Well, Sup Forums? Has Superman turned heel or will he be the shining beacon of hope we all want him to be?

Well, Sup Forums? Has Superman turned heel or will he be the shining beacon of hope we all want him to be?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtu.be/0VxQHdDDCO4
twitter.com/AnonBabble

Too bad whedon will fuck it up with quips up the ass

I thought we already saw this movie?

I wonder if the movie is going to even feel like one movie?
Snyder and Joss' styles are just so different

And apparently Joss is having Danny Elfman score his scenes separately

Wasn't there an interview that said that Whedon will stay true to Snyder's original tone and vision?

Right now I'm trying my best to completely lower any and all expectations I have for this. I figure if I go in convinced to my very core that it's going to be the worst superhero movie in the history of superhero movies... maybe I'll be able to come out saying it was okay.

Depends, I see them trying to keep the future vision but that doesn't necessarily mean it can't happen after he resurrects.
>Steppenwolf gets hit with an Icecream cone

Looks like everyone will blame Whedon for everything they don't like about the movie when it comes out.

Even though most of it's already done.

He's making a shitload of reshoots, probably to add WW barefoot and muh feminism.
Also you bet your ass he will use again the "puny god" scene

Well yeah, he can TRY
But he also tried to make Age of Ultron a good movie

So we know how poorly his efforts can go

I'm not sure about that. The movie comes out in 5 months, and most of the VFX must be already done by now.

You're forgetting who this is
He probably had a clause in his contract to make Anita Sarkeezian to look over the movie to make sure it was ok

>Steppenwolf gets hit with an Icecream cone

Damn I don't know why but that made laugh out loud hard af

>>Steppenwolf gets hit with an Icecream cone

>Looks you just got served Steppenwolf. SOFT served.

At most he'll be evil for 10 minutes before Lois breaks past Darkseid's mind control.

I still cant believe they're Death and Return after having only one film to himself.

>I still cant believe they're Death and Return after having only one film to himself.
Because for some reason whenever movie producers adapt something from another medium, they always ransack the greatest moments as fast as possible

People don't realize, but this trilogy revolves heavily around Superman and his impact on the world. Just because Henry Cavill doesn't have the most lines in the script doesn't mean he still isn't the star.

Why? Because your autism cannot allow them to do it any earlier than fifteen movies later down the line?

Well Lois is "The Key". So how much of the film will be dedicated to finding and protecting Lois before she leaves on her own to confront Superman.

This one will flop, am I right Sup Forums? I mean, it has to!

Ruh-roh
That triggers Joss's sensitive feelings.
Women are NOT plot devices! They have agency no matter what you say shitlord

Half the reshoots are probably Lois focused to give her a real place in the film instead of being a plotdevice

The capeshit movie bubble is finally going to burst. I've been saying this since Thor but this time for serious!

See? Just like Sup Forums predicted, Superman returns from the dead as a the joyful hope inspiring hero that people want!

Whedon is a "male feminist", what mean he hates women as much as the average user but he's in denial about it

Most of the problems with Age of Ultron are a result of either trying to do too much in the run time or studio interference; things Snyder gets a pass on because >muh kino and >muh extended edition.

So this is how Snyder "honors" Superman... by making him a grim, joyless dickwad? Is Snyder projecting himself onto Supes? It sure as hell seems like it.

Nah, being a "male feminist", his problem is that he hates himself and is using his maleness as a scourge to punish himself.
>Ugh, hurt me more. Tell me I'm bad. But maybe I'm also good because I'm helping you? Please tell me I'm good

He just wants mommy to hell him he's a good boy

Based Snyder doubling down on everything plebs and not muh fags attacked him for. That's artistic integrity for you

Live-action mulletman?
Expectations slightly raised.

So are we getting Injustice Superman?

I doubt they buried him in a black suit

What if this is some mental battle like in Superman III?

I wish
At least that would show conviction and some kind of planning

Snyder/WB wants their cake and to eat it too.
He's a brooding anti-hero badass
But he's also SUPERMAN and full of hope!

their styles could work very well together, Whedon adding entertaining interactions between the characters while Snyder handles all the key scenes and action sequences and I really hope that Whedon learns one or two things from Snyder like how to elevate a scene and not make it look like its been done with a tv-budget.
Snyder could as well have learnt some things from Whedon but he is gone for now.

At best their styles could really work well together if done in the right places and I really hope Whedon isn't such a fucktard to try and push his own vision everywhere.

>Steppenwolf gets hit with an Icecream cone
>Born to be Wild starts playing

>anti-hero
Care to explain this one, shitposter-kun?

He doesn't quip so he can't be a hero

The black suit was already in Zod's skull hallucination in MoS

>murders terrorists in Terrorstan with a smile on his face
>threatens to murder, well pretty much anyone who stands in his way (i.e. Lex, Batman)

>An antihero, or antiheroine, is a protagonist who lacks conventional heroic qualities such as idealism, courage, or morality. These characters are usually considered "conspicuously contrary to an archetypal hero

Of course now you're gonna respond with that reddit style pictograph of all the people he saved, and then I'll respond to that with it being about character traits, and you'll say I'm retarded and a liar and a shill and don't understand that Snyder was just trying to humanize Superman, to which I'll say that the humanized frailties and personality flaws, and overall failings and "bittersweetness" as you define them are what shift him from being a Classical Hero to an Anti-Hero, at which point you'll just double down on the name calling and I'll go find porn and masturbate.

Good thread. See you in six hours when we do it all over again.

Superman is a plot device in these movies, not an actual character. That's the problem.

Nice try but this is fan art

Superman is awfully apathetic about humanity. He can be a good guy and help humanity when he's not having existential crises about helping humanity.

This can't be real.

The Jaws movies revolve heavily around the shark but nobody's saying it's a nuanced character.

>Snyder
>Good Action scenes

Pick one- youtu.be/0VxQHdDDCO4

>Superman is a plot device in these movies, not an actual character. That's the problem.
And that won't change if his Clark Kent persona stays dead. Snyder just wasn't interested in the Daily Planet.

Wow I've never seen a more jaded person on an Arabian moving picture emporium.

Actions speak louder than words.Superman's actions, as you've already pointed out, attest to his heroism. His human frailties don't matter when he's shown to have overcome them several times. That's what courage is. Self-sacrifice for the greater good, putting yourself in harm's way for the sake of other people, that's what a hero does. That's what Superman did in the films.

Superman sans Clark Kent can still be an interesting character

Most Justice League comics have very little Clark Kent, reporter, in them.

Cavill doesn't deserve this shit.

>Inexperienced and violent in MoS
>Sidelined in BvS and killed off
>Evil in JL

When will he actually get to become Superman?

>Superman is a plot device in these movies, not an actual character
How do you explain his character development then?

>Superman is awfully apathetic about humanity.

I call b8 but anyway, he has always been helping even before he wore the cape and even after, he has been constantly saving people, he saved earth twice already and dying by doing so.

It's not

>Actions speak louder than words.Superman's actions, as you've already pointed out, attest to his heroism.
Do they?
Do they really?

The big complaint by Sup Forums of MoS is that Superman never tries to drag Zod out of the city.
They just brawl like Zod slapped Lois' ass. It didn't matter where.
But it did matter and it should have mattered.

Snyder only cares about the "epic" scene. And a lot of time, he succeeds on making an image look really good. But he misses out on everything else going on.
Like, again in MoS, Lois and Clark hug in the middle of a wasteland of destruction. Yes, nice image. But meanwhile there are people that need help and Superman is having snuggly time with his squeeze.

That type of stuff happens again and again
Superman is only heroic when it doesn't conflict with looking cool.

WHY DON'T YOU QUIP YOU MOTHERFUCKER?? FUCK CHARACTER ARCS FUCK OVERARCHING PLOTS FUCK COMPLEXITY JUST QUIP BITCH WHY DON'T WANT A FUCKING BOOK JUST SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THE SIZE OF YOUR TURDS ALREADY REEEEEE

>The big complaint by Sup Forums of MoS is that Superman never tries to drag Zod out of the city.

Which is idiotic because the fight is actually taken out of Metropolis only for Zod to take it back there.

>he saved earth twice already and dying by doing so.
He saved Lois and Martha, not the Earth
They both just happened to live on it

That's the difference between SnyderSupes and mainline Superman. The Earth alone is enough to give everything.
Snyder's version is a Randian superhero. Through selfishness comes productivity and through productivity the world is improved

>Actions speak louder than words.Superman's actions, as you've already pointed out, attest to his heroism.
Anti-heroes do the right thing at the end of the day too. Nothing you've said actually precludes the idea of this Clark being one. For example, Dirty Harry is the go-to example of an anti-hero, yet his actions still have him catching the bad guy by the time the movies over. By your logic he's not an anti-hero because his behavior before that point is irrelevant.
You seem to think anti-hero is synonymous with villain. It's not. It's about presentation and in that sense yes, the human frailties do matter. They're the distinction.

But we never see Superman's will to leave the city.
That's the important thing
They brawl all the way to heaven, but it isn't a choice made by any of them. The fight just leads them there and then straight back down again.

Let's not forget the "little hop over the gasoline tanker that explodes and demolishes a building" bit
Can't argue against that one

>"He needs to do this for the story I want to work".
>"But that makes no sense"
>"What if we railroad him and ignore any logical consistency in the plot, and then accuse people of being stupid and just wanting The Avengers again in interviews?"
>"Fine guys, whatever."

That's how I explain it.

>people still fall for this shill strat

I see these two posts in literally every thread I read about the subject. Makes me wonder if it's the same employee.

>But we never see Superman's will to leave the city.

Listen to yourself, good God.

People forget that Snyder asked to do MoS2 before BvS but the executives told him to skip it.

He's gonna tell you to rewatch the movie because Clark looks back and recoils in horror at letting that happen. Just like how when he's making out with Lois if you watch *really carefully* multiple times in zapruder-esque super slow motion you can see they're *actually* shaking due to PTSD.

>Sup Forums STILL don't understand the struggle of a real person turned into a symbol
>implying if any of you were the superman you wouldn't go full Kurt Cobain in a matter of months
No hope for you guys, maybe with Whedon aboard these movies will be easier to follow

With whedon directing, WW will probably beat his ass for fun

Well we don't?

We don't see Clark tackle Zod and try to drag him outside the limits.
When they're in space, we don't see him try to kick him down elsewhere
His choice of where to fight is very passive

Remember, everything that happens in a movie is by choice. The writer and director chose every last moment. If something doesn't happen and it should, it's a legitimate criticism.
Movies aren't real and you can't say "Well character X didn't have time to do Y". Of course they did. They were just chosen not to.

No he fought Batman well really he went to Batman because Lois and Martha.
All acts of heroism in the movie except the African Warlords had no real stake for him.

>they leave the city and Zod comes back
>y-yeah but did Superman want to leave the city like he did in the movie
Haha oh wow

>>they leave the city and Zod comes back
Flying straight up and falling straight down does not constitute "leaving the city"

>>Sup Forums STILL don't understand the struggle of a real person turned into a symbol
>implying if any of you were the superman you wouldn't go full Kurt Cobain in a matter of months
If I wanted to see a movie about an average asshole tormented by his inner demons I'd just take a three hour selfie. You gonna defend that for years on end as well, or do I need to get Armond White to cum in your face first for that to happen?

They hit a fucking satellite during the fight.

So?

Wonder Woman was well received because it was an extremely simple stoy to follow but unfortunately had no depth or substance to it. Personally I say ignore the normies completely and go full kino. Delete all handholding.

>If I wanted to see a movie about an average asshole tormented by his inner demons I'd just take a three hour selfie
That or a good movie, whatever you choose

>literally in space
>NOPE STILL IN THE CITY
I guess Superman is still in Krypton then.

...what character development?

In Man of Steel he only steps up to the plate because an alien invasion forces him to, and after that he can't go back into hiding again because people know he exists now.

In BvS, he is just sort of following along from stupid plot twist to stupid plot twist, occasionally saving people like its the most tedious fucking job anyone has ever been forced to do. In MoS Clarke saves people because he can't stop himself, but at least he seemed dedicated to it. In BvS, literally every fucking scene of him doing superhero stuff he has a face that says "Fuck, why am I even here?"

In the end, he kills himself to satisfy the martyr complex that he been drilled into his head for two movies.

That isn't character development. How does he grow? How does his viewpoint change? What does he learn? What important choices does he make? What does he WANT, and why?

Snyder's superman is painted so broadly that every one of those questions has, at best, an answer that's just a plot mandate rather than any aspect of the character within that plot.

Wheldon avengers 1 and 2 : 90% and 75% on RT
Zack hack MoS and DvS : 55% and 27% on RT

Zach Snyder movies sucks, this is a proved FACT

>leaving the city upwards isn't really leaving city
wew let's agree to disagree now, I don't see this leading to anything

Rewatch the movie until the fanfiction that's about to get posted sinks in.

>In Man of Steel he only steps up to the plate because an alien invasion forces him to, and after that he can't go back into hiding again because people know he exists now.
He was helping a lot of people before the invasion remeber?

If Snyder's Superman isn't a hero like people claim, then he wouldn't be saving people, period. It's that simple. Do EMT's smile all the time and quip when they're saving lives? No. Saving lives is a serious matter, and should not be treated lightly. All you NOT MUH fags need to get a grip.

>technically speaking the thermosphere where they hit the satellite is still within the geographical area of city, just tens of miles above it.
>tips fedora

You're getting pretty autistic about something that doesn't change the outcome of the argument.

There is no scene in the end fight of Man of Steel that has Superman clearly and obviously expressing a desire to fight Zod outside Metropolis

You cannot say there was such a scene.

And hell, let's just erase that argument entirely
What about the other scenes of Superman not giving a shit?
Like when he's making out with Lois inside a crater of his own making? Why isn't he helping all the people he can hear screaming for help?

So he becomes a hero in these movies culminating in the sacrifice of his own life? All that despite humanity questioning him and his motivations? Good character development

Alternatively don't rewatch if you're not going to pay attention this time either

Sure. Helping people and then bolting like a scared deer so no one would catch him in the act.

Clarke in MoS acts like saving human lives is equivalent to masturbating in public restrooms. He knows he shouldn't do it, but he can't stop.

>So he becomes a hero in these movies culminating in the sacrifice of his own life? All that despite humanity questioning him and his motivations? Good character development
That's not what character development means

>their styles could work very well together
>inplying anything could work with fedora-SJW

Because he was scared of the gov going after him but he keep helping people anyway.

Because he doesn't know how to fight you fucking moron. It's his first day and he's having to singlehandedly fight off an army as strong as he is. Jesus Christ you autistic fuck did you get butthurt in Batman Begins when Bruce let Ra's die?

>What about the other scenes of Superman not giving a shit?

Oh, you mean when he
>Saves the people on the oil rig
>Saves Lois from bleeding to death
>Saves several soldiers during the fight in
>Tries to get the fight out of Smallville but two super powered Kryptonians double teaming him stop his attempts every time
>Saves Lois after the Phantom Zone portal sucks everything inside it

Yeah, he just doesn't give a fuck.

Well that shows in his utter lack of understanding how a newspaper is run.

Arguing with you retards is a waste of time.

Kys faggot.

>goes from no hero to hero, to hero who doubts his role as a hero after becoming a controversial figure, to full self-sacrificing hero
>n-not character development
lol

see

You can save people and still not be a hero in the literary sense.

Do EMT's scowl and stare silently into the middle distance?

When one person helps another, they usually say stuff like "are you OK?" They don't stare and grimace.

Take helping that Mexican child. A person who isn't autistic would say something along the lines of "it's going to be OK," and would probably smile to reassure a small child.

Personally, I would try to do it quickly so I could save as many people as possible and get victims to the hospital but I'd still talk to reassure them.

It bothers me why couldn't he just send Zod to the phantom zone instead of killing him like he always do in comics

Fucking Snyder wanting to be Edgy

But the firemen who risked their lives on 9/11 were quipping all the way, "I don't see how this is a party" being the most repeated line

>A hero (masculine) or heroine (feminine) is a person or main character of a literary work who, in the face of danger, combats adversity through impressive feats of ingenuity, bravery or strength, often sacrificing their own personal concerns for a greater good.

Try again.

That's not actually character development; he doesn't change. He's doing the asme thing hew as doing as an eleven year old; saving people and waiting for the other shoe to drop and questioning if he should even try at all. His mentality hasn't changed and the movie doesn't really explore it. Clark's pretty static as a character.

That's kind of the problem with your "Actions speak louder than words" presentation; you can infer anything you want onto actions/