuck are you talking about "rely" , "rely" for what? The only time nato was activated was during the september 11 attacks ,the us didn't defend europe yet.

> they are funding you
How do you fund some1 when you give them nothing? Are you fucking retarded?

YOU DONT HAVE A COMPETENT MILITARY BECAUSE OTHERS HAVE BEEN STANDING IN YOUR PLACE. How hard is it to comprehend. If America wasn't in Europe what stops Russia from taking the east back. Sure as fuck isn't the baby army you guys have created. When you don't have to protect yourself you rely on others.

>YOU DONT HAVE A COMPETENT MILITARY BECAUSE OTHERS HAVE BEEN STANDING IN YOUR PLACE

What in fuck's name are you talking about? Only countries that 100% depend on nato troops to defend them due to lack of equipment are the fucking baltics ,and all of europe helps on that .

>what stops Russia from taking the east back
It's own fucking economy.

What do you think you just fight a war and that's done? Gg , game over ? That's not how fucking real life works , see afghanistan , see iraq, see libya, see Chechnya in the late 90's.

Stop shouting at each other please

k

Chill out, Europe's gonna make it without you

Thanks

>what stops Russia from taking the east back
Common sense? What stops us from taking ex-USSR and Central Asian countries back? They are not in NATO.

The NATO was created to accomplish three things.

1) Keep Germany small
2) Have USA in Europe
3) Have Russia out of Europe

In my opinion the NATO is obsolete.

>what stops Russia from taking the east back
what stops south korea from taking north korea?
money.

I can't wait for when the missle defense shield is created and Putin and every other half-baked country who scraped together a nuke can fuck off.

The only safety the US has is if we are so ahead in military and technology that you'll never be able to do anything without asking first.

>How will the Europeans react when America leaves and they have to fund their own army
No one cares. Yanks out, please.

do you expect us to beg you to stay?
actually, I am really happy if American troops move out of EU. Without NATO, US will have lost its biggest tool to influence us, and we are wealthy enough to support our own army if necessary

it doesnt matter if we have 5 tanks or 30 tanks

for what we want to use it, its enough
neighbouring countries are friendly, and it doesnt matter what we have if a big one invades us

youll never protect us, you just want to sell us your shit equipment, which is literally shit

fuck off amerijew, you want us to pay for deep concerns

The UK and France are capable on their own of defending Europe against Russia. They're not the big bad Soviet Union anymore, we are not entirely necessary there.

>america needs to stop playing word police
>america needs to stop enforcing their imperialism on us
>americans are stupid warmongers
>lol nice military budget stupid americans enjoy not having healthcare

trump wins
>omg america you need to protect us stop being so selfish

I am very ashamed to be European
the world may hate you America, to me you re the greatest force for good the world has ever seen

>to me you re the greatest force for good the world has ever seen

germany circa 1937

>americans think Europe needs to spend 2% of gdp to be safe from Russia
pro tip: Russia literally can't handle invading all the former warsaw pact even without nato
It's economy cannot support it, it lacks the troops and the natives are going to democracy acbar 24/7.

The real danger is Russian subversion, which EU helps the most against, not USA.

Merkel admitted that Germany is totally reliant on American defense and got upset when Obama said he might redeploy troops out of Germany to the South China Sea.

Like it or not, you need us more than we need you

The US isn't directly funding European Armies. But the US has to constantly compensate for European unpreparedness, and lack of funding of their own forces.

Europeans simply expect the US to fulfill any material, or logistical necessities. They'd rather push aside money to fund their unsustainable welfare system. The US is indirectly subsidizing all of this. So, either start doing what you agreed to do. Or build up your own forces. Either way your military expenditure will increase.

>The US isn't directly funding European Armies. But the US has to constantly compensate for European unpreparedness, and lack of funding of their own forces.
>Europeans simply expect the US to fulfill any material, or logistical necessities.

What in fuck's name are you talking about? You do realize that the only country to activate article 5 was the united states right? On top of that most european countries have fought us's wars in iraq and afghanistan .

You keep talking about america the european side of nato...yeah...that never happened

>Implying we're a beta country

What are YOU talking about?
You don't need to be at war to be prepared.
When Russian rebels started the war in Ukraine. Did the rest of Euope did fuck all? No, they didn't. The US moved men and equipment east, to be prepared for anything or at least to make a message.

In the Balkans. Did Europeans do anything? Nope, Again US had to come do the job of the Europeans. Only once the US came into the picture, did all the cockroaches rally behind the US to try and get some credit for having helped.

What about the libyan intervention?
That was a UK-French initiative.
They used American logistics all the time.
Without American, they can barely even fucking operate outside of their countries.

>European cunts don't fund their armies because they expect America to do all the work for them
>Shit talk America anyway
>America says defend yourself
>WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY BUT YOU PROMIIIIIIIISED

What the actual fuck m8?

>When Russian rebels started the war in Ukraine. Did the rest of Euope did fuck all? No, they didn't. The US moved men and equipment east, to be prepared for anything or at least to make a message.
>The US moved men and equipment east
We're already here m8 .

We also have no reason to defend ukraine . It's not in NATO , it's not in the EU , and we're not the ones that promised to help ukraine in exchange for nuclear disarmament .

>In the Balkans. Did Europeans do anything?
Are you talking about the fucking yugoslav wars?
We weren't even in nato when that shit happened and our shit government decided to help you nonetheless despite protests all over the country.

The yugoslav fucking wars had NOTHING to do with european nato defense, no nato was country was even threatened.

>What about the libyan intervention?
>They used American logistics all the time.

And the americans used european nato logistics and bases. Were they supposed to not just to fucking prove some kind of military supremacy at a higher cost to a fucking ally?What exactly is your point?
The uk and france might've "initiated" the talks but don't pretend the US didn't have interests in libya, you've been butting heads with Gaddafi since the 80's , what is the gulf of sindra incidents .

>they can barely even fucking operate outside of their countries
You just took that out of your ass. There's literally no proof for that .

The end of NATO is the best thing that could happen to us.

Si vis pacem, para bellum.

We'll be okay, the other European countries will surely crying for helping every other week though.

>regional rival encroaching in your borders
>it's not in the EU
I swear, Yuros never learn.

>we're not the ones that promised to help ukraine in exchange for nuclear disarmament .
>Rumanian Education
At least bother reading the freakingn clauses.In no moment does either country pledge to protect Ukraine. We pledged not to invade them, which Russia did. We stuck to our pledge, Russia didn't.

>No nato country was threatened
It wasn't about it being a threat. It was about a genocide taking place right next to your borders and nothing being done about it. It wasn't a Nato thing but an international disaster.

>The uk and france might've "initiated" the talks but don't pretend the US didn't have interests in libya, you've been butting heads with Gaddafi since the 80's
That wasn't the point at all. The point is that "nato logistics" are just another name for American logistics. At least bother reading into this, and you will find out just how incompetent and dependent european armies are on the US military.

Also, Yes, the US uses European bases. It's just geography dude. Nothing to do with European doing a good job. You expect us to fly a jet all the way from new york to bomb somewhere in Iraq.

yugo was was a civil war and doing anything would be seen as an act of aggression, until you decided its not

It was a civil war initially.
but when it turned into mass murder, and ethnic cleansing, the international community had the legitimacy to act. The US and everyone pushed on the EU but they didn't. It took US intervention to stop the genocide.
>Wahhh American imperialism, am I right?

We will clamp onto Germany with both hands.

>regional rival encroaching in your borders
>it's not in the EU
>I swear, Yuros never learn.

Our armies are already here you imbecile , we don't need to fucking move our troops CAUSE THEY ARE ALREADY HERE !! ...jesus christ

>pledge to protect Ukraine
I said promised not pledged and that wasn't the point. The point was that the EU had no fucking reason to intervene in the ukraine "war".

>It wasn't a Nato thing but an international disaster.
Doesn't change the fact that no european country's safety was at risk,which is also the fucking point.

>mass murder
>ethnic cleansing
>genocide
>The US and everyone pushed on the EU but they didn't. It took US intervention to stop the genocide.

You killed more fucking civilians in iraq than bosnians that died in the "genocide" . What the fuck are you talking about?

the EU was a cool kids yacthclub back then, solely about money
UN peacekeepers were sent with peeshooters, are you not in the UN?

Our government has been promising to increase spendings for like 3 years now, while cutting the spendings.

Even the left wing war hating opposition has cried about how irresponsible it is to have an underfunded military for the safety of our soldiers.

Poland stronk, V4 stronk, we shall make it

>1000th thread
Against who do we need an army? A imaginary foe, that only you can see?
Stop your military shilling burger and please leave europe to europeans.

Yes, I forgot the mighty Rumanian forces.
Ready to hold the line against Russian encroachment.

>You killed more fucking civilians in iraq
citation needed.

Also, are you aware of the definition of Genocide? Just killing killing doesn't attribute a genocide.

This. Russia has no reason to attack countries like finland or estonia.
And you can double, ahh fuck that, tenfold the military in they countries and it would do nothing to prevent an russian invasion.
IF they want to.
fuck off burger

Idc, there are no imminent threats to Europe.

The whole Russia thing is fearmongering, and someone is benefitting from it politically.

Sweden and Finland have managed without NATO, so why shouldn't the rest of Europe?

You're literally creating a strawman

>Yes, I forgot the mighty Rumanian forces.
>Ready to hold the line against Russian encroachment.

That's not the fucking point. The point was as you said . "US did something it moves troops the europe,why didn't europe do the same" which is fucking retarded because our troops are already fucking here ....

>Also, are you aware of the definition of Genocide? Just killing killing doesn't attribute a genocide.
When the fuck did i call that a genocide? I said you killed more than the genocide , never called ur iraq civilian deaths a genocide. What the fuck?

Also legit P.S. question
>Rumanian
I've recently seen this spelling a few times on Sup Forums and i'm genuinely curios
Is that supposed to be an insult? We used to be called that way.

"Nothing new under the sun."
I pity the fool who ever trusted that USA would keep its promises.

>Yes, I forgot the mighty Rumanian forces. Ready to hold the line against Russian encroachment.
That was a joke.

No, it's not intended as an insult. I thought that it was how you spelled it. I think it's because of EUIV or some other game where I saw romania spelled as rumania. I don't remeber.

>How will the Europeans react when America leaves and they have to fund their own army
*record scratch*
*accordion music starts playing*

>would keep it's promise

>EU countries don't follow the 2% guideline they created
>The US didn't keep its promises

Huh?

I'm going to take a guess and say they'll fund their own army.

What kind of question is that? Europe doesn't need you lmfao

>they'll fund their own army.
With what money? Only Germanys economy is doing well. They'd have to cut programs and healthcare spending to make up the costs

USA created NATO-vassalhood in promise that it would defend them. And now it is breaking that promise, everything else is just irrelevant minor detail.

Good. We can focus on ourselves for a change.

I'm sure Germany would slip the leash again and drown the region in conflict.

>for a change

you mean go back to your old ways?

Question is not if but when there's gonna be the next ethnic cleansing in the Balkans.

>USA created NATO-vassalhood in promise that it would defend them.
Not at all. It was created as a mutual defense alliance in post-WWII Europe. Any country can enact article 5.
>And now it is breaking that promise
Literally all they have to do is spend a measly 1% more of their GDP on defense and there would be no fuss. Either stick to the guidelines or don't be in the alliance if you aren't going to take it at least halfway seriously.

The promise wasn't unilateral. You signed up to Nato and made certain promises yourself. You have not attained to any of them. Why should we? Why should the US pay for the security of Europe? Different century. I think the US did enough protecting Europe. 70 years. The US proved it's point.

Also, this is all ending thanks to EU frugality. Not the US. If you just stuck to your promises nothing would be like it is today.

Why are so many Americans trying to live up to the "Americans are completely retarded" meme?

>You signed up to Nato and made certain promises yourself. You have not attained to any of them.
Finland was never a NATO country.

It must be trying to be historically accurate because that's how we used to be called till recently actually(officially mid 1800's but unofficially a lot more recent). You can see a remnants of that in other languages.

>With what money? Only Germanys economy is doing well.
If the UK leaves the union, our armies combined will still spend double the amount Russia does on its military.
I think we'll manage somehow

Came here to post literally this. Such hypocrisy.

m8 you can't just wait until Russia attacks and then raise a real military in a week so you can fight them, you need a large standing army that is ready to go as soon as a conflict happens. You need more vehichles, more weapons, more equipment, more training, more everything.

>defense
>large floating boats carrying rockets and planes to destroy things thousands and thousands of kilometers from american soil

i can rape your mom and call it a favour too

This

God I hope Europe falls the fuck apart.

Weve been nothing but the toppest of lads to you ungrateful walking afterbirths, and all we get is endless greif from you fags.

I hope Emperor Trump leaves you guys to get raped by muslims and slavs.

I agree.

B-but you will look after ya old dad right son?

This


never trust americans, history bares proof more than once.

>How will the Europeans react when America leaves and they have to fund their own army
EST EUROPA NUNC UNITA

seeing the reaction go from 'america stop being world police' to 'you cant trust americans why arent you going to help us' overnight actually makes me hate europeans.

How much cash you got on you

The hypocrisy with those dicklickers has always been legendary:

>european powers rape and commit genocidw for centuries
>America doesnt do a fifth of the shit they did and somehow we are THE most evil country to ever have existed in any reality

Yuros can go fuck themselves.

Considering the refugee crisis in Europe, you can't just left them alone with that. They are overreacting, obviously.

lel fuck em

im seriously ok with putin being our guy now, at least he doesnt pretend to be anything he isnt

Bruh, the main reason for the tension between the West and Russia has been the US. If the US pulls out of NATO and its troops from Europe, it would only be positive for Russian-European relations. Americans (and the butthurt belt) can bring up Ukraine as much as they want, but it's a totally different situation. The Baltics, Sweden, Finland and Poland are not in Russia's sphere of influence like Ukraine was before the regime change. Putin remains a nutter, but he could never justify invading any of the above countries.

Not that the US would ever pull out of NATO. It benefits you more than anything by giving. Geopolitically but also financially. If Trump is the businessman he claims to be, he would never let those billions of dollars of defense contracts slide.

Other than that it seems most European countries have been gradually increasing their defense budget in the past years. This will only continue at a higher rate with Trump as president.

Trump is threatening Europe because he wants bigger defense budgets in European countries, so the American defense industry will get more orders.